The Men Who Made Dark Souls Whole

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#51 Posted by noby_guy (91 posts) -

Can they do the same for consoles? ;_;

@Astromarine said:

PLAY THIS GAME PATRICK

Also, THIS!

#52 Posted by Drace (164 posts) -

@CptBedlam said:

A Dark Souls article on GB? What is this craziness?

I'd be interesting to know what the guys at Namco/From think about all this and whether they plan to release their own patch some day.

Agreed. I would love to hear what the devs think about all this.

#53 Posted by OllyOxenFree (4970 posts) -
@jamesisaacs said:

This article needs removing as it is totally BS.

Your face is totally BS.
#54 Posted by Greebman (115 posts) -

An interview with From Soft would be the best.

#55 Posted by McGhee (6094 posts) -

@addc182 said:

I think this article is a bit insulting to FromSoftware, as although they are new to PC games, it is Namco Bandai pushing them hard with a tight deadline so they could release before the console DLC was put out, which led them to take shortcuts they would not have made if they had a reasonable amount of time to develop the game (e.g graphics options and GFWL (from the XBL code)). Especially considering they were never originally planning on doing a PC version, as their code base would be completely different from the design to accomodate for this. Not to mention the DLC/expansion they have been working on at the same time which adds a good 10 hours at least to the game.

You also neglect to mention the actual problems which have been occuring with the updates patch which at a couple of points in its update cycle has had glitches in the fix which break the health system so you turn invincible in online play ruining everyones experience of the game.

He also had an early version of the code for 2 weeks which he had been studying and fiddling with before he began his "30 minute fix".

The idea was Dark Souls may have been designed like a fighting game, where the game logic and frame rendering are completely interwoven, and modifying the frame rate would be disastrous. As it turns out, that doesn't appear to be true.

Apart from this was true and is why it can only be doubled and locked to 60fps with proportional changes to the game code as opposed to having a freely changing FPS as seen in most modern 3D games.

It seems a bit like you're shitting on the devs without knowing the full story Patrick, thats unnecessary, even if you didn't like the game

How anyone could read this article and look at it as "shitting on the devs" is beyond me.

#56 Edited by Gunharp (337 posts) -

@KaneRobot said:

@CptBedlam said:

A Dark Souls article on GB? What is this crazyness?

...you know Dark & Demon Souls were a frequent topic on the podcast, right?

I guess not, or you wouldn't be asking.

http://www.giantbomb.com/news/lifes-a-bitch-and-then-you-die-45-hours-with-dark-souls/3722/?page=2&sort=first

I miss Rorie.

@addc182:

You're on point but P.Scoops is not purposely shitting on the developers. Yes the title of this piece comes off as lame in my opinion and you've clarified what else was going on. So instead of attacking him, just pile on the knowledge.

Also I don't think this port would have happened without Namco Bandai Games. They published it, did the marketing and have a community team. I am pretty sure they were the ones paying attention to the petition. Who knows what happened to get this ship on PC, or how much FromSoftware was paid and supported for the PC Port.

Lastly the engine they are using I don't know a ton about. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PhyreEngine, wonder what kind of hurdles it already had in place. Having worked on PS3, its not like there is an abundant amount of Tools from SCE for even test.

#57 Edited by peritus (993 posts) -

@noby_guy said:

Can they do the same for consoles? ;_;

@Astromarine said:

PLAY THIS GAME PATRICK

Also, THIS!

Seconded! ( and film it for our amusement please! )

Oh, and nice article :)

#58 Posted by walterbennet (154 posts) -

Is the top image from Dark Souls or Demon's Souls?

#59 Posted by MindChamber (345 posts) -

"

Where FromSoftware didn't dare tread, fans stepped up and made Dark Souls for PC the mythical port it should have been"

did someone used to work at the Enquirer?

#60 Posted by Lurkero (395 posts) -

It's sad when the community does things that the developer should or could have easily done itself.

@jamesisaacs said:

This article needs removing as it is totally BS.

Thank you for explaining

#61 Posted by hakunin (388 posts) -
The Xbox 360 and PlayStation 3 versions have infamous frame rate issues, but those were not addressed in the PC version, seemingly out of a fear of possibly breaking it.

Yeah, this is just not true. If you have the hardware those infamous areas (Blighttown, urhg) that suffered from frame rate issues on the console will run smoothly.

#62 Posted by Akeldama (4244 posts) -

@patrickklepek: I don't mean any disrespect, but what is the point of this article? It really doesn't offer any new insight or information about Dark Souls and the PC mod scene that one could glean from a cursory Google search. I am stoked to see Dark Souls on the front page again, but is this just for the uninitiated? Also, well written as usual, Scoops McTrick!

#63 Posted by CptBedlam (4449 posts) -

@walterbennet: It's Dark Souls, one of the new levels.

#64 Posted by Karkarov (3079 posts) -

Yeah the title of this thread and the subtitle for it are a bit crude, insulting to the REAL people who made Dark Souls, and a gross oversimplification. Heck I have even played with the 60 fps trick, it adds nothing to the game, the "visual" difference is minor at best. I found it actually played smoother if I capped it at 30 because the frame rate never suddenly went down or up, it was a stable 30 at all times.

These modifications are cool, but these guys are hardly "hero's" and it is still a great game with or without them.

#65 Posted by bd_monkey (16 posts) -

It's true about the bugs. I've put just over one hundred hours into the pc version with out any mods, and have only had on bug where I fell through the world. I'm glad they where able to bring us this port and can't wait for what ever comes next. Hopefully with better grafix options.

#66 Posted by mcwizardry (11 posts) -

Durante doesn't have access to the Dark Souls code, all he has to work with is a log of calls to the Direct3D API.

#67 Posted by jackopm (20 posts) -

I don't get why people are so knee-jerk defensive of From. I think it's perfectly reasonable to say they made a sub-expectations PC port, and just because they're scrappy underdogs that everyone's rooting for doesn't mean you can't give them flack for it. Oh, you say that that we should cut them slack because it's their first PC port? Why? They're still asking for you to pay a significant sum for it.

I played a decent amount of DS on PS3 (>12 hours), and I enjoyed it for what it was; same with Demons' Souls. I think From is doing important work and should be lauded for their achievements. I also think it's pretty wack that they released what looks, from the outside, like a slapdash PC port that was substantially improved immediately after release and claimed they just "weren't experienced enough" for it. Some of the imagery in the article may be a little sensationalist, but I think most of the sentiments seem valid. People immediately crying foul over From Software's feelings should maybe consider being less emotionally invested in a company, especially when they make a misstep.

#68 Posted by NorseDudeTR (423 posts) -

Man, I cannot wait, CANNOT WAIT for the dlc. Well, I guess I can, because I´ll have to, but still, it´s going to be great. And it´ll probably kick my ass.

#69 Posted by Milkman (16677 posts) -

This article has been given the Peter Serafinowicz stamp of approval.

#70 Posted by JackOhara (227 posts) -

@Deusx said:

This is incredibly old, but hey, it's about Dark Souls. That said, I do not want more coverage of the game here, GB wouldn't be able to make that game justice because they don't understand it. Vinny was the closest one to actually play it and he didn't even finish the damn game. He wasn't into the lore or why he was doing things in the first place. He was just focused on "waa this game is so haaard" when in reality it isn't. The only one who really understood why the Souls series was so amazing was Rorie.

People exaggerate the difficulty of the Souls games WAY too much. I think it's funny that most of the older vid games journalism crowd seems to be to most vocal regarding its supposed 'difficulty', did they ever play Megaman or Metroid?

#71 Posted by ExZippo (31 posts) -

@jackopm: Except they charged $40 instead of $50 (or $60) and packaged $15 worth of DLC content in it. So they didn't charge "quite a sum" for it.

Also the port does work perfectly, it's an exact port of the 360 version, except the framerate is stable. Just because it doesn't add a ton of other stuff doesn't make it a bad port. It doesn't make it a great port either. The port of Darksiders II was far worse, with cut content between platforms and game breaking bugs.

#72 Posted by bd_monkey (16 posts) -

@ExZippo said:

@jackopm: Except they charged $40 instead of $50 (or $60) and packaged $15 worth of DLC content in it. So they didn't charge "quite a sum" for it.

Also the port does work perfectly, it's an exact port of the 360 version, except the framerate is stable. Just because it doesn't add a ton of other stuff doesn't make it a bad port. It doesn't make it a great port either. The port of Darksiders II was far worse, with cut content between platforms and game breaking bugs.

When I look at how much I pay for breakfast every week forty dollars is almost negligible. It's unfortunate that so many of us have become so spoiled that we wont give any thing a chance until its in the bargain bin. This is still a great game even with out the "fixes". If we want to continue seeing games that we like, and in fact any media, we have to vote with our dollars so that developers see that the market is here. To bad people think that hours and hours of skilled work is not worth more the five dollars.

#73 Edited by SpartanHoplite (384 posts) -

@Smithers said:

Its a shame the netcode of this game isn't up to scratch. Being able to summon people and be summoned reliably and quickly would make this an amazing port. Still, this is probably my Best 2011 Game Of 2012.

Yeah, the netcode sux no matter the platform, shame. Hopefully they'll do better for the next Souls game.

#74 Posted by Tesla (1919 posts) -

Dark Souls is the best videogame.

#75 Posted by falling_fast (2210 posts) -

hmm, I kind of assumed with an article title like that that the fixes/problems would have been more important.

#76 Posted by ExZippo (31 posts) -

@bd_monkey: Even worse is the fact this game will last you around 60+ hours of just one playthrough (no one ever does one playthrough).

I'm at 210 hours in the PC version, and about 200 in the PS3 version. But hey I guess $40 is "too much" for 410 hours of fun!

#77 Edited by evanbower (1211 posts) -

@KaneRobot said:

@CptBedlam said:

A Dark Souls article on GB? What is this crazyness?

...you know Dark & Demon Souls were a frequent topic on the podcast, right?

I guess not, or you wouldn't be asking.

Also Quick Looks, and video features dedicating to trying to teach Ryan to play the game.

Edit: Also, the Quick Look was an hour and a half. So, over 3 hours of video content dedicated to the game.

Online
#78 Posted by Drekly (159 posts) -

@Milkman: Love that guy.

#79 Posted by ripelivejam (3816 posts) -

Well written scoops if a bit superfluous So much about this sounds amazing but I'm still having a rough time sticking to it. I love the world and aesthetic, and how the world is so seamless, but it can be so downright frustrating, especially having to power through the same exact groups of enemies over and over. Last I played I did get past the Capra demon, which seems to be a sore point for some, but it appears that that's not very far in the game at all. I also had to do some grinding, which supposedly for this is a big no-no. Is it necessary to summon players to succeed?

#80 Posted by shodan2020 (664 posts) -

@ripelivejam: I summoned people when I needed help on some of the bosses. There's no shame in that. I love Dark Souls for the aesthetic and the grand views and really unique and detailed looking creatures and people that inhabit that world. Syn's Fortress and the Smough and Ornstein boss fight will really test your Dark Souls mettle. Prepare, and enjoy! :)

#81 Posted by PoisonJam7 (350 posts) -

You failed to mention that the guy who did this rez fix also pirated the game.

#82 Posted by Mentaur (11 posts) -

The best PC feature for me - 3D Vision support (made even better by another modder, HeliX - http://helixmod.blogspot.co.uk/)

Along with the resolution and fps fix you can play this game in glorious 3D at 1080p 60fps and it looks and feels incredible. As you can imagine the atmosphere and immersion are addictive, and it really shows off the quality of the artwork. The game is also a bit easier to play as you can judge distances more easily - very useful in combat, and it makes the swinging blades in Sen's Fortress more terrifying and yet simpler to avoid. Once you've turned the 3D on and spent 5minutes admiring your avatar in all the different bits of armour it is impossible to go back to 2D.

If you love Dark Souls you have to check it out this way. You can use nVidia 3D play to run HDMI into a compatible 3D TV. This is capped at 720p60 (or 1080p24) but should still look good.

#83 Posted by Laiv162560asse (487 posts) -

Specious arguments: deployed!

Journalistic integrity: undermined!

Incompetent port: legitimised!

Dark Souls Defence Force - returning to base.

#84 Posted by believer258 (11808 posts) -

@PoisonJam7 said:

You failed to mention that the guy who did this rez fix also pirated the game.

How do you know? Before you say "because 30 minutes after release", read this:

It’s not a hack he came up with 30 minutes after downloading it, though, an important detail lost in the celebratory cheers. He had been working on it for days. Thoman assumed the port would use Direct X 9, and created an “interceptor.” This would forcibly change the resolution of the game, even if the game didn't have an option for it

I'm not saying you're wrong, but I've seen that claim made and refuted before - he only needed DirectX 9, not the game. Do you have a source?

#85 Posted by EverydayOdyssey (171 posts) -

As a gamer who has put over 100 hours into Dark Souls I really liked the article (not much of a surprise). Glad that I keep on seeing interesting and original content on Giant Bomb.

#86 Posted by ShadowSkill11 (1783 posts) -

Durante and the DSFix made the game a joy to play on PC. Those first few hours on launch day playing the game were a tremendous disappointment. Then I saw DSfix 0.1 right after I logged off and all was well in the world. The 60 fps patch thrown into DSFix 1.7 is just extra frosting on the cake for people like me with powerful computers.

#87 Posted by Eurobum (244 posts) -

The From apologists where do they come from, why do they form resistance?

They uniformly morph the truth, although the game doesn't perform.

A gracious mention even gets them peeved

When will their dark souls be retrieved?

#88 Posted by Mesadoram (5 posts) -

I love Dark Souls. Any attempt to improve the game or give it some spotlight is a big plus in my book.

#89 Posted by thebigJ_A (1000 posts) -

@mak_wikus said:

The last screenshot is from Borderlands 2. Is that a mistake?

....

Read the caption, duder.....

#90 Edited by bd_monkey (16 posts) -

@ripelivejam: It's not bad to level up unless your walking around in not hollow form. The PvP is based on level so you'll get invaded by players plus or minus 10 levels of your current level. So if you are level 20 you can get invaded by anyone between level 10 to 30. (it may actually be plus or minus 5) But it can be avoided if you are hollow. You also need to consider upgrading your weapons and armor. It will make a difference.

After leveling up to about 30, all those sections will become cake walks. Just hang in there, all you need to do is get comfortable with the controls and the game will become fairly easy.

If you want a good beginners guide I recommend EpicNameBro's chanal on You Tube

http://www.youtube.com/user/EpicNameBro

He is currently doing a play-through where he explains everything for a novice player

If you want to see some insane high level play check out Vageta311's chanel.

http://www.youtube.com/user/vageta311

He also get into explaining stuff like parrying

#91 Posted by Carlos1408 (1500 posts) -

I bum Dark Souls and loved Demon's Souls. I'm very much looking forward to playing the DLC on Xbox! :D

#92 Posted by envane (1162 posts) -

@Carlos1408: you bum ? what

#93 Posted by toots (457 posts) -

this is a good article, on a topic that didn't get much coverage beyond the blanket statements, nice one Pat.

#94 Posted by daltonrowe (19 posts) -

Great article. I'm glad to see that modders were very fair and understanding.

#95 Posted by cyraxible (687 posts) -

I'm really happy that you delved into the effort from both parties on this port. Saying that Durante fixed the resolution problem in 23 minutes makes for eye catching headlines but is grossly wrong.

I really want GB to do a video feature with Dark Souls. Breaking Brad or whatever, I just want to see you guys get destroyed by my favorite game.

#96 Edited by Kosayn (452 posts) -

It's good that the fans helped fix resolution for the PC, because ports should fit their system. But I feel that From Software operates from some sort of alternate dimension where it is still 1989, and to be honest, I hope that never changes.

All fans of Dark Souls - a great game - should find themselves a cheap PS3 and play Demon's Souls, which has the same great challenge and exploration elements, but also a more gamelike, more dystopian world design. And better working non-Namco multiplayer.

It's the only truly necessary game of this console generation. It's nothing but a giant middle finger in disc form to all its contemporaries; their tutorials, and their checkpoints, and their quicktime button prompts, and their mocap facial animations, and their DLC, and their unpredictable AI, and their cinematics.

It behaves like a real video game - for the most part, we've forgotten what that is for the last 7 years.

#97 Edited by jasondesante (603 posts) -

I really hope they open Dark Souls up to the Steam Workshop. It might be too difficult to do that because of all the online awesomeness, so maybe From Software should throw these guys a couple bucks and make this part of the actual version so everyone can enjoy the benefits of a better Dark Souls. In a few years From Software will be no doubt saying that the Steam version of Dark Souls far outsold any other version of Dark or Demons Souls, so why not make the best version even better by providing that better experience to everyone from the second they buy the game. Do it up From Software!

#98 Posted by xbob42 (497 posts) -

@EvilKatarn said:

even more that we're talking about small graphics fixes here, not massive overhauls.

Um. Yes, these are fucking massive overhauls. Basically making it from a shitty, horribly blurry low resolution to proper high resolution visuals. The fidelity difference is fucking incredible. And from 30 to 60 frames is just as good. These are NOT fucking minor things.

#99 Posted by Durante (2 posts) -

@addc182 said:

You also neglect to mention the actual problems which have been occuring with the updates patch which at a couple of points in its update cycle has had glitches in the fix which break the health system so you turn invincible in online play ruining everyones experience of the game.

I'd like to clarify that this never actually happened. There were some issues during the development of DSfix (and some small ones still remain), but they were always purely graphical in nature and never affected gameplay.

For those curious about the impact of the fix, you can check my Dark Souls gallery at abload.

The game features a surprising amount of detail, much of which is sadly lost at default settings.

#100 Posted by Korolev (1704 posts) -

That was actually interesting to read. I have the console versions of Demon's Souls and Dark Souls, so I'll stick with them, but once again, it demonstrates the power of PC modding.

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