Few questions about Borderlands 2 combat.

#1 Edited by prospectsmarch (2 posts) -

Recently I got the the opportunity to play this game at a friend's house. I've been interested in the series since the release of BL1, but was always hesitant to get it. But now that I've played the first hour or so and the game got me hooked. I have a few questions, mainly regarding the combat and enemies.

I generally like loot-driven games. I played through Diablo 3 around three times -- in spite of the monotonous combat -- because of the loot and consistent progression. So, here is my concern, I'm aware of the fact that the game starts slow, but does the combat gets significantly better?

I'm one of the few who really enjoyed BioShock Infinite (and the original for that matter). I thought it had a good balance between depth and breadth; I was able to tackle situations in creative ways, which made the gameplay immensely satisfying. It's a bit of bummer that you only get one ability per class, but I know that the game is reasonably varied (in terms of equipment, weapons and environments?), but how deep and engaging is the combat system? Does the combat have any tactical elements?

Finally, how's the enemy variety? Do all enemies behave the same, or do you have to rethink how you tackle each scenario based on the combination of enemies you encounter?

This doesn't really bother me that much, but do all weapons sound like toy guns? I feel like they fall a bit flat, sound-wise, kind of like GTA IV.

Anyhow, thanks in advance.

#2 Posted by SpaceInsomniac (3885 posts) -

Recently I got the the opportunity to play this game at a friend's house. I've been interested in the series since the release of BL1, but was always hesitant to get it. But now that I've played the first hour or so and the game got me hooked. I have a few questions, mainly regarding the combat and enemies.

I generally like loot-driven games. I played through Diablo 3 around three times -- in spite of the monotonous combat -- because of the loot and consistent progression. So, here is my concern, I'm aware of the fact that the game starts slow, but does the combat gets significantly better?

I'm one of the few who really enjoyed BioShock Infinite (and the original for that matter). I thought it had a good balance between depth and breadth; I was able to tackle situations in creative ways, which made the gameplay immensely satisfying. It's a bit of bummer that you only get one ability per class, but I know that the game is reasonably varied (in terms of equipment, weapons and environments?), but how deep and engaging is the combat system? Does the combat have any tactical elements?

Finally, how's the enemy variety? Do all enemies behave the same, or do you have to rethink how you tackle each scenario based on the combination of enemies you encounter?

This doesn't really bother me that much, but do all weapons sound like toy guns? I feel like they fall a bit flat, sound-wise, kind of like GTA IV.

Anyhow, thanks in advance.

Which character are you using? Combat gets better, but some characters require you to get much further into their skill trees before they become really fun to use. Most of the middle tier skills change the game in some pretty fun ways, as do the end tier skills. You'll need to be level 16 for mid tier, and 31 for end tier.

Combat has some basic tactical elements. Corrosion melts armor, fire melts flesh, electricity zaps shields, and slag deals double damage. Things like that. You'll learn about it all when you reach the first town. It's nothing too deep, but when you co-op, you can add a bit more strategy. The real strategy comes from combining weapons, skills, and gear to find highly effective builds.

Enemy variety is pretty good, and they do not at all behave the same. Enemy varieties aren't mixed all that much, though. That's a good thing, as you'd have to switch between your weapons far too much.

#3 Edited by prospectsmarch (2 posts) -

@spaceinsomniac: I know the real hook here is the loot, but can the combat stand on its own? I'm planning on using the Siren, by the way.

#4 Edited by Seppli (10251 posts) -

I've only played like 10 hours of Borderlands 2, but from where I'm sitting, I have had a hard time tolerating the insane amounts of sway and whatnot, and the random optics on the guns. I'd much prefer it, if gunplay was tighter, and certain aspects of the guns were customizable, rather completely random. Especially the random magnification sights make the loose feeling super swayin' shooting even more annoying.

If they tighten up the shooting. Add some much needed customization to guns. And add Titanfall-style organic movement and defensive maneuvers into the mix. I'll be game for Borderlands 3. Also - any shooter game gets better with destructible environments.

P.S. There's loads of different enemies, each requiring the same tactic. Shoot them.

#5 Posted by SpaceInsomniac (3885 posts) -

Siren is a good choice for having a useful and entertaining skill right away. Her skill trees are also a lot of fun to explore. By comparison, the assassin doesn't really come into his own until his final tier skills.

Combat isn't great, but it's good enough. Certainly more entertaining than any other loot game I've ever played. Mix the combat with loot and skills, and things get a lot more entertaining. Play with a friend or two whenever you can.

#6 Posted by believer258 (12105 posts) -

@seppli said:

I've only played like 10 hours of Borderlands 2, but from where I'm sitting, I have had a hard time tolerating the insane amounts of sway and whatnot, and the random optics on the guns. I'd much prefer it, if gunplay was tighter, and certain aspects of the guns were customizable, rather completely random. Especially the random magnification sights make the loose feeling super swayin' shooting even more annoying.

If they tighten up the shooting. Add some much needed customization to guns. And add Titanfall-style organic movement into the mix. I'm game for Borderlands 3. Also - any shooter game gets better with destructible environments.

P.S. There's loads of different enemies, each requiring the same tactic. Shoot them.

It doesn't ever really get tighter. Borderlands 2 is better than Borderlands 1 except in a handful of very key areas, one of them being that none of the guns feel particularly useful. In Borderlands 1, you almost always came across a gun that would feel pretty dependable for an hour or two of gameplay. In all of my time with Borderlands 2, I never came across a gun that I felt "attached" to. I was always switching to something else, hoping that it would feel like a fine-tuned weapon. None of them ever were.

#7 Edited by DinosaurCanada (121 posts) -

I generally did not get bored or frustrated with the variety of enemies in the second game, plenty of different variations of each type. The first game was super weak on that front.

Most of the classes feel the same until about level 16-17, since that's usually when you get a good flow of when and how to use your powers in a fight, what tree you're going down etc. Overall, as you said, it's still definitely more about the shooting and looting, with the powers there to compliment and vary that.

#8 Posted by tomobedlam (37 posts) -

It depends on the char you play, the one that take the longest to shine is zero, but the siren and the soldier are good for getting in to the game, the loot is pretty shitty, but some of the best weapons are easilly obtained, mostly from the dlcs, the more you advanced the more difficult it gets due to the exponential increase in damage, and health of the enemies, and the last mode, UVHM also includes health regen , and an almost total dependency on slag,(there are ways around that but it implies knowing very well what weapons and build to use) but in the tiny tina DLC they included a set of slagging weapons, grenades and shields that make it more tolerable, the gunzereker is overpowered as shit and is a walking glitch but if you just want to faceroll everything is your best choice, Axton, Maya, and Zero can be powerhouses too but to a less degree and you have to learn how to play those chars, Co-op is pretty fun if you have some friends to play with, randoms can be difficult

#9 Edited by geirr (2680 posts) -

I love Borderlands 2; much of that love however might be contributed to my wife's insane love for it as well. She turns into a beast when she plays it with her Siren and with the right strategies we merrily lay waste to anything in our path - and the combat with friends is pretty amazing. Single player though I just have no fun with it at all. I don't like the AI routines, wiggling all over the place, and I constantly feel like I could die at any second, and it feels kinda unbalanced? Or maybe that's a good thing? There's tons of fun and rewarding strategies to find when playing with others, but alone, I just really suck at this and can't be bothered.

Oh and the guns, to me, never really lose their "toy-like" feel. They're fairly cute though, if you're into that.

#10 Edited by mosespippy (4379 posts) -

In my experience with Borderlands 2 I'd say that the end game is where the variety is. You'll be running bosses over and over again for their legendary loot. At least all those bosses have different tactics required. The rest of the game is just fodder enemies. The Siren is a great class especially in co-op since she can instantly revive players from a distance. I'd suggest playing co-op with someone a few levels higher than you. The loot in this game seems to always be trash for the player by three or four levels. If you hop into a higher level players game you should be getting loot that is trash to them but good for you. It's one of the bad design choices that makes me say that Borderlands 1 is a better game. The other is the quest design and level design has you backtracking through long uninteresting levels a lot.

#11 Edited by Fredchuckdave (6011 posts) -

Enemy variety is alright in Borderlands 2, certainly much better than the first game in that regard. The game basically becomes more interesting the more willing you are to try out different weapons and various enemies will be easier with different approaches (basically every humanoid is easier with a sniper rifle for example). The early legendaries (other than the grenade mod) you have access to are pretty shitty so you'll have to focus on whatever loot the game deigns to give you. Levelling up a Goliath is an entertaining, rewarding experience; though the same can't be said for Varkids which you'll probably just wind up shotgunning down. This gun made the game pretty fun for like 5-6 levels.

#12 Posted by ShaggE (6636 posts) -

It easily has the best combat in the series since Borderlands 1.

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