Hideaki Itsuno teases Dragons Dogma 2 and Devil May Cry 5

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#51 Posted by JFunkhouser (66 posts) -

Dragons Dogma 2? Hells yes! Loved the shit out of the first one, despite the flaws. The first time I saw the Deep Down trailer, I really hoped it was Dragons Dogma 2.

#52 Posted by Humanity (8835 posts) -

@yummylee: Sure I'm just saying, there is a roughly 10 hour lead up to that point, when you're playing for the first time. To put that much of your time and energy into an hour long ending (or more depending on how long you take in the Everfall) it just doesn't seem like a wise investment if you're not actually having fun for those 10 hours.

#53 Edited by Ezekiel (374 posts) -

After how lame DMC4 was, I'm not sure I want another. 3 is the only DMC I like. I'd rather he made a new hack and slash. One that isn't divided into levels and can be played with one character all the way through.

#54 Posted by GnaTSoL (791 posts) -

I loved OG Dante, especially him in DMC4 believe it or not. I loved him along with Trish and Lady together all interacting freshly with one another. It gave me a Lupin and the gang kind of vibe but with demon hunters.

Why must all games be serious with serious storylines and character development blah blah blah. DMC is lax-action and that's the way I love it.

For whoever liked how DmC played like, most likely DMC5 will have an updated engine taking the best from the reboot.

I heard they dumbed down the way the fighting worked in DmC for everybody, which is why lots praise the action-system for its forgiveness, and I bet they do the same in DMC5.

#55 Posted by Seppli (10251 posts) -

I'm pitching a tent for Dragon's Dogma 2. I want it. So much!

#56 Posted by Oldirtybearon (4602 posts) -

Considering all the improvements they made with Dark Arisen, I don't see why Itsuno and his team shouldn't get another crack at a proper Dragon's Dogma sequel. DD and DD:DA were ballers choice 2012.

#57 Posted by Darkly (4 posts) -

@brighty said:

@jimmyfenix said:

I have mixed opinions about a DMC 5 if that game is in the works it has to be all fan service right ?

Thats a pretty broad logic leap to make, I think they're simply just going back to what the fans wanted (i.e. a continuation of the original series and the original series style of gameplay and over-the-top Bayonetta-esque action) because DmC was slammed from its inception by fans, failed to attract enough new fans to make up for alienating some of the older ones, and as a result the game ultimately bombed.

Sales are a trailing indicator though, DMC4 being received lukewarmly by fans is also likely a symptom of poor sales of the follow-up (much like DMC3's amazing showing was responsible for a lot of DMC4's massive sales). And DmC was nothing if not over-the-top, but frankly I'd rather see Bayonetta 2 come out on other consoles before DMC5.

DMC4 has sold over 2.7 million copies, something that - sadly enough - will take DmC years to reach itself. DMC4 was received lukewarmly by fans only because of the lackluster character that is Nero, which was a character that had horrible storytelling associated with it - which isn't a far cry from how Ninja Theory handled DmC itself especially when it came to the characterization of Dante and Vergil.

As for Vergil, I wouldn't say he was much of an anti hero, either. My personal head canon gives him motivations that would make him lean towards anti-heroism, but going strictly from what DMC3 has told us, it's hard to confirm any motivation besides his desire for power. Capcom never goes beyond power. They never give any reasons as to why he wants power. Based on the very limited descriptions of him, he's squarely a villain.

That said, he's still a much, much better villain than DmC Vergil, for a couple of reasons. First, he's actually made to be a worth adversary for Dante right from the get go, giving him a feeling of power and of being an actual threat. DMC3 makes it very obvious that Vergil is, if not better than, at least equivalent , through copious amounts of cutscenes with him killing demons easily, and then of course having that threat realized when he defeats Dante in the first battle. Beating Vergil at the end of DMC3 feels like a genuine major accomplishment, and not just because that boss battle is one of the hardest in the game; DMC3's setting up of Vergil as a powerhouse who's beaten Dante at least once allows for an epic confrontation that DmC lacks.

DmC's Vergil fight, on the other hand, stumbles right out of the gate in a couple areas. Vergil suddenly goes from someone who, while was a bit of a jerk, was certainly established as a good guy, and then immediately makes him evil. There's barely any transition at all from his good self to his bad self. He isn't even willing to talk the idea over with Dante, instead insisting that Dante simply get out of his way (which stands in stark contrast to the great lengths he was willing to go in order to convince Dante to join the Order). The sudden change in character is jarring and incredibly rushed, and makes the player scratch their head instead of feeling like this is a believable conflict.

The second major area where DmC's fight falls flat is in establishing Vergil as any sort of threat. I mentioned before the lengths that DMC3 goes to in order to make the player believe just how powerful Vergil is. This game takes none of those lessons, though. In fact, I believe the only baddie that we actually watch Vergil kill during the entire game is Lilith, and that's done in a way that does nothing to make Vergil look powerful at all (he just shoots her twice with a sniper rifle).

Outside of that, Vergil essentially demonstrates no sense of power whatsoever. Dante ends up killing all of the bosses, Dante ends up beating Mundus while Vergil gets eaten or something, and Dante is the one who ends up saving Vergil during the silly slow down mission. The game establishes Vergil as a good tactician, but never gives the player a reason to fear him in a one on one battle at all. So when the game throws the player and Vergil into a one on one fight at the end, that sense of imposingness that DMC3 Vergil had is absent. The fact that this fight is incredibly easy doesn't help DmC Vergil's characterization as a wimp.

#58 Posted by Aetheldod (3514 posts) -

Wow cant believe any of you isn´t stocked for a new Rival Schools D: , fuck Devil May Cry , fighting games is were its at!!!!

#59 Posted by DonChipotle (2694 posts) -

Yo, guys, fuck Dragon's Dogma and Devil May Cry. Did none of you see the part where he wants to make a Rival Schools 3? Rival Schools is my shit! I want to donate to this man's Rival Schools 3 fund.

#60 Edited by EXTomar (4507 posts) -

Just like how people were supposedly excited for Vampire/Darkstalkers, people are excited for Rival Schools. Which turns out to be that people are more excited about the idea a new game instead of actually buying anything.

#61 Posted by Yadilie (380 posts) -

@razielcuts: A new Onimusha? Nope. Don't want it. Not after the travesty of Dawn of Dreams. They will not able to top Onimusha 1 and they'll try and will fail miserably. Talk of sequels is kind of annoying. Make new IPs. I don't care if you take combat mechanics from another game just make a new damn IP.

#62 Posted by DonutFever (3550 posts) -

I didn't like the DMC games, but liked DmC, so bummer.

#63 Posted by Hailinel (23930 posts) -

DmC would have been better off as its own thing instead of trying to serve as a replacement for DMC. If Capcom makes DMC5, I'll fully support that.

It's bizarre to think that DmC could wind up in the same annals as Bomberman: Act Zero.

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#64 Posted by kishinfoulux (2256 posts) -

Gamers don't deserve another DMC game after letting the last one flop. It was pretty good, but ZOMG HE DOESN'T HAVE WHITE HAIR SO FUCK IT.

#65 Edited by Hailinel (23930 posts) -

Gamers don't deserve another DMC game after letting the last one flop. It was pretty good, but ZOMG HE DOESN'T HAVE WHITE HAIR SO FUCK IT.

That wasn't the only nor anything close to the primary reason that old DMC fans avoided DmC. That you and others are still pulling out the hair criticism as the main line of reasoning why people don't like DmC is ignorant, to say the least.

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#66 Edited by ArbitraryWater (11487 posts) -

@hailinel said:

It's bizarre to think that DmC could wind up in the same annals as Bomberman: Act Zero.

Oh please, that's not even a fair comparison. Bomberman Act Zero is universally regarded as one of the worst games of this console generation, failed reboot or no. Whatever weird hate people have for DmC, it's at least is competently made. I stand by Prince of Persia 2008 as a more accurate comparison, and much like DmC that game left off on a pretty serious cliffhanger that will never be resolved. Thanks video game designers, for trying to put sequel hooks in your untested reboots.

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#67 Posted by Hailinel (23930 posts) -

@hailinel said:

It's bizarre to think that DmC could wind up in the same annals as Bomberman: Act Zero.

Oh please, that's not even a fair comparison. Bomberman Act Zero is universally regarded as one of the worst games of this console generation, failed reboot or no. Whatever weird hate people have for DmC, it's at least is competently made. I stand by Prince of Persia 2008 as a more accurate comparison, and much like DmC that game left off on a pretty serious cliffhanger that will never be resolved.

Fair point.

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#70 Posted by JoeyRavn (4949 posts) -

Dragon's Dogma: Dark Arisen was the last game I played on consoles before selling my 360. I really liked the game, but, IMO, it was subpar experience. The resolution, the graphical detail, the vignetting, the framerate... That game deserved better. If Capcom puts it on PC, I'll be all over DD2.

#72 Edited by BrunoTheThird (9 posts) -

What if, story-wise, DMC5 was a direct sequel to DMC3, and a prequel to DMC1? Eh? Eh!?

#73 Posted by ESREVER (2671 posts) -

Nice! I would take either a DMC5 or a DmC2. One thing I hope they do is use Lady more in the Devil May Cry series. She's such a fantastic character who gets so little screen time.

#74 Posted by adam1808 (1378 posts) -

Echoing the sane people on this thread, I would much rather a DmC2 than a DMC5. Although business is always fickle, I hope Capcom stick to their guns and let NT do a sequel. I LOVED the old DMC games but that character and that world is played out.

As for Dragon's Dogma, they have a great foundation to work from. If they make a more interesting world I am 100% down for that.

#75 Edited by Humanity (8835 posts) -

@arbitrarywater said:

@hailinel said:

It's bizarre to think that DmC could wind up in the same annals as Bomberman: Act Zero.

Oh please, that's not even a fair comparison. Bomberman Act Zero is universally regarded as one of the worst games of this console generation, failed reboot or no. Whatever weird hate people have for DmC, it's at least is competently made. I stand by Prince of Persia 2008 as a more accurate comparison, and much like DmC that game left off on a pretty serious cliffhanger that will never be resolved. Thanks video game designers, for trying to put sequel hooks in your untested reboots.

Actually the 2008 Prince of Persia had DLC that picks up right after the end of the game. I liked it too, although the platforming got a little streamlined there was a sense of speed to traversing the puzzles that simply wasn't present in the past iterations. A lot of the level design was really beautiful too and the ending while a cliff hanger of sorts was really touching.

Also agreed, the comparison to Bomberman Zero is ludicrous at best. Not to get into it but the hair thing aside, the arguments people present against DmC make them sound like grumpy old men yelling at rap not being music.

#76 Posted by hermes (1378 posts) -

@wraxend said:

@mildmolasses said:

@hermes said:

@mildmolasses: Considering their attempt at a new character was Nero, who, for all intents and propose, and with no explanation, looks and dresses like a young Dante, I would say no. They are physically incapable of making a DMC game with a protagonist that doesn't look like a white haired bishonen.

And on your second suggestion, I would love little more than playing Bayonetta 2 in a PS3/360/PS4/XB1, but since Nintendo is publishing this one, I would consider it unlikely.

That's why the Sigma it and add Baby Bayonetta as a playable character. Bam! New game!

Well Mass Effect was published by Microsoft to begin with but is now on the PS3 so I hope it's not impossible that Bayonetta 2 will eventually come out on other systems.

Believe me, I would love that to happen... but I think Platinum does not have the resources to work on that conversion, the way EA does. Besides, I believe Nintendo is more than just publishing the game, but are the ones behind the production as well. At this point, I wouldn't be surprised Bayonetta 2 goes the way of MadWorld and never sees another console release.

#77 Posted by Quarters (1633 posts) -

I have really mixed feelings about this. I love the original DMC series, so a new one of that would be great, but I would be severely bummed if that meant that there wouldn't be a DmC sequel. Out of the two, I'd rather see where DmC would go. Partially, this is because I don't think the old games would ever push past DMC2 on the timeline, which is just a huge waste, and it means that DMC2 will always be the end of the series. That's just dumb.

#78 Edited by BoOzak (882 posts) -

@quarters said:

I have really mixed feelings about this. I love the original DMC series, so a new one of that would be great, but I would be severely bummed if that meant that there wouldn't be a DmC sequel. Out of the two, I'd rather see where DmC would go. Partially, this is because I don't think the old games would ever push past DMC2 on the timeline, which is just a huge waste, and it means that DMC2 will always be the end of the series. That's just dumb.

You could just do what I do and not acknowledge 2 as part of the series, i'm sure Capcom would be happy if you did. I see the Devil May Cry series the same way I see Zelda. There's always a guy named Dante, who owns a demon hunting place called Devil May Cry, and he has white hair. (generally) Other than that they're completly different games set in different universes. You could connect them, if you wanted to. (much like Zelda) But you dont need to. They all make sense by themselves. (4 less so but it stil works)

Anyway, i'm all for another DD and DMC whichever form they take, I dont really care. Personally i'd rather Ninja Theory start fresh on a new IP.

#79 Posted by Damodar (1302 posts) -

I am also in the "Fuck Dragon's Dogma 2, gimme Rival Schools" boat. Rival Schools is so good.

#80 Posted by Snail (8584 posts) -

We all knew what this thread was going to turn into, didn't we?

Personally I'd welcome more DmC or DMC (I miss the latter, but I had fun with the former as well). I'd be okay with them doing each franchise on alternate years, giving each "sub-franchise" a two-year cycle. Yeah that sounds like a plan. Hey Capcom hear me out!

#81 Posted by Humanity (8835 posts) -

@snail said:

We all knew what this thread was going to turn into, didn't we?

Personally I'd welcome more DmC or DMC (I miss the latter, but I had fun with the former as well). I'd be okay with them doing each franchise on alternate years, giving each "sub-franchise" a two-year cycle. Yeah that sounds like a plan. Hey Capcom hear me out!

This is actually a really cool idea. Like the Call of Duty split - same franchise, different teams.

#82 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

DD2. I need it. I'm ready.

DD:DA GOTY.

#83 Posted by leinad44 (503 posts) -

Given what DMC4 was I'd rather have DmC2. There was just so much more imagination with DmC. Screw the fanboys.

#84 Posted by kishinfoulux (2256 posts) -

@hailinel said:

@kishinfoulux said:

Gamers don't deserve another DMC game after letting the last one flop. It was pretty good, but ZOMG HE DOESN'T HAVE WHITE HAIR SO FUCK IT.

That wasn't the only nor anything close to the primary reason that old DMC fans avoided DmC. That you and others are still pulling out the hair criticism as the main line of reasoning why people don't like DmC is ignorant, to say the least.

Most of the reasons were fucking petty and you know it. While some bitched about the gameplay (even though it was totally fine) most bitched about the character all the changes surrounding that.

#85 Posted by micemoney (135 posts) -

DmC was the shit.

#86 Edited by Heltom92 (706 posts) -

I am way more interested in a sequel to DmC than I am for Devil May Cry 5. I hope it happens.

#87 Posted by Hailinel (23930 posts) -

@kishinfoulux: Nope. Sorry, don't agree. Not everyone appreciated the gameplay shift. DmC is not an objectively better experience. It's just different, and people that like one don't necessarily have the same fondness for the other.

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#88 Edited by Encephalon (1240 posts) -

I enjoyed DmC more than the previous games in the series,so it would bum me out, personally, if the next one headed back in the direction of 1-4.

As for another Dragon's Dogma, sign me the fuck up. The flaws of the first game are so plainly obvious that I think they can knock it out of the park with a sequel.

#89 Posted by Pr1mus (3821 posts) -

I'd rather have DmC 2 than DMC 5. No interest whatsoever in the old games and DmC was pretty goddamn fantastic. However i'd be fine with the game being a one time thing too considering how terrible Vergil's Downfall was.

#90 Posted by Undeadpool (4913 posts) -

@darkly: Good points all around on Vergil, but I didn't really mention the DmC Vergil VS the DMC one...I was just mentioning that 4 likely sold better than the reboot because 3 was so (rightly, beautifully) beloved and DmC was likely more lackluster sales-wise because of how "meh" DMC4 was received. Whether it was because of Nero (one of Capcom's LAZIEST character designs) or not has little bearing as I'm not talking about my opinion, I'm talking about observable phenomena (see also: Spiderman 3, an absolutely ABYSMAL film made tons of money because of how popular Spiderman 2 was, ).

@hailinel said:

@undeadpool: Well, DMC5 is the more likely of those options, as it is the only one even remotely realistic. People need to stop complaining that Bayonetta 2 is a Wii U exclusive. The game is being funded on Nintendo's dime. Seeing it on a Sony or Microsoft console will not happen. It's amazing people are still deluding themselves on this. (Not you specifically, but in general.)

As I understand, it's less being "funded" by Nintendo and more that Sega (in their glorious, infinite WISDOM) had no interest in publishing it, though I could be wrong on that. Either way, I get WHY it's a WiiU exclusive, I just don't like it. And I'll damn sure POUT about it if I feel like! Such a pouting will I have!!

#91 Posted by Hailinel (23930 posts) -

@hailinel said:

@undeadpool: Well, DMC5 is the more likely of those options, as it is the only one even remotely realistic. People need to stop complaining that Bayonetta 2 is a Wii U exclusive. The game is being funded on Nintendo's dime. Seeing it on a Sony or Microsoft console will not happen. It's amazing people are still deluding themselves on this. (Not you specifically, but in general.)

As I understand, it's less being "funded" by Nintendo and more that Sega (in their glorious, infinite WISDOM) had no interest in publishing it, though I could be wrong on that. Either way, I get WHY it's a WiiU exclusive, I just don't like it. And I'll damn sure POUT about it if I feel like! Such a pouting will I have!!

It's being funded in that Nintendo is paying for Bayonetta 2's development. Sega was just acting as a middle-man to allow Nintendo and Platinum to engage in this arrangement (they weren't interested in funding a sequel themselves). As Kamiya frequently tells people on Twitter, anyone that wants Bayonetta 2 on another platform needs to talk to Nintendo about it.

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#92 Posted by Undeadpool (4913 posts) -
#93 Edited by TobbRobb (4581 posts) -

I want all of this in my pants. Even if it ends up terrible.

Just put it in my pants dammit.

#94 Posted by kishinfoulux (2256 posts) -

@hailinel said:

@kishinfoulux: Nope. Sorry, don't agree. Not everyone appreciated the gameplay shift. DmC is not an objectively better experience. It's just different, and people that like one don't necessarily have the same fondness for the other.

I mean that's great, but thems the facts. That was a large reason for the outrage. Saying otherwise is nonsense.

Also who are you to determine which is objectively better? Get off the high horse.

#95 Posted by N7 (3573 posts) -

@lysergica33 said:

I really hope that Devil May Cry 5 is shorthand for DmC: 2 as the way that game set up a sequel was pretty enticing, and I really, really enjoyed everything about that game. Great combat, great soundtrack, great level and art design, great writing. All just fuckin' great. I was surprised it wasn't all that well received.

Because CapCom decided DMC needed a reboot nobody was fucking asking for.

As a fan of the original series, I can appreciate that they tried to improve upon graphics and controls somewhat but it fell flat on every other critical feature of a DMC game. I'll try to explain to people what is simply a series of poor design choices in DmC:

1. DmC in 30 fps on consoles. In series in which frame perfect execution and dodges is vital, they managed to dumb it down by halving the amount of frames. Not to mention, it's just jarring to run 30 fps for a action game.

2. Controls. They used their Heavenly Sword mentality, a huge flop of a game by the way, onto a succesful series like DMC. They removed switching and cycling between weapons, into pressing and holding shoulder buttons. That's two (iirc. unremappable) buttons wasted that could have taken a single button.

2. Absence of styles (Trickster, Swordmaster, Gunslinger, Royalguard, Quicksilver, Doppelganger) that made DMC3 unique, instead they made the movesets and progression God of War-esque, buying into moves instead of having to master distinct styles. Normally, if everyone's favourite moves were present in this new DmC, this wouldn't be a problem. Only the barebones staples like stinger, prop shredder and bullet rain return.

3. Absence of originality in weapons. DMC3 had crazy weapons like a rock guitar, ice nun-chucks, a rocket launcher. A game heavily focused on using weapons in combo's should at least have interesting weapons. How is a scythe original?

4. Dante's new devil trigger. Why did they give a game primarily about ground to ground combat an overpowered deviil trigger built around abusing air combo's?

5. Dante is even more one-dimensional this time around. ''Consider yourself dumped'' isn't clever dialogue. I get bad high school vibes from him, the fans of the DMC series is over 20 years old by now. The original Dante at least had a stab at the sometimes weird story in the game and showed a little character progression.

6. Why on earth can you NOT use Vergil in bloody palace? He's DLC to boot, at least make him usable in the bloody palace.

7. Too much goddamn platforming. A DMC game is about the exhilirating battles and small puzzles inbetween. How could Ninja Theory put so much emphasis on getting from A to B?

So no, it's not this dumb notion about "Dante has black hair now" or some other crap. They botched gameplay by messing too much with it. DMC5 shouldn't be about fan service, it should be about taking the standards of DMC to a next level, not to the likes of Heavenly Sword.

Logged in for the first time in months because you are the man. I don't have much to say here, just that you got it all right.

#96 Edited by Hailinel (23930 posts) -

@hailinel said:

@kishinfoulux: Nope. Sorry, don't agree. Not everyone appreciated the gameplay shift. DmC is not an objectively better experience. It's just different, and people that like one don't necessarily have the same fondness for the other.

I mean that's great, but thems the facts. That was a large reason for the outrage. Saying otherwise is nonsense.

Also who are you to determine which is objectively better? Get off the high horse.

Can you cite evidence to prove this supposed fact? Because until you do, it's impossible to take you seriously. Are you just ignoring people that criticize DmC for any reason other than the hair?

Also, I'm not saying either game is objectively better. I don't know where you got that from.

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