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    Deus Ex: Human Revolution

    Game » consists of 17 releases. Released Aug 23, 2011

    Human Revolution is the third game in the Deus Ex series, a prequel where players take control of augmented security officer Adam Jensen, and investigate attacks against Sarif Industries, a leader in augmentation technology.

    This Game Says More About the Players Than the Game

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    Undeadpool

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    #1  Edited By Undeadpool

    I've played this game a few times and talked to my friends/roommates a number of times about it, and while we all love it to varying degrees something hilarious has stood out to me: that is that people who have a problem with the format are, in fact, the problem themselves. Now I get it, this is the Internet and people whine about things they shouldn't, but one of the most popular, and seemingly substantiated, quotes I hear about this game is that the bosses basically require you to have combat spec'ed characters in order to beat them, but this underlies a hilarious problem that most of these people seem to have: they decided that the game wanted them to shoot first and ask questions later. They never actually explored the space, which can be tough to be fair, and just declared "This is a boss character and thus I must shoot them!...which sucks! I hate this game!" even though most of the bosses present alternate avenues of beating them. I won't say what they are for the sake of people who ACTUALLY play this game as intended, but seriously: if you thought the bosses required an endless stream of bullets/grenades, then YOU fucked up, not the devs.

    What do you say? Am I right or am I just blowing smoke? Did you figure out how to beat the bosses without firing a shot or did you decide that since this game is "modern" that the solution must be more bullets? And what does your answer say about you as a game player?

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    salad10203

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    #2  Edited By salad10203

    I played the game as a hacker build and beat the game on hard, but the bosses were definitely combat-heavy. So you are blowing smoke. But my real complaint with the game was the weak story. I loved everything else.

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    SomeDeliCook

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    #3  Edited By SomeDeliCook

    If there is a huge amount of players backlashing against it, then no, its not every single of the player's faults, its the developer's for not clearly giving them hints that theres other ways to deal with the boss

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    HadesTimes

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    #4  Edited By HadesTimes

    When a game has been telling you to go hacker/stealth for a few hours. And then you get capped because you haven't added any points into armor. Its just no fun. Perhaps with determination and effort any boss can be overcome with ANY build; but most people play games to have fun, not JUST a challenge. And the fact that they farmed out the bosses to another company doesn't help the case for the game either.

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    Undeadpool

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    #5  Edited By Undeadpool

    @salad10203: @SomeDeliCook: But these are the same players who were worried that the game wouldn't be like the first one. So any "hints" would've been met with spite. I honestly figured both the first and second boss out after commiserating with others, but it IS possible to beat either or both of them without ever firing your gun, so it seems like the game is runaway success that people aren't giving enough credit to.

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    Akyho

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    #6  Edited By Akyho

    I was hacker/stealth build the first time i played. I ran i hid. i threw grenades I jumped rolled and fired my revolver into his face DEAD.

    Third try.

    Second boss I still was in no way combat speced.

    First few seconds i thaught "EMP! will disrupt her stealth!" so i combined my mine templates with EMP and placed them.....i screwed my self up the first two goes cos of my mine placement. Once that was set i was able to fight her. Then out of luck i had her blow up one of the generators at the side eletrocuted herself and i unleashed with my revolver. DEAD.

    Third one I made the right choice earlier. All i had to do was run away from the first shot. And when he cloaked I switched on my See through walls vision. i ran I hid and shot him with my revolver. DEAD Took me three trys.

    Last boss took two and that was just cos i was trying to figure out what i was supposed to do.

    The boss battles arnt that bad. Yes jarring when your stealth but doable.

    Playing through on hardest and I made the first battle EASIER! I have my boss killing rocket launcher with me now. 6 shots to the first boss dead. No problems.

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    McHampton

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    #7  Edited By McHampton

    @Undeadpool: You can avoid shooting the third boss if you just punch him while he's in his wall-vaulting animation, but I'm sure that's just an amusing oversight on part of the guys who built it.

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    Undeadpool

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    #8  Edited By Undeadpool

    @Akyho: 1st Boss: You can run around and he won't see you til you attack. Use this to, as Dash O' Pepper would say, "THROW A BARREL AT 'IM!"

    2nd Boss: Have her hit the generators with her electrical attack. Three ought to do it (if you have EMP shielding, this is easier)

    3rd Boss: You already got that one

    4th Boss: If you persuaded Hugh Darrow into giving up his code, you can easily hack your way past the final boss.

    And this proves my point: too many people went in guns blazing and then complained that the bosses all required their guns to be blazing...

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    Enigma777

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    #9  Edited By Enigma777

    I loved every aspect of the game, especially the bosses. Not sure what people are complaining about tbh. 

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    alistercat

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    #10  Edited By alistercat

    The idea of a 'combat focused' character in this game is kind of a myth though, as there are no stats and very few combat abilities. I put everything in to hacking and for the bosses all I did was keep one fully upgraded combat rifle and all the EMP grenades I could find since the bosses are augmented. Throw grenade, shoot. Almost nothing about how you 'spec' your character will prevent you from doing this.

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    InitialP

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    #11  Edited By InitialP

    There seems to be soooo much exp floating around in this game when playing non-lethal stealth. I was able to get my hacking and camoflauge maxed out pretty early on and still had points to put into some combat stuff by the second boss. I defeated every boss except the first (since I hadn't unlocked typhoon yet) by stunning them with the stun gun or a grenade then a couple of hits with a powered up Typhoon shot. This is all on the "Give Me a Challenge" mind you, so this brute force option may not work on "Give me Deus Ex."

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    valrog

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    #12  Edited By valrog

    Yes, you can defeat some bosses without firing a shot for instance, but the whole event makes it seem they were meant to be shot down and that's about it. It's a lot harder without the "right" Augmentations, but definitely doable. It's not much about the encounter as it is about setting. Locked in a room with a boss? Really? They could get more creative, that's all.

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    deactivated-61665c8292280

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    @valrog said:

    Yes, you can defeat some bosses without firing a shot for instance, but the whole event makes it seem they were meant to be shot down and that's about it. It's a lot harder without the "right" Augmentations, but definitely doable. It's not much about the encounter as it is about setting. Locked in a room with a boss? Really? They could get more creative, that's all.

    I would say this is close-ish to my answer as well. 
     
    It's sort of undeniable that the bosses are distinctly one-dimensional in the way the other ninety percent of the game isn't. This is a game predicated on the idea that the player can inhabit the environment  and determine solutions to the game's varied puzzle-like structure as they see fit, given the context of their respective mission or the layout of the present landscape. Once you hit the boss fights, that thesis changes dramatically, immediately, and without warning. Suddenly, the player is funneled into a situation where they haven't the control or knowledge of the environment. Suddenly, that situation is asking the player to adhere to a substantially narrower field of freedoms in order to continue. And this is mostly made frustrating by the already suspect combat system, which isn't forgiving enough to allow new or unskilled players the time necessary to outwit the immediate threat, much less to explore the area for clues or assistance.  
     
    Sure, the boss battles can be won, but mostly, they can be cheesed. It comes down to a process of manipulating the AI beyond a certain point of immersion. Catching them in animations. Waiting until they clip into an invisible wall from which they cannot escape. Gaming the system. 
     
    You're right in that it says more about the players than about the game itself, but you're wrong about what is actually being said about the players. Our present video game audiences have standards that differ somewhat significantly from the standards of audiences of the past. Look at Demon's Souls as another example. We've been conditioned collectively to champion immersion over challenge. And when the challenge of a task in a video game pulls us from within that sphere of immersion--especially when we didn't anticipate the challenge or choose in premeditation a high difficulty from the start--that's when the audience repulses the things the video game offers to us as stimulus. 
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    Mnemoidian

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    #14  Edited By Mnemoidian
    @Undeadpool I took down the first 2 bosses with an abundance of tazer rounds to the face, second or third attempt.

    Namir was simple once I found the laser rifle in the room with the boss. :)
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    JudgeDread

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    #15  Edited By JudgeDread

    bosses are shit,

    why would my stealth character jump out into the open and reveal himself? (an action I have no control over whatsoever)

    Then wait until the generic boss opens fire?

    This section of the game will be used in game design curriculum as an example of poor planning and poor game design.

    Whoever are responsible for this should be ashamed of themselves.

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    TaliciaDragonsong

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    Seems like the players want the game to be something that its not.
    What if Sam Fisher gets caught in the open by an enemy? Will he just surrender or let himself be shot?
    You could be James fricking Bond but once you're spotted or you are in a stand off (you can't stealth your way through a story, unlike your basement real life) then you are seen and you will have to fight.
    Look at the surroundings, get some of the free weapons supplied or just come prepared.
    If you're a augmented awesome ass kicking Jensen, but you somehow thought not bringing a gun was a good thing to do while infiltrating a base filled with dudes hellbent on shooting you then you, sir, are not worthy of the augments. 
     
    Seriously, deal with it.

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    napalm

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    #17  Edited By napalm

    The problem I had with the boss fights is there is no AI. It is literally a single target charging you, shooting an endless stream of bullets. If they had the boss battles take place in a relatively open area, and there was a bit more tactility to them, then I would agree with you. But, it's not, so I don't. The fact that there are boss battles in this game at all is a bit of a shame.

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    FritzDude

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    #18  Edited By FritzDude

    I'm playing a heavily focused stealth character and I could totally sneak around with my cloak augmentation in the first boss battle. It was quite easy because he damaged himself with his own grenades and walked on my mines.

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    JudgeDread

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    #19  Edited By JudgeDread

    @TaliciaDragonsong said:

    Seems like the players want the game to be something that its not.
    What if Sam Fisher gets caught in the open by an enemy? Will he just surrender or let himself be shot?
    You could be James fricking Bond but once you're spotted or you are in a stand off (you can't stealth your way through a story, unlike your basement real life) then you are seen and you will have to fight.
    Look at the surroundings, get some of the free weapons supplied or just come prepared.
    If you're a augmented awesome ass kicking Jensen, but you somehow thought not bringing a gun was a good thing to do while infiltrating a base filled with dudes hellbent on shooting you then you, sir, are not worthy of the augments.

    Seriously, deal with it.
    No Caption Provided

    thing is that decision, to be seen, was forced on the gamer from the developer. Gamers with stealth/hack focus would have chosen a different way if they would have been allowed to. Just as you can in Mass Effect 1 when you could talk yourself out of a bossfight.

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    TaliciaDragonsong

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    @JudgeDread: Yeah, but how many boss fights?
    I still had to blast my way through the entire of Virmire as an Adept.
    Point here is that the confrontations offer other ways to beat it, perhaps not while stealthing a guy to death or avoiding the boss at all, but that's the path the dev's choose.
    As you said, if they would have been allowed to.
     
    Also the news that some other company handled the boss fights might be to blame for this but I cannot understand people tripping about it so dire.
    I played pretty stealthy but if an big augmented tank dude is right in front of you its kinda silly you expect to suddenly go stealth and do what? Stun him? Take him down silently?
    He already saw you, he already punched you in the face, its go time baby, even a stealther gets into a direct confrontation at times.
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    Akyho

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    #21  Edited By Akyho

    I think TaliciaDragonsong just hut on why I was perfectly at home with the boss battles. Mass effect 2 I was the sniper that would cloak. I wasnt a character for fighting 1 on 1 and if my team were down I would have to jump dive and hide. I completed Mass effected 2 on the hardest difficulty that alot of people had problems with. While i used cloak and tactics to win.

    So when it comes to these fights its not all that diffrent.

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    Addfwyn

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    #22  Edited By Addfwyn

    I think part of the problem was the way the game was advertised was that you could play it however you wanted to progress through the game, and there are often multiple paths. Then you reach points in the game where your choices are suddenly cut off. Yes, you have a few different ways you can use to kill a boss. Heavy explosives, barrels, grenades, straight up shoot outs, that's all fine. However, until you reach those points you have no idea that this would ever be expected of you. Prior to that you can do everything stealth and non-lethally, and then suddenly you are thrust into a situation where you are locked in a room with a guy you have to kill with no real warning about it. Combine that with the game's atrocious AI, and it can be frustrating. If you have been reading about the game in advance, it's no problem cause you are prepared for that situation. However those of us who wanted to avoid spoilers and took the 'progress how you like' advice to heart were somewhat punished for it.

    The first time I reached the first boss, my load out was entirely non-lethal and stealth oriented. All my weapons were tranquilizers, stun guns, etc. I even tried tranquing him to 'death' (Metal Gear Solid 4 style) before I realized that wasn't go to work, no matter how many drugs I loaded into him. So my options were pretty limited, and I had to end up backtracking to an earlier save (only a few hours thankfully) in order to have the right kinda load out to kill him. Since the combat is, for me, THE least appealing thing in the game, it was a pretty big annoyance. I was really hoping that you could talk your way around the fight, avoid it (with whatever consequences have you), or at the very least tranq the boss to death ala MGS4. The bosses seem to be out of a totally different game and are handled in a way that is contrary to absolutely everything else in the game.

    That said, I haven't even finished the game yet or fought all of the bosses, so I can't speak for all of them. The game is fun in short spurts, but it really really struggles to hold my attention, so my progress has been pretty slow. I just don't see why the game even NEEDS bosses. I don't think the experience would have been lessened for not having them.

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    Rolyatkcinmai

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    #23  Edited By Rolyatkcinmai

    The problem with them for me is when the cut scenes that bring you into the boss fight go against everything your character has been doing.

    My super intelligent hacker intellectual guy would not have fallen for the locked room with AI Eliza Cassan. It completely breaks immersion and was out of character.

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    DizzyMedal

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    #24  Edited By DizzyMedal

    On Give Me Deus Ex, it takes about 42 shots to the back with the stun gun for the last boss (I may have lost count) and 9 times out of ten he only stops twitching just as your auto reload finishes. I spent the entire game pretty much only using non-lethal takedowns (occasional dart gun sometimes if I didn't feel like stealthing over four rooms just for one guy) so I usually had plenty of stun gun ammo. Those fights with the twitching and the hollering were hilarious and I would never play that game any other way. Besides if you hack absolutely everything and only spend money on viruses and stealth weapon ammo, do every single side mission and get the stealth and non-lethal bonus for each mission, by the last two or three bosses you pretty much leveled up all your stealth slots and have started throwing random points into the armor anyway.

    ETA: Whoops, not the last boss (I completely forgot about that bitch, that one did kind of suck, but I just hotbared my energy snack bars and it wasn't too awful)

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    Ravenlight

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    #25  Edited By Ravenlight

    Taser + EMP or gas grenades. For. Every. Boss. (The last "boss" doesn't count). No damage taken.

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    ryanwho

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    #26  Edited By ryanwho

    Its an interesting approach to blame a player for a poorly balanced game that does little to let you know what may lie ahead and what you should prepare for. Interesting and stupid. You don't sell your game as "play it how you want" then bottleneck everyone through a boss that requires you to run around and hide, throwing canisters and shit. "Play the game correctly" is never applicable. If most people are playing the game "incorrectly" and making it halfway through then hitting a brick wall, the game did a poor job explaining the basics of what it thought you needed to know. The problem isn't people running and gunning. The problem is running and gunning works 9 times out of 10. So its silly to suddenly pretend "no that's not how you play". Well it gets you through most of the game just fine. So the problem was on the developer end.

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    ArbitraryWater

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    #27  Edited By ArbitraryWater

    No, the boss battles are stupid because they funnel the player down a single avenue of play. However, the developers were at least kind enough to make the upgraded Typhoon overpowered enough to kill all of them in two or so shots.

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    Undeadpool

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    #28  Edited By Undeadpool

    @JudgeDread: In Deus Ex: HR you can hack your way out of a boss fight and most of the other bosses can be taken out without you drawing a weapon. The fact that you saw a boss and immediately assumed you had to shoot your way out isn't the dev's fault, and it's kind of the point I'm trying to make with this thread: the fact that people just assumed the only way past the bosses was to shoot their way through is more telling of them than the game itself. And beyond the boss fights, the game never "forces" you to be spotted or trigger an alarm.

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    rapid

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    #29  Edited By rapid

    @Undeadpool said:

    @Akyho: 1st Boss: You can run around and he won't see you til you attack. Use this to, as Dash O' Pepper would say, "THROW A BARREL AT 'IM!"

    2nd Boss: Have her hit the generators with her electrical attack. Three ought to do it (if you have EMP shielding, this is easier)

    3rd Boss: You already got that one

    4th Boss: If you persuaded Hugh Darrow into giving up his code, you can easily hack your way past the final boss.

    And this proves my point: too many people went in guns blazing and then complained that the bosses all required their guns to be blazing...

    Boss 1 : The stun gun can immobilize him for a period of time while you throw a barrel at him lol

    Someone had the same idea as me

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    ryanwho

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    #30  Edited By ryanwho

    @Undeadpool said:

    @JudgeDread: In Deus Ex: HR you can hack your way out of a boss fight and most of the other bosses can be taken out without you drawing a weapon. The fact that you saw a boss and immediately assumed you had to shoot your way out isn't the dev's fault, and it's kind of the point I'm trying to make with this thread: the fact that people just assumed the only way past the bosses was to shoot their way through is more telling of them than the game itself. And beyond the boss fights, the game never "forces" you to be spotted or trigger an alarm.

    Its telling that they were able to get through the whole game up until that point doing something, then suddenly that no longer worked? No, that just tells me that lateral thinking is purely optional outside of boss fights when your enemy fodder can be taken down through "run and gun". The enemy fights prior to the boss had optional lateral thinking, but shooting everyone works just fine too. So you never had to think laterally. Then suddenly a boss pops up and its the player's fault? No. If the enemies were more formidable ramping up to the boss, people's expectations would have been colored and a lot less people would be bitching about a sudden shift. The game did a poor job preparing you up until that point. You can blame the player all you want.

    I'm not a huge MGS fan at all, but I point to the fight against The End as an example of how boss fights might have worked here. That's the fight I think of when I think "lateral thinking". I don't think of a fight that just completely negates your technique up until then and requires you to learn a new one on the spot. It feels like a very old way of handling things. That's how you work a boss back in the days of coinslots so you can make a tidy profit.

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    PsychedelicET

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    #31  Edited By PsychedelicET

    I completely agree with the OP - I've found the criticism of the boss battles in this game baffling. It's like people have forgotten that this is a video game, and then how to play "video games". The boss battles were super easy in this game and did not break "immersion" for me at all. I appreciate you saying it like it is, OP. Some people will blame anyone but themselves for their poor understanding and execution of concepts and systems.

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    Undeadpool

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    #32  Edited By Undeadpool

    @ryanwho: And it's also stupid to blame the developer because people who WEREN'T running and gunning are faced with a boss and suddenly decide "Well, it's a boss so I have to run and gun, right? Even though I haven't been doing any of that for the entire game, boss=shoot."

    I'll agree that the game didn't do a great job of ramping you up IF you were running and gunning, but that's only one of many ways to make it through the game. And it's only one of a couple of ways to make it past the bosses.

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    Undeadpool

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    #33  Edited By Undeadpool

    @TaliciaDragonsong said:

    @JudgeDread: Yeah, but how many boss fights? I still had to blast my way through the entire of Virmire as an Adept. Point here is that the confrontations offer other ways to beat it, perhaps not while stealthing a guy to death or avoiding the boss at all, but that's the path the dev's choose. As you said, if they would have been allowed to. Also the news that some other company handled the boss fights might be to blame for this but I cannot understand people tripping about it so dire. I played pretty stealthy but if an big augmented tank dude is right in front of you its kinda silly you expect to suddenly go stealth and do what? Stun him? Take him down silently? He already saw you, he already punched you in the face, its go time baby, even a stealther gets into a direct confrontation at times.

    Ding ding ding! We have a WINNER! I think, as with a lot of things, nostalgia is tinting how people remember the first Deus Ex (it certainly was when Alpha Protocol gave us the same weapon system, but was almost universally panned for it, while Deus Ex is praised) like it clearly is with ME (which makes me feel old). As pointed out, you can "non-combat" your way through exactly the same number of bosses in both Human Revolution and Mass Effect, but for some reason Mass Effect gets a pass?

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    MeierTheRed

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    #34  Edited By MeierTheRed

    I was playing a stealthy hacker. And i only did non lethal take downs, or used trenq rifle or stun gun. So i had no lethal weapons in my arsenal for the first boss. But of course the room was littered with weapons for me to use. But playing as a pacifist, i really hated the idea that i had to kill these bosses. The lack of a other way around them really put me off to the bosses. 
     
    Any how, so with my mantra of no guns, i naturally found the barrels, and threw 4 of those at him and he went down in around 20 seconds or so. Not a very exciting boss battle. I started having issues with Yelena, and i had no idea the first time how i could beat here without being electrocuted by the power nodes, so after dying a lot. I just use some of my 10-12 left over praxis points to upgrade the Typhoon. So i stunned here with the sun gun, typhooned here, stunned here and typhooned here. Down she went in 20 second as the fist.  
     
    So after that i just used that tactic on the rest of the bosses, i only used the typhoon on them and no one else, i just didn't want to deal with the bosses, they broke my immersion.
      
    So in summery 2x Typhoon = dead boss on normal, 3x Typhoon on hard, or just 2 and a few gun shots if you prefer that solution.

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    xyzygy

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    #35  Edited By xyzygy

    It's funny, I actually found myself to be one of the "ragers" during my boss battle with Federova. I was playing on Hard and had NOTHING into my armor or combat abilities. I was dying and getting frustrated. But I was fast, silent, and my stealth lasted forever. So I thought about it and instead of just trying to run around and kill her, I would stealth and use my see-through-walls ability to run up to her and unleash some shotgun shells I had found in the cabinets along the walls. She was actually quite easy once I had thought about it and timed everything.

    With Namir, as soon as the boss battle began I ran towards him with my fully upgraded pistol and popped about 7 bullets straight into his head and won. The whole fight lasted maybe 3 seconds.

    The first boss was just using stealth well and getting headshots, and the final boss is easy for a hacking specialist with stealth.

    When used well, your characters strengths will always get you through the boss battle!

    I don't get how people say that you are being "forced" to beat the boss a certain way though. I clearly used stealth to my advantage during my boss fights and it really wasn't that difficult, even on Give Me Deus Ex.

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    ryanwho

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    #36  Edited By ryanwho

    @xyzygy: Again, the problem is leading up to the boss. The expectations for a challenge aren't leveled. You hack a torret here, throw an EMP there, its a cakewalk. Where it would make more sense to be training me to better understand how to deal with bullet sponges in a limited space. In a game like Zelda this is never a problem because there's one correct solution, and you know the weapon you find is the weapon you need to learn for the boss. Deus Ex doesn't need to limit itself that much, but a smarter approach would be having the level leading up to the boss teach you the skills you'll need for him or her so they can be refined.

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    VikingCommando

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    #37  Edited By VikingCommando

    @Rapid said:

    @Undeadpool said:

    @Akyho: 1st Boss: You can run around and he won't see you til you attack. Use this to, as Dash O' Pepper would say, "THROW A BARREL AT 'IM!"

    2nd Boss: Have her hit the generators with her electrical attack. Three ought to do it (if you have EMP shielding, this is easier)

    3rd Boss: You already got that one

    4th Boss: If you persuaded Hugh Darrow into giving up his code, you can easily hack your way past the final boss.

    And this proves my point: too many people went in guns blazing and then complained that the bosses all required their guns to be blazing...

    Boss 1 : The stun gun can immobilize him for a period of time while you throw a barrel at him lol

    [vid]

    Someone had the same idea as me

    You both must see how that kind of playstyle is completely counter intuitive to how people had been playing the game up until now. If you had been playing stealth, carrying the silenced pistol and the non lethal weapons, odds are you would've been playing in a much different manner.

    Yes, the game provides alternatives that often do not involve firing a shot, but those strategies are not interesting or even satisfying to use. Had they let us make better use of the stealth mechanics, the boss fights could've been more interesting. Instead it came down to either having the right augs, abusing the ai's animations, or stun locking; not very compelling.

    I cannot help but state again that the problem lies not with the player for not finding the alternatives, but with the devs for providing the players with such poor alternatives. Ultimately the boss fights all came down to being various buckets you filled with damage, and that is not how these boss fights should've played out.

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    rapid

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    #38  Edited By rapid

    @VikingCommando: Not even in the original were the boss fights that well executed, so I wasn't expecting the boss fights to be spectacular.

    But Going back to OP though, I think its both. In a lot of games in general often how you fight the Boss is completely different than how you approach every other enemy. In some ways, that gives the player a challenge, here's something that completely forces the way you been playing, making you think on the fly, adapt or survive. In a game like Deus Ex though, yes I agree that it might break the immersion as how perceive Jenson to be. If this was a movie, I certainly could not see Jenson using those tactics to beat his enemy. But who knows, for someone else this might be what their Adam Jenson is like.

    I've always conceptualized a Boss always like a Term or Unit Exam testing everything you've learned till now, and you need to you use all the play styles to win. So for me, I was perfectly okay with doing something completely different when it came to boss fights.

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    Akyho

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    #39  Edited By Akyho

    I @Undeadpool: something that folks have said. "I was stealthy with my slienced pistol and stun gun." i was stealthy and didnt fight head on till the end which ruined my chance for the achievment. i had the silenced pistol which was only used the first mission. i had my revolver only used in boss battles. had my sniper rifle. used start of second china visit and bosses. crossbow a few usefull times after half way. and a giant laser i never used.

    i was equiped for adaptability . if i needed to snipe i was prepped. if i needed to fight head on i was prepped. if i needed to shoot an apple off someones head I WAS PREPPED!

    played enough games to know they will throw you out of your confort zone. the boss battles were signposted. the gun littered around. second boss the corridors are filled with arrows made out of lmg heavy guns. be prepared for anything. fallout i equip for long meduim and close range. i dont say i am long range game should make it long range.

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    Bribo

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    #40  Edited By Bribo

    I'm a little late to this party, other stuff to play - you know how it is.

    I've just killed the second boss by being ultra-smart, but the first boss fell due to a failure in the AI. I stunned him and then he spent the remainder of his existence chucking grenades into the corner of the room where he thought I was.

    Bosses aside, I would be interested to know how many people invested their praxis points towards being a badass in combat rather than being a stealthy hacker guy. I suspect nobody did that. You have hundreds of opportunities to be the badass combat guy in the miriad of other FPS shooters you can buy.

    Of course, I choose the geek route (although I can punch through walls) but I would be interested to hear from those who chose the tough-guy route.

    It would be a great disservice to this game if nobody persued the traditional course of killing everyone-who-looks-at-you-cross-eyed. 'Cos it's in there if that's what you want to do.

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    veektarius

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    #41  Edited By veektarius

    The fact that you've found ways to kill the bosses without guns does not mean they are strategies for a non-combat build of character. These are strategies that would work equally well for someone with a gun, and you'd get to shoot them too. And in the case of the first "barrel-throwing" strategy, why, exactly, is this less of a combat solution than using a rocket launcher? You still have to avoid getting hit, then duck out and shoot something at the enemy. None of these solutions requires hacking, certainly, none requires stealth, and only one involves persuasion.

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    TheDudeOfGaming

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    #42  Edited By TheDudeOfGaming

    I didn't really mind the boss battles, but they were combat focused. On the other hand if you go in prepared they aren't a problem even on the hardest difficulty. In any case, a great game.

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