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Jeff Gerstmann's Top 10 Games of 2013

These are Jeff Gerstmann's 10 freshest games of 2013.

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Jeff Gerstmann is a professional bull-rider and certified Zumba instructor working out of Northern California. When asked to rank his favorite video games for us, his initial response was "heck, I'm game for anything, but I'll tell you kids up front, I haven't played a video game since they got rid of the Total Carnage machine down at the 7-11 on Baywood." We figured that was good enough to come up with a list of 2013's best games. You can follow Jeff on Twitter or Tumblr, if you like. The newly redesigned "jeff gerstmann dot com" is expected to launch in 2014.

Video games were released in 2013. I have attempted to take 10 of the games I liked the most and fashion them into some sort of ordered list. Normally, this isn't an especially difficult process. But, then, very few things that went down in 2013 could be classified as "easy," so why should this list be any different?

If we look back on this year, I think we'll remember it as a year when the big games got bigger and safer while the small games started feeling, well, bigger. That's not to say that this is the first year for "indie" gaming to come into its own. That happened years ago. But those smaller games are getting tighter and sharper and better. The big games aren't exactly slouching, either, but with new consoles pounding their way into stores this year, the games that were forced to straddle the generational line suffered a bit. Also, the big games felt safer. Even Naughty Dog's bold end-of-the-generation send-off, The Last of Us, was built around the well-worn trope of "zombie fun." Obviously, it did a whole lot more with that concept than most games would.

Even with all that in mind, the gap between the big publishers' stuff and the small-team, self-published business felt narrower than before. Is that good or bad? That probably has to do with your own personal interests. I like big games, I like small games. My list ended up having some of each. It almost had Marvel Heroes on it, which I really enjoyed at the time and, upon returning to it recently to check in on its updates, it still seems to be moving in the right direction. Also, I really liked Papers, Please, but I couldn't find a way to get it onto this list ahead of any of these other games. Grand Theft Auto V damn near poked its way onto the list, too.

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10. The Stanley Parable

The Stanley Parable is intensely charming, with enough different paths and endings to make you believe that literally anything you did might have a meaningful impact on where you can go and what you can do. You might stumble into something that resets the game, or you might find yourself trapped in a seemingly endless loop of doors. Something even (sort of) happens if you do nothing. If they'd added a divorce, a treasure map, and karaoke instead of a baby, a fire, and a bomb then we might be looking at a twisted remake of Takeshi no Chousenjou. As someone who can get behind a game that deliberately fucks with the people playing it, The Stanley Parable is absolutely fantastic.

9. The Legend of Zelda: A Link Between Worlds

Sometimes, right before you doze off at night, you think little thoughts like "man, wouldn't it be cool if Nintendo stopped crappin' up the Zelda franchise and just made a direct sequel to an old Zelda game instead?" Then you fall asleep and tend to forget that your brain ever cooked up such a dumb idea. Nintendo has finally listened to those little impulses in the back of your brain by releasing a game that, in Japan, literally has the Japanese name for A Link to the Past ("Triforce of the Gods") with a fat "2" written after it. It builds on that world in inventive ways and lays out some of its progression in a very un-Zelda-like way.

It's weird to think that a throwback to the 16-bit days may be the most forward-looking Zelda in years, but... well, that's exactly what A Link Between Worlds is.

8. Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance

It's short and a little on the simple side once you learn a few different attack timings, but Revengeance shreds through the world of Metal Gear with a zest that feels directly opposite Kojima's standard plodding and contemplative pace. It practically serves up a gigantic walking tank for you to fight during its tutorial, letting you carve up a Metal Gear and setting the tone for a wild and weird adventure through the wilder and weirder world of American politics. By the time you get to the conclusion you'll probably have seen the insides of hundreds of different robot soldiers and you'll definitely have seen Raiden wearing a sombrero.

For a game that went through such a troubled early production, even the late hand-off to Platinum seemed risky. But everything comes together nicely.

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7. Gunpoint

The moments right before you start actively working your way through a level are the best parts of Gunpoint. Getting a moment to glance at a level and start to work out what you're going to need to do to infiltrate, rewire, and escape from a given building makes all the difference. Of course, you can eventually just start rushing through things and making up solutions on the fly, and the game implements extremely frequent auto-saves to let you experiment without any real punishment. This helps make the stealth bits go down smoothly.

Also, diving on a guy from above and just punching the shit out of him is really satisfying.

6. Divekick

Divekick shouldn't be as good as it is. The jokes get a little too inside, the characters get a little too weird, and it's entirely reliant on you finding people to play against, which isn't always guaranteed these days. But it's so incredibly intense that every single hit feels like a shock from a taser. Every loss has you immediately rerunning the events in your head to figure out where you went wrong. And it does all this with two buttons. The dumb gimmick ends up being beautiful in its simplicity and way more involved than you'd expect.

In a way, Divekick feels like the sort of game that couldn't really exist as a commercial product until relatively recently. It's just the kind of tough sell that you'd expect to remain as some free, obscure hidden PC treasure that only a small handful of people ever feasibly play. It'd probably only have keyboard support and the graphics would, somehow, be even worse. That it was actually released onto proper digital storefronts and sold for actual money in hopes of finding an actual audience speaks volumes about the variety of games available to today's game-loving public.

I like Divekick a lot and should probably play more of it.

5. Assassin's Creed IV: Black Flag

How about this for a hell of a turnaround, huh? After Assassin's Creed III it felt like the franchise was just about finished: The last Ezio game sort of stunk up the joint and AC3 came through to finish the job by introducing a bunch of new, bad characters and a bunch of boring tree climbing systems that were probably really hard to build. Meanwhile, Watch Dogs was rolling down the pike with a ton of buzz. It looked like the open world cyber fantasy that I sort of always hoped that Assassin's Creed would properly address someday. Then Watch Dogs apparently didn't come together properly and got pushed way back and an even funnier thing happened: The Assassin's Creed IV team totally turned things around.

AC4 gives you a character you can get interested in and a world that you want to see. It gets close to the light and likable moments of Assassin's Creed II and Brotherhood while giving you a big-ass ship with which to explore a vast world of piratical fun. It mixes in a little hunting and crafting, Far Cry 3-style. And it delivers solid cities with climbable points and enough different gadgets and items to make you feel intensely powerful. Not that you'd need much help in that department, since the combat is really just a flashy set of easily followed prompts designed to make you feel like some kind of raw, murdering machine. You know what? It works.

Wrap that all up in a world that manages to make fun of all the Desmond stuff in a way that almost makes me forgive them for messing up all the Desmond stuff as badly as they did and yeah. I'm back on board, Assassin's Creed. Congrats to the development team (all 20,000 of you) for picking up the ACIII mess and making something useful out of it.

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4. Rogue Legacy

In a year filled with games that made you say "rogue" without actually talking about Rogue, only one had the sheer audacity to put the word "Rogue" in its title. Actually, I don't know if that's true. Rogue Legacy's ties to proper rogue-likes are tenuous at best, but considering we've reached a point where every single game with any sort of consequence for death ever is now billed as a "roguelike" or perhaps even a "roguelike-like," Rogue Legacy is as roguish as it needs to be... and then some.

The skill tree and item system provides the hooks that keep you going and keep you feeling like you're making forward progress in your true quest of beating all of the castle's big, dumb bosses and winning. The random nature of the castle design leads to some wonderful surprises, including an explicit reference to the Konami arcade classic, Pooyan.

The tight control and different character options kept me obsessed with Rogue Legacy until I had completed it a couple of times and it's some of the most enjoyable time I've had with a game this year.

3. Saints Row IV

Is it weird that I have come to care about the characters in a game that treats its characters almost totally carelessly as a core part of its design? In some ways, the cast of Saints Row has become the video game equivalent of the cast of Ocean's Eleven. At this point, I'd probably play just about any game that had those characters in it and trust that the developers behind it would find a way to make it "the right kind of dumb."

Saints Row IV leans a little too heavily on its predecessor and, as a result, doesn't hit as hard as The Third did. But it was still an open-world game done with a fun-first attitude, rather than focusing on various AI behaviors and different ways to make its clockwork city more intricate. It's the Crackdown sequel I thought I very much didn't actually want anymore, cut with a pile of great interactions and left-turns that, these days, only Saints Row can get away with.

2. Antichamber

For me, the best puzzle games use up your brain like a resource. At some point, that resource is fully extinguished and you can't rely on it to help you solve any more parts of the puzzle. You're going to have to step away for a night (or, at least, a few hours) and come back refreshed to proceed. And, when I did that, the parts of Antichamber that tripped me up suddenly became easy, like the answer was rattling around in my stupid head the entire time. Like great puzzle games before it, Antichamber makes you feel smart when you're making progress without making you feel like a complete idiot every time you get stuck.

It also has a great visual style, for the most part, right down to the way it integrates its menus and map into the game's brain-kinking environment. And the various bricklaying tools you acquire and upgrade over the course of the game are simply fun to use. The puzzles are, largely, a joy to solve, and that made me stick with it until I'd seen as much of the game as I could possibly see. Was it 100% of the game? Heck, I don't know. Maybe I should jump back in there and check around, just to make sure I didn't miss anything...

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1. BioShock Infinite

I feel like the people who pick at BioShock Infinite's various paradoxes probably aren't much fun to be around. Those sorts of plot holes pop up in plenty of great multiverse and time-travel fiction. Did you sit outside a theater in 1989 to picket Back to the Future Part II, too?

But whatever, I'm not here to make excuses for BioShock Infinite. It stands on its own just fine. It creates a great-looking, interesting world that's full of mystery and fun to explore. It flips you around to different universes and realities with reckless abandon, letting you work to figure out what, exactly, has changed. It stitches together its story with combat that is, for the most part, fun to engage with, with the game's fast-moving skylines letting you outmaneuver the opposition in some pretty exciting ways. It's an escort mission that doesn't require you to babysit the person you're escorting. And the whole thing comes together in a series of interesting revelations that manage to reframe both the story you just witnessed as well as the BioShock franchise at large. It's a pretty cool trick that left me quite satisfied. It also opens the door for either a million more BioShocks or kills the franchise completely by revealing the universe's One Weird Trick. As weird as this may sound, I hope this leads to the end of BioShock. It's a great way to go out, and it'd be cool to see the team at Irrational create a different type of game.

Jeff Gerstmann on Google+

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chocolaterhinovampire

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Bioshock Infinite was my number 3 GOTY. It did not play well at all and felt super dated in that respect, but I enjoyed the story and world enough to overlook that. Jeff is Jeff. He is super definitive in his opinions and likes what he likes. Great list

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Kinetic_MD

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@josephknows said:

this this this

I like Infinite enough that I have it up on my list at #9, but man did that that game have serious issues with its narrative that doesn't involve the time travel thing.

Bringing up points of racism and revolution and "resolving" them with the gutless "both sides are bad" conclusion is sad.

If you're not going to give those incredibly important and sensitive themes the attention they deserve, then don't bother bringing them up at all.

As Infinite stands, they are merely background elements made to help prop up the world that was in the end about a white man and a white woman's relationship with a time traveling multiverse twist.

It felt cheap because it seems like Levine and co. just brought those issues up in a lame effort to make the game feel "more mature" by tackling them in the manner that they did.

Maybe if they were only brought up in passing, it'd be more forgivable. Of course, the setting makes that impossible. There's also an argument to be made that keeping it all tucked away in such a setting would be even worse.

But going the opposite route that Infinte took is more perilous. By making race and revolution such integral parts in the first half of the plot and the world-building, the blunders are all the more offensive because of the political statement the game ultimately makes with what it presented.

And no, making caricatures of how racist America was in the past isn't daring an indictment of racism at all. It's absolutely the safest route to take because no one would argue against that at all.

If all Infinite's developers could do is to poke fun at centuries old racism and then paint the revolutionaries in the same bad light for rising up in armed struggle, then there is a helluva way to go for them to tell complex and compelling stories using those particular themes.

With all that said, time travel and multiverse stuff was pretty fuckin' awesome.

Combat really could've been less tiring though.

Also great to see the MGR love! Kickass game that's funny and at least takes a simple but firm stance against child soldiers and the insanity of how war fuels modern economies and politics!

I respectfully disagree with most of this.

1) Calling the "both sides are bad" (which in itself doesn't accurately describe what happened) gutless just isn't a very informed opinion. Gutless would've been the oppressed rising up and being benevolent, caring leaders who would never do terrible things to people because they know the pain of oppression, just like is seen in EVERY OTHER MEDIA that deals with this kind of thing. The reality of the world is that oppressed peoples typically rise up and inflict even more pain on their oppressors because they want them to know how much it hurt, revenge and all that junk. Then, without any checks on their power, they go on to do much of the same crap the oppressors did because people in general really aren't all that different. This has repeated itself over and over again, just look at the results of the Arab Spring revolutions for proof, or crack open a history book. Infinite pointing out this fact about people isn't gutless at all. It's just the opposite, in my opinion.

2) The background you describe was indeed there to prop up Booker and Elizabeth's story. That's why it's a background; the story was never about liberation, racism, or any of that. It was about Booker getting Elizabeth out of Columbia. Just because racism and jingoism are present in a story's setting doesn't mean they have to become part of the focal point, and they never were. The characters/groups who represented them did have some prominence, but the story was never ABOUT that stuff, nor was it obligated to be. It was always about Booker and Elizabeth leaving the city while all hell was breaking loose.

3) Race and revolution were NEVER integral parts of the story. They were background elements, plain and simple. I've kind of already addressed this one, but again, the revolution only became important to Booker when it forced him to rely on it for a way out of Columbia. For the greater story, it was there to reinforce the theme of cycles. People oppress people, the oppressed rise up and oppress other people, those oppressed rise up and oppress other people...etc. It happens everywhere.

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unsolvedparadox

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Alrighty, I definitely have a lot of 2013 games to catch up on. Thanks (I think)!

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firecracker22

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I'm surprised that GTA V isn't on Jeff's list. Not because it's 'the best' or anything like that, but because he really seemed to have enjoyed it. He seemed to really love the game. Granted, he was really sour on GTA Online. I guess GTA Online really made Jeff sour on the game.

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Edited By Plipster

Well....Bioshock Infinite was the game I actually cared about this year. So...yeah...

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Phreaker

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Awesome list Jeff!

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Cold_Blooded_Chiller

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I would have gone with the XBox 360 version of Diablo III, but in the spirit of following the guidelines I had GTA and Bioshock on equal footing.

Best character for me was Trevor in GTA, and I hope to hell they bring him back (although unlikely due to a certain endgame decision players must make).

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pirateogta

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GTA V was absolutely robbed! I don't see how the rocky release of GTA Online can detract from the single player experience. Nobody is going online just to play deathmatches with GTA's lock-on targeting, like Jeff always brings up. He does not seem to be aware of the vast amount of content in the multiplayer. There are hundreds of cooperative missions and there is actual progression aside from leveling. If you want to go online and randomly shoot people you can, but there is so much more to it than that. All that aside, the single player experience alone makes it a GOTY contender (and easy winner for me). It's a damn shame to see it snubbed.

Especially with games like Saints Row IV appearing in the list. That is the epitome of lazy game design. So much recycled content... what would have been a DLC made into a full-priced game. GTA V is light years ahead in every facet of open world game design. The sheer quality and scope is unmatched by any other contender this year.

But hey, GTA V is still the highest rated game of the year (and the best-selling to boot). Nothing can change that!

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metalmoog

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Personally I would have pulled Bioshock Infinite off the top spot on the list and replaced it with The Last of Us.

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@jsnyder82 said:

@jasonleeson said:

GTAV not even anywhere in the top 10. I'm finally done with GOTY's. Geoff was the last guy I related to. Now it's over. I'll never care again.

Nobody cares.

Nobody cares about a lot of opinions posted in these comments. Why single this one out? Just curious! You didn't make a very constructive comment and were needlessly rude for seemingly no reason simply because someone said something you disagree with, so I'm guessing there are reasons behind it that I just don't understand. Let me know when you get a chance!

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billyok

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GTAV not even anywhere in the top 10. I'm finally done with GOTY's. Geoff was the last guy I related to. Now it's over. I'll never care again.

Never trust Geoff Jerstmann.

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jsnyder82

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GTAV not even anywhere in the top 10. I'm finally done with GOTY's. Geoff was the last guy I related to. Now it's over. I'll never care again.

Nobody cares.

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@gokumane: You illustrated Jeff's point perfectly with your comment.

"I feel like the people who pick at BioShock Infinite's various paradoxes probably aren't much fun to be around."

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Edited By supaslicer

This list was so dope no joke! I have even purchased Bioshock for friends during steam sales because I felt it is my number 1 game of the year and they should play it as well.

I like how Jeff stirred up a conversation that I felt was SUPER - DEAD.

I went through and found all but 1 voxophone recording, and… for a video game… thought that the story was extremely intriguing and I was one of few who actually liked the ending.

Sure killing Booker at the end doesn't solve the problems for all Elizabeths that exist in all the worlds, but then again, in another universe… Booker and Elizabeth are 2 gangsters cruising down the street in their six-fo' (cannot wait for that DLC).

A multiple worlds theory means anything is possible, and nothing has a bow on it. In saying that, I felt the story was bomb… a giant bomb (see what i did there haha)

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Edited By clush

I can appreciate the 'shut up and have fun!' sentiment as a way to get more enjoyment out of Infinite. It's probably the best way to play it.

However, the game itself doesnt make adopting that mindset an easy thing to do for me. The Luteces are constantly intellectually taunting you and on the whole the game pats itself on the back a bit too much for being so clever. It's kinda like Inception in that way. It challenges you to wrap your mind around a concept, but when you actually put some effort into that, said concept doesnt hold up.

That's why I think comparing it to Back to the Future doesnt fly... that movie doesnt take itself anywhere near as seriously as Infinite seems to do.

It might not even be the game's own fault. I think a lot of the criticism is a reaction to the boatloads of praise the game's 'brilliant story' got from reviewers on release (again, much like Inception). That's gonna draw extra attention to it from the people who play it, and that added scrutiny doesnt necessarily do the game a lot of favors.

Fair play to @jeff for not letting that bother him.

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JasonLeeson

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GTAV not even anywhere in the top 10. I'm finally done with GOTY's. Geoff was the last guy I related to. Now it's over. I'll never care again.

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@humanity: They're still video games. Every video game has its own unique context no matter how different or similar it is to any other game that's ever been released.

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Edited By Humanity

@bluefish said:

@josephknows said:

1) Bringing up points of racism and revolution and "resolving" them with the gutless 1A) "both sides are bad" conclusion is sad.

2) If you're not going to give those incredibly important and sensitive themes the attention they deserve, then don't bother bringing them up at all.

3) As Infinite stands, they are merely background elements made to help prop up the world that was in the end about a white man and a white woman's relationship with a time traveling multiverse twist.

4) It felt cheap because it seems like Levine and co. just brought those issues up in a lame effort to make the game feel "more mature" by tackling them in the manner that they did.

I think you're being overly harsh man. I realize you DO like the game but these complaints are echo'ed (more like shouted from the hilltops) by the haters.
1) It's not their job to resolve racism and I think the game would have been pretty tasteless if it tied itself singularly to racism the way the first one tied itself to Ayn Rand's views. We know the result of a racist culture, it's ours but we're moving away. Touching on racism as part of the portrayed culture gave the player a touchstone to identify with the world, to make it something we understood. Infinite never felt like a thesis statement the way the first one did. Was it weaker for that? Yea, maybe. But it's also a totally different game with different narrative priorities.
1A) This makes no sense. Fitzroy's turn was not connected to her race. Revolutionaries being non-compromising killers is often a reality and acts as commentary on the corruption of power. I don't see it as connected thematically to racism rather I see it as part of the games (much bigger focus) on the imperfection of humans and the abuse of power that comes with it.
2) I feel like racism in America has been pretty covered. And with the way they did it, those themes helped support the joke of Columbia as it mocked a certain slant of American culture.
3) I think this is a huge oversimplification. Does 'Madmen''s 1960's setting just serve as a backdrop for a story about a cool handsome guy destroying himself? Does the 1930's just serve as a background for Indiana Jones punching natives and finding things? I really don't side with that. Infinite is an adventure game and period piece. Is that period fictional? Yea, but I think the spirit is still very much the same.
4) I'm sorry it feels that way. Themes like racism and American exceptional-ism are less delved into than than what we saw in Rapture but this is a different game in the way it handles itself and I feel like, had Bioshock 1 not been made, this game would not be having these criticisms leveled at it so harshly.
Is it perfect? No, but I feel like people are harshing on it for what it isn't rather than what it is.
my 2 cents.

It's kind of a lose-lose situation here in a way if you want to be negative about it. Either you go with the "power corrupts" motif and people complain that is cliched or you go with the sappy "hooray we're free" route and that is an even bigger cliche. In a way it was somewhat bold of them to say "look at this working class struggle to fight their oppressors, and then become worse than they were" - it's not a story that is told very often.

As for race issues on a whole, I believe much like Columbia they were meant to be a mere backdrop to this story about as you say a man and a woman, although pointing out they're white is somewhat irrelevant. At one point you have to be realistic and can't nitpick every choice of "why is Booker white? Why is Elizabeth white? Why is the woman imprisoned? Why does the man have to save the woman?" etc etc. For the purpose of this story, it just so happened that the two main characters were white. In a way it might have been interesting if Elizabeth was in fact African-American which would make her first journey into Columbia an even more striking experience, but even then I'm certain detractors would point out that her race was simply used for shock value.

The first time around the game has quite a powerful effect, to the point where half the internet was excitedly talking about it, which is exactly why it was such a great game. If people want to really sit down and pick apart the plot of the game we can do likewise for anything, Last of Us, Gone Home, anything really and it instantly begins to fall apart.

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infinite was a fun game with a great story and even better ending. That said, the actual gameplay and shooting was a huge stepdown from bioshock1

definitely should be in everyones top 10, but numba 1? nahh

The shooting itself with the new powers wasn't as good as 1 or 2, but the skyhook blows both of the previous games out of the water, at least for me. It made it so much more exciting than the sort-of-clunky plasmid-gun combos of the first game, or the deliberate-and-kinda-boring trap setting of 2. It was faster, frenetic and a joy for someone who loves their shooters to be fast.

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MindChamber

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infinite was a fun game with a great story and even better ending. That said, the actual gameplay and shooting was a huge stepdown from bioshock1

definitely should be in everyones top 10, but numba 1? nahh

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Skytylz

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Edited By Skytylz

@humanity said:

@skytylz said:

@humanity said:

@skytylz: I always said that these games should be kept in separate categories. You cannot judge a two hour experience like Gone Home on the same merits as Infinite or Last of Us. A shorter game of a much more, compact, if not to say limited scope simply doesn't deal with the same challenges that an 8-10 hour games face. If you stretched Gone Home or Brothers into a 10 hour story they would simply not hold up.

So I'm not saying they're bad games, but to keep them in the same category as full feature titles is wrong in my opinion and unfair to teams that built those much more complex and involved undertakings.

Maybe more games should be 2-3 hour experiences then since it seems like those are a lot more interesting. Also, I'm not going to be more forgiving of a games flaws because it is longer I'm going to be more critical.

I think you're not understanding the repercussions here. People don't want to pay $65 for 2-3 hour games, while at the same time they want more quality and quantity in their AAA releases than a $15 game can provide. Making a story last 8-10 hours without feeling drawn out or artificial is much harder than accomplishing the same in 2 hours time - this is something that you either are ignoring or don't understand? It's perfectly ok to be critical of storytelling but you understand the difference right?

The challenge in an 8-10 hour game is usually more to do with keeping the mechanics interesting as that is usually the reason the game is longer. Also, you don't have to worry about a story feeling drawn out if you write a story that is appropriate for the length that you are going to tell it. There are lots of great TV seasons that are probably 8-10 hours that don't feel drawn out and tell a single narrative. Therefore I'm going to be just as critical no matter the length and would rather have a great short experience than a drawn out ok one.

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bluefish

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1) Bringing up points of racism and revolution and "resolving" them with the gutless 1A) "both sides are bad" conclusion is sad.

2) If you're not going to give those incredibly important and sensitive themes the attention they deserve, then don't bother bringing them up at all.

3) As Infinite stands, they are merely background elements made to help prop up the world that was in the end about a white man and a white woman's relationship with a time traveling multiverse twist.

4) It felt cheap because it seems like Levine and co. just brought those issues up in a lame effort to make the game feel "more mature" by tackling them in the manner that they did.

I think you're being overly harsh man. I realize you DO like the game but these complaints are echo'ed (more like shouted from the hilltops) by the haters.
1) It's not their job to resolve racism and I think the game would have been pretty tasteless if it tied itself singularly to racism the way the first one tied itself to Ayn Rand's views. We know the result of a racist culture, it's ours but we're moving away. Touching on racism as part of the portrayed culture gave the player a touchstone to identify with the world, to make it something we understood. Infinite never felt like a thesis statement the way the first one did. Was it weaker for that? Yea, maybe. But it's also a totally different game with different narrative priorities.
1A) This makes no sense. Fitzroy's turn was not connected to her race. Revolutionaries being non-compromising killers is often a reality and acts as commentary on the corruption of power. I don't see it as connected thematically to racism rather I see it as part of the games (much bigger focus) on the imperfection of humans and the abuse of power that comes with it.
2) I feel like racism in America has been pretty covered. And with the way they did it, those themes helped support the joke of Columbia as it mocked a certain slant of American culture.
3) I think this is a huge oversimplification. Does 'Madmen''s 1960's setting just serve as a backdrop for a story about a cool handsome guy destroying himself? Does the 1930's just serve as a background for Indiana Jones punching natives and finding things? I really don't side with that. Infinite is an adventure game and period piece. Is that period fictional? Yea, but I think the spirit is still very much the same.
4) I'm sorry it feels that way. Themes like racism and American exceptional-ism are less delved into than than what we saw in Rapture but this is a different game in the way it handles itself and I feel like, had Bioshock 1 not been made, this game would not be having these criticisms leveled at it so harshly.
Is it perfect? No, but I feel like people are harshing on it for what it isn't rather than what it is.
my 2 cents.
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bluefish

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Edited By bluefish

@thesoutherndandy said:

@theger said:

Jeff knows it. Eff all ya Binfinite haters.

Word. Glad to see it getting the love it deserves.

I literally said "NO DUCKING WAY" out loud seeing the end of that list. ...but with an 'F'

Jeff and I's taste fall on opposite sides of the fence way more often than not but gosh he never fails to surprise me. That old friggin weirdo.

Much love Bioshock!

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Humanity

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@skytylz said:

@humanity said:

@skytylz: I always said that these games should be kept in separate categories. You cannot judge a two hour experience like Gone Home on the same merits as Infinite or Last of Us. A shorter game of a much more, compact, if not to say limited scope simply doesn't deal with the same challenges that an 8-10 hour games face. If you stretched Gone Home or Brothers into a 10 hour story they would simply not hold up.

So I'm not saying they're bad games, but to keep them in the same category as full feature titles is wrong in my opinion and unfair to teams that built those much more complex and involved undertakings.

Maybe more games should be 2-3 hour experiences then since it seems like those are a lot more interesting. Also, I'm not going to be more forgiving of a games flaws because it is longer I'm going to be more critical.

I think you're not understanding the repercussions here. People don't want to pay $65 for 2-3 hour games, while at the same time they want more quality and quantity in their AAA releases than a $15 game can provide. Making a story last 8-10 hours without feeling drawn out or artificial is much harder than accomplishing the same in 2 hours time - this is something that you either are ignoring or don't understand? It's perfectly ok to be critical of storytelling but you understand the difference right?

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Skytylz

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@humanity said:

@skytylz: I always said that these games should be kept in separate categories. You cannot judge a two hour experience like Gone Home on the same merits as Infinite or Last of Us. A shorter game of a much more, compact, if not to say limited scope simply doesn't deal with the same challenges that an 8-10 hour games face. If you stretched Gone Home or Brothers into a 10 hour story they would simply not hold up.

So I'm not saying they're bad games, but to keep them in the same category as full feature titles is wrong in my opinion and unfair to teams that built those much more complex and involved undertakings.

Maybe more games should be 2-3 hour experiences then since it seems like those are a lot more interesting. Also, I'm not going to be more forgiving of a games flaws because it is longer I'm going to be more critical.

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Humanity

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Edited By Humanity

@skytylz: I always said that these games should be kept in separate categories. You cannot judge a two hour experience like Gone Home on the same merits as Infinite or Last of Us. A shorter game of a much more, compact, if not to say limited scope simply doesn't deal with the same challenges that an 8-10 hour games face. If you stretched Gone Home or Brothers into a 10 hour story they would simply not hold up.

So I'm not saying they're bad games, but to keep them in the same category as full feature titles is wrong in my opinion and unfair to teams that built those much more complex and involved undertakings.

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evan_buchholz

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"I feel like the people who pick at BioShock Infinite's various paradoxes probably aren't much fun to be around. Those sorts of plot holes pop up in plenty of great multiverse and time-travel fiction. Did you sit outside a theater in 1989 to picket Back to the Future Part II, too?"

I think what Jeff is saying is... that Biff Tannen should have ruled Columbia and that game would have been way better...

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Seanakin66

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Audemus patria nostra [sic] defendere. 'Nuff said.

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Saints Row IV! Easily the most fun I've had all year is on that game. Plus, that game is completely hilarious.

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divergence

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Edited By divergence

Bioshock infinite bummed me. I reached a point (much like AC III) that the game just bored me and I couldn;t' continue on. Oh well, maybe I missed the best parts. I'm just now getting in to AC IV and liking iit (with some caveats) but I think I'll actually finish it. Antichamber- man what a mind-bender. Didn't finish it as it kind of broke my pea-brain. But loved what I did play of it.

Overall, I don't have much to play on my Xbox One, although from what I'm seeing from AC IV I think the future looks bright. Considering the publisher's comments regarding the next one in the series, I look forward to seeing what AC V looks like. And we wont have to wait soon, normally they seem to unveil and start pumping the next AC game in the first couple months of the year.

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@atwa said:

Did you sit outside a theater in 1989 to picket Back to the Future Part II, too?

No, my problem with Bioshock Infinite was never the plot holes, dumb leaps of logic, any lack of pacing and bad character development.

Then you are not the person that message was directed at, so stop being so defensive.

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Chrisiscool

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Never bleach your hair ever

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Shingro

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Edited By Shingro

Bioshock is an excellent example of a shooter, it's the full package, a story that's not disposable whether you agree it was a good idea or not, fantastic characters, interesting concepts executed on well (music, storyline, cycles, skylines, tears.) even good combat (skylines should frankly be a design nightmare as far as AI and design are concerned, but they aren't the hot mess they should be first run.)

Compared against almost any other shooter created in the last year, or even last few years it'd stand tall among the best or at very least most ambitious, which usually awards a grudging respect. If Bioshock Infinite was a new IP by an unknown developer I feel a lot of people's complaints would become muted.

It feels to me like hating it became a weird aversion fad. Most of the arguments are exactly the same and lack personal texture. Like people are reading similar critiques and just adopting it wholesale for social status reasons. Sorta like how very few people REALLY care about Justin beiber one way or another, but intentionally amplify their dislike.

That's probably not true in every case, just a thought. I'm probably talking crazy.

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I'm super shocked Killer Instinct didn't make number 10. Maybe that would have been too on the nose though.

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If all Infinite's developers could do is to poke fun at centuries old racism and then paint the revolutionaries in the same bad light for rising up in armed struggle, then there is a helluva way to go for them to tell complex and compelling stories using those particular themes.

This criticism always comes across to me as incredibly naive. From the French Revolution to the Russian Revolution, and from the Taliban to Zimbabwe, the vast majority of violent revolutions and uprisings tend to end in the opposing faction becoming more and more radicalized until it ends up committing greater atrocities than the oppressor. Yet by recognizing this reality, Bioshock apparently offends people by upsetting their neat little world view where there's only black and white, wrong and right. Bioshock does not suggest that revolutions are inherently wrong, yet because it actually portrays a very common consequence of them it suddenly is supporting the oppressors? Again --- naive as hell.