Something terrible is going to happen to Elizabeth...

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#1 Edited by Getz (2995 posts) -

From just the brief two minutes of the Bioshock Infinite E3 demo, it's apparent that Irrational are really making an effort to flesh out Elizabeth's character. Without even playing the game or seeing more of it I can tell you a lot about her: she's goofy and light-hearted, she's sheltered, naive, fragile and at the same time extremely powerful.

So what's the next logical step for a fleshed-out character in a complex narrative such as this? Killing her off of course! I can easily see Ken Levine tugging on our heart strings like the diabolical puppet master that he is. What do you guys think? You think she's gonna survive the whole game? I know it's way too early to tell, but it's fun to theorize, innit?

#2 Posted by BeachThunder (11799 posts) -

NoooOOOooo, this thread needs a spoiler tag, I can already tell you're right D: In fact, I'll go one step further, you'll actually have to kill her yourself. It will be just like the little sisters, except this time he wants you to have an even more emotional response (ie. she's your companion for the sheer majority of the game, rather than just a random little girl).
 
Or maybe she's SHODAN...You'll travel though time into 1999, where someone's playing SS2 and SHODAN will jump out of the in-game computer screen, revealing that she's actually the future version of Elizabeth. You then realise you must kill Elizabeth before she turns into SHODAN. Too crazy? We'll just have to wait and see...

#3 Posted by Synaptic (308 posts) -

I see it more that you have to do worse and worse things to survive with her throughout the game, and you watch her slowly break down over it.

#4 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@Synaptic said:

I see it more that you have to do worse and worse things to survive with her throughout the game, and you watch her slowly break down over it.

oooh, I like that. Booker seems like a pretty upright guy though; I don't see him doing anything immoral. I do see a loss of innocence in Elizabeth though, after seeing all the horrible shit people are capable of.

#5 Posted by Synaptic (308 posts) -

@Getz said:

@Synaptic said:

I see it more that you have to do worse and worse things to survive with her throughout the game, and you watch her slowly break down over it.

oooh, I like that. Booker seems like a pretty upright guy though; I don't see him doing anything immoral. I do see a loss of innocence in Elizabeth though, after seeing all the horrible shit people are capable of.

I definitely agree with your picture of Booker; I just think his number one priority is Elizabeth's safety, and that could lead to some morally grey actions in order to protect her.

#6 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@BeachThunder said:

Or maybe she's SHODAN...You'll travel though time into 1999, where someone's playing SS2 and SHODAN will jump out of the in-game computer screen, revealing that she's actually the future version of Elizabeth. You then realise you must kill Elizabeth before she turns into SHODAN.

Neo-Lincoln SHODAN Pre-Alpha?

#7 Posted by SomeDeliCook (2272 posts) -

@Getz: You're actually wrong OP. This is a -shock game, therefore the character that was helping you most of the game will halfway through turn on you and reveal their real plans. After you kill Songbird, who turned out to be keeping a witch (Liz) in prison before she causes trouble, she turns on you.

End with a disappointing boss fight.

#8 Posted by Dany (7887 posts) -

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

#9 Posted by FluxWaveZ (19321 posts) -
@Dany said:

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

I guarantee she won't.
Online
#10 Posted by Wrighteous86 (3780 posts) -

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Dany said:

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

I guarantee she won't.

She is already dead! OMG twist!

#11 Edited by Dany (7887 posts) -

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Dany said:

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

I guarantee she won't.

naive empathic lovable cute character design 101 or (nelccd 101), she has to. its like the dog in fable 2

#12 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@SomeDeliCook: Um actually you're wrong, QED.

#13 Posted by Afroman269 (7387 posts) -

Probably.

#14 Posted by benjaebe (2783 posts) -

The oft-proven Fumito Ueda Theory of Game Design leads me to believe that, because she's so innocent and we care about her, she's probably going to die.

#15 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@benjaebe said:

The oft-proven Fumito Ueda Theory of Game Design leads me to believe that, because she's so innocent and we care about her, she's probably going to die.

S'funny when I was thinking about making this topic I was specifically thinking about Shadow of the Colossus and Ico.

#16 Posted by FluxWaveZ (19321 posts) -
@Dany said: 

naive empathic lovable cute character design 101 or (nelccd 101), she has to. its like the dog in fable 2

It's also a predictable and expected outcome, not to mention a weak story beat. I'd be surprised if Ken Levine decided to do this.
Online
#17 Posted by ZimboDK (848 posts) -
@Wrighteous86 said:

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Dany said:

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

I guarantee she won't.

She is already dead! OMG twist!

So she's a zombie with fire and electricity shooting out of her hands? We're doomed.
#18 Posted by Dany (7887 posts) -

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Dany said:

naive empathic lovable cute character design 101 or (nelccd 101), she has to. its like the dog in fable 2

It's also a predictable and expected outcome, not to mention a weak story beat. I'd be surprised if Ken Levine decided to do this.

It may be the easiest route to go but the most effective imo after building up a character as elizabeth appears to be.

#19 Edited by FluxWaveZ (19321 posts) -
@Dany said: 

It may be the easiest route to go but the most effective imo after building up a character as elizabeth appears to be.

Why the most effective? There could be several routes to follow in order to pull the players' heartstrings. There could be an ending where she's forced to be imprisoned by the Songbird, an ending where she goes absolutely insane because of her powers, an ending where she's forced to be imprisoned by the government after you retrieve her from Columbia, an ending where she gets stuck in an alternate dimension/time... 
 
It doesn't always have to be "kill the character that the player gets attached to the most" in order evoke a sense of sadness in said player. And hey, maybe they don't even want to bring about tragedy in the game's ending and actually have a happy ending where she's alive, all is well and Booker is happy with Elizabeth.
Online
#20 Posted by BeachThunder (11799 posts) -
@Wrighteous86 said:

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Dany said:

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

I guarantee she won't.

She is already dead! OMG twist!

WHAT A TWIST!
 
Also, notice the Star Wars sign that was shown. So, maybe "Liz, I am your father!"
 
@SomeDeliCook said:

End with a disappointing boss fight.

I think this is guaranteed more than anything else in this thread. I beat the final boss of SS2 in about 20 seconds on the hardest difficulty >__>
#21 Posted by SomeDeliCook (2272 posts) -

You'll probably have to sacrifice her or yourself in the end. Sacrifice yourself for the good ending, sacrifice her for the bad ending.

#22 Posted by Aronman789 (2676 posts) -

Turns out you were Liz all along and made up the persona of Booker to help yourself build up the courage to escape from Columbia. 
 
Magic-powered Liz is an illusion.

#23 Posted by captain_clayman (3320 posts) -

fuuuuuuck you're probably right.

#24 Posted by BeachThunder (11799 posts) -
@Aronman789 said:
Turns out you were Liz all along and made up the persona of Booker to help yourself build up the courage to escape from Columbia.  Magic-powered Liz is an illusion.
Maybe she had a sex change in the future and Booker is her sex-changed future self which she made appear using a tear, and she is manipulating that version of her future self throughout the game :o
#25 Posted by HandsomeDead (11863 posts) -

Congratulations, OP. You've realised drama is caused by conflict.

#26 Posted by Bloodgraiv3 (2712 posts) -

I really hope not. 
#27 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@Aronman789 said:

Turns out you were Liz all along and made up the persona of Booker to help yourself build up the courage to escape from Columbia. Magic-powered Liz is an illusion.

Also known as Fight Club

#28 Posted by TanoPrime (180 posts) -

A broad with uber power who turns out to be a frail little princess and get saved by the duder in the end to have fat little babies and make mah sandwich?  It sounds like pretty standard, realistic storytelling to me.  Now, if she ends up getting the player's character pregnant and making him clean windows after saving the world...oooooo, now that's a twist!
#29 Posted by Solemn (278 posts) -

That was the first thing that came to my mind when I saw the demo: "Hmmm, I think Levine is going to kill Liz in this one." 

#30 Posted by Agent47 (1894 posts) -
@Wrighteous86 said:

@FluxWaveZ said:

@Dany said:

She will die by the time the game is over. I guarantee it.

I guarantee she won't.

She is already dead! OMG twist!

Oh shiiiit it was all a DREAM! You were knocked unconsciousin the first act!
#31 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@TanoPrime said:

A broad with uber power who turns out to be a frail little princess and get saved by the duder in the end to have fat little babies and make mah sandwich? It sounds like pretty standard, realistic storytelling to me. Now, if she ends up getting the player's character pregnant and making him clean windows after saving the world...oooooo, now that's a twist!

"Broad," really?

#32 Posted by Mr_Skeleton (5140 posts) -

Morality choices!

#33 Posted by MariachiMacabre (7071 posts) -

@Getz said:

@TanoPrime said:


A broad with uber power who turns out to be a frail little princess and get saved by the duder in the end to have fat little babies and make mah sandwich? It sounds like pretty standard, realistic storytelling to me. Now, if she ends up getting the player's character pregnant and making him clean windows after saving the world...oooooo, now that's a twist!

"Broad," really?

Shut up and drink this eggcream, ya dumb broad.

#34 Posted by NTM (7320 posts) -

So what you're saying is that Levine will try to make us cry?

#35 Posted by Venatio (4491 posts) -

She's gonna say the words "would you kindly" at the end and it's gonna blow our minds
 
 
 

 

#36 Posted by McGhee (6094 posts) -

The bad guy is going to jump down from behind and stab her in the back with a ten foot sword. Nerds will shed tears for decades.

#37 Posted by TanoPrime (180 posts) -
@MariachiMacabre said:

@Getz said:

@TanoPrime said:


A broad with uber power who turns out to be a frail little princess and get saved by the duder in the end to have fat little babies and make mah sandwich? It sounds like pretty standard, realistic storytelling to me. Now, if she ends up getting the player's character pregnant and making him clean windows after saving the world...oooooo, now that's a twist!

"Broad," really?

Shut up and drink this eggcream, ya dumb broad.

LOL, eggcream!  I like you.  As for the other guy, I did not studder.  But given the fact that you completly ignored that the game will probably go the wussy route of having a powerful female character who has to ultimately become a pretty frail flower to appeal to little 15 yr old FAPmonkeys (you know, the important part of my statement) and decided to focus on my given choice of vocabulary...hmm, this tells me you really had nothing important to say.  If you wish to white knight it up and defend fair maiden of pixels, then mount upon thine font cover steed and ride forth into the fray!  But do know I have already slain the dragon and I'm banging the princess.  What a hot broad!  
#38 Edited by kingzetta (4307 posts) -

nah booker is going to die

#39 Posted by BeachThunder (11799 posts) -

Elizabeth will turn into a potato.

#40 Posted by Origina1Penguin (3500 posts) -

Multiple endings.

#41 Posted by Yanngc33 (4496 posts) -

She won't die, she'll punch people in the balls to victory

#42 Posted by MattyFTM (14364 posts) -

The game revolves so heavily around her abilities, if she does die, it'll have to be at the very end of the game.

Moderator
#43 Posted by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -

@TanoPrime said:

@MariachiMacabre said:

@Getz said:

@TanoPrime said:


A broad with uber power who turns out to be a frail little princess and get saved by the duder in the end to have fat little babies and make mah sandwich? It sounds like pretty standard, realistic storytelling to me. Now, if she ends up getting the player's character pregnant and making him clean windows after saving the world...oooooo, now that's a twist!

"Broad," really?

Shut up and drink this eggcream, ya dumb broad.

LOL, eggcream! I like you. As for the other guy, I did not studder. But given the fact that you completly ignored that the game will probably go the wussy route of having a powerful female character who has to ultimately become a pretty frail flower to appeal to little 15 yr old FAPmonkeys (you know, the important part of my statement) and decided to focus on my given choice of vocabulary...hmm, this tells me you really had nothing important to say. If you wish to white knight it up and defend fair maiden of pixels, then mount upon thine font cover steed and ride forth into the fray! But do know I have already slain the dragon and I'm banging the princess. What a hot broad!

"stutter"

If you're trying to come of as brash and cool, it's best to be able to spell simple words. This is especially important when you refer to your own vocabulary as some measure of your intellect.

ON TOPIC : I think she'll end up as the final boss of the game. She's very powerful and much desired by the main antagonist.

#44 Posted by TanoPrime (180 posts) -
@SeriouslyNow said:

@TanoPrime said:

@MariachiMacabre said:

@Getz said:

@TanoPrime said:


A broad with uber power who turns out to be a frail little princess and get saved by the duder in the end to have fat little babies and make mah sandwich? It sounds like pretty standard, realistic storytelling to me. Now, if she ends up getting the player's character pregnant and making him clean windows after saving the world...oooooo, now that's a twist!

"Broad," really?

Shut up and drink this eggcream, ya dumb broad.

 
LOL, eggcream! I like you. As for the other guy, I did not studder. But given the fact that you completly ignored that the game will probably go the wussy route of having a powerful female character who has to ultimately become a pretty frail flower to appeal to little 15 yr old FAPmonkeys (you know, the important part of my statement) and decided to focus on my given choice of vocabulary...hmm, this tells me you really had nothing important to say. If you wish to white knight it up and defend fair maiden of pixels, then mount upon thine font cover steed and ride forth into the fray! But do know I have already slain the dragon and I'm banging the princess. What a hot broad!

"stutter"

If you're trying to come of as brash and cool, it's best to be able to spell simple words. This is especially important when you refer to your own vocabulary as some measure of your intellect.

ON TOPIC : I think she'll end up as the final boss of the game. She's very powerful and much desired by the main antagonist.


I'm not trying to come off as anything, hero.  I've said my piece and have moved on.  
 
ON TOPIC: I don't see her as a boss type.  It would be a twist to be sure but she seems like something that the devs would play safe with or want to keep around.  She seems made to make the game more appealing to a larger audience (females, casuals, etc).  I have nothing to based that impression on except that as someone who hated the first 2 bioshocks for their dreary atmosphere and characters.  This game, however, appeals due to the seemingly more open enviroment visually and interactions with the woman. 
#45 Edited by Ghostiet (5242 posts) -

I don't think so. It would be too obvious for Irrational to Joss Whedon her.

#46 Posted by BeachThunder (11799 posts) -
@MattyFTM said:

The game revolves so heavily around her abilities, if she does die, it'll have to be at the very end of the game.

Why?
 
She could die and Booker might absorb her powers. Maybe she dies and someone else with other powers follows you around instead. She could die and then you must travel through time (or do something else) in order to make her un-die...
#47 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@TanoPrime said:

LOL, eggcream! I like you. As for the other guy, I did not studder. But given the fact that you completly ignored that the game will probably go the wussy route of having a powerful female character who has to ultimately become a pretty frail flower to appeal to little 15 yr old FAPmonkeys (you know, the important part of my statement) and decided to focus on my given choice of vocabulary...hmm, this tells me you really had nothing important to say. If you wish to white knight it up and defend fair maiden of pixels, then mount upon thine font cover steed and ride forth into the fray! But do know I have already slain the dragon and I'm banging the princess. What a hot broad!

There was something important in that mess of a comment you left? It read like godamned nonsense to me.

#48 Posted by MonkeyKing1969 (2666 posts) -

Oh, come now folks she is the classic 'honey pot' character meant to trick you. They set up Songbird who this big, powerful and menacing looking thing, and Elizabeth as an innocent, beautiful yet powerful thing. Yet, who do you think the BIG BAD of the game is really going to be? At the end of the game you (the player) will be given the choice as to if you kill Elizabeth or let her live. To let her live will mean knowing you are releasing some great powerful evil into the world. Elizabeth is cute, doe-eyed, and innocent looking because they want you to be invested in helping her throughout the game until the "twist" when it is revealed Songbird is protecting the world from the great evil -- Elizabeth.

#49 Posted by Getz (2995 posts) -

@MonkeyKing1969 said:

Oh, come now folks she is the classic 'honey pot' character meant to trick you. They set up Songbird who this big, powerful and menacing looking thing, and Elizabeth as an innocent, beautiful yet powerful thing. Yet, who do you think the BIG BAD of the game is really going to be? At the end of the game you (the player) will be given the choice as to if you kill Elizabeth or let her live. To let her live will mean knowing you are releasing some great powerful evil into the world. Elizabeth is cute, doe-eyed, and innocent looking because they want you to be invested in helping her throughout the game until the "twist" when it is revealed Songbird is protecting the world from the great evil -- Elizabeth.

This is probably my favorite theory so far.

#50 Posted by RepThePlantDawg420 (131 posts) -

probably.

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