Finally hit a wall, thinking about restarting.

#1 Posted by ADAMWD (609 posts) -

I'm about 17 hours in and am SL 46. I've been progressing through the game without any real issues, but now I'm in Anor Londo, and am continually getting my ass handed to me by Smough and Ornstein. Hell, I can barely kill the two big dudes that are guarding the entrance to the boss area. My two best weapons are Lightning Spear +2 and Queelag's Furysword +2. I don't even know if these are sufficient for defeating them, or if I should upgrade them more, or find some other weapons. I'm out of humanity as well, and super low on souls, so maybe by best bet would be to do some farming?

My current stats are...

Vitality - 25

Attunement - 12

Endurance - 22

Strength - 21

Dexterity - 17

Resistance - 13

Intelligence - 11

Faith - 8

I feel like I didn't really optimize my skill allocation. Would it be worth to restart knowing that I could get to where I am now in a fraction of the time, with a better built character, or should I just continue with what I have? Any suggestions for where/what I should do next?

#2 Posted by imsh_pl (3298 posts) -
@ADAMWD: I beat Orstein and Smough on the first try with a help of two phantoms, had a lightning uchi+2 (so similar to the spear) and no magic/pyromancy/miracles. I had much more poorly allocated stats - spent many points in dex (which is pretty useless in this game) and didn't really focus on strength/endurance. Just try beating the bosses alongside strangers, they are all much, much easier that way.
 
My advice: focus on 2-3 stats max while levelling up, maybe occasional end/vit pump to get more health/stamina. If I were you I would focus on strength OR dexterity, but not two at the same time (I'd pick str :P) because the weapons generally focus on one or the other.
#3 Posted by SpaceRunaway (870 posts) -

I'd stay at Anor Londo, hang around the bonfire in the castle and farm some of the Silver Knights for a while, just to build up souls and humanity.  After you've got some humanity summon someone?  Sorry, I'm not playing a strength build, so I couldn't help you with the finer points of close combat with Bebop and Rocksteady.  Out of curiosity, what are you using for armor and ring equips?

#4 Posted by metalsnakezero (2318 posts) -

Best thing to do is direct all attacks on one person since the other guy will just refill their health when their buddy dies. If you have pyromancy skills or a fire base weapon like the Queelag's Furysword, use them on Ornstein since he is weak to fire, works on his small form or his 2nd form. Keep an eye on them and dodge every attack they make, moving from side to side and never away since most of their attacks are forward attacking.

#5 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -

You can summon a knight on one of the stair cases. For 360 I was about your level when I beat them. You should be able to summon someone. For the big guys guarding just pull one SLOWLY at a time. 

#6 Edited by MrKlorox (11209 posts) -

Your stats for your SL are fine. I'd just go back to the forest and grind mages and invisible thieves if I felt underleveled. You still have plenty of room for optimization of stats.
 
 I'd recommend a lot of endurance and vitality/resistance. Just don't waste more points on strength unless you plan on using heavy ass shields. Go back to Anor Londo around level 55-60.

#7 Posted by sixghost (1679 posts) -

Your only real wasted stats are maybe 5-6 pts too many in STR, and 3-4 points too many in DEX depending on the weapons you'd like to use. You really don't seem that bad off, maybe you could be 6-7 levels higher, but that's not going to be the thing holding you back from beating them.

#8 Posted by ADAMWD (609 posts) -

@SpaceRunaway: I'm using the Gold-Hemmed robe set for armor, and for rings I'm using Ring of Steel Protection and the Gold Serpent Ring.

#9 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -
@ADAMWD said:

@SpaceRunaway: I'm using the Gold-Hemmed robe set for armor, and for rings I'm using Ring of Steel Protection and the Gold Serpent Ring.

That has little to now armour at all. What class are you. I bet you take shit tons of damage with each hit. 
#10 Edited by Jiggah (308 posts) -

Your stats are fine.

You can swap out the gold serpent ring for this fight. I would actually take the silver one for the extra 20% soul increase over the gold for boss fights.

Get a good shield i.e. Eagle Shield, that has high stability and good lightning resistance. Fire-based weapons are your friends, the Quelaag Fury Sword is a good to use. Pryomancy is also a huge plus.

You can summon Solaire for this fight. The summoning sign is on the left stairs as you approach the fog, but make sure to kill the giant stone dude/annoying arrow guy first. Also, a lot of people put summoning signs down for this fight. So, "Need Humanity." Although most people are usually between SL 50-60.

#11 Edited by ADAMWD (609 posts) -

@The_Laughing_Man said:

@ADAMWD said:

@SpaceRunaway: I'm using the Gold-Hemmed robe set for armor, and for rings I'm using Ring of Steel Protection and the Gold Serpent Ring.

That has little to now armour at all. What class are you. I bet you take shit tons of damage with each hit.

I don't really get the stats on armor in this game. The robes have higher PhysDef than any other armor set I have other than Black Iron Armor. What armor would you suggest using, I'm trying to avoid any that causes slow rolls.

Also, does anyone have any tips for killing Lautrec? His dual sickles go right through my shield while his buddies are just pests that get in the way.

#12 Posted by SpaceRunaway (870 posts) -

Do you have Havel's Ring yet?  I could see that helping you a lot.

#13 Posted by DoctorWelch (2774 posts) -

If you have humanity then you should use it and summon phantoms to help you. Then use the electric spear and you should beat them easily.

Starting over actually isnt that bad of an idea. My first playthrough I chose a bandit and it took me like 30-40 hours to get through anor londo (I spent a lot of time farming and idling but still) and I started over. Then I chose a pyromancer and got to anor londo in about 5 or 6 hours maybe less because I had everything mapped out and memorized. So even though starting over would feel shitty, you could probably get back there in less than half the time.

#14 Edited by Tiwi (1401 posts) -

My advice would be getting the pyro hand. and leveling it to 13 or something like that. After you've done that join the chaos covenant and use the chaos fireball, takes off about 50% of the fast dude (ormstein i believe). That should be sufficient to killing them both.

I would advice against going for killing smough first on the initial playthough, you can always come back.

or just level your SL more for the resistance :-P I was level 56 or something when i fought THEM*. I was also something like 50 hours in I believe :-P

#15 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -
@ADAMWD said:

@The_Laughing_Man said:

@ADAMWD said:

@SpaceRunaway: I'm using the Gold-Hemmed robe set for armor, and for rings I'm using Ring of Steel Protection and the Gold Serpent Ring.

That has little to now armour at all. What class are you. I bet you take shit tons of damage with each hit.

I don't really get the stats on armor in this game. The robes have higher PhysDef than any other armor set I have other than Black Iron Armor. What armor would you suggest using, I'm trying to avoid any that causes slow rolls.

Also, does anyone have any tips for killing Lautrec? His dual sickles go right through my shield while his buddies are just pests that get in the way.

Go get havels ring. And some times you gotta roll slow.  
 
Lautrec was cake. I just smacked him with fireballs. 
#16 Posted by Jiggah (308 posts) -

@ADAMWD said:

@The_Laughing_Man said:

@ADAMWD said:

@SpaceRunaway: I'm using the Gold-Hemmed robe set for armor, and for rings I'm using Ring of Steel Protection and the Gold Serpent Ring.

That has little to now armour at all. What class are you. I bet you take shit tons of damage with each hit.

I don't really get the stats on armor in this game. The robes have higher PhysDef than any other armor set I have other than Black Iron Armor. What armor would you suggest using, I'm trying to avoid any that causes slow rolls.

Also, does anyone have any tips for killing Lautrec? His dual sickles go right through my shield while his buddies are just pests that get in the way.

Run circless around the room i.e. go up the stair, and take pot shots at Lautrec as he climbs up or drop stab him. Running around will keep the three guys in a single file rather than gang up on you. Just keep whittling down his health.

#17 Posted by The_Laughing_Man (13629 posts) -
@Jiggah said:

@ADAMWD said:

@The_Laughing_Man said:

@ADAMWD said:

@SpaceRunaway: I'm using the Gold-Hemmed robe set for armor, and for rings I'm using Ring of Steel Protection and the Gold Serpent Ring.

That has little to now armour at all. What class are you. I bet you take shit tons of damage with each hit.

I don't really get the stats on armor in this game. The robes have higher PhysDef than any other armor set I have other than Black Iron Armor. What armor would you suggest using, I'm trying to avoid any that causes slow rolls.

Also, does anyone have any tips for killing Lautrec? His dual sickles go right through my shield while his buddies are just pests that get in the way.

Run circless around the room i.e. go up the stair, and take pot shots at Lautrec as he climbs up or drop stab him. Running around will keep the three guys in a single file rather than gang up on you. Just keep whittling down his health.

@OP you are mor or less thinking the same way I did when I first started. Some times you do just gotta armour up and move at a fuck slow pace. 
#18 Posted by ADAMWD (609 posts) -

@The_Laughing_Man: I didn't choose the master key, is there another way to reach Havel?

#19 Edited by SpaceRunaway (870 posts) -

Oh, one last thing.  If you haven't tried helping other people out yet, I'd say that's the way to go for souls and humanity.  If farming isn't going so well, you should go back to the room before you fought the Iron Golem (Sen's Fortress boss) put down your sign and try seeing if anyone summons you.  Victories are 15K each time, plus usually one humanity.  It's a real good way to make money before you level too high and lock yourself out.  Just make sure you've opened the gates of Anor Londo from the inside, or the side door next to the blacksmith if you haven't already.

#20 Edited by Mmmslash (2168 posts) -

@ADAMWD said:

@The_Laughing_Man: I didn't choose the master key, is there another way to reach Havel?

After you defeat Moonlight Butterfly, there is a tower with a petrified blacksmith on top. He's holding a Divine Ember, and a Watchtower basement key. If you're not aware where it is, it is down the path next to the doorway in the forest that requires the 20k crest key. You'll reach a clearing, stick to the wall along the left. Don't head down the path you'll see, but continue to the ruins. The Moonlight Butterfly is on top.

Take this key and head down to the bottom of Darkroot Basin. You'll come across an open field with golems, and a Hydra shooting waterjets at you. Directly across is a large tower. This is Havel's tower. Be warned, though, Havel is directly inside the doorway, and he hits like a tank. He's slow, and easy enough to dodge.

Also as a secondary warning, if you come across a Black Knight on your descent, you have gone the wrong way. Fortunately, past that Knight is a stamina regenerating shield, a bonfire, and the path to the Valley of Drakes.

#21 Posted by RandomInternetUser (6789 posts) -

I've taken a couple weeks break (part because the last week has been filled with BF3 at all times I had the chance) after walking into Lost Izalith and seeing what was there and dieing. Fucking ass holes there, I should probably try bows, that might do it.

#22 Posted by McFly (63 posts) -

@ADAMWD: Actually, you have the PERFECT weapons to take on Smough and Orstein. Smough is weak to lightning (use the lightning spear on him) and Orstein is weak to fire (switch to Quelag's furysword for him). You can just poke Smough to death with your spear in phase 1 while standing behind your shield. You can also try farming a few humanities by leaving your summon sign near the bonfire and helping others beat the boss in coop. Then when you've enough, you can summon Solaire and other plaeyrs yourself.

Gold-Hemmed armor isn't bad, if you're good at dodging and rolling out of the way. If you're often hit by attacks, then a heavier set would be better despite the weight penalty. It's just a playstyle thing and no armor is ostensibly better than the other. Hell, the Elite Knight Set +10 has more physical defense than any other set in the game, even Havel's.

I don't know if you can make it out of Anor Londo and back to Firelink without a Lordvessel but if you can, you can try farming humanities at the Depths (like this). I can't stress this enough -- that fight is super easy in coop (almost like it was designed for coop). You're most definitely not stuck. In fact, you've pretty good base stats going forward for a strenght/dex build.

#23 Posted by ADAMWD (609 posts) -

I just got the Furysword to +5, I'm probably going to go to the forest now, I haven't been there at all yet. Hopefully I'll get some humanity there, then I can return to Anor Londo to co-op the boss.

#24 Posted by Karkarov (3187 posts) -

Protipage!!!!!

Smough is much less dangerous in form 2 but far easier to kill in form 1.

Orstein and Smough both are not so good with fire....

Lightning weapons suck for this fight, smough will not be an issue with them but Ornstein laughs at them

Ornstein in form two has a bad habit. He likes to throw lightning bolts at you if you get a certain distance from him. His lightning bolts don't pass through pillars though....

Your spells cast with a catalyst get cast from over top your head... you know high enough they shoot over broken pillars....

#25 Posted by anticucho (15 posts) -

You don't need to kill the guards you can just sprint past them and traverse the white light without taking any damage. As you start down the stairs the guard usually goes to the right of the pillar to come at you (bro) and you can just go left and sprint to the white light avoiding the arrows from the left. It took me like 10 tries to kill smough/ornstein so I became a pro at running past the guard/archer.

#26 Posted by Branwulf (411 posts) -

If you are still having trouble, getting a pyromancy flame upgraded to +10 or more and greater combustion/combustion will help a lot.

#27 Posted by TheWyotee93 (187 posts) -

I have tried this boss about 15 times solo and twice with two NPCs and have still not beaten them. For the solo encounters I'm pretty sure i'm just playing shitty and getting frustrated because i'm using a Titanite Catch Pole which hits smough for about 108 damage every hit and still only beat smough solo twice. Also, I have gotten really unlucky with my summons because we could kill smough no problem, then they would die from Ornstein's butt stomp which would annoy me to no end. I would like your guys' opinion on this. Should I keep summoning phantoms and hope for the best, (I still have about 14 Humanity) or should I keep going solo?

#28 Posted by McShank (1629 posts) -

@TheWyotee93 said:

I have tried this boss about 15 times solo and twice with two NPCs and have still not beaten them. For the solo encounters I'm pretty sure i'm just playing shitty and getting frustrated because i'm using a Titanite Catch Pole which hits smough for about 108 damage every hit and still only beat smough solo twice. Also, I have gotten really unlucky with my summons because we could kill smough no problem, then they would die from Ornstein's butt stomp which would annoy me to no end. I would like your guys' opinion on this. Should I keep summoning phantoms and hope for the best, (I still have about 14 Humanity) or should I keep going solo?

Keep summoning.. the people you are getting will either learn from their mistakes or you wont get those same ones again. Also, you weapon of choice is pretty slow which can be a determining factor until you get more stats for its damage to be relevant. If you have something smaller / faster or anything really that can be better then that weapon, id say to use it.. S&O are really easy bosses if you just take your time and kite them around while taking a swing or 2 when the times right. I soloed them in NG+ and NG++ and all that changed was how much damage i could take before i had to stop being stupid >.<

#29 Posted by Neferon (262 posts) -

I died a few times on this boss as well. I found that killing Ornstein first greatly reduced the difficulty of the second part of the fight. Smaugh's attack are much easier to anticipate and avoid.

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