It depends. The auto scrolling levels in Rayman Origins frustrated me to no end, but in Super Meat Boy they weren't as difficult as the normal levels.

I think that's not really the same thing unless there's a reason why you can't go forward as fast as you would like. I'd say that an auto-scroller is defined by the fact that it's not that you can't stop but rather that you can't go.

The traditional auto scrolling examples would be Tank levels of Mario 3, some Super Mario World levels and the worst Yoshi's Island levels that exist. Also the underwater chase of Psychonauts where you're in a giant bubble that slowly moves across a landscape. Something where you're being chased doesn't really apply unless, like in Psychonauts, you're stopped from going forwards as well as from going back.

I hate them. Not because they push me, but because they limit me. I hate when a level dictates how fast I can move through it. My biggest enjoyment from platformers comes from running through the levels quickly and skillfully, forced scrolling completely destroys that.

Levels like those in Rayman are the exception to me though. They're all about moving fast and hitting precise jumps. I found those chest levels to be the most fun part of that game.

Vertical and Horizontal shooters wouldn't really work without them..

@video_game_king said:

Sonic is bad?

@yi_orange: I'd actually forgotten about the chest levels. I was thinking of one of the levels in the... floating instruments in the sky world. It just felt like the fluidity of the controls wasn't up to par with the level design in places.

Ah the auto-scrollers. The speedrunners worst enemy.

Hah, I love them. I don't know why. I think it's because in almost every platformer that includes them they're usually really easy and just a nice fun diversion.

That Sonic snowboarding portion posted above? Love it.

This part of Mickey Mania (4:58 if it doesn't auto-correct)? Love it.

Common-sense game-design tells you not to include elements that your audience didn't sign up for, but I still welcome them.

edit: I accidentally included the link to the terrible SNES version of Mickey Mania. Fixed it with a Genesis link.

Wait, I gotta come back with one more awesome one:

If it doesn't auto-correct, it's at 14:24:

It depends on the game I guess, but most of the time it just really slows down the pace of any game.

If I make it to the edge of the screen, I shouldn't have to wait for the game to catch up with me...

The ones in Rayman Legends are pretty awesome.

They can be done well but they usually aren't.

@video_game_king said:

Maybe, if I knew what you were trying to say with that screenshot.

Auto-scrolling levels are just like any other gameplay element; they're welcome when done well, and unwelcome when they aren't.

@hailinel:

That Sonic 3 makes everything better.

they're meh. I don't care if a game has them sometimes, but I'm not crossing my fingers for the next level to be an auto scroller or anything.

I'm thinking of auto scrolling sections I really like, like that one level in Castlevania 3 that scrolls upward, but I can't say that, that level wouldn't be better if you could just scroll it faster by moving faster forward. It might create an imbalance where jumping near the top of the screen would push the bottom up and give you less time to climb, though simply designing around that by not making the edge of the screen the real danger but instead some kind of hazard that moves at a set pace and that pushed you forward would probably solve that.

So sure, auto scrolling that prevents you from moving forward is seldom fun. Screw the parts of levels that force you to ride in a big elevator and fight off enemies.

I like that the answers to the poll are essentially: No, No, No, Maybe, and Other.

Auto-scrollers are on the same level as water stages in terms of irritation.

@video_game_king said:

That part lasted for all of ten seconds.

I think they can work if it's not overly long and you respawn quickly.

@rjpelonia:

And what a glorious ten seconds it was.

I'm fine with them if they make interesting use of the mechanic. Can't say I really run into them often enough to have formed a real opinion though.

Trine 1 last level comes to mind. terrible, though I don't remember if it scrolls in a fixed manner, I just remember the lava, and I assume it must always be at the bottom of the screen?

I dont mind them when they're as glorious as this:

But I despise them when they're as evil as this:

@rebel_scum said:

I dont mind them when they're as glorious as this:

But I despise them when they're as evil as this:

Yeah, fuck that level in Ecco! It forces you down various dead ends. One of the most unfair levels in any game ever.

I have a tendency to love them. They break monotony and add tension. Sure, they can be hard, but I like that it's sort of like a forced, lite speed-run.

Depends - the DKC3 one with the big-ass saw was cool.

I love me some shmups, and they're basically one long auto-scroller. So yeah, I like them.

does a game like Gradius or RType count as auto scroll levels?

I've played some pretty good auto scrolling levels. The Tower in VVVVVV comes to mind, and obviously, like crithon mentioned - stuff like R-Type.
But, sure, poorly designed auto scrolling levels are probably worse than regular poorly designed levels, because there's an added point of failure that'll force you replay them over and over again.

I also like to imagine stuff like Terminal Velocity's tunnel sections being auto scrolling first person/3D games, and I'm kinda into that idea.

@development: YES! I was totally going to mention Rocket Knight.

I think forced scroll works when it's done well. It's usually not. It's about pacing, I think. If the scroll is too slow, it becomes tedious. If it's too fast, it becomes frustrating. It has to be quick enough to be a challenge, but still relatively doable.

Yes, I clicked on this thread to chime in that shmups are entirely the kind of autoscroller that I enjoy. And rail shooters like Starfox and Panzer Dragoon and Rez.

As for autoscrollers in games that normally do not autoscroll; do not like, do not want.

Those Donkey Kong Country games have had some great auto scrolling levels. They got on my nerves in Super Mario 3d World though, it just felt like I was spending too much time waiting on the camera. Maybe auto scrolling levels should adapt if you're moving forward really quickly, because there's nothing worse than a level designed to make you move fast slowing down your progress.

Edit: Actually now that I think about it, I believe the Donkey Kong Country levels I'm thinking of are actually just chase levels.

It depends on the game, or what it's being used for. For instance most shooters have them (like 1942 or TwinBee) and it's fine. It's part of the challenge and how well it's done is a big part of whether or not the game is any good.

Some older side scrollers had them, like Silver Surfer (which was arguably a bad shooter) and BattleToads, but those games were bad implementation. Despite what some may say, I love what Battletoads is going for but that game is seriously punishing and Silver Surfer just feels like torture. So those games don't implement it well for me.

Kid Chameleon has a level or two with forced scrolling and despite the fact that I'm hugely biased (it's my favorite Genesis game and I've played it a billion times) I think it did it well as the forced scrolling doesn't feel unfair when it's used.

So, ya. It just depends on the game and the implementation of it.

I know, right? The funny thing was I was thinking about not putting in the Maybe answer. Having the only positive answer being Other (please explain).

I just want to say, like I said in the first post, I mean the kind of auto scroller where it's not forced movement and you can get ahead of the screen such that you are running against the boundary of the screen. I don't mean Minecarts or Rayman Chests or any of that. That's forced movement, not forced scrolling. Completely different when it comes to pacing! One's a sprint and the other's meander. I mean those Yoshi's Island levels where you have to walk slowly over clouds while the screen slowly pans. Here, let me find a video.

So anyone saying "Yeah I like those fast paced levels" basically I'm sorry, that's not what I was asking about. I was asking about the slow paced version of those levels that are garbage. So it's probably safe to say you can look at the poll and take a few votes away from "I kind of like it." Maybe should've included the video with the post originally. I'll edit it into my other post now (apparently you can't edit a post with a poll in it).

(Also, yeah, forgot about Ripsaw Rage from DKC3 @ch3burashka, that one's pretty decent. Moves at a fairly good clip, doesn't involve much waiting (in fact that'll be the death of you in that level often enough), does have one spot where you can get above the camera too at the end though it doesn't jump up to meet you, you just have to wait for it to catch up to you so you can ride the saw up while invincible. I definitely think of that one as an exception.

I would also point out, generally that Castle Crush from DKC2 is not included in my definition either as at a points you totally get Squawks and can just fly up and away from the slowly rising floor. When the game takes Squawks away from you are given a bonus stage to reset the floor with so you get a nice speedy area. Also the minecart stages all don't count because I consider Forced Movement and Forced Scrolling to be different concepts.)

do the crash bandicoot levels where you are being chased by a boulder or polar bear count? if so, yes.

Thems the bad poll options. Auto scrolling just makes the trial and error aspect of platformers more obvious.

The poll options are bad.

yep, forced scrolling levels are a chore. Most of the time the challenge simply comes from the forced scrolling. (e.g. falling platforms)

@video_game_king said:

That doesn't count.

This doesn't count either:

the thread is obviously talking about slow-moving scrolling stages, not things like vehicle segments or QTEs or stuff like that

@egg:

If you're going to go with Mega Man 8, at least go with the first Wily stage.

I'm not even sure why I brought up Mega Man 8 to begin with.

@themasterds: So you mean bad auto scrollers? your question is; do we all dislike badly implemented things in games? I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say...Yes? a majority of us will dislike bad examples of game design?

@freshbandito: Well how do I know someone out there doesn't carry a torch for that Yoshi's Island level? Some people really like that game you know, maybe some people like those levels. Plus most people can agree Mario World is a fantastic game and it also has a few slow moving auto scrollers.

Also I want to emphasise again, forced movement and forced scrolling are entirely different. Even if you hate both (I like a good Minecart level myself because I don't stop for nothing) you hate them for entirely different reasons. For Forced Movement it's because they're hard and things move fast, for Forced Scrolling it's because they're long and boring and everything moves slow. I don't consider one to be an execution of the other, they're two entirely different things in my head. One involves making the thing you're riding in move at a constant rate, the other involves making the screen move at a constant rate without any concern for the rate you move at.

@themasterds: I think it's a case of implementation though right? you could have good and bad auto scrolling levels and the bad ones are slow and frustrating and the good ones find a good balance of pace and difficulty.

I quite like a well paced auto-scroller, adds a sense of urgency to a tight platformer.

@freshbandito: There's a difference between an auto scroller and a game that forbids you from turning around because something's chasing you. Auto Scrolling often takes away your ability to go faster than they'd like. A chase scene often doesn't. For instance Slime Climb and Toxic Tower, two levels with rising tides that don't disallow the screen to scroll according to player movement. (Note: Castle Crush also allows you to get ahead of the rising floor but you need to use it for most of the level.) Really the only good chase scene that also constrains the camera I can think of is Ripsaw Rage. Can you name a second example? One that scrolls at a uniform rate in order to keep the threat on screen at all times and is actually good? Oh shit, wait, Kong-fused Cliffs.

Okay, how about name an example from a game not made by Rare during their golden age? Not a chase scene in which you are not allowed to go back, but a chase scene where you are not only not allowed to go back for obvious reasons but not allowed to go forward for less obvious reasons.

Your poll is heavily skewed towards not liking auto scroll levels. Therefore the poll portion of this is invalid, in my opinion.

I like auto scrolling levels, generally. Don´t have to build an entire game around them, but they have their place. Like the ones in Rayman Legends. It really all comes down to level design. Heck, a good level can make even an average platformer look fantastic. Like the one in Little big planet, where you escape from.. a dinosaur? I don´t really remember what it was- but that one was good.

I think they are all right. I have seen them done well and I have seen some really bad ones. I think it all comes down to two things. The context and the actual speed. I tend to almost always prefer to have something on screen to be running from as opposed to just running from the borders of the screen itself. Give me lava, or a big wave, maybe a rock or something. As for the speed, I don't ever want to be running up against a wall at the edge of the screen. It is cool to force me to keep my momentum but don't be so slow that you can't keep up with me while doing it.

@themasterds: You clearly don't want to hear that people have a different opinion to yours if you keep wanting evidence and proof to back their opinion that they don't mind auto scrollers.You also seem to constantly narrow the criteria to exclude a lot of what people are citing as fun auto scrollers after changing your terminology from 'Forced Scrolling' so that you can discount a bunch of the suggestions. Look up auto scroller and you will find included a lot if not all of the games that you've discounted.

But fine I will mention instances of auto scrolling in games that I enjoyed to backup my personal opinion that I have enjoyed some;

Electronic Super Joy has a number of levels where dealing with the missiles on screen and manipulating their movement pattern becomes incredibly important because of the auto-scroll not enabling you to outrun them as you'd normally do.

Sky Chase Zone in Sonic the hedgehog 2 is one of my favourite levels in videogaming and left me wanting to try wingwalking from an early age, I memorised the level select cheat just so I could play that level.

Mickey and Donald's world of illusion, auto scrolling sections where the platforms moved as boulders rained down, I recall that section being very intense when I was that young.

Super Meat Boy, as I previously stated this game's forced scroll levels epitomize what I like about a good auto scroll, it made me put into practice my skill at the game at a pace the game dictated and this added another layer to the play when I was no longer free to set my own pace.

Those are examples, new and old, that jump to my mind. Some people not liking an auto scroll section in Yoshi's Island has done nothing to make me dislike all examples of a type of gameplay.