Really far behind the curve I know but my goal to finish my back log of games is now in full swing. I've played to level 11 in one character and level 5 in the others trying to find a play style that fitted how I wanted to finish the game and I have since worked out what annoys me about this. Normally in loot and grind fests I've played games like WoW in a 3rd person view. As such when I moved to borderlands being in first person I was under the assumption that when I had my cross hairs on the guys head that's what it would hit when more often than not the bullets miss. This has made playing Mordecai early on annoying because I get 4 shots in my sniper then I spend half the time kiting around trying to reload. The soldier is equally annoying because half my clip hits dirt when there is a skag literally licking my crotch.......FUUUUU

Does anyone else find it vexing that a game that is in an FPS perspective doesn't reward me for having already honed my aiming skills in games that require a lot more skill than this. It makes me feel retarded because I've never missed this much in other games. While I am all for RNG what benefit is there playing properly if I have the chance to miss so many attacks >_>

I haven't played Borderlands in a good long while but I remember the game playing like a standard FPS in terms of shooting (not using dice rolls like in Alpha Protocol) so if you have good aim you'll hit it. Where the RPG aspect came in was the damage the gun did and if it had any special attributes. So, I don't know what to tell you.

Aim down the sites? Seriously, there isn't really much else to say. As the gentleman above states, it's all about skill. Leveling just gets you more health and points to spend on skills, it doesn't affect gun stats (thought it does affect what weapons you can or cannot use).

Cool, the post above you is trying to get into a comma. I tried playing, but couldn't, just couldn't get into it.

I'll have another look, but I am definitely of the opinion that when aiming down the sites and firing one bullet from a crouched position I would assume the bullet would fire dead straight. I've watched said straight bullet miss stationary targets. I know you need to lead moving targets but it just feels off. I've just jumped into CSS and BF2 BC2 and can confirm that I apparently can still aim so NFI what's up. Will try again, this game might get put on the back burner for a while I think :| Also does anyone else feel it's a very sparse desolate game, co-op would be a hoot but sp just feels very lonely and bleh.

I'll have another look, but I am definitely of the opinion that when aiming down the sites and firing one bullet from a crouched position I would assume the bullet would fire dead straight. I've watched said straight bullet miss stationary targets. I know you need to lead moving targets but it just feels off. I've just jumped into CSS and BF2 BC2 and can confirm that I apparently can still aim so NFI what's up. Will try again, this game might get put on the back burner for a while I think :| Also does anyone else feel it's a very sparse desolate game, co-op would be a hoot but sp just feels very lonely and bleh.

Odd I never really had this issue with the game. Just point at a dude's head and watch the crits fly.

I didnt really have a problem with the shooting or accuracy, but that might be because i play a lot of first person shooters.

The only time I really found this became an issue was when I tried to play the Sniper. I'd hit an enemy right in the head but the game would be happy enough to tell me I'd missed if I didn't pass a stat check, that was frustrating. I played through as the Soldier though and had no problem just unloading clips into guys and killing them. I've never really heard of someone having this issue playing Soldier.

I got Mordecai to 38 or so and never really had issues with hitting stationary targets. Plenty of issues with moving targets because I suck at FPS, sure, but not the ones that just sitting there. I do recommend looking at talents, plotting how you want to build your toon and choose your guns, accordingly. Then stick with them. Your gun skills level and you get bonuses as you go. I jumped around to all kinds of different guns, so I don't think any of my guns skills on Mordecai are even above 20.

I really noticed this as well, apparently bullets travel super f'ing slow in that game compared to other shooters. That was one of the things that bugged me the most about Borderlands (especially as sniper).

@grnt: Sniper rifles aren't great in Borderlands. If you're playing with others online, you might be able to have a good time using them, but solo, you're probably just going to get annoyed. As for the bullets not hitting the target, maybe you're using guns with low accuracy. Each gun has an accuracy rating, and that would certainly affect your ability to hit a target at a distance.

Played the game to 67 as the Siren and in the 50's as the Hunter, and reading this makes me want to start a Soldier run, but this was never an issue for me. The game felt fine, it had some problems (or rather it had intricacies from the RPG-style accuracy stats) but the aiming was definitely never an issue for me. Maybe it's because I knew that and always used three-round burst combat rifles and magnums, but I was capable of hitting everything I wanted to. The aim assist certainly helps. 

@cinemandrew said:

@grnt: Sniper rifles aren't great in Borderlands. If you're playing with others online, you might be able to have a good time using them, but solo, you're probably just going to get annoyed. As for the bullets not hitting the target, maybe you're using guns with low accuracy. Each gun has an accuracy rating, and that would certainly affect your ability to hit a target at a distance.

totally forgot about the accuracy rating and at low levels, I am sure he is finding nothing but crap guns. good call, there.

I think you look at it this way: your character is not a 100% hit, and different weapons are easier/harder to hit with. But when you hit, you wan't it to hurt, so you aim for the head.

The early game weapons are generally pretty inaccurate (with ratings around 70-80 or so). However, you'll probably find or buy an awesome weapon soon. I hope you stick with it, I love Borderlands. 

@Gamer_152 said:

The only time I really found this became an issue was when I tried to play the Sniper. I'd hit an enemy right in the head but the game would be happy enough to tell me I'd missed if I didn't pass a stat check, that was frustrating. I played through as the Soldier though and had no problem just unloading clips into guys and killing them. I've never really heard of someone having this issue playing Soldier.

The game has funky hit detection when it comes to the launchers and sniper rifles. Not sure if it was a character-specific thing, or a way to balance it so you don't break the game going crazy with one type of gun.

the game is at base level a shooter, and works based on your ability to react in action. That said, even as a shooter, it has a slow start due to the RPG like nature. Once you beat Bone head and get the weapons to fight nine toes it should start to ramp up and fit more with the RPGs you play.

Edit: Also at that point you should be somewhat used to FPS combat by then, and not as bothered.

Your weapon proficiency also affects your accuracy, in a positive way, so just keep using it and leveling the gun proficiency up and you'll have an easier time.

I think this is a simple case of you sucking. Borderlands has no dice rolls in the shooting, aiming at a persons head will shoot that person in the head 100% of the time. Maybe you should try shotguns and get a tad closer.

@PlasmaBeam44 said:

...(not using dice rolls like in Alpha Protocol)...

I remember Jeff stating this in the Quick Look as well, but it's not the case. The aiming is not "dice rolls"/random in any way, but it IS dependent on how much you've leveled up your proficiency with each weapon type. The main problem is that the people who designed the weapon proficiency system apparently had no idea how bad their decisions were.

Basically, once you start aiming down your sights in Alpha Protocol, it takes a certain amount of time to steady your aim, and if you wait until the crosshairs have become as small as possible, your shot is guaranteed to go exactly where you aim. Untrained, the pistol and assault rifle take FOUR SECONDS to be fully steadied. If you fire those weapons while moving at all, or before your aim is fully steadied, there is a pretty good chance your shots will go wide of the target, though if you wait like 3 seconds or more your shots have an OK chance of connecting, though definitely not where you're actually aiming.

As you reach milestones in those proficiencies, it takes 3 seconds, then 2.5 seconds, then 2 seconds, then 1.5 seconds. While that is a dramatic improvement compared to 4 seconds, 1.5 seconds (which you only get after dumping like a zillion levelups into a particular weapon proficiency) still feels like forever compared to just about every other game that has aim-down-sights shooting.

Sounds like you need to start paying more attention to the accuracy stat on your guns. IIRC for a rifle you want a minimum accuracy of 90 but honestly 95 should be what you're going for. You may want to consider running Mordecai as a pistoleer for the time being then respec to rifles when you get a good drop. For Roland, anything with an 80 should do the trick.

Don't get discouraged. Borderlands is probably one of my favorite games. Beginning gear isn't great, but it never is in RPGs. Once you get a little ways in you'll pick up weapons with higher damage and increased accuracy. In fact, check the accuracy stat on your weapons because that might be a large reason as to why you miss. Seriously though, this game made me max out Mordecai and complete all of the dlc. I rarely spend that much time with a game anymore.

Borderlands just never clicked with me.

I played with Lilith all the way to the mid 50s, and never had any aiming issues with any of my weapons.... And I went between SMGs and snipers a lot, so I dunno what to tell ya.

@grnt: Increasing your proficiency in your weapon of choice will help with your aiming woes. Eventually it will get super easy to get multiple crits in a row.

Alright cheers guys I'll keep with it, I find it off that people say there are no dice rolls when the weapon stat of accuracy and apparently proficiency come into it. How can a weapon with 70% accuracy not dice roll? If we are both standing still at acceptable range I'm only guaranteed 7/10 to hit....sounds like dice roll to me. I'll aim to get to the 20's this week and see if my perception changes. My solider is still pretty low so might pursue it with him and see how we go.