"Adult-Oriented", Handled Maturely?

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#1 Posted by BulletStorm (487 posts) -

I don't have a lot of / any experience with, what Atlus is calling "Adult-Oriented" experiences in my games. Quite frankly, when I think about that combination; it just strikes me as immature. Yeah, thats a bit of backwards logic, mature themes + game = immaturity, but that's just my thinking. 
 
But, judging by both the trailer, and the development team's reputation; do you think Catherine could pull off "Adult-Oriented" experiences in a matter that is serious, develops plot and character and doesn't come off as being just throwaway nudity and erotica? I'd say, and hope yes.

#2 Posted by Jeffsekai (7027 posts) -

It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay.

#3 Posted by LordXavierBritish (6320 posts) -

Is this the first game to even legitimately try this? Like, there has obviously been sex in games before, but I don't think it has ever been tied to the narrative in any significant way. 
 
It has to have been done before right?

#4 Edited by ImmortalSaiyan (4676 posts) -

I have a lot of faith in the Persona 4 team. I think they can pull it off.

#5 Posted by Ramyun (664 posts) -

Yeah, I know what you mean. But that does raise a good question about the nature of our industry in general. I mean, would we be able to see adult oriented themes done more seriously and maturely without it resorting to being pandering. The only game I have heard that did adult oriented properly would be Heavy Rain.

#6 Posted by BraveToaster (12590 posts) -

The only thing that matters to me is if the game is good or not.

#7 Posted by Hailinel (24255 posts) -
@LordXavierBritish said:
" Is this the first game to even legitimately try this? Like, there has obviously been sex in games before, but I don't think it has ever been tied to the narrative in any significant way.  It has to have been done before right? "
Mature themes have been covered by games before in honestly mature ways, though when sex is involved, it more often than not devolves into marketing teams pointing out to hormonal fourteen-year-olds that hey, you can totally bone that hot blue alien chick in our game!
 
I trust that Atlus, for all the more immature sexual humor that exist in some of their games, can pull off a story steeped in mature sexuality well, given the dark themes that the Megami Tensei franchise routinely touches upon.
#8 Posted by MisterMouse (3543 posts) -

unfortunately some of what I have seen so far (just from the trailer) it seems like there will be some gratuitous nudity just for the heck of it, but I feel in addition to that the main lady will play a big enough role in the game that all of that will make sense to a certain amount.

#9 Posted by Landon (4132 posts) -
@Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!...
But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean...
#10 Posted by Jeffsekai (7027 posts) -
@Landon said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt.
#11 Posted by Landon (4132 posts) -
@Jeffsekai said:
" @Landon said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
*throws hands in air*
If "answer question, get porn" isn't enough plot/gameplay for you, I dont know what is!
#12 Posted by Thordain (959 posts) -

If they can pull off angsty teenagers shooting themselves in the head, I think they can handle sex. 

#13 Edited by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms. 
 
 
But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it. 
#14 Posted by Jeffsekai (7027 posts) -
@Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms.   But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it.  "
So wait, you tell me Actually there is then you back track and say there isnt.
#15 Posted by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms.   But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it.  "
So wait, you tell me Actually there is then you back track and say there isnt. "
No. You misunderstood. I didn't say that there wasn't, i said few do.  Most maturity labels are due to excessive violent content or explicit sex. But there are games that use it in the right places too, even in hentai games i gather. 
#16 Posted by LordXavierBritish (6320 posts) -
@Jeust said:
"  i gather.  "
Don't lie.
#17 Posted by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@LordXavierBritish said:
" @Jeust said:
"  i gather.  "
Don't lie. "
I shall not. ^^
#18 Posted by Jeffsekai (7027 posts) -
@Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms.   But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it.  "
So wait, you tell me Actually there is then you back track and say there isnt. "
No. You misunderstood. I didn't say that there wasn't, i said few do.  Most maturity labels are due to excessive violent content or explicit sex. But there are games that use it in the right places too, even in hentai games i gather.  "
Read the bold.
#19 Posted by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms.   But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it.  "
So wait, you tell me Actually there is then you back track and say there isnt. "
No. You misunderstood. I didn't say that there wasn't, i said few do.  Most maturity labels are due to excessive violent content or explicit sex. But there are games that use it in the right places too, even in hentai games i gather.  "
Read the bold. "
My bad ^^
#20 Posted by MordeaniisChaos (5730 posts) -
@BulletStorm said:
" I don't have a lot of / any experience with, what Atlus is calling "Adult-Oriented" experiences in my games. Quite frankly, when I think about that combination; it just strikes me as immature. Yeah, thats a bit of backwards logic, mature themes + game = immaturity, but that's just my thinking.  But, judging by both the trailer, and the development team's reputation; do you think Catherine could pull off "Adult-Oriented" experiences in a matter that is serious, develops plot and character and doesn't come off as being just throwaway nudity and erotica? I'd say, and hope yes. "
It's possible for sex to be in a mature game. As long as the sex isn't the point of the game, I don't see the issue. It looks like the sex will be dealt with in a much more mature way than in games like Dragon Age and Mass Effect 2.
#21 Posted by Brodehouse (9764 posts) -

It's entirely possible.  
 
Some people will absolutely refuse to see the maturity in it, because the visuals are rendered in anime style.

#22 Posted by raiz265 (2237 posts) -
@ImmortalSaiyan said:
" I have a lot of faith in the Persona 4 team. I think they can pull it off. "
Remember, they still are japanese.
#23 Posted by Jazz (2251 posts) -

I'd argue that most of the Persona games dealt with 'adult orientated' subject matters. That covers more than just visual representations of  blood and sex. 
It's more about the themes in the game. Psychological trauma etc.
If all the Silent Hill games aren't 'Adult Orientated' then I must have lost the plot somewhere along the line. 
@raiz265 said:

" @ImmortalSaiyan said:
" I have a lot of faith in the Persona 4 team. I think they can pull it off. "
Remember, they still are japanese. "
(rolls eyes)
#24 Edited by ProfessorEss (7307 posts) -
@Brodehouse said:

It's entirely possible.
Some people will absolutely refuse to see the maturity in it, because the visuals are rendered in anime style. "

To be fair, this will be done in the same way most Japanophiles write off every tit in a western game as "gratuitous" in an attempt to draw in the "lowest common denominator".
 
Can't wait to see more about Catherine tho, the quality looks crazy high.
#25 Posted by Cirdain (3038 posts) -
@Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms.   But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it.  "
So wait, you tell me Actually there is then you back track and say there isnt. "
No. You misunderstood. I didn't say that there wasn't, i said few do.  Most maturity labels are due to excessive violent content or explicit sex. But there are games that use it in the right places too, even in hentai games i gather.  "
Read the bold. "
My bad ^^ "
Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot. 
#26 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

Adult means boobs and blood. That's it. Level your expectations.

#27 Edited by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@Cirdain said:

" @Jeust said:

" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" @Jeust said:
" @Jeffsekai said:

" @Landon said:

" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
Actually there is. The one that was discussed here featuring "crippled" models seemed pretty good, as it treated people with disabilities with respect within the plot of the game. The gameplay i can't say, because i haven't played, but there are certainly good games in these terms.   But about the Catherine, if it will treat mature themes maturely then will be one of the few games to do so. The persona games were deep games, but not necessarily with a lot of maturity to it.  "
So wait, you tell me Actually there is then you back track and say there isnt. "
No. You misunderstood. I didn't say that there wasn't, i said few do.  Most maturity labels are due to excessive violent content or explicit sex. But there are games that use it in the right places too, even in hentai games i gather.  "
Read the bold. "
My bad ^^ "
Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot.  "
Yep. Sometimes too soft-core for one's tastes. ^^
#28 Edited by zityz (2360 posts) -

Its not the game in question most of the time (not all) thats Immature. It's the audience who flocks to it that makes it immature. 
 
"yo dawg I hurd this games got tits and sex and shit, thats awesome" 
"man you should buy that shit, its going to be sick" 
 
you could also insert this conversation into games that SHOULD not be made, like The Guy Game and just about ANY new Leasure Suit Larry games. 
 
if done right,you can add a mature theme and keep it enganging to the story. Like Mass Effect for example. 
 
EDIT: Not to say everyone is like this. There are quitea lot of people that have the brain capacity to handle subject matter in a mature way. Unfortunatly, your outnumbered by the average moron.
#29 Posted by JackSukeru (5908 posts) -
@Jeust said:
" @Cirdain said:

Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot.  "

Yep. Sometimes too soft-core for one's tastes. ^^ "
And where are my multiple choice answers? Srsly, do they expect me to come up with the stuff I say myself or something?
#30 Posted by guiseppe (2840 posts) -

I think you have to take the whole subject more lightly to appreciate it.

#31 Edited by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@RockmanBionics said:

" @Jeust said:

" @Cirdain said:

Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot.  "

Yep. Sometimes too soft-core for one's tastes. ^^ "
And where are my multiple choice answers? Srsly, do they expect me to come up with the stuff I say myself or something? "
It's probably like mass effect. They give you a word by which to characterize your reaction, and you have to improvise accordingly. Mad, cool, bitchy, courageous, endearing... ^^ 
 
Go go Sheppard!
#32 Posted by Drakhir (410 posts) -
@Jeust said:
" @RockmanBionics said:

" @Jeust said:

" @Cirdain said:

Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot.  "

Yep. Sometimes too soft-core for one's tastes. ^^ "
And where are my multiple choice answers? Srsly, do they expect me to come up with the stuff I say myself or something? "
It's probably like mass effect. They give you a word by which to characterize your reaction, and you have to improvise accordingly. Mad, cool, bitchy, courageous, endearing... ^^  Go go Sheppard! "
Can we keep this about Catherine and its mature themes?
 
I believe that the mature part will be placed correctly in the story, in order not to give us simple "fanservice". I mean, Atlus wouldn't just release something with a weak story and lots of sex.
#33 Posted by Jeust (10537 posts) -
@Drakhir said:
" @Jeust said:
" @RockmanBionics said:

" @Jeust said:

" @Cirdain said:

Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot.  "

Yep. Sometimes too soft-core for one's tastes. ^^ "
And where are my multiple choice answers? Srsly, do they expect me to come up with the stuff I say myself or something? "
It's probably like mass effect. They give you a word by which to characterize your reaction, and you have to improvise accordingly. Mad, cool, bitchy, courageous, endearing... ^^  Go go Sheppard! "
Can we keep this about Catherine and its mature themes?
 
I believe that the mature part will be placed correctly in the story, in order not to give us simple "fanservice". I mean, Atlus wouldn't just release something with a weak story and lots of sex. "
I agree. Still most of the times that's what happens. So I'll reserve my judgement for the final product.   
 
But I'm looking forward to the game. 
#34 Posted by FluxWaveZ (19321 posts) -

Yeah, I hope Atlus are above making a game centered on sex for it to sell.  Obviously, there's much more going in the game than just the erotica and I hope that Atlus making a big deal of the erotic aspects of the game is just for marketing purposes.

#35 Posted by scarace360 (4828 posts) -

I think they could pull it off but what i really wanna see them do is doge fox with this game and what there going to say when an idiot says that this game is all about sex and destroying your kids.

#36 Posted by Brendan (7731 posts) -

I hope they can pull it off, but it's not looking good for a game with advertising that centers around boobs.   
Online
#37 Posted by SpiralStairs (1020 posts) -

The SMT games are full of philosophical and religious themes, the kind of thing that a mature audience would be more interested in. I'm sure this game won't be just about tits, they'll probably just be there to make things more interesting.

#38 Posted by Cirdain (3038 posts) -
@Jeust said:
" @Drakhir said:
" @Jeust said:
" @RockmanBionics said:

" @Jeust said:

" @Cirdain said:

Life is a hentai game with a story and an anti-climatic plot.  "

Yep. Sometimes too soft-core for one's tastes. ^^ "
And where are my multiple choice answers? Srsly, do they expect me to come up with the stuff I say myself or something? "
It's probably like mass effect. They give you a word by which to characterize your reaction, and you have to improvise accordingly. Mad, cool, bitchy, courageous, endearing... ^^  Go go Sheppard! "
Can we keep this about Catherine and its mature themes?
 
I believe that the mature part will be placed correctly in the story, in order not to give us simple "fanservice". I mean, Atlus wouldn't just release something with a weak story and lots of sex. "
I agree. Still most of the times that's what happens. So I'll reserve my judgement for the final product.    But I'm looking forward to the game.  "
Hmm... one of these guys is trollin'. But, Who!?
#39 Posted by BulletStorm (487 posts) -

So! Good discussion eh? I figure that the general consensus is that Catherine can handle sex in a mature way as can other mediums - like literature and film - and that it wouldn't necessarily be the first to do so. Though I haven't played Dragon Age, I've done the paramour routes in Mass Effect - which don't quite meet what I consider "Mature", depending on who is romanced. 

#40 Posted by AndrewB (7565 posts) -

I like to go with the belief that Atlus knows what they're doing and can pull it off with maturity, but that the trailer is just the way it is because it's highlighting the sex stuff to sell the game to you (when in reality it kinda seems like it's polarizing opinions of those who actually follow game development). 
 
I'll be curious to see how our overly puritan games rating system handles it though. Will there be content they'll feel the need/be forced to cut to make the MA rating? I personally don't think the game will be anything beyond risque, so I don't think that'll be an issue, but then we haven't really seen all that much of the game yet to be sure.

#41 Posted by MackGyver (538 posts) -

I's sure they can but it's a very fine line they will have to walk. They don't want it to be another adult Anime dating game and they don't want the game to show too little or else it would disappointed the "Adult" rating.

#42 Edited by Cornman89 (1579 posts) -

While from the first trailer it's quite clear they're aiming for the cheap titillation brand of "mature", the Persona games tend to surprise you with the subject matter they're willing to broach, so I fully expect the game to take a hard left turn at some point and become a meditation on the destruction wrought by obsessive love. Or something.

#43 Posted by wolf_blitzer85 (5253 posts) -
@zityz said:
" Its not the game in question most of the time (not all) thats Immature. It's the audience who flocks to it that makes it immature.
This dude nailed it.
#44 Posted by Hailinel (24255 posts) -
@raiz265 said:
" @ImmortalSaiyan said:
" I have a lot of faith in the Persona 4 team. I think they can pull it off. "
Remember, they still are japanese. "
What does nationality have to do with anything?
#45 Posted by afrofools (1335 posts) -
@BulletStorm: While not as mature as I presume you would like, I think the idea is that she is the playable character's ideal woman, and since she is ideal to his desires, that means she is probably really 'hot' and represented that way to the player to make her believable to be his ideal girl (from his fantasies etc), and attract the hentai audience at the same time.  SPOILER WARNING: Click here to reveal hidden content.
 
To me the whole idea of a game, which has a plot based around a guy lusting after his dream girl and getting caught in some weird dream shit, is really interesting, and that is why I want to get this game.
#46 Posted by Deusoma (3004 posts) -

I don't mean to come off as prejudiced, I'm just speaking from general experience with both North American and Japanese culture, but I sincerely believe that if and when the first adult-oriented videogame comes along that handles the subject matter maturely, it's not going to be a Japanese game. It's not that they're incapable of doing it, it's just that they're totally and completely comfortable with a certain level of immaturity in their games. Of course, at the moment, pretty much every development company on this side of the world is like that too, so it'll be a while before we see such a game from anywhere.

#47 Posted by DoctorOptimist (502 posts) -

It seems to be an extremely trippy and psychologically taunting games that explores the natures of death and sex. It's similiar to David Lynch movies in that aspect. Atlus is known for creating, hip yet intelligent and provocative storytelling into their games. The sexual content seems to be more maturely handled than any DOA title.

#48 Posted by Azteck (7449 posts) -
@Landon said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" @Landon said:
" @Jeffsekai said:
" It means Boobs and Sex. Basically it's gonna be a Hentai Game with a plot/gameplay. "
Hey! There are plenty of hentai games with plot and gameplay!... But...but its not like I've played any of them or nothin'...I mean... "
No there isnt. "
*throws hands in air* If "answer question, get porn" isn't enough plot/gameplay for you, I dont know what is! "
Hahaha. Thanks for the laugh.
#49 Posted by DoctorWelch (2774 posts) -

If anyone can it's Atlus, and from the trailer, I'd say they are doing a pretty good job of making sex have something to do with the story in the game other than just "Yo, boobs, thats cool right?"

#50 Posted by dieguy (108 posts) -

I'm sorry but I don't think they can do it or at least they're not going to try . Look at that, does this say maturity to you?
 

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