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When Passions Flare, Lines Are Crossed [UPDATED]

One player's heated rhetoric about sexual harassment in the fighting community causes a furious debate, one that has Capcom apologizing.

UPDATE: Bakhtanians has issued a statement in the wake of today's coverage. Read it here.

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“This is a community that’s, you know, 15 or 20-years-old and the sexual harassment is part of a culture,” said competitive fighting game player Aris "Aris" Bakhtanians on a recent live stream for Capcom's Cross Assault show, “and if you remove that from the fighting game community, it’s not the fighting game community.”

Capcom has since apologized for comments made during a conversation on sexual harassment in the fighting game community, which that quote was pulled from. It was a discussion focused on Bakhtanians, and took place during a recent episode of the company’s Cross Assault reality show. It’s part of a promotion for Street Fighter X Tekken.

Cross Assault started with 10 contestants divided into two teams, Team Tekken and Team Street Fighter. The final four contestants will be determined today, and the last matches begin March 3.

A reader initially pointed out the inflammatory commentary, which took place during day five.

Bakhtanians is the head of Team Tekken, and was engaged in a conversation that chiefly involved Twitch.tv community manager Jared Rea. Twitch.tv is hosting the daily streaming of the day-long Cross Assault episodes.

“The views and opinions expressed by cast members in the live internet program 'Cross Assault' do not reflect those of Capcom,” said a Capcom spokesperson in a statement issued to me last night. “As a company, Capcom believes that everyone should be treated with respect. This particular issue was brought to our attention and has been addressed. We sincerely apologize to anyone that was offended by any comments expressed during the show.”

You can listen to the conversation by fast forwarding to one hour and 45 minutes into the following video. A user on YouTube also collected a series of comments made by Bakhtanians on day one.

For example: "Miranda, I wanna know your bra size."

Tensions were immediately raised over Rea's suggestion the fighting game community, once insular and limited but now steadily growing year-over-year, was potentially alienating outsiders from becoming fans of fighting games or the competitive scene because of inappropriate sexual language. Bakhtanians took issue with Rea's criticism.

Here’s a lengthy transcript of their exchange:

Rea: You know what it is, to be honest with you? We’re getting older. Do you really want to keep hanging around with a bunch of [guys in their] early 20s who don’t know how to treat one another with respect? That’s what it is.

Bakhtanians: Alright, man. The thing is...if you don’t like the scene, how it is right now, it just seems like you’re trying to create...turn it into something that it’s not, and it’s never going to be. You know what I mean?

Rea: That’s really unfortunate [inaudible]...the way it is right now, they want to enjoy fighting games, but they’re so incredibly turned off by [the language].

Bakhtanians: This doesn’t involve me, Jared, I don’t know if you can hear me--this is Aris. This doesn’t really involve me, but if you don’t like onions, you get your sandwich without onions, man. I mean, this is the fighting game community.

Rea: Can I get my Street Fighter without sexual harassment?

Bakhtanians: You can’t. You can’t because they’re one and the same thing. This is a community that’s, you know, 15 or 20 years old, and the sexual harassment is part of a culture, and if you remove that from the fighting game community, it’s not the fighting game community--it’s StarCraft. There’s nothing wrong with StarCraft if you enjoy it, and there’s nothing wrong with anything about eSports, but why would you want just one flavor of ice cream, you know? There’s eSports for people who like eSports, and there’s fighting games for people who like spicy food and like to have fun. There’s no reason to turn them into the same thing, you know?

You can’t go to the NBA and say “hey, I like basketball, but I don’t want them to play with a basketball, I want them to play with a football.” It just doesn’t...it doesn’t make sense to have that attitude, you know? These things are established for years. That would be like someone from the fighting game community going over to StarCraft and trying to say “hey, StarCraft, you guys are too soft, let’s start making sexual harassment jokes to each other on StarCraft.” That’s not cool, people wouldn’t like that. StarCraft isn’t like that. People would get defensive, and that’s what you’re trying to do the fighting game community, and it’s not right. It’s ethically wrong.

I know that you’re thinking “what do you know about ethics? You say racial stuff and sexist stuff.” But those are jokes and if you were really a member of the fighting game community, you would know that. You would know that these are jokes.

Rea: So, ensuring that we alienate any and all female viewers...that’s the ethical thing to do?

Bakhtanians: Well, you know, there are layers here, if you think about this. There are layers of ethics. There are people who are racist and commit hate crimes, right? And then there are people who are racist but they have tons of friends of all colors and they have deep love for those friends. Do you think those people are one and the same? Absolutely not.

StarCraft was brought up several times during the discussion of fighting games role in the larger eSports movement, specifically in regards to what lessons the community should and should not learn from its popularity.

I reached out to Bakhtanians to discuss his comments on Cross Assault, but he didn't respond.

When I contacted Capcom, I included a transcript of the relevant conversation. The company told me the cast and crew had been informed that “any inappropriate or disrespectful comments will not be tolerated during filming.”

Upon receiving the statement from Capcom, I forwarded it in full to Bakhtanians. No response.

And there is one very important fact about this whole story: Cross Assault is not a male-only event. There are two females: Team Street Fighter’s Sherry “Sherryjenix” Nhan and Team Tekken’s Miranda “Super_Yan” Pakozdi.

During the exchange, as matches raged in the background, Pakozdi chimed in about Bakhtanians’ explanation for the pervasiveness of inappropriate sexual language within fighting game culture.

“It hurts the community,” she said.

Everyone in the stream made reference to Keystone events at the San Jose Bar & Grill in San Jose, California, a spot that’s reportedly known for its more crass comments about during play. Pakozdi acknowledged it was an issue during Keystone events, but that it never went, from her perspective, over the line.

“You don’t know where the line is,” she declared.

“My point is is where I’m from, in our arcade, our line may be different than yours,” responded Bakhtanians, “but the point is that fighting games are never gonna be the same as StarCraft, it’s never gonna be the same. You can’t turn basketball into baseball, no matter what you do.”

Rea said sexual harassment was less of an issue in the StarCraft community, a point that others, including Bakhtanians, pushed back on. He conceded. Regardless, he argued, private matches can’t be controlled, but the actions of the participants and audience members raised the real concern.

Again, here’s a snippet:

Rea: When I go to MSL or MLG and someone blows up a ghost [Starcraft], does someone go “Yeah, rape that bitch!”?

[group laughter]

Bakhtanians: But, you know, Jared, you’re right. But if there was that much money being spent on Street Fighter, it wouldn’t be happening here, either, you know. There would be more rules, there would be security here, it’s not the same thing. It’s not the same thing.

Rea: When I go to SoCal regionals and I see a Phoenix [from Marvel vs. Capcom 3] on main stage getting blown up and there’s some dude in the audience just yelling “Bitch! Bitch!” every time she gets hit and then she killed and goes “Yeah, rape that bitch!” Yeah, that’s totally acceptable! Really? Really? You’re going to tell me that’s acceptable?

Bakhtanians: Look, man. What is unacceptable about that? There’s nothing unacceptable about that. These are people, we’re in America, man, this isn’t North Korea. We can say what we want. People get emotional.

There was some light discussion after this, but it mostly trailed off.

Pakozdi, who was assigned to work with Bakhtanians as part of Team Tekken, did not simply blow things off. Like many people, she signed onto Twitter and expressed disappointment over the day’s events. She eventually deleted much of her commentary, but it was captured by the same reader who tipped me off to this in the first place.

“I hope my mom isn’t disappointed with all of this shit,” reads one tweet.

“Capcom and the stream teams know and they don’t care. I just gotta wait 2 more days,” reads another.

“I’m not leaving because by contract I have to stay here 2 more days. If it were up to me I would have left long ago," she said.

Bakhtanians is a well known in the community, explaining his Cross Assault involvement.

I reached out to Pakozdi, but she did not respond.

Day six of Cross Assault took place yesterday. Pakozdi played, but if you start watching around eight hours and 32 minutes into the stream, where she's playing as Balrog, she doesn't even attack. She just pushes forward on the stick. This continues in the next matches, where she plays as Ken using the same "strategy."

Essentially, she's given up.

Per the rules of the show, she would then have to face off against John "Dr. Sub-Zero" Rockafeller, who was already eliminated. If he beat her in three out of five matches, he would be "revived."

Instead, she forfeited. Moments after she bowed out, Rockafeller looked over and handed his prizes over to her.

“I would like to donate everything to Super_Yan for being an angel,” he said.

Bakhtanians also contributes the website Avoiding the Puddle and the site’s associated Twitter account.

“esports,” he wrote last night.

Previously, however, he did have his own personal Twitter account. What’s listed in his bio?

“Fuck you.”

Patrick Klepek on Google+
1225 Comments
Posted by moregrammarplz

@Pinworm45 said:

He's done similar if not worse things to other people. None of them cared and found it funny. Why should he and his friends all change the culture they've created to satisfy ONE person out of political correctness - something he actively wants to avoid in his community?

Because the 'culture' he's created is fucking garbage and needs to be replaced with something civilized.

Edited by Phonics

Lets completely ignore the fact that the FGC is one of the biggest real life trolling fests where everyone gets blown up all the time. If you can't handle someone telling you that they are going to sniff your hair if you lose then maybe you're in the wrong place. In her audition she claimed that shes into the fighting game community but still she would crack because of Aris acting creepy? What bullshit, she knew she couldn't hack it at the game and didn't really want to be there and this is why this came out. Even Sherry called her soft.

I just feel for the amazing people that could of been on the show instead of her. Regardless of what kind of criticism this brings from various clueless journalists (Jim Sterling) or eeeeesports people, who have ZERO clue what they are talking about, fighting games will continue to bring the hype and big personalities, something other 'esports' still can't do.

Also lets not mention that aris is known for acting creepy and doing this to everyone including sherry, mike ross and tastysteve. Stay free 'journalists'

Posted by leejunfan83

This article doesn't belong on Giant bomb

Posted by Pinworm45

@clientkiller said:

Patrick, I'm really glad you're highlighting this kind of harassment in video games. If the industry is to be taken seriously by the world then it means everyone involved needs to take responsibility to stop this kind of thing from being seen as "normal". Playing games online gives anonymity and the free reign to be sexist, racist and homophobic without consequence.

Do you even understand what's going on? This didn't happen "online", it wasn't even close to Anonymous, this article has nothing to do with either of those things, and nothing that happened was even close to Sexist, Racist, or Homophobic.

Posted by Lunar_Aura

@Pinworm45 said:

@jasondesante said:

some homo virgin rips on girls because he is fat and hideous and half retarded. Just put him in a corner and let him have his tantrum. Girls that play fighting games are just as cool as guys that play fighting games. Trash talk in fighting games is a last resort for those who aren't comfortable playing the game.

He insults men just as much as girls.. just no one gives a shit about that. People have to white knight girls, which is sexist itself, because it's implying that women can't handle trash talk, which apparently this one couldn't. Pretty fucking ironic that you proceed to call this guy a "homo virgin" who can't get girls because he is fat, as if that is somehow any less sexist than anything he has ever said. it is in fact more sexist, because his "sexism" was merely gendered insults like "bitch".

Thank you for this.

Posted by astonish

What a douche.

Posted by mfpantst
@Kratch said:

There is a difference between trash talking and making fun of people, and being sexist or racist in a hurtful way. If you have to resort to sexism or racism to trash talk, you're probably not very good at it.

This.  Also, if you want to split hairs I think the possibility exists there's a place for 'smack talk' in the vein of talking about how you're beating a player, even using sexual phrasing (like raping) and I think tons of smart people could argue that point until we're all blue in the face.  But seriously?  Talking about someone's bra size?  Talking about having two girls mudwrestle and you 'take home' the winner?  a) how is that "trash talk" even remotely? and b) I guess when this dude was in high school and he tried to feel up some girl he thought was hot nobody stepped in and put his nuts in his throat.  I'm shocked that doesn't happen when he's in a room.  I mean he's a big guy, but that just means bad fucking knees right?
 
Also
@rmanthorp said:

I'm SO mad you reported on this. YOU GIVE THEM WHAT THEY WANT!


Seriously, Patrick.  Great article.  Great series of articles for a while now.  Good job. (or GG!!!!!?)
Posted by dudeglove

Just a sample of the racist/sexist remarks I've received after a couple of SFIV matches.

Posted by Pinworm45

@moregrammarplz said:

@Pinworm45 said:

He's done similar if not worse things to other people. None of them cared and found it funny. Why should he and his friends all change the culture they've created to satisfy ONE person out of political correctness - something he actively wants to avoid in his community?

Because the 'culture' he's created is fucking garbage and needs to be replaced with something civilized.

I think the PC culture is fucking garbage and needs to be replaced with something I prefer.

Who the fuck are you to dictate what a group of people can and can not enjoy? Who the fuck are you to be this moral arbiter? How about you exercise your rights to ignore that which you don't like, and partake in that which you do? I'm not going out of my way to force you and your group of friends to swear do whatever you don't like, show me the same respect (or at least that's what I'd say if I was part of their group, I'm not)

Posted by Snorlaaax

@Aohnonono said:

@Snorlaaax said:

Clearly, you haven't watched. Or else, you would've known Aris was "harassing" everyone. Mike Ross, Kor, and Ricky Ortiz. And when someone said maybe he was going too far with Miranda, SHE shrugged it off and laughed. Dismissing it as if it wasn't anything. Also, he sniffed Mike Ross; where were you then, white knight?

Sniffing Mike Ross and harassing other people isn't cool either, you complete and utter tool. Miranda did speak up on day 2 and Capcom REPRIMANDED ARIS ABOUT IT! This is a direct quote from sp00ky this morning. He continued to be a dick and Capcom did nothing.

Kid, I know you want really bad to be that guy in this situation, but seriously, you will get nothing out of playing white knight. You never do. You're closing your eyes and refusing to look at the situation from all angles. Which is fine---just don't complain to me when people call you out for being very naive.

Posted by Philzpilz

That was fairly despicable

Posted by McQuinn
@Pinworm45

@Deusoma said:

@Pinworm45 said:

@WilliamHenry said:

@McQuinn said:

Aris is the captain because he is the biggest supporter of the 3D fighting game community. He is definitely an ass, but he does it jokingly and not insultingly although pretty blunt and childish. Making fun of people is a part of the fighting game community and it is there to build competition and hype. Everyone knew Aris was going to act like that. Sherry, the other female contestant, looked quite pissed that Miranda forfeited.

Why is being an intolerate asshole part of the FGC? Why can't people be respectful of others and treat everyone fairly? I'm not saying you can't rib each other, but you don't have to be an complete asshole when you do it. Your comments shouldn't make someone else feel uncomfortable. Giving the dude a pass because he's joking and does it to everyone isn't acceptable. Saying it as a joke does not automatically make it okay to say. If thats how the community operates, why would anyone ever want to become a part of it?

He does treat everyone fairly. he smacktalks to everyone equally. It's part of his scene.

Being horrible to everyone may be "being fair" inasmuch that it's balanced, but it is absolutely not "treating people fairly"; treating a person fairly means to treat them with respect and dignity. The fact that he is an asshole to everyone instead of just to some people doesn't negate the fact that he's still an asshole. WilliamHenry was absolutely correct.

He's doing it in jest and it's part of the culture. He's hardly the only one who does it, and it's the type of culture that he and his peers enjoy. Who are you to tell them to change?

Look, as fat creepy looking guy, Aris isn't a bad guy, just an immature one from the old school arcade scene. He expects people to reciprocate because getting people heated is fun and hype. Some people are soft, but Aris won't change the way he is because he's been around since soul calibur 1.
Posted by CornishRocker

It's people like that who keep me from playing fighting games online. They certainly don't allow for much growth in their communities outside of people clearly stuck in an early teen mindset.

Posted by Mdk5631

who cares?

Posted by Aohnonono

@Phonics said:

Lets completely ignore the fact that the FGC is one of the biggest real life trolling fests where everyone gets blown up all the time. If you can't handle someone telling you that they are going to sniff your hair if you lose then maybe you're in the wrong place. In her audition she claimed that shes into the fighting game community but still she would crack because of Aris acting creepy? What bullshit, she knew she couldn't hack it at the game and didn't really want to be there and this is why this came out. Even Sherry called her soft.

I just feel for the amazing people that could of been on the show instead of her. Regardless of what kind of criticism this brings from various clueless journalists (Jim Sterling) or eeeeesports people, who have ZERO clue what they are talking about, fighting games will continue to bring the hype and big personalities, something other 'esports' still can't do.

Sherry's an uncle tom and she wasn't there in the room whle Miranda was being harassed by aris, she has no say in how super__yan felt or should feel. The fact that you're trying to blame the victim is utterly disgusting. You're blaming Miranda for wasting a spot, you're saying she should have known she was going to be constantly sexually harassed by Aris upon accepting an invitation to the show. Get real.

Posted by whatthegeek

@Figyg: I'm not sure I get your point - women are equal as long as they dress conservatively and are depicted as such in video games?

Or is your point that sexual harassment exists because sexy women are just too damned attractive not to get harassed?

It doesn't matter how the women in the game are depicted, it doesn't matter how the women being harassed were dressed, it doesn't matter how old the harasser is - sexual harassment is wrong. Period - end of story. There's no qualifier here - it's not OK to sexually harass someone because Cammy made you all hot and bothered. By putting qualifiers on when and how sexual harassment can be OK you're essentially validating sexual misconduct of all kinds, and that's a douchey thing to do.

Posted by bloodsoul5

This article is bullshit. As someone who has watched FGC tournament streams for a few years now, I can safely say Aris does not represent the community. This is being blown way the fuck out of the proportion.

Posted by RedEyesBlueBunny

it's really unfortunate what happened, but i still love Aris. he took this one a little too far though. It was a very unlucky situation for Miranda who seems like a very sweet and sensitive person, and that's not the kind of person that Aris knows how to deal with.

Posted by bybeach

I'm confused,why can't it be 'Fuck em up!' as oppossed to 'Rape that bitch'. sounds like somebody has something on their mind when they get emotional, just not the idea you are going to rip your opponent a new asshole.. Though lines do get frequently crossed, war isn't to rape, it is to kill. This is sort of the same mentality, right? Notice how much class we view people who rape in war? 
 
Just wondering.
Edited by Pinworm45

@Aohnonono said:

@Phonics said:

Lets completely ignore the fact that the FGC is one of the biggest real life trolling fests where everyone gets blown up all the time. If you can't handle someone telling you that they are going to sniff your hair if you lose then maybe you're in the wrong place. In her audition she claimed that shes into the fighting game community but still she would crack because of Aris acting creepy? What bullshit, she knew she couldn't hack it at the game and didn't really want to be there and this is why this came out. Even Sherry called her soft.

I just feel for the amazing people that could of been on the show instead of her. Regardless of what kind of criticism this brings from various clueless journalists (Jim Sterling) or eeeeesports people, who have ZERO clue what they are talking about, fighting games will continue to bring the hype and big personalities, something other 'esports' still can't do.

Sherry's an uncle tom and she wasn't there in the room whle Miranda was being harassed by aris, she has no say in how super__yan felt or should feel. The fact that you're trying to blame the victim is utterly disgusting. You're blaming Miranda for wasting a spot, you're saying she should have known she was going to be constantly sexually harassed by Aris upon accepting an invitation to the show. Get real.

Someone who was "trash-talked at" - particularly with a group that's known for mutual, jest trash talk - isn't a victim. The very proposition is insulting to people who are actually victims.

Posted by Phonics

@Aohnonono said:

@Phonics said:

Lets completely ignore the fact that the FGC is one of the biggest real life trolling fests where everyone gets blown up all the time. If you can't handle someone telling you that they are going to sniff your hair if you lose then maybe you're in the wrong place. In her audition she claimed that shes into the fighting game community but still she would crack because of Aris acting creepy? What bullshit, she knew she couldn't hack it at the game and didn't really want to be there and this is why this came out. Even Sherry called her soft.

I just feel for the amazing people that could of been on the show instead of her. Regardless of what kind of criticism this brings from various clueless journalists (Jim Sterling) or eeeeesports people, who have ZERO clue what they are talking about, fighting games will continue to bring the hype and big personalities, something other 'esports' still can't do.

Sherry's an uncle tom and she wasn't there in the room whle Miranda was being harassed by aris, she has no say in how super__yan felt or should feel. The fact that you're trying to blame the victim is utterly disgusting. You're blaming Miranda for wasting a spot, you're saying she should have known she was going to be constantly sexually harassed by Aris upon accepting an invitation to the show. Get real.

Don't worry dude I'm sure she'll hold your hand if you defend her hard enough.

Posted by Sword5

@Conceited: What did Jared do? He always seemed like a dirt bag outside of his Giantbomb appearances.

Posted by moregrammarplz

@Pinworm45 said:

I think the PC culture is fucking garbage and needs to be replaced with something I prefer.

Who the fuck are you to dictate what a group of people can and can not enjoy? Who the fuck are you to be this moral arbiter? How about you exercise your rights to ignore that which you don't like, and partake in that which you do? I'm not going out of my way to force you and your group of friends to swear do whatever you don't like, show me the same respect (or at least that's what I'd say if I was part of their group, I'm not)

But you don't deserve respect. All you do is insult each other and do hateful shit like chant "BITCH BITCH BITCH" when a woman is playing.

I don't care about your culture. Just because eSports wants to be an exclusive little club doesn't exempt them from having to act like decent human beings. Same goes for all the other similar communities that eSports apologists cite as evidence that it's okay to act like complete shitheads.

Posted by NancyDrewFan123

@Conceited said:

Great, now a bunch of people who have no idea what happened and have no perspective on this because they aren't involved in the FGC will blow this infinitely out of proportion and think the FGC is filled with scumbags. While I realize Aris is largely to blame for this, this article did not need to be written. Why not do a positive piece on how awesome the FGC is? How accepting they are of Ricky Ortiz (openly gay) and Kayopolice? (Trans-gendered)

I don't know if you're going to win your argument by pointing out two people that are both constantly the object of ridicule and scorn within the fighting game community. I mean, even the "nice" members of the FGC have some not cool things to say about Kayo: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GU378JRzsuU

Posted by Grondoth

Wow, these comments are reminding me how terrible video game people are with gender issues. For a hobby that embraces technological innovation, a big chunk of you guys are pretty backwards. Harassment isn't tolerable. Sexism isn't funny or acceptable. We've got to grow up as a community.

Posted by Alkaiser

@pekoe212 said:

@Pinworm45 said:

@jasondesante said:

some homo virgin rips on girls because he is fat and hideous and half retarded. Just put him in a corner and let him have his tantrum. Girls that play fighting games are just as cool as guys that play fighting games. Trash talk in fighting games is a last resort for those who aren't comfortable playing the game.

He insults men just as much as girls.. just no one gives a shit about that. People have to white knight girls, which is sexist itself, because it's implying that women can't handle trash talk, which apparently this one couldn't. Pretty fucking ironic that you proceed to call this guy a "homo virgin" who can't get girls because he is fat, as if that is somehow any less sexist than anything he has ever said. it is in fact more sexist, because his "sexism" was merely gendered insults like "bitch".

The difference to me, is that usually men are insulted for not being "man" enough, i.e. being like a woman. And a woman is insulted for....being a woman. That's why it can really hurt sometimes. That my membership in the other 50% of the population can be used as an "insult" against me, a "weakness," you can't really dismiss someone's worth at a more basic level.

I don't really have anything to add to this issue except for the fact that I can feel the my blood pressure spike up everytime I hear the term 'white knighting.' Because apparently guys are only offended by sexism because they want to get laid.

And not, you know, because they've had something bad happen to someone they care about like their mom or someone similar who was victimized for being a woman. Or a friend who was bullied for being a 'bitch' or 'slut' and ended up doing something to hurt themselves out of shame or sadness.

Shit like racism or sexism shouldn't be tolerated by anyone, male or female.

Posted by unreal999

Patric is taking shit out of context. Seriously read up and do research before making shit up. Also, opinion of ARIS does not reflect on entire fighting game scene. But this post is from somebody from the outside, who has no idea what is going on.

Posted by wjb

"Sometimes people sexually harass other people, and some people like ketchup on their fries. Some people say the n-word and want to rid the world of minorities, some people like Pepsi."

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. Hold on, professor, you're making TOO MUCH SENSE to the class.

There was a time when gamers did not want to be identified as loser nerds who live in their mom's basement; now it's assholes who cannot begin to comprehend the horrible things they say out loud, and make piss-poor excuses to justify their ignorance. That's what I'm ashamed of.

Online
Posted by Lazyaza

Duke Nukem would be proud of this guy. =P

Edited by Mattalorian

This is horribly depressing. Does Aris honestly believe that being a disrespectful asshole is an integral part of the fighting game community? His comments are uneducated, juvenile, and disgusting. Fuck that arrogant asshole.

Posted by Luddite

Ever notice how the freedom of speech used to defend people's right to not be politically correct (read: deliberately rude) is somehow not a defense for calling them out on it. You're free to be an asshole, I'm free to call you one. I know which side of that equation I want to be on.

Online
Posted by thegoldencat7

What an asshole. It would be a shame if people assume he represents the FGC.

Posted by Aohnonono

@Pinworm45 said:

@Aohnonono said:

@Phonics said:

Lets completely ignore the fact that the FGC is one of the biggest real life trolling fests where everyone gets blown up all the time. If you can't handle someone telling you that they are going to sniff your hair if you lose then maybe you're in the wrong place. In her audition she claimed that shes into the fighting game community but still she would crack because of Aris acting creepy? What bullshit, she knew she couldn't hack it at the game and didn't really want to be there and this is why this came out. Even Sherry called her soft.

I just feel for the amazing people that could of been on the show instead of her. Regardless of what kind of criticism this brings from various clueless journalists (Jim Sterling) or eeeeesports people, who have ZERO clue what they are talking about, fighting games will continue to bring the hype and big personalities, something other 'esports' still can't do.

Sherry's an uncle tom and she wasn't there in the room whle Miranda was being harassed by aris, she has no say in how super__yan felt or should feel. The fact that you're trying to blame the victim is utterly disgusting. You're blaming Miranda for wasting a spot, you're saying she should have known she was going to be constantly sexually harassed by Aris upon accepting an invitation to the show. Get real.

Someone who was "trash-talked at" - particularly with a group that's known for mutual, jest trash talk - isn't a victim. The very proposition is insulting to people who are actually victims.

It wasn't just trash talk dude, he touched her inappropriately (eg: threatened to sniff her hair and then literally did so when she lost a match). When she left the room upset he said, without her even being there "Good, I hope she's crying in the restroom now". You are literally defending a woman hater and I can't be any clearer than I already have been so I'm done with you.

Edited by Deusoma
@Pinworm45 said:

He's doing it in jest and it's part of the culture. He's hardly the only one who does it, and it's the type of culture that he and his peers enjoy. Who are you to tell them to change?

I am a decent human being, for starters, at least I'd like to think so. I'm not talking about just this one man, the entire idea of a 'culture' that involves this garbage at a fundamental level is absolutely repugnant to me, but not as much as the idea of people defending it as though fighting games would somehow become "less pure" if their fans weren't allowed to be racist, homophobic, or misogynistic.
Posted by Pinworm45

@Alkaiser said:

@pekoe212 said:

@Pinworm45 said:

@jasondesante said:

some homo virgin rips on girls because he is fat and hideous and half retarded. Just put him in a corner and let him have his tantrum. Girls that play fighting games are just as cool as guys that play fighting games. Trash talk in fighting games is a last resort for those who aren't comfortable playing the game.

He insults men just as much as girls.. just no one gives a shit about that. People have to white knight girls, which is sexist itself, because it's implying that women can't handle trash talk, which apparently this one couldn't. Pretty fucking ironic that you proceed to call this guy a "homo virgin" who can't get girls because he is fat, as if that is somehow any less sexist than anything he has ever said. it is in fact more sexist, because his "sexism" was merely gendered insults like "bitch".

The difference to me, is that usually men are insulted for not being "man" enough, i.e. being like a woman. And a woman is insulted for....being a woman. That's why it can really hurt sometimes. That my membership in the other 50% of the population can be used as an "insult" against me, a "weakness," you can't really dismiss someone's worth at a more basic level.

I don't really have anything to add to this issue except for the fact that I can feel the my blood pressure spike up everytime I hear the term 'white knighting.' Because apparently guys are only offended by sexism because they want to get laid.

And not, you know, because they've had something bad happen to someone they care about like their mom or someone similar who was victimized for being a woman. Or a friend who was bullied for being a 'bitch' or 'slut' and ended up doing something to hurt themselves out of shame or sadness.

Shit like racism or sexism shouldn't be tolerated by anyone, male or female.

Except it's not sexism. Trash talking a girl is not fucking sexism. It is not sexism any more than trash talking a guy is. You know what's sexism? not allowing women to vote. Not letting them advance in their career.

You know what's not sexism? Trash talking women in a video game with a culture and group based around trash talk. The fact that no one cared when he did this to men, makes this white knighting. The fact that people think women are such fragile, inferior creatures that they need to be defended but men don't makes this white knighting.

Posted by prestonhedges

"You can’t go to the NBA and say “hey, I like basketball, but I don’t want them to play with a basketball, I want them to play with a football.”

I need to find out what controller he's got. Apparently it doesn't use buttons, it uses sexual harassment. What the fuck is he even talking about?

"But if there was that much money being spent on Street Fighter, it wouldn’t be happening here, either, you know. There would be more rules, there would be security here, it’s not the same thing. It’s not the same thing."

In other words, he would get replaced by someone a bit more professional.

Whoever's paying him his wage should seriously reconsider what they're paying for.

Posted by LaserLambert

@Pinworm45: He's not insulting men for being men he's insulting women for existing. calling him a homo virgin is not sexist, because it is an insult directed at 1 person. not roughly half the population of a species.

Posted by Pinworm45

@moregrammarplz said:

@Pinworm45 said:

I think the PC culture is fucking garbage and needs to be replaced with something I prefer.

Who the fuck are you to dictate what a group of people can and can not enjoy? Who the fuck are you to be this moral arbiter? How about you exercise your rights to ignore that which you don't like, and partake in that which you do? I'm not going out of my way to force you and your group of friends to swear do whatever you don't like, show me the same respect (or at least that's what I'd say if I was part of their group, I'm not)

But you don't deserve respect. All you do is insult each other and do hateful shit like chant "BITCH BITCH BITCH" when a woman is playing.

I don't care about your culture. Just because eSports wants to be an exclusive little club doesn't exempt them from having to act like decent human beings. Same goes for all the other similar communities that eSports apologists cite as evidence that it's okay to act like complete shitheads.

So your solution to people not showing respect is to not show them respect? Alright, I don't really care. That's their group, their culture, they enjoy it, I'm not going to ask them to change, and apparently you aren't either because you're being just as insulting, doing the exact same thing (actually worse, you aren't doing it in jest) and I'm sure you're no hypocrite.

Posted by Phonics

@Grondoth said:

Wow, these comments are reminding me how terrible video game people are with gender issues. For a hobby that embraces technological innovation, a big chunk of you guys are pretty backwards. Harassment isn't tolerable. Sexism isn't funny or acceptable. We've got to grow up as a community.

You're clueless. The fighting game community is known for its incredibly offensive trash talk thats almost always good natured and friendly. Example: In a recent tournament there was a really white guy playing and the commentators (who were both black) called him casper the ghost. I'm sure you would of had that tournament shut down and the commentators sued. Or maybe not since he wasnt a girl eh champ?

Posted by Jayzilla

I didn't know Gimli was a gamer. He should go back to his cave.

Posted by darkdragonmage99
@soundlug:  True you have all those rights but the one right you don't have is the right to shut them up.   Be offended all you want there is a lot of stupid crap spewed by idiots that offend me doesn't mean I ever try to deny their right to say it.   
 
Let people say what they are going to say there is no reason to control those things at all . By the way I don't find the word bitch sexist in the least and the rape that bitch comment yeah I've heard that plenty of times  playing with nothing but guys. Believe it or not in a lot of gaming community rape has a different meaning then most people are use to it's used more to meaning of being beaten extremely badly . 
 
language evolves it's all in the meaning of the words not the words themselves I doubt the guy meant literally  rape that bitch  anymore then when my friends means they shoved something up my ass when they yell they assraped me when they assassinate me in halo. 
Edited by churrific

Like others have said, I wish Patrick would've gotten both sides of the story, including an insider's view from the community (not jared). Running the story without even speaking directly to the participants, or even getting a quote out of them, only provides a superficial glance at the situation and the community as a whole. A really negative one at that. No one's saying the FGC is perfect, but If you're gonna blow up a community, at least get some opposing viewpoints before using one man to paint a really ugly picture of a group of people to outsiders who have no exposure to them. I.E. Do some due diligence beforehand.

Posted by Pinworm45

@Aohnonono said:

@Pinworm45 said:

@Aohnonono said:

@Phonics said:

Lets completely ignore the fact that the FGC is one of the biggest real life trolling fests where everyone gets blown up all the time. If you can't handle someone telling you that they are going to sniff your hair if you lose then maybe you're in the wrong place. In her audition she claimed that shes into the fighting game community but still she would crack because of Aris acting creepy? What bullshit, she knew she couldn't hack it at the game and didn't really want to be there and this is why this came out. Even Sherry called her soft.

I just feel for the amazing people that could of been on the show instead of her. Regardless of what kind of criticism this brings from various clueless journalists (Jim Sterling) or eeeeesports people, who have ZERO clue what they are talking about, fighting games will continue to bring the hype and big personalities, something other 'esports' still can't do.

Sherry's an uncle tom and she wasn't there in the room whle Miranda was being harassed by aris, she has no say in how super__yan felt or should feel. The fact that you're trying to blame the victim is utterly disgusting. You're blaming Miranda for wasting a spot, you're saying she should have known she was going to be constantly sexually harassed by Aris upon accepting an invitation to the show. Get real.

Someone who was "trash-talked at" - particularly with a group that's known for mutual, jest trash talk - isn't a victim. The very proposition is insulting to people who are actually victims.

It wasn't just trash talk dude, he touched her inappropriately (eg: threatened to sniff her hair and then literally did so when she lost a match). When she left the room upset he said, without her even being there "Good, I hope she's crying in the restroom now". You are literally defending a woman hater and I can't be any clearer than I already have been so I'm done with you.

HE DID THE EXACT SAME THING TO A DUDE. NO ONE GAVE A SHIT, INCLUDING YOU. That does not make him a "woman hater", that's fucking ridiculous. You're the real woman hater, you think women are so inferior and weak that they can't take what men can, and need to be defended from trash talk.

Edited by ghostNPC

What a piece of human waste this Aris is.

And unfortunately it seems that some people in the comments here are actually defending him. Wow.

Posted by OneManX

@jmood88 said:

@OneManX said:

@Conceited said:

Great, now a bunch of people who have no idea what happened and have no perspective on this because they aren't involved in the FGC will blow this infinitely out of proportion and think the FGC is filled with scumbags. While I realize Aris is largely to blame for this, this article did not need to be written. Why not do a positive piece on how awesome the FGC is? How accepting they are of Ricky Ortiz (openly gay) and Kayopolice? (Trans-gendered)

Because as a fan of the FGC, you want some of the BS to be called out. Because it's not all the way positive, and while they do accept people like Kayo and Ortiz, there are still snide comments about them. If you want to grow, some of the dirty laundry is gonna get aired.

Gaming in general is filled with a bunch of racist/sexist/homophobic assholes. You could replace "FGC" with "First person shooter" or "sports gaming" community and it would fit.

That doesn't mean... you have to accept it. These guys are in position to make a lot of money of this. And shine a light on Gaming in general. And if people from outside looking in, sees a bunch of, for a lack of a better term, ignorant players it makes anyone look bad if they want to play games professionally and get those big sponsorships.

Posted by Grimluck343

@unreal999 said:

Patric is taking shit out of context.

Posted by mfpantst
@Luddite said:

Ever notice how the freedom of speech used to defend people's right to not be politically correct (read: deliberately rude) is somehow not a defense for calling them out on it. You're free to be an asshole, I'm free to call you one. I know which side of that equation I want to be on.

Yarp.  Well spoken. i guess, unfortunately, that protection doesn't extend to freedom from responding phsyically to an asshole, but all the more then that protection extends to calling out assholes!
 
@bybeach said:
I'm confused,why can't it be 'Fuck em up!' as oppossed to 'Rape that bitch'. sounds like somebody has something on their mind when they get emotional, just not the idea you are going to rip your opponent a new asshole.. Though lines do get frequently crossed, war isn't to rape, it is to kill. This is sort of the same mentality, right? Notice how much class we view people who rape in war?  Just wondering.
I'm kinda down with that.  I do think there's a difference between using sexual talk in 'trash talk' and straight up trash talk (eg: what's your bra size, the whole mud wrestling bit, sniffing hair) but I like your thought. Just use straight out vulgarity.  Honestly.  Possibly one of the smartest comments yet.
Posted by PXAbstraction

"This is a community that’s, you know, 15 or 20 years old, and the sexual harassment is part of a culture, and if you remove that from the fighting game community, it’s not the fighting game community"

If that's the case, then fuck your ignorant, broken community.

Posted by SuperWristBands

Wow. I remember watching some Aris commentary when he was with Kayo Police and he didn't seem awful at all. The above quotes really don't make him sound like someone I'd want to be around.
 
I gotta say though, as someone who watches tournament streams when I can I don't recall ever seeing such things from other commentators. Especially James Chan and Ultra David. Those guys are great.
 
Also, good job Jared. You're a pretty stand up guy.

Posted by McGhee

Anyone that has spent a little time watching fighting game streams knows what a bunch of childish degenerates they all are.