The Cancer of BFBC2

#1 Edited by TiE23 (297 posts) -

  
Just got into a conquest match on good old Atacama Desert. It was the most egregious thing I ever saw. They were literally spawn killing us. You'd spawn, and two seconds later you were dead. At a point, I start to wonder why they even do this for so long. They reach level 50, but it seems that they never play the game. It's just Helicopter Spawn Killing game.
 
   
 
If you look up the top players on the leaderboard, their kills in helicopters are counted in the tens of thousands.
 http://bfbcs.com/BFBC2_leaderboard/360 
  http://bfbcs.com/BFBC2_leaderboard/ps3
  http://bfbcs.com/BFBC2_leaderboard/pc
#2 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -

Never ever ran into this on PS3. 

#3 Posted by TiE23 (297 posts) -
@The_Laughing_Man: It's there. It's on all the consoles. Sure, 60% of the time a game on Atacama Desert won't be especially heli-whore centric. But that other 40% of the time you're guaranteed to find two 45+ ranks riding the helicopter the entire game.
#4 Edited by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -
@TiE23 said:

" @The_Laughing_Man: It's there. It's on all the consoles. Sure, 60% of the time a game on Atacama Desert won't be especially heli-whore centric. But that other 40% of the time you're guaranteed to find two 45+ ranks riding the helicopter the entire game. "

Ive played quite a few matches on that level. And most of the time no one touches the copters. And the few I have seen get blown to hell before they near the base.  
 
And having many kills on a copter being the num one is well..DUH. They have been playing a lot.  
 
Did you even check the top guy for PS3? He doesn't have many copter kills at all. 
#5 Posted by TiE23 (297 posts) -
@The_Laughing_Man: Number one has 45 platinum medals, that's a whole other issue. And the second place player has 36,000+ kills with attack helicopters, and only around 12,000+ kills with weapons. The top players boost in different ways.
 
Just because you personally haven't experienced the issue doesn't mean it's not there.
#6 Posted by ZimboDK (848 posts) -

I've been on a couple of teams where we completely dominated the other team on Atacama, and there's always someone who starts baseraping and spawn killing. We had 2 tanks and a chopper in their base. I just hovered around one of the Points in a UAV, but no one got out of the base. Well, almost no one. I had a pretty good shooting match with a recon who managed to slip out undetected. Anyway, round ends and the few who are left disconnect immediately. It doesn't take much to ruin a game.

#7 Posted by natetodamax (19136 posts) -

Jeez, I couldn't possibly imagine having that many kills with a helicopter.

#8 Posted by illmatic19 (964 posts) -

Don't blame the game for being a n00b.
 
On a serious note, I have encountered this problem. I just end up rage quitting, best solution.

#9 Posted by babblinmule (1262 posts) -

Never seen anything like that before on Atacama desert.... heck i didn't even realise that there WERE choppers on that map till last week!

#10 Posted by KimChi4U (368 posts) -

 
A little off topic to the helicopter kills thing, what interests me more is how there are 4 players on the one team with no points. I see this in games all the time and I feel this is a major problem. People quit a match after getting royally beat and then the match gets lopsided. When new players joining a match come in, they find themselves starting midway through a match already being spawn camped. They leave and the cycle continues. It's already bad enough that one side is already winning, but they also have an advantage in numbers. 
 
There have been evenings where people in my friends list aren't on and I spend 30-40 minutes hopping from match to match, getting into games where we're being spawn camped constantly. Coud there not be a way to fix this situation? 
 
I'm also seeing a lot of games (especially in rush) where you wind up in a 4 on 4 situation. Not only does this make for a long, drawn-out, boring game. But the match-making system never adds even amounts of people to each side when they join. I've seen matches go from 4v4 to 7v4.

#11 Edited by MrKlorox (11185 posts) -

I was real surprised DICE is still using such archaic methods of deciding where to spawn soldiers when I first played it. In like every other patch they mention things that are supposed to help prevent spawn killing, but they never work.
 
I mean if they won't let us capture the final base, even after we own the rest of the bases, then make it actually out of bounds. You know, where the timer counts down and you get destroyed? One or the other, DICE.
 
@KimChi4U: You're right. Auto Balance has been a massive issue for DICE in every BF game ever. You'd think they would re-distribute the top players based on total earned career points every 10 minutes or so. Maybe have a rape prevention thing after the whole team gets killed 5+ times without scoring themselves a single kill.
 
Either way, Conquest is completely broken in BC2.

#12 Edited by The_Painted (181 posts) -

The spawnkilling was what lead me to stop playing this game. I got incredibly tired of joining a game of Conquest and realizing that there were two tanks in the only place I could spawn, along with medics gunning people down before they could go anywhere. And half of the time there would be a large group of medics as well, endlessly killing people as they spawned and reviving each other on the off chance that someone managed to kill one of them. I really enjoyed the multiplayer, but it just got to be too much of a hassle.

#13 Posted by Meteora (5787 posts) -

That map is a horrible, horrible sin on BFBC2. As much as I love me some helicopters, its got to stop. <.<

#14 Posted by durog (219 posts) -
I've never been in a situation where I would get spawn killed over and over again, even in situation where one team was totally raping another.  There are plenty of emplacements, vehicles etc. that you can use in the atacama desert to counter a helicopter. But I do believe auto-balancing doesn't seem to work, there were times I was on a team for 10+ rounds and the other team would get rolled and vice versa.
#15 Posted by Defias (169 posts) -

Spawn killing is a huge problem that I encounter rather frequently and is quite infuriating, I haven't been playing it for a while due to this.

#16 Posted by Jayross (2365 posts) -

Atacama Desert is such a joke on conquest, everything about it is just badly designed.

#17 Edited by TwoOneFive (9461 posts) -
@The_Laughing_Man said:

" Never ever ran into this on PS3.  "

i actually did yesterday. eveytime a new chopper spawned, a guy in the others teams chopper blew it up and killed everyone at that base. they did this the entire round. there should be some sort of auto defense system at the base to keep this from happening, somewhat like what they do in killzone 2.... 
 
i wish more games borrowed ideas from killzone 2.... wait no, forget that. fuck them, K2 is the best. K3 is going to be the best MP game ever made. 
#18 Posted by SathingtonWaltz (2053 posts) -

That sucks, I wonder why they just don't make the base out of bounds or something. 

#19 Edited by Garrus (543 posts) -

I believe that Atacama desert didn't even need choppers. It'd be fine as a nice tank standoff map.
 
Another part of the problem is the players on the console version of the game. I'll list some. (I don't know what it's like on PC game version but this is mostly what happens every single time.)
 
A) General stupidity and over-panick about K/D "OH NEGATIVE KD WILL AFFECT MY CHANCES OF CHILDREN"
B) Chopper is too easy to spawn camp with, penalty regarding spawn kills is absent (BF 1943 anyone? I thought that was a great idea)
C) "Tracer Darts are useless, they get me no kills, they do no damage, they're hard to use, they only tag things, i can't lock on to a person with R.Launcher when I tag a person, they're annoying, takes more skill dude to hit a chopper without one, noobs use tracer darts only, chopper never gets hit when i aim straight at it when its moving"
D) "FUCK YOU NOOB IF I CAN'T HAVE CHOPPER YOU CAN'T, FUCK YOU" Behaviour on a team is crippling. No its not a case of greifing, its a case of people actually being THAT stupid.
 
Now not everyone or every Atacama Desert game is like this but generally this is what happens on that map. People get overly desperate for kills and the sense of ranking up and reward is too great for some people. Enough to the point where they just keep spawn camping and will do anything to get a chance at it. This combined with stupidity of the 'camped team and their supposed inability to acknowledge something called a "Tracer Dart Gun" means they rage quit and more idiots flow in who still have no clue wtf is going on.

#20 Posted by Prymet1me (100 posts) -

Dam glad i play this on the pc, I had this game for two weeks on xbox because friends talked me into renting it from gamefly....wasnt feeling it, there was no team play and I wanted more players in the game, I got the pc version from steam and the game felt much better. Also there are servers on the pc that will kick you for base raping an uncap.

#21 Edited by AndyMP (224 posts) -

I got back into this game just yesterday and played a bunch of games today. The choppers have ruined at least 3 out of the 7 games I've played on Atacama Desert, which otherwise would likely be my favorite map. Problem being that there doesn't seem to be an effective way of shooting them down. Seen a ton of spawn campers as well, some successful and most not. But the weapons in the base for dealing with choppers who just circle around the base is ridiculous. You can get maybe 4-5 shots off from the gun back there only for the chopper to circle back around and flatten you and everything else in the base. The "lock on" weapon would be fine but buildings get in the way and it's a waste of time. What they need is a better surface to air missile like MW2 has, at least in that game for all its faults you can deal pretty quickly with a chopper or aircraft in that game.

#22 Posted by AndyMP (224 posts) -
@murdocsvan said:
" Indubitably.     "
Nice, I guess that's your 8 letter word for the BestBuy quest ? haha
#23 Posted by gamb1t (964 posts) -

use the rpg on foot to kill the chopper. mad ez

#24 Posted by TiE23 (297 posts) -
@gamb1t said:
" use the rpg on foot to kill the chopper. mad ez "
No, typing that sentence was easy.
#25 Posted by President_Barackbar (3344 posts) -

I think the big problem with helicopter spawn camping is the fact that you don't actually unlock the tracer pistol for a while. I got the game about a month ago and don't play it enough to really level that much (I'm currently rank 10). I also seem to notice that sometimes you will be on a team where absolutely no one has or uses the tracer, and when that happens you're kinda screwed.

#26 Posted by Zidane_24 (737 posts) -

Did anybody else think this was going to be another thread about Snipers?  
 
Yeah, spawn-killing is a big reason why I don't play a whole lot of BF:BC2 anymore.
#27 Posted by Gutlieb (87 posts) -

This has never happened to me. After the patch on PC the game runs well, guns are superbly balanced and pretty much no spawn camping on the servers I play on.

#28 Posted by Infininja (881 posts) -
@AndyMP said:
" I got back into this game just yesterday and played a bunch of games today. The choppers have ruined at least 3 out of the 7 games I've played on Atacama Desert, which otherwise would likely be my favorite map. Problem being that there doesn't seem to be an effective way of shooting them down. Seen a ton of spawn campers as well, some successful and most not. But the weapons in the base for dealing with choppers who just circle around the base is ridiculous. You can get maybe 4-5 shots off from the gun back there only for the chopper to circle back around and flatten you and everything else in the base. The "lock on" weapon would be fine but buildings get in the way and it's a waste of time. What they need is a better surface to air missile like MW2 has, at least in that game for all its faults you can deal pretty quickly with a chopper or aircraft in that game. " 
You may already know this, but BC2 has both bullet travel time and drop. Aiming in front of and above the helicopters while taking into account distance and speed will land you many more hits.
#29 Posted by iFail (236 posts) -

Really, I've never had an issue with helis on Atacama Desert. Then again I tend to jump in the awesome emplaced gatling and set my mouse sensitivity up and just shred helis.

#30 Posted by Wacomole (811 posts) -

 The helicopter base-killing on Atacama Conquest mode pretty much ended my playing of Conquest altogether quite a while ago. 
Ironically, though, Atacama Desert map is now actually one of the best Rush maps in the game, with its mixture of wide open spaces and intense house to house fighting which culminates in a big old tank battle at the end.  It still has the helicopter in it, but the new VADS gun can tear it to shreds much easier than the old AA gun. Plus the "base-killing-for points" players must still be "quarantined" over on the Conquest Mode flying around in circles having what passes for their idea of fun. 

#31 Posted by Wacomole (811 posts) -
@iFail said:
" Really, I've never had an issue with helis on Atacama Desert. Then again I tend to jump in the awesome emplaced gatling and set my mouse sensitivity up and just shred helis. "
The problem they are talking about (spawn killing) is only evident in the Conquest Mode of Atacama.  The VADS gun that you're talking about is on the new Rush mode of Atacama. (unless they've added the VADS to the Conquest)
#32 Posted by Laticsfan (596 posts) -

Never had this problem,  but if I did I would just leave and join a different game. The worst I've had is jumping into an allied vehicle to be gunner, only for the driver/pilot to turn around and go out of bounds. At which point I jump out so he gets blown up for his stupidity and I run off to actually have some fun.

#33 Posted by iFail (236 posts) -
@MoleyUK: Oh, that would explain it. I've never seen very competent heli pilots on Conquest in Atacama, but I don't play much conquest, it doesn't seem as fun as it was in BF2.
#34 Posted by Sogeman (851 posts) -

It's one of those things that made me stop playing Atacama Desert in Conquest.
 
When someone started it (even someone on my team) I usually quit the match because when you're not the ones in the Helis you're not getting points anyway.
 
They made it easier to shoot the Helis down though. On the Rush version the Heli is pretty much destroyed after a minute because of the Gatling AA. No idea if they added that to the Conquest map as well. It's a Heli Rape machine.

#35 Posted by iFail (236 posts) -

Yeah, that gatling is awesome. I put 10 rounds in a heli tail and it snapped off, crashing the occupants.

#36 Posted by Bouke (1401 posts) -

I think an easy fix is changing the area the helicopters can fly in to not include the opposites teams base... because it is pretty frustrating getting owned by a helicopter or two. And i also hate being on the team with the choppers; because they get all the kills! Come on leave some for the rest of us!
#37 Edited by Sogeman (851 posts) -

Not necessary. They had it perfect in BF1943: No points for kills in the bases. I wonder why they changed that. Biggest mistake.
 
The AA Gatling is fantastic though. Got a kill on Atacama Rush from the first base as defender on a guy in the Attacker base with it.

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