Ornstein and Smough advice please?

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#51 Posted by crithon (3081 posts) -

@crithon said:

I felt I had more problems with the knights BEFORE them. The hype behind Ornstein and Smough was just so ridiculous I expected the worst.

You're absolutely right.

Anor Londo is a mess for first-timers. The archers, obviously, will punish you relentlessly until you either bulldoze your way through them or seek help to strategize from afar. Tough customers in their own right, the Silver Knights inside have backstab windows much narrower than most enemies, and who can punish the player even for non-mistakes (e.g. -- landing a clean hit from behind instead of successfully performing a backstab).

Ornstein and Smough try to overwhelm the player with shock and awe. They want you to panic, to feel dread and despair. The moment you're overcome by that is the moment you lose, but not a second before. Staying calm and keeping to a gameplan is key.

yes, or blight town, the whole not sure where I could walk while being shot at by a toxic dart I can't see. But that's me saying what was the worst, but also that's where I learned backstabbing technique through being scared out of my mind.

But yeah, by the time you reach Ornstein and Smough you learn "Never fight 2 enemies at once." So it's really a fight about common sense. Actually the whole section before there's quite a lot of Invasion even if I'm looking for someone to help me, I'm just bait for someone to wack me while I'm at the bonfire.

But yeah, Dark Souls, boy scout level of preparation matters.

#52 Edited by NathHaw (2760 posts) -

One of my favorite boss fights. Took me like a thousand tries not calling in any help, so I guess it was that much better when I finally defeated.

#53 Edited by bybeach (4730 posts) -

@crithon: I don't mean to wander from the OP's intent, but I gave what I considered good first hand advice a few posts back about the 2 bosses.

A few words about invasion. Watch out for a lot of 'Need Humanity' orange signs, especially around bonfires. dicks (invaders) may be fishing. But are they such dicks? I beat one, and they mostly seem to leave my souls for me! I fight them back for fair play, though I mostly lose. But so long as they leave my souls, it was really only once I was put off because the invading party would not let me kindle after consuming my second humanity. I preferenced died to NPC's because of that, instead of fighting him/her , and waited for the 'need humanity' signs to disappear around the bonfire...lol! Then it was all jake.

Edit-And congrats to the OP!

#54 Edited by crithon (3081 posts) -

@bybeach: hmmm it depends, had a friend of mine tell me he spotted a few cheaters with infinite health hacks. But yeah most players bow or make some kind of gesture before fighting and then leave your souls. Just had one by the bonfire just easily Bonk me on the head.

#55 Edited by Deathpooky (1380 posts) -

For anyone else looking for help on O&S - my strategy that got them down in a couple tries:

Used an upgraded Quelagg's Furysword for good, quick damage and Silver Knight Armor because of the lightning resists. Bring in Solaire and let him tank Smough if possible, Ornstein goes down quickly enough when fighting alone. Just shield and swipe when you get a chance, heal as needed.

When fighting Super Smough, I went two handed and relied on dodging. Get in some damage with Solaire distracting him, but likely Solaire will die quickly. After that, keep just in range of his hammer to bait out attacks and roll towards him when you see a side swipe or overhead slam coming. You'll end up right next to him but won't get hit by the hammer blow, letting you get in a few slashes, possibly even staggering him to let you get more. Usually then he'll jump away, if not I'll roll back and recover stamina. Keep an eye out for the super butt slam and roll away like crazy if you see it coming, and roll away from any charges or attacks you can't punish.

#56 Posted by KyleBsure (51 posts) -

I arrived at Anor Londo with 13 Humanity and 9 Twin Humanity.

I kneel here a broken man...

I have 3 Humanity and 6 Twin Humanity.

This game is killing me.

If you're an XBOX360 gamer with a copy of Dark Souls, please heed my summon sign and help me beat douchebag and fatty.

I'll be online after Unprofessional Fridays tonight as my girlfriend has left me for some french guy named Solaire.

Sincerely,

GristleThorn

a.k.a. the lightning bolt pin cushion

#57 Posted by Zevvion (1830 posts) -

Everything in Dark Souls is easy in hindsight. Just keep the fatty behind a pillar so he can't hit you, and either block the other's attacks if you can take the punishment from his lightning, or dodge entirely. Doesn't really matter.

They are not difficult at all if you fight them one at a time and trapping the fatty behind a pillar is extremely easy to do.

#58 Edited by Melvargh (489 posts) -

I solo'd O&S shieldless with a Zweihander yesterday.

#59 Posted by mike28212 (30 posts) -

I got extremely lucky taking on these two guys my first time this morning. I tried to summon some help but the first few failed. The guy I finally summoned successfully was awesome. He was doing mega magic damage and basically took them both down by himself. I got in a few hits but not many. I felt a little guilty but I'll take it.

#60 Posted by psylah (2162 posts) -

#61 Posted by VeggiesBro (117 posts) -

I beat them the other day in NG+ and I must say, it was a much different fight this last go around. But like others have said, separate! Then tackle Ornstein first, always blocking and managing your stamina all the while. When he goes down, it's a matter of picking away at Smough and being conservative while doing it.

For my NG++ I am going to try doing it the other way.

#62 Posted by TeamJersey (339 posts) -

@psylah: That gif is the greatest.

#63 Posted by xinek (4 posts) -

This fight was so nasty. I summoned two phantoms to help with it. After I beat the game, I went back to Anor Londo in NG+, staying at the same SL, and spent the next 20 hours or so of the game just sunbro-ing there.

#64 Posted by natetodamax (19177 posts) -

Yep, I had the most trouble with this boss fight. Tried multiple times to solo it (at first because I didn't know I could summon Solaire) and I just could not get them to separate well enough. Once I started summoning Solaire, I ran into another problem: he would instantly aggro on the Royal Sentinels and fight them. The reason why I hadn't killed them myself was because I would usually take a few hits from them during the engagement and I didn't want to start the boss fight with less Estus Flasks. So I would run through the fog door and 30 seconds later Solaire would finally show up with 25-50% of his health left and he would just get pummeled. Eventually I managed to kill them without taking too much damage and Solaire and I wrecked Smough and Ornstein when we both were able to walk through the fog door with full health.

#65 Edited by notlupus (44 posts) -

I've been slamming against them for the last two days, had Super O beat, literally one slash left, but my own bicardi sweat ( power within) killed me haha. Anyone that could give me a hand would be appreciated. GFWL - GinsuWallaby / Steam - notlupus27

#66 Posted by EdgeKasey (130 posts) -

What's your level?

#67 Posted by Belegorm (362 posts) -

My most exciting moment probably in Dark Souls was when I beat O + S solo in holo form, maybe a couple weeks after the game was released. Used my handy Ricard's Rapier that I had recently acquired to whittle down Ornstein, then kited Smough with a bow.

Then I got bored with the game after getting stuck on 4 Kings for a while, put the game down for a couple of years, came back and beat it. On my second playthrough I now know about AI phantom summons, so I beat O + S with Solaire on my second try this time ;)

#68 Edited by notlupus (44 posts) -

@edgekasey: lvl 70 lol...yeah I know I should walk all over them.

#69 Edited by EdgeKasey (130 posts) -

@notlupus:

I was just asking the level to see if I had any characters close to your level for an assist. It can be a pain. :)

#70 Posted by JackG100 (404 posts) -

Im level 8 and kinda stuck there, without humanity too. :D So if anyone wants low level summoning help lemme know and maybe we can help eachother like some douchebags cooperating and stuff!

#71 Posted by notlupus (44 posts) -

my hands were literally shaking when I realized I was going to win. 10+ zweihander on fire and 1+ Demon Spear = around 1/2 mill souls from scratch. My sun bro's help....priceless.....and yes this was playing in the background. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoJgkgRxUfc

#72 Edited by Zevvion (1830 posts) -

@notlupus said:

I've been slamming against them for the last two days, had Super O beat, literally one slash left, but my own bicardi sweat ( power within) killed me haha. Anyone that could give me a hand would be appreciated. GFWL - GinsuWallaby / Steam - notlupus27

Have you managed to defeat them yet? Curious.

#73 Posted by arab_prince (2053 posts) -

Hate this boss so much...very close to quitting. Level 60 ish if anyone wants to help a brotha out....

#74 Posted by Savage (318 posts) -

@arab_prince: What level are you and what platform are you playing the game on? I'd be happy to jump in and help if you're on PC.

#75 Edited by arab_prince (2053 posts) -

@savage: luckily my dear friend dudeglove saw this and came to my rescue. Was at level 59 on PC...may ask you for help in the future if you're willing :)

#76 Posted by Savage (318 posts) -
#77 Edited by dudeglove (7688 posts) -

@jackg100: You can get soft humanity from killing the painting guardians (white robed ninja dudes). The best I have is a level 13 GiantDad that could be of help.

#78 Edited by Tarsier (1057 posts) -

me ill show u

#79 Posted by JackG100 (404 posts) -

@dudeglove: Sweet, ill go farm those after Im done working then. Managed to kill Ornstein, but it was a hollow victory as I got oneshotted by the fatties flying arse... :D

#80 Posted by Zevvion (1830 posts) -

@bybeach said:

I know everyone has answered your questions by now. Hunt for humanity by farming rats in the sewers. Having the covetous serpent ring rocks, but you will get humanity that way regardless.

Now I just fought those 2 assholes two days ago. Sadly as a reflection on me, it took me three days of trying, yet it was so simple in the end.

My advice is simple. I leveled up, leveled up, leveled up stats pertinent to me(strength, endurance, vitality) and best weapon, silver knight armour(lighter weight than Havel's). I used the halberd(Raw-well long by this point) because it's normal attack is quick a bit like a spears, and powerful.

Then it went like this. I slowly developed the winning strategy of taking out the Dragon-slayer first quickly, and then I aggroed and faced the enhanced Executioner, staying a distance from ...Her(?), and rolling in for normal sticks past the hammer drop. I would not stay, lest that incur the lightning Plop of instant death (lol). And when I finally mentally understood and incorporated that strategy, it was almost easy!! I was a nearly beaten Lady Warrior from the far east, before.

Congratulations on beating them. They are the most difficult boss in the game by far. For next time, you really don't have to level up that much though. That fight seems tailor made for co-op. Dark Souls' combat system really isn't a good system for fighting multiple enemies, let alone bosses. Since you're outnumbered, the key is not getting hit and taking your time watching for an opportunity.

Rolling is key. You can level up like hell and try blocking but it just costs so much time, it's not worth it. You can use the pillars to try and trap one of them, especially Smough is susceptible to that, but otherwise just roll. Two hand your weapon.

I like taking Smough out first. Reason being he has less health and killing Ornstein last gives better rewards. That fight is never easy though. You can get fucked by having hyper aggressive Ornstein or the lock-on system flipping out. I think it's a shitty bossfight.

#81 Posted by dudeglove (7688 posts) -

@jackg100 said:

@dudeglove: Sweet, ill go farm those after Im done working then. Managed to kill Ornstein, but it was a hollow victory as I got oneshotted by the fatties flying arse... :D

The time I fought him it was also a 1HKO situation. The light crossbow is extremely useful because of its low stat requirements. Get it up to +15 and you can just cheese Smough from afar while he rubs up against pillars.

#82 Posted by JackG100 (404 posts) -

I dont find them all that hard usually, but as level eight the game is kinda different...

#83 Edited by Sinusoidal (1299 posts) -

I'm not bragging or anything, but I had almost no trouble with O&S at all. The first time I went in all cautious, had no idea what I was in for, they surrounded me in the corner and promptly slaughtered me. So, I took off some armour, went in dancing and swinging and took out Ornstein without a hitch. Then I simply cheesed Smough with arrows from behind a pillar for the second half of the fight. He didn't get in a hit!

In fact - while I didn't do the DLC - it seems like most of the bosses in this game can be cheesed even without a guide. The hardest part for me were the two archers firing the huge knock-you-over arrows on the narrow walkways on the way to O&S. Also, fuck that autodeath the first time you face the crystal dragon thingy boss. I lost 50'000+ souls to that shit (well, lost them when I died the second time to an invader...) That's the one time I felt the game was being unfair.

#84 Edited by JackG100 (404 posts) -

Ran off and farmed some humanity from rats in the depths, then ran back and summoned sun-bro and on the first attempt I killed them both. They didnt even touch me once...

Instead i am now stuck on 4kings, think im gonna go kill the butterfly so I can summon Beatrix. She tends to blast those kings pretty hard.

#85 Posted by jaycrockett (433 posts) -

I suck at bosses in the is game so was prepared to take a victory any way I could.

Attempt 1: Solo, totally crushed, no chance.

Attempt 2: With Solaire, killed O, crushed by Super S.

Attempt 3: With Solaire, co-op buddy, got invaded and killed outside boss room!

Attempt 4: With Solaire + buddy, killed O, crushed by Super S.

Attempt 5: With Solaire + buddy, killed S, killed super O. Really good co-op guy. I'll take it!

#86 Posted by freakin9 (1102 posts) -

This boss is a real pain, unless you are a sorcerer, then it's easy like every other boss in the game. I try to spend time outside this boss occasionally trying to help people kill them. Whether they want to kill Smough or Ornstein first, I can do it for them easily with crystal soul spear and crystal homing mass. Trying to save people from some potential long term frustration, been there.

#87 Edited by thefozz26 (30 posts) -

This was the hardest challenge iv faced in a game, 10 hours of grinding followed by what was probably 60 attempts over the course of 2 weeks, it became an obsession beating those guys, i was determined to work out there patterns slowly. I found it much easier to finish off Smough (fatty) first then i spent ages dying against giant ornstien. But eventually i realized that instead of hiding behind the pillars and waiting for giant ornstien to attack, i took a much more aggressive approach and found getting up close and personal and around / under his legs was much easier because you were inside his spear range more often, just that jumping lighting attack to watch out for then. i was ecstatic when i beat them. I literally ran around my house screaming! Didnt use the NPC for help either, surely that cheating in Dark Souls right?? Iv not looked back since, as i speak only for 3 bosses left to go, Nito i killed first time which i was suprised about after seeing Vinnie struggle on his show..

#88 Posted by Savage (318 posts) -

@thefozz26: That's awesome. Congratulations! It's experiences like that that remind me why I love games so much.

#89 Edited by dudeglove (7688 posts) -
16-bit O&S?

#90 Posted by natetodamax (19177 posts) -

@thefozz26: Nice! I think Nito is one of the easiest bosses in the game because of the thing he does that opens him up for attack and instantly kills every skeleton in the area. I kept waiting for Vinny to realize that's what was happening, heh.

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