Amazon Says Mass Effect 3 Refunds Aren’t Unique

Honestly, I hated the endings too. The endings and the post-ending sequence ruined Mass Effect pretty thoroughly. But if you played the game to the end, you completely used the product. There's no justification for a refund at that point.

The ending was definitely disappointing.... but the game was pretty solid up till then. Can't wait to see what the DLC turns out to be.

Patrick's digging some dirt with his shady, undercover "customer" persona.

@StrainedEyes said:

I haven't gotten to the ending yet, but I'm 25 hours in and the game is pretty great so far, despite some shortcomings. I can't imagine a disappointing ending will effect my opinion of it that much.

I could not imagine it either. I was prepared for a bad ending because of the things I heard so expectation had nothing to do with it. But that ending's awfulness is on another level. It takes real skill to make an ending that completely shitty.

I was prepared but I still was not prepared.

I agree that the ending of ME3 is pretty appalling and has plot holes the size of Mont Blanc, but despite this it didn't ruin the rest of the game for me, which was very enjoyable. The Mass Effect series definitely deserves a better ending, but to say it negates the whole series is crazy.

@AlphaDormante: There was a movie released a few months ago that asked the audience to go to a URL to see how it ends. The Matrix Revolutions was widely considered an incredibly disappointed, inexplicable, and random ending to a once-promising sci-fi trilogy where characters act out of character, have or don't have abilities in situations that make no sense, and is not an altogether happy ending. There's precedent (no matter how outrageous) in other forms of media for both their "incomplete" ending, and for their unsatisfying conclusion.

An artist can essentially end their work however the fuck they want. It's up to you to decide if it's worth it or not. You decided that ME3 wasn't. You don't deserve your money back. You'll get it back because whiny bitch customers get what they want. But you paid for that company's ending to that story, and you got it. Art is open to interpretation, stories are open to interpretation, basically any media is open to interpretation. The game was playable, and finishable. Therefore, it did all it had to do in order for you to get what you paid for. Sorry boutcha.

If I pay for HBO, I don't get to watch HBO for a year, and then bitch that I think The Walking Dead is overrated garbage and demand my money back. They offered me something, they gave me that something, I have to deal with the consequences. They didn't lie to me or anything. I just wound up not liking it. Live and learn. Don't bitch and moan for JUSTICE!!1!

But yes, the endings suck.

Unhappiness is justified. A refund is ridiculous.

@Butano said:

@Bumpton So as bad as the KOTOR 2 ending then I'm guessing?

I dont think that is possible. I havent played ME3 yet but the Kotor 2 ending was absolutely the most bullshit ending in video game history. I mean I was ready for it to tell me to put in disc 2....

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@depecheload said:

I think some of the things fans are doing regarding ME3 are going overboard, but I'm still happy about it.

Think about it, EA/BioWare decided that the THIRD game in a TRILOGY would be a great game to try to mainstream and simplify for a mainstream audience. They crammed in a mulitplayer mode no fans were really clamoring for, and they stripped out elements from the original main story and then shoveled them onto overpriced day one DLC.

So I'm sorry, my sympathy for EA/BioWare is zero. Everything they've done with ME3 has been for them and their profits, nothing to benefit the consumer. When you do that, it always comes back to get you. They're getting what they deserve.

That DLC thing where they ripped out content from the main game expressly for the DLC didn't happen.

If you look at the leaks that came out, the Prothean was originally a much larger character. And even as you play it as the script is today, i'ts insane that he's optional!

So he's either content that was ripped out of the main game for DLC, or evidence that BioWare cut corners, sped things along to make development end sooner. Either way, it's a decision that was made to benefit their bottom line and not the story/consumer.

I will wait for all the DLC to be packaged all together, buy it from Amazon, play the game, and then get a full refund. That way I won't have to spend any money on the game that ruined the potential set out by one of my favorite stories ever, Mass Effect 1.

@SmokePants: @SmokePants said:

@AlphaDormante said:

@AxleFGK said:

i don't know what the ending is but I'm just going to ASSUME its not a super happy perfect ending, and that you can just use an FAQ to make it a happy perfect ending like everyone did in mass effect 2... the whole idea of the game is to have consequences for what you did. hence the name, yet the fans just use FAQs to stop anything bad from happening in their playthroughs.

Nothing to do with that. Every single ending is legitimately terrible. The writing is awful, characters are OOC, and there are gaping plotholes the size of Australia. It is bad, okay? Anyone who makes comments like "Well, I haven't seen the endings yet myself, BUT..." really needs to stop making assumptions and look before they think themselves capable of judging.

More on topic, Amazon's service has always been fantastic. I've never regretted a single transaction I've made with them.

That's a load of crap. Post hoc rationalization at its worst. The endings are thematically valid. The writing is fine. The characterizations are fine. The crux of the issue is that people don't like where the galaxy ended up, so they are trying to assign blame and everything associated with the last 15 minutes will be colored in a negative light, even though it's beside the point and even though you could make the same sorts of arguments against other games that you did like. As each day passes, you will find more and more wrong with the game, because you want to believe that these things are objectively bad and that your feelings are justified.

It's the echo chamber of the internet. People were talking crap about ME2's ending -- the Collectors don't make sense, Sheperd would never have said that to the Illusive Man, Harbinger is a crappy villain, etc. It didn't gain traction, because Sheperd and all his buddies got to come out of it smelling like roses. And if that had been the case here, you wouldn't notice or care about the writing or the characterization. So just drop the spurious BS and admit to yourself why you really don't like the ending.

Possible Spoilers

People had gripes about ME2 but this is a different story. What happened in ME2's ending was based on what your character did. The ending of ME3 has nothing to do with what choices you have made. It is just like Deus Ex: Human Revolution but at least that game had 4 buttons to pick from.

The three possible endings are presented to you using a plot device that appears out of nowhere. No previous actions affect these choices (assuming you played enough multi-player or did enough side missions). Get to the end and pick. You could save there and just watch all the endings.

The endings are unsatisfying. It isn't that we all wanted Shepard and the Normandy crew to walk away smelling like roses. We wanted something meaningful to happen. We wanted to know what all that effort had been for. We wanted some closure with these characters.

The endings also don't make sense in the game's universe. The point of Mass Effect was never "Organics and Synthetics can never get along" the whole series preached against that. In Mass Effect 2 two synthetics were vital to Shepard's success. Without EDI and Legion the suicide mission would have never even gotten off the ground. Maybe this point gets to me a little more than it should since I JUST settled things between the Geth and the Quarians before I entered the end game. You tell me that organics and synthetics will never get along right after I see them getting along.

How does sending synthetics to destroy all the advanced organics help the organics? I have to save you by killing you. Great. Who the hell is this guy to make that decision anyway? If he created the reapers he can stop the reapers. This idea goes completely against the ideas of acceptance and inclusion the game has been preaching since ME1.

Also, they blow up all the mass relays. So if we are to assume that these things to also wipeout the system that they are located in (like in Arrival) they still leave people stranded with no interstellar transportation. The galaxy is presented as having a complex and interconnected economy so it would stand to reason that entire worlds are now going to be without vital goods. Plantes of people will starve. How do you think the quarians are doing. They just got their planet back and before they get to lay one brick in reconstruction they are cut off and on their own. Things look pretty dark.

Worst of all the endings are nearly identical. You get a short cut scene where all of your buddies escape (how the hell did they get out of there by the way) and then you listen to Buzz Aldrin (a truly brave man and a pioneer in space travel) read some lines at you. Then they try to sell you DLC with a pop up ad.

That's it.

I don't see how people can come to the defense of this. It is weak writing and it just looks lazy.

There is no way they could have come up with a set of endings that would please the entire fan base. People have lived with this IP for too long. They have rolled it around in there head and come up with their own endings. There is no way to please everyone here. Unfortunately they have chosen a set of endings that pleases the least amount of people possible.

Now you drop your BS and let people complain if they want to. No one is asking you to dislike these endings. If you enjoy them then good for you. Having more things to enjoy is fantastic.

@Wrighteous86 said:

@AlphaDormante: There was a movie released a few months ago that asked the audience to go to a URL to see how it ends. The Matrix Revolutions was widely considered an incredibly disappointed, inexplicable, and random ending to a once-promising sci-fi trilogy where characters act out of character, have or don't have abilities in situations that make no sense, and is not an altogether happy ending.

An artist can essentially end their work however the fuck they want. It's up to you to decide if it's worth it or not. You decided that ME3 wasn't. You don't deserve your money back. You'll get it back because whiny bitch customers get what they want. But you paid for that company's ending to that story, and you got it. Art is open to interpretation, stories are open to interpretation, basically any media is open to interpretation. The game was playable, and finishable. Therefore, it did all it had to do in order for you to get what you paid for. Sorry boutcha.

But yes, the endings suck.

Unhappiness is justified. A refund is ridiculous.

Um, I never went for a refund. I used my product and was happy with about 95% of it, so not much point in it. You're lecturing the wrong person here.

Wow Amazon, I'm glad I bought a Kindle Fire. Probably going to go to you for all my gaming needs now.

I'm enjoying that the majority of the community here sees the unnecessary uproar. The few here who partake in said uproar feel the need to defend it with vitriol.

"No, fuck you! It is awful!" is not a valid argument, nor are your shitty attempts to rationalize it through (wrong) analogies.

Let's use a correct one here. To take the car argument used earlier. You don't drive it 50k miles and then it catches on fire.

What you did was buy a fucking puzzle of a car, contained in a box without pictures, because you bought two other puzzles before that you liked. Then you put it together, hung it up on the wall with the other puzzles and decided that you thought it was ugly.

@Patman99 said:

@Butano said:

@Bumpton So as bad as the KOTOR 2 ending then I'm guessing?

I dont think that is possible. I havent played ME3 yet but the Kotor 2 ending was absolutely the most bullshit ending in video game history. I mean I was ready for it to tell me to put in disc 2....

I'll defend KotOR 2 until I die :P

ME3 however has a truly terrible ending. A lot of it comes down to the extremely high expectations set by the whole series up to that point though. If it were any other game people wouldn't be as upset. It would still be bad though.

People should not be petitioning for a new ending. People should not complain to the FTC over this. However that ending is historically bad. One of the worst ending to one of the best stories.

The context is a bit odd (returning a game because you didn't like the ending), but Amazon's response isn't all that surprising. Their customer service is amazing...BUT be warned amazon is also known for arbitrarily banning customers who abuse that service (frequent refunds, complaints, etc...it's a little unclear what the criteria for being banned is.

Holy crap Amazon is in on the Bioware/EA conspiracy to release a bad ending and make us all think it's fine!

Doest the PAL version of this game for PS3 have game-breaking frame rate problems?? Shouldnt that be the controversial aspect of this game

@vaportra1l said:

But anyways, I finished ME3 and I'm not enraged so I guess I'm broken? I thought the game was excellent overall.

Same here, I'm a huge fan of the series and thought the ending was absolutely fine. I've still yet to here a single salient reason from anyone as to why the end of the game is so hated. Granted, it's hardly the game's strongest point and a lot of the endings are very similar, but how that qualifies it as a "series-destroying travesty" is just beyond me.

@Clonedzero said:

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

Nerds be like, mad entitled and shit.

yeah, i hate capitalism too!

I don't have a problem with people being reimbursed for their money if they have a problem with the product. But I think returning a game because you hated the ending is a little extreme.

@reddwarf42 said:

People should not be petitioning for a new ending. People should not complain to the FTC over this. However that ending is historically bad. One of the worst ending to one of the best stories.

The FTC thing is horrifically stupid. When people look over and see idiots like that as the representatives of our ire, I can't really blame them for thinking we're completely unjustified.

@Wrighteous86: I think Walking Dead is on AMC

...if only I had bought my PS3 Skyrim from Amazon, maybe could have gotten a full refund for that broken piece of crap. Gamestop was like, re....fund? wha?

@Mode7 said:

@Wrighteous86: I think Walking Dead is on AMC

Haha, fair point. I don't like it, anyway. EDIT: I only watched the first season.

@gbrading said:

I agree that the ending of ME3 is pretty appalling and has plot holes the size of Mont Blanc, but despite this it didn't ruin the rest of the game for me, which was very enjoyable. The Mass Effect series definitely deserves a better ending, but to say it negates the whole series is crazy.

Yeah, that is a little hyperbolic. I've played though with my paragon character and now I just can't motivate myself to continue playing. I've seen all the endings. There is nothing uniquely available to a renegade. It does not ruin the entire series but it does kind of hang a dark shadow over it.

So how did this game get all those perfect scores again? I don't see many reviewers complaining about the ending or deducting points for it.

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

@Clonedzero said:

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

Nerds be like, mad entitled and shit.

yeah, i hate capitalism too!

I don't have a problem with people being reimbursed for their money if they have a problem with the product. But I think returning a game because you hated the ending is a little extreme.

i just find this notion that "entitled consumer" is a bad thing completely ridiculous. thats the point of capitalism. if bioware starts fucking all their games up (DA2, and now with ME3's horrible ending) then the consumer can and SHOULD be upset by this. the product they bought isn't up to the standards they expected. if they can they SHOULD get their money back. its captialism. if bioware starts sucking, it should lose buisness. thats how captialism works. if gamers start actually demanding higher quality games with better writing, then guess what? that'll push companies to make higher quality gamers with better writing.

I...I was pretty okay about the ending. And I had over 55 hours of playtime. Went through the whole series. What was so terrible that I missed?

I wonder how many people have it on PC and returned it, after having tied it to Origin?

If such hypothetical people kept using it, or re-downloaded it later, they would be scum.

This policy will be changed soon. People are going to abuse the shit out of it if they haven't been already.

Okay. Now this is reaching for news now.

@Wrighteous86 said:

@AlphaDormante: An artist can essentially end their work however the fuck they want. It's up to you to decide if it's worth it or not. You decided that ME3 wasn't. You don't deserve your money back. You'll get it back because whiny bitch customers get what they want. But you paid for that company's ending to that story, and you got it. Art is open to interpretation, stories are open to interpretation, basically any media is open to interpretation. The game was playable, and finishable. Therefore, it did all it had to do in order for you to get what you paid for. Sorry boutcha.

Just quoting you because there are too many posts like this.

People, "art" is not an excuse. It is not something to hide behind. It is an achievement of human development. Something we all should take pride in. To call something "art" and use that as a way to shield it from complaints is incredibly dismissive. It's not fair to the audience, and especially not fair to the work. Art can be criticized. It can be deemed to hold value. People are right to judge. Right to criticize.

When a story betrays itself as much as Mass Effect 3's ending did, it is faulty. It's broken in the plainest way a story can be. People are right to ask for refunds, because they received a product that does not function as advertised. It is literally at odds with everything people could have expected, from both experience playing the games and awareness of what this product should be. There are dozens of interviews with Bioware swearing up and down that the game plays out in the complete opposite way that it does. Thus the thing that consumers obtained cannot be functioning correctly. People are right to ask for a refund.

@Wrighteous86 said:

@Mode7 said:

@Wrighteous86: I think Walking Dead is on AMC

Haha, fair point. I don't like it, anyway. EDIT: I only watched the first season.

You make a good point though. After reading about the development and listening to the bombcast where Casey Hudson said he had never played Mass Effect outside of development I was not going to buy it. I waited until I saw some reviews and had heard from my friends and then I decided to go ahead and get it. I enjoyed that game and that is that. I won't be asking for my money back just because the last 10 minuets were nonsense.

Makes good sense for Amazon though. Giving people returns on this will get them the kind of loyalty you can't buy.

Ah, so basically I can play video games for the cost of postage, is what they're saying? Like gamefly without premiums?

Whoever you talked to is not a gamer :)

@thebazel said:

So how did this game get all those perfect scores again? I don't see many reviewers complaining about the ending or deducting points for it.

Wasn't there an EA review event for this game?

I would complain about every product I bought if I thought I could get full resale value on it.

@Clonedzero said:

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

@Clonedzero said:

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

Nerds be like, mad entitled and shit.

yeah, i hate capitalism too!

I don't have a problem with people being reimbursed for their money if they have a problem with the product. But I think returning a game because you hated the ending is a little extreme.

i just find this notion that "entitled consumer" is a bad thing completely ridiculous. thats the point of capitalism. if bioware starts fucking all their games up (DA2, and now with ME3's horrible ending) then the consumer can and SHOULD be upset by this. the product they bought isn't up to the standards they expected. if they can they SHOULD get their money back. its captialism. if bioware starts sucking, it should lose buisness. thats how captialism works. if gamers start actually demanding higher quality games with better writing, then guess what? that'll push companies to make higher quality gamers with better writing.

First we need to become more careful consumers. EA did this because they knew they could. The people that we already going to buy ME3 were going to buy it no matter what. They had us all hooked. Until we start being more selective they will keep doing this.

Also, the BioWare name means nothing. "BioWare" are making the new C&C Generals game. It is just a word that EA can attach to certain projects now.

I honestly had no idea Amazon had this return policy, and i don't think many other people knew either. Now that i am in the know, why would i ever not buy new releases from Amazon? How is there a used game market if i can return a game i just played through for all my money back?

@Bwast said:

This policy will be changed soon. People are going to abuse the shit out of it if they haven't been already.

Amazon monitors all your returns. If they notice this, they will blacklist you from ordering from their site. I don't mean ban your account. I mean they will refuse to mail parcels to your home address. It isn't worth playing with fire since Amazon has a great customer support service when you do need to do returns or replacements.

Mass Effect had such great potential to be a DS9-esque serial TPS-RPG. It really did. But no, they had to lose the script between sequels, rip out RPG mechanics, shove them back in, do a "Dudebro Dating Sim", let the player make hard choices but then not have that effect any real changes, have a narrative that invites branching paths but top it off with a cauterized single ending, etc.

@Mode7 said:

@Clonedzero said:

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

@Clonedzero said:

@Everyones_A_Critic said:

Nerds be like, mad entitled and shit.

yeah, i hate capitalism too!

I don't have a problem with people being reimbursed for their money if they have a problem with the product. But I think returning a game because you hated the ending is a little extreme.

i just find this notion that "entitled consumer" is a bad thing completely ridiculous. thats the point of capitalism. if bioware starts fucking all their games up (DA2, and now with ME3's horrible ending) then the consumer can and SHOULD be upset by this. the product they bought isn't up to the standards they expected. if they can they SHOULD get their money back. its captialism. if bioware starts sucking, it should lose buisness. thats how captialism works. if gamers start actually demanding higher quality games with better writing, then guess what? that'll push companies to make higher quality gamers with better writing.

First we need to become more careful consumers. EA did this because they knew they could. The people that we already going to buy ME3 were going to buy it no matter what. They had us all hooked. Until we start being more selective they will keep doing this.

Also, the BioWare name means nothing. "BioWare" are making the new C&C Generals game. It is just a word that EA can attach to certain projects now.

I'm waiting for the BioWare NFL Head Coach game.

Well, the whining gets more and more interesting.

Personally, when I had a game where the ending was crap, I just jumped off the franchise wagon. I don't see the point in getting all worked up about something not related to bugs or forced DLC schemes.

And yeah, demanding money back because you didn't like an ending is a bit much. Just don't buy any DLC and don't buy ME4 when that inevitably comes out. That's a better show of discontent than whining like babies.

Thanks for going through the trouble of Confirming this Story Patrick.

All this childish bullshit about the ending(s) is gross and I had hoped GB would ignore the wailing manbabies. But I guess that's generous of Amazon, so good on them.

Patrick Klepek if you knew this was the case with amazon because you had experienced their great customer service why did you feel the need to take it any further just because ME3 was attached to a stupid rumor?

@unstoptheday said:

I can't be the only person who thinks this Mass Effect 3 stuff has gotten way out of hand. Right?

No you are not, blood is going to shoot out of my eyes if i have to hear another twenty something cry baby call for Bioware to give them what the want.

But what makes me hate all this ME3 ending bullshit even more is, there are signs that they are listening to them and may appease them, along with asking for input on DA3. WTF Bioware show some balls and stand up for your product.

@jorojoserojas said:

I...I was pretty okay about the ending. And I had over 55 hours of playtime. Went through the whole series. What was so terrible that I missed?

You shut your mouth! It was garbage and Bioware sucks and ME3 brings down all of the video game community as a whole! It is the most personally offensive thing anyone has ever been witnessed.

jkjk, lol. I'm with you. I had great time with every game in the series.

It's more fun to pretend that the CEO of Amazon is so angry at the ending to Mass Effect 3 that he's allowing everyone to get their money back if they share in his rage.

So you ran with a story by quoting Random Amazon CS Rep #7371 instead of, you know, their PR? Doesn't that seem a little..iffy?

how can the ending be that bad? at least it ends!!!

I returned mine because it's been two weeks and I still can't import my face. I waited, I had most of the important stuff already spoiled for me thanks to the internet and coworkers, and at this point I'm so disgusted with everything surrounding this game that I just don't want to play it anymore. I'll probably borrow it from somebody like I did with Mass Effect 2. At least this time I'll have access to the full game.

Don't worry, they'll still get some money from me when I buy the story DLC.