In the fantasy world of Falana, a mysterious swordsman named Dust, armed with a living sword called Ahrah and a quirky companion named Fidget, seeks to free a village from oppression while uncovering the truth behind his past.
Have we become so hypersensitive to anthropomorphic animal characters that any representation gets labeled a furry? This turn does not bode well for the new Sly Cooper game.
F the internet on this one. I grew up wanting to be a turtle trained in the art of ninjitsu. As such I gave up the right to be uptight about humanized animals long ago. So this whole "furry" issue is meaningless to me, and just an advent of contemporary culture that I shant get hung up on like some impressionable teen. Even if the dev here is/was really into fetishizing furries, couldn't care less. John K. of (Ren and Stimpy fame) is quite clearly filled with many deviant and ridiculous thoughts, and that will never interfere with my love of the glorious content he produces.
That said, I think the art style is great. The only issue I have are the close-ups, as they become a little "soft" when blown up to that size, but the animation and colour palette more than make up for that.
I usually really dislike the look of most 2D games. Rayman: Origins for instance I find hard to look at because the art style is horrible, though most people seem to like it. This one though I really like the art style of. If it came out for PC I would buy it.
I think it looks pretty good, I think some of the characters could look a bit better (assorted villagers etc.), but I quite like the look of Dust himself. Love the overall look of the game and don't really have any qualms about anthropomorphic animals in videogames, there used to be so many of them when I was a kid, I sort of feel like it's gaming bread-and-butter. There's nothing sexualised about it (unless the game takes a weird turn at some point) so it doesn't really bother me at all.
It's sad that this has become the most popular thread about this game on these forums. I'd comment about the high school level of bigotry displayed here over the anthro connection, but I can't tell how many users of this site are actually still *in* high school or less.
That's not a crack about intelligence level, but certainly maturity.
I like that the OP actually seems pretty nice and never meant this as an insult or any kind of reference to furries or anything, and yet that's what many people have been latching onto. He just found the art style to be a turn off. Not like it was sick or something, but that it just struck him as something he didn't like. Similar to how many felt regarding Brink's art style. It's different, and some won't like it. That's fine. But even the OP said he appreciates the gameplay regardless of the art being a turn off.
Can't we, as a gaming community, just appreciate the gameplay? Bickering over the style is just silly. Sure many won't dig the style. Who cares? It's a videogame. We don't need to argue about every difference in personal preference we have. Let's just enjoy the game.
I like that the OP actually seems pretty nice and never meant this as an insult or any kind of reference to furries or anything, and yet that's what many people have been latching onto. He just found the art style to be a turn off. Not like it was sick or something, but that it just struck him as something he didn't like. Similar to how many felt regarding Brink's art style. It's different, and some won't like it. That's fine. But even the OP said he appreciates the gameplay regardless of the art being a turn off.
Can't we, as a gaming community, just appreciate the gameplay? Bickering over the style is just silly. Sure many won't dig the style. Who cares? It's a videogame. We don't need to argue about every difference in personal preference we have. Let's just enjoy the game.
I don't see why we can't debate this. Tune out the jerks and I think you'll find that this discussion is pretty enlightening.
@AndrewB said:
It's sad that this has become the most popular thread about this game on these forums. I'd comment about the high school level of bigotry displayed here over the anthro connection, but I can't tell how many users of this site are actually still *in* high school or less.
That's not a crack about intelligence level, but certainly maturity.
The last two pages have been perfectly civil and surprisingly not bigoted, as far as I can tell. Am I missing something here?
Even if he's not the best artist, from an objective standpoint that's hardly a reason for being "turned off" of the rest of the game. Dust seems to have its merits in gameplay terms, and I don't see how bad artwork is a big deal.
Because you have to look at the whole time you're playing the game. And lol at bringing up an "Objective standpoint" in response to an opinion.
You're entitled to an opinion, but it's passing judgement on a work. When Jeff or Ryan review a game on this site, that review is an opinion, but they obviously strive to be objective. I guess this is an informal setting so it doesn't matter. Eh.
Uhhh what? An opinion cannot be objective by definition. They're opposites.
@iFail: I was speaking of the overall tone this (and most every piece I seem to read) about Dust has taken. I just don't get why every discussion I've seen of this game devolves into discussion of furry culture. A piece of media can contain anthropomorphic characters without being associated with furries; though I stress that even if if this game was created by and for furries, that doesn't discount how amazing the art direction is, nor do I even denounce furries in any way.
I just hate that every discussion I've seen of this game since launch has been about the anthropomorphic characters and not about the game itself. My disgust is not even exclusive to Giant Bomb. It just shouldn't even be a part of the conversation.
Even if he's not the best artist, from an objective standpoint that's hardly a reason for being "turned off" of the rest of the game. Dust seems to have its merits in gameplay terms, and I don't see how bad artwork is a big deal.
Because you have to look at the whole time you're playing the game. And lol at bringing up an "Objective standpoint" in response to an opinion.
You're entitled to an opinion, but it's passing judgement on a work. When Jeff or Ryan review a game on this site, that review is an opinion, but they obviously strive to be objective. I guess this is an informal setting so it doesn't matter. Eh.
Uhhh what? An opinion cannot be objective by definition. They're opposites.
There's a distinction between being objective and trying to be objective. The definition of objective would be something along the lines of being without bias, right? Obviously humans by nature are always biased to a degree. That being said, we try to be unbiased a lot of the time, because objectivity has clear advantages. Given the social stigma against favoritism and prejudice, this should go without saying. I even gave you an example in the post you quoted.
The point I was making in the first place was that we should try to be objective when judging others work.
I like that the OP actually seems pretty nice and never meant this as an insult or any kind of reference to furries or anything, and yet that's what many people have been latching onto. He just found the art style to be a turn off. Not like it was sick or something, but that it just struck him as something he didn't like. Similar to how many felt regarding Brink's art style. It's different, and some won't like it. That's fine. But even the OP said he appreciates the gameplay regardless of the art being a turn off.
Can't we, as a gaming community, just appreciate the gameplay? Bickering over the style is just silly. Sure many won't dig the style. Who cares? It's a videogame. We don't need to argue about every difference in personal preference we have. Let's just enjoy the game.
I don't see why we can't debate this. Tune out the jerks and I think you'll find that this discussion is pretty enlightening.
Out of what I've seen in this thread and the Dust Quick Look, it has been about 10% reasonable statements of just not preferring a style and 90% absurd claims against the game for some unknown reason. The fact that people feel compelled to respond in this manner and even sometimes put down those who can appreciate the style and just like the game is simply sad. The point of what I said was that the OP's original topic is valid. But he acknowledged that the thread completely went in a different direction than he had expected or wanted. I'm agreeing with that. Things didn't become a reasonable discussion; it became a crazy argument with people posting inappropriate pictures and suggesting that anyone who likes this style is probably just hiding their secret lust for furries. This thread and the comments in the Quick Look are disturbing.
I agree that there might be some discussion to be had on the fact that people sometimes just don't like some art styles(as I said, games like Brink or anime-style games), but that isn't what this thread is. Not by a long shot. Maybe it can be turned around, but right now, probably the only reason it has at all calmed down is due to it being the time of day when there are less duders on the site than normal. Given a few more hours, I imagine this will blow up again and be just as idiotic as it has been for most of the rest of this thread. It's just sad that the -biggest- thread and discussion around the game is featured around preconceptions regarding the art style and not even the game itself. The OP is awesome because he has played the game and said it's cool but the visuals are just a bit of a turn off for him, but the majority of complaints here are from people just saying they won't even give the game a chance because they loosely tie it to some Internet subculture they don't like. It's a real shame, as there's so many better things to discuss about the game than defining what it is some people don't like about the art in it. The art is the art. Let's play the game and talk about the game.
It is an art style which has been corrupted by furries. Are you disgusted by The Simpsons because of all the Simpson porn out there? Of course not!
An excellent point, short and simple and to the point, this was what I was trying to say earlier.
If you think the art is bad then that's okay, but if you think the art is bad because somebody have drawn furry porn that have absolutely no relation to this game, then that is just silly.
I'm not a fan of the art style when the characters are up close and talking, but the game looks amazing in motion.
Also, I'm having a ridiculous amount of fun playing this. I'm doing it on the 'tough' setting and the challenge is just right.
he-he really? i keep biting the dust on normal ffs :) lol. BAH BAD AT TIMING PARRYS
@TruthTellah said:
Can't we, as a gaming community, just appreciate the gameplay? Bickering over the style is just silly. Sure many won't dig the style. Who cares? It's a videogame. We don't need to argue about every difference in personal preference we have. Let's just enjoy the game.
Couldn't agree more - i have a mate who is very focused on gaming "technology"; so whenever a game comes out the first thing he says is "its not very pretty" or "game X looks better"; not once does he talk about the actual game play and it drives me insane.
I appreciate that aesthetics are part of a games appeal but they shouldn't be a defining factor to answer the question "is this a good game" - i mean hell, mine-craft looks like shit, and its brilliant.
I'm not a fan of the art style when the characters are up close and talking, but the game looks amazing in motion.
Also, I'm having a ridiculous amount of fun playing this. I'm doing it on the 'tough' setting and the challenge is just right.
he-he really? i keep biting the dust on normal ffs :) lol. BAH BAD AT TIMING PARRYS
Yeah you really need to get the parry timing down for some of the bigger enemies. The first hour was the hardest, now that I've pumped some stats up its not too bad really
I'm not a fan of talking animals in general, but I actually like the style of Dust. Fidget seems rather annoying with her squeaky voice and kinda creepy look, though I can manage that since the gameplay is great. Controls remind me a lot of Symphony of the Night in how fluid and "right" they feel. Buying this as soon as payday comes.
Yeah, kinda. Part of it is the same thing that I don't like about most animated things today in that it looks too "clean." Old cartoons looked dark and gritty. I like that.
Edit: Also, I should say that when I say "gritty," I mean literal grit. Like dirt.
I agree but I have this problem with HD in general. But ya, I don't like most modern hand drawn animation either. It does not look as good as it used to. Well, I cant say that for all of it, but most of it. This game is one of those cases for me though. Edit: Oh, but I liked the animation a lot though. I haven't played it yet but the animation on the quicklook looked really good. Maybe a little better then I would have expected it to. As for this being about "furries", that just whininess and no that does not bother me at all. You people are just making it weird. Was Sly Cooper bad too? I don't see the difference. Stop being silly.
When it comes to the "too clean" part, it is a by-product of much improved equipment.
First off, most do the art digitally now, but secondly, the hand drawing has become a lot more accurate. My sister is a Manga artist and she uses pens which do not smudge or come off the page at all unless you specifically add water before drawing or use the special "smudge pens". This means that even brushing her hand over it as she draws will not move tiny amounts of colour around. It makes the entire drawing part extremely accurate (so making a single dot mistake will be noticeable); so much so that many drawings that people believe to be digitally drawn are actually hand-drawn (leading artists to actually start digitally drawing it again because people don't notice when they actually hand draw it). Added to that, we have much better scanning, recording and editing tools for uploading and animation making it actually more difficult to make it look "gritty" that it is to make it look perfectly "clean". Also, quite often, putting that in will make the entire thing jarring, especially in videogames, as different objects/layers/frames may have differing areas/amounts of discolouration meaning they don't look like they exist in the same room or it looks like the entire thing is constantly jumping around in space (sort of like when green-screening/affects are added to a real life scene, slight changes in lighting can completely destroy the scene) and simply adding in a layer after-the-fact to make the affect (so keeping all the drawing and animation pristine, then adding in an overlay to make it seem gritty) usually has the ultimate affect of making the entire thing seem like you are looking at it through a dirty window.
If I see my sister (and remember) I'll ask her about it since she would know much more than I (especially since she speaks with a lot of other artists when she has stalls at conventions and things) and she may have a better explanation or more to tell.
Not really. I get people not liking the disney aspect but its so beautifully done. The backgrounds are amazing, all it needs is a double rainbow somewhere.
Dear Everyone who has a problem with the character art,
You're missing out on a great game.
Sincerely,
People who don't get caught up in trivial things.
Have you read any of the comments on here? Most of the people who say they don't like the art are going to buy the game anyway because it looks like a good game. I think the art is pretty bad, not because of the furry thing (although its clearly comes from that background - as evidenced by the guy's past.) but because I just think it is ugly. Saturated colour, bad character design and no idea of how to be subtle. But i'm still going to get it because the gameplay looks fun.
Liking or not liking the look of a game is one the reasons you purchase or not. I really don't see how its trivial.
it's their eyes especially i find really ugly. i don't care about furries it's just that that's the only place i've seen this character design before you know and i think the way they're drawn and their eyes are just not ... good.
there's some other things about the art i'm not sure about too, as others have said. i don't know enough terminology to describe what i'm trying to get at though so i guess never mind.
but! i'm still loving the game, the combat's so much fun and all the other systems are cool too. the writing's pretty sharp too, just a slight shame it's performed (purposefully i guess?) in the style of a bad anime dub.
I grew up watching movies like American Tail, Secret of Nimh and Robin Hood (the disney one with the animals) so I don't understand the aversion people are having towards the art-style. I find the art-style of those movies far more interesting then the traditional 2D Disney princess movies and think that it translates fantastically to this style of game. And no, I have no interest in the furry sexual fetish.
I grew up watching movies like American Tail, Secret of Nimh and Robin Hood (the disney one with the animals) so I don't understand the aversion people are having towards the art-style. I find the art-style of those movies far more interesting then the traditional 2D Disney princess movies and think that it translates fantastically to this style of game. And no, I have no interest in the furry sexual fetish.
It's not that the characters are furry. Don Bluth and Disney are a different style altogether than what this game's art direction is (they're also not in the furry genre). The art style of the characters is a pseudo Eastern style of anthro. Now, a lot of Eastern characters have a certain appeal that makes for good character design and this game's character design does not have that appeal. The backgrounds are absolutely stunning, and the animations aren't terrible (unless you compare them to The Secret of Nimh and other movies of that ilk). The game looks really fun to play with a great combat system, interesting leveling system, and base building that will probably keep me playing for a long time.
The characters are not necessarily 'furry', but they lack a certain appeal that is difficult to quantify. It looks like fan art from the front page of Deviantart. Just because a character is anthropomorphized doesn't mean it's the same style as a Disney anthro character... or even another Eastern anthro style. This is, quite frankly, not very well-done fake manga anthro character design.
I hate to even say bad things about it, because the guy did the game all by himself. I'm picking the game up today because the character design, while not the greatest, isn't enough to put me off from all the other great things this game is doing. And it's very impressive that he has made something this deep and polished. It's a damn shame that the character design is getting most of the attention when we should be talking about other things. People are just throwing around the term 'furry' a lot and I don't think they fully understand what they're talking about.
@JillSammich: Are you currently taking an art class or something? I felt like I needed to be taking notes while I was reading your post...
Anyway, I don't know why there is so much "heat" on the forums about this game. It looks interesting and fun so I'll probably give it a shot...I guess I'm just too old to think that in-depth about games anymore.
@MB: I'm a computer animator actually... I do art sometimes. Being an animator actually ruins you on a lot of stuff. I can barely watch television anime any more because of the way they have to be produced to get them out with limited resources.
I feel too old to think about a lot of things that that in-depth actually. It's just when I look at art and art related things (especially games and animation) I can't help but to pick it apart.
Knowing how things are done actually makes the wonder even more. I have gained an appreciation of how difficult these things are, which is why I don't want to talk a lot of shit about the Dust creator and his work. It does, however, make you notice more when things are... off...
@Tarsier: Not even the adorableness that is Kyubey?
Tehe.
pokemone like stuff is fine. i just dont like furries and these are on the border of that which gets into the omega-creepy realm which i want no part in
I'll be honest. I've seen way too many Rule 34 images of cutesy anthropomorphic characters like that to view this game in a "pure" mindset.
That aside, the art style wouldn't appeal to me even if my brain wasn't lined with filth. The production quality looks amazing, however. Props where props due.
I am not really bothered by the art design or quality since I've enjoyed a few games with some really off-putting art. If you've ever played an Expansion 07th visual novel, you'd know what I mean. Higurashi was especially odd. Here, take a look for yourselves:
Oh god... THE MITTEN HANDSThe art is better in Umineko though still weird. By the way, play Umineko, it's awesome.
@Tarsier: Not even the adorableness that is Kyubey?
It's a question to Cloud: would you call the animals in the game anime animals? Because I see people referring to them like that.
I'd call them anthropomorphic designs somewhat inspired by anime, sure. I'd really rather use another word than inspired since I think the character designs for Dust look like total trash, but whatever!
Even though I don't really like the character design, it's the backgrounds that I find unappealing- as others have said, they're somehow simultaneously very blurry, bloomy, over-saturated, over-soft and too high-contrast to the point of distraction. Everything is lit like it's in direct sunlight, even when in gloomy forests or in caves, where the light should be softer and more ambient. Combine this with the low-contrast brightly colored character sprites, everything seems really off-kilter - like putting Colorforms on a thrift-store painting. Nothing looks like it fits together.
Also, the guy just doesn't know how to lead the eye with anything other than animation, and it causes the visual focus to shift around all over. I think this is one reason why it looks okay in motion but like garbage when still.
The art itself looks fantastic but I hate the "furry" character design. That wouldn't stop me from playing it, though. The fact that my Xbox barely works is what stops me from playing it.
I love the design of Dust himself, cool samurai inspired look, and his tail movement is fantastic, but stuff like Fidget is what gets to me, downright creepy.
I don't really care if its anthropomorphic animals or not. I mean, I like Star Fox, so whatever. I just think the eyes on the characters give it that "amateur fanart" look. Everything else looks fine. Dust looks great, you can't even see his eyes.
I think I would be able to look past this if I hadn't met a horrifying furry fan in real life. Kind of like how I'd probably be able to give a lot of bad anime a pass if I hadn't tried to join an anime club like 8 years ago and had a true nightmare scenario during the first meeting. Its petty and I'm probably stupid for passing up what could be a great game based on my own biases, but I just can't get over the bad first impression I got from the fanbases. Or the bad follow-up impressions as well.
Yeah, I'm not really into it. Tastes vary but for me story and art direction is a huge part of why I play a game, so this will probably be a pass for me. I know everyone's gonna jump down my throat but great gameplay is more common than great art and story, so I feel it's pretty legitimate to skip a title because of how it looks.
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