Should Valve buff heroes not picked in the 2014 Int'l ?

#1 Edited by Fitzgerald (326 posts) -

We're seeing lots of heroes that are getting picked over and over again this tournament, despite questionable win rates. IE Skywrath, Brewmaster, Bristleback, Tide, etc. Despite this, there are ALSO heroes that have yet to be picked once. The best list I could find is:

    • Bloodseeker
    • Bounty Hunter
    • Broodmother
    • Crystal Maiden
    • Huskar
    • Keeper of the Light
    • Lina
    • Luna
    • Magnus
    • Medusa
    • Meepo
    • Night Stalker
    • Omniknight
    • Phantom Lancer
    • Pudge
    • Slardar
    • Spectre
    • Spirit Breaker
    • Undying
    • Earth Spirit
    • Terrorblade
    • Sven
    • Legion Commander
    • Pheonix

Should un-picked heroes get a buff after the tournament is over to ensure they don't get ignored next time or to shift the meta? Personally, I'm really surprised that Huskar, Bloodseeker, Medusa, and Phantom Lancer are on this list. They aren't heroes that I play or even like playing, but they definitely seem like strong heroes. At least, I'm easily intimidated by a good Huskar, for sure.

Edit: Updated the list based on ( this list ). Still, some heroes are getting VERY few picks, and others are never picked but sometimes banned.

#2 Posted by therealnelsk (326 posts) -

Overall game balance is probably more complicated than just buffing heroes that weren't picked in TI. However, I think you can be sure they'll be making balance changes and incorporating this information among a bunch of other factors to determine where the meta needs to go.

#3 Posted by Fitzgerald (326 posts) -

@therealnelsk: Sure enough. I'm kinda jealous of whoever it is at Valve who's job it is to watch the stats throughout the tourny and balance the game accordingly. That'd be a full-time job and then some!

That said, I just hope that they don't *nerf* popular heroes. I think nerfs should be a last resort: like, this hero is truly OP or there are no other options.

#4 Posted by chiablo (1009 posts) -

To be fair, the popularity of Faceless Void and Skywrath came out of nowhere. A month ago, they were considered trash tier heroes and nobody in their right mind would ever run Void mid. I'm really hoping that these teams have some secret team compositions that they are holding onto for the finals, for these preliminary matches, they are playing it super safe.

If you want to see stagnant meta, look at League of Legends:

League of Legends: 36 matches played, 40 champions picked

DotA day 1 group stage: 36 matches played, 76 heroes picked

#5 Posted by Slag (5050 posts) -

pro Level DOTA is a lot different than lower MMR DOTA, A lot of the unpopular heroes at pro level are real popular at lower ones

Online
#6 Edited by Mister_V (1459 posts) -

Some of the heros you listed are not available in captains mode.

#7 Posted by Hadoken101 (931 posts) -

@mister_v said:

Some of the heros you listed are not available in captains mode.

Yeah, to be more specific, Broodmother, Terrorblade, Legion Commander, Earth Spirit, and Phoenix are all non-selectable heroes in competitive play currently.

#8 Posted by Mister_V (1459 posts) -

@mister_v said:

Some of the heros you listed are not available in captains mode.

Yeah, to be more specific, Broodmother, Terrorblade, Legion Commander, Earth Spirit, and Phoenix are all non-selectable heroes in competitive play currently.

Ah thanks, I knew TB LC and Phoenix where not but i couldn't find a definitive list.

#9 Edited by EXTomar (4987 posts) -

No, heroes should be changed because in general things need to change. The play at The International is unusual and unconventional where at best some will attempt to mimic "stunts" seen there. Trying to satisfy that small and very particular crowd that is bending the meta-game in a short and concentrated period of time is not a good recipe for everyone else.

#10 Posted by ajamafalous (12228 posts) -

No. The professional Dota meta shifts almost every month without balance patches. I don't mean to be presumptuous and forgive me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like maybe you haven't kept up with pro Dota for that long. Heroes like Clockwerk, Lifestealer and Gyrocopter were all considered C- and D-tier picks a few months before TI3, and they ended up being staples of that tournament.

The difference in picks between Low, Medium, and High MMR games is quite different as well.

#11 Edited by Fitzgerald (326 posts) -

@ajamafalous: No offense taken. I've played DOTA for a long while but I never paid attention to the tournament scene until TI 2014.

#12 Posted by Viking_Funeral (1962 posts) -

No. The professional Dota meta shifts almost every month without balance patches.

Pretty much this.

#13 Posted by Atwa (664 posts) -

@slag said:

pro Level DOTA is a lot different than lower MMR DOTA, A lot of the unpopular heroes at pro level are real popular at lower ones

Nailed it really, you can't balance games completely around the competitive scene as most people that play are at a very casual level.

#14 Posted by BeardyDuck (114 posts) -

@ajamafalous: No offense taken. I've played DOTA for a long while but I never paid attention to the tournament scene until TI 2014.

I'm just wondering, but why would you make this thread then if you only started following the competitive scene recently? This kind of topic asks for people who have been following for a long time and understand why heroes aren't picked as often as others.

#15 Posted by gamefreak9 (2489 posts) -

Some heroes are just high risk high reward. For instance, nobody would argue with a straight face that faceless void(though not on your list) is a terrible hero, its just that he is vulnerable in the beginning and no team wants to play that risky a game. Yet for how dangerous he becomes it makes sense for him to vulnerable. So no its an over simplification to say that heroes who are not picked must be buffed.

#16 Posted by GERALTITUDE (3660 posts) -

all about Hero Combos rather than single heroes in my mind so not sure a list of heroes who werent picked is really that valuable balance wise

#17 Posted by Fearbeard (835 posts) -

I don't really see the relevance... Most games of Dota 2 don't play out like any that you would see at a major tournament. Some heroes just work better in ability combos.

In pub games I've seen just about every hero on that list played well and dominate.

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