I just did the math and this game is really long. There are 85 missions with 5 difficulties and four character classes. so if you beat every mission on every difficulty with each character thats 1700.

AND the season pass includes 45 more missions. so that makes it 2600 missions with the DLC.

Thats kind of insane. And beating every mission on every difficulty with each character is a requirement for the Platinum Trophy/1000 Points.

Freaking nuts. Talk about replay value...

THEY KILLED THE CAPTAIN!!! CCCCCCCCCCCAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAPPPPPPTTTAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIIN!!!!!!

That's an odd definition of replay value. If you're just replaying the same boring missions over and over again with minor variations in character, that sounds like rather poor replay value to me.

Also, doing the math that way is weird. If any minor variation in character or difficulty is counted as a whole other mission, then Demon's Souls has BILLIONS of variations that you have to play through, counting all the different ways you can spec your character and all the NG+ variations you could do. Not to mention Spelunky, which probably has quintillions of different possible level layouts, counting all the variations.

I will agree though that that's a pretty high bar for a platinum trophy. That's probably going to take you the better part of a year, at least.

So it's got 85 missions in the base game and 45 more with DLC then? That adds up to a little shy of 1700.

I think you dont understand. You don't just play though the missions once. the fun of the game is trying to beat them on harder difficulties and get better loot.

You're looking at it the wrong way. EDF is all about progression. you don't start a new game plus or anything like that its all one playthough, gaining higher level loot and making your character stronger to try and face harder difficulties. The missions aren't boring either... and EDF isn't random like spelunkie. each mission on each difficulty is an individual accomplishment that is static and always there for you to face when you are ready.

and I was kind of kidding when I said replay value anyway....

I do understand, but 85 levels is 85 levels regardless of difficulty or character classes. You wouldn't say that Halo 3 has 40 levels since it has ten levels and 4 difficulties. Hell, if you were to go down that route, you would have to figure-up all of the different combinations of skulls possible. So that's ten more levels for every single skull, ten more for every combination of two skulls, ten more for every combination of three skulls, ten more for every combination of four skulls, etc., and that just doesn't make any fucking sense whatsoever.

Again EDF just doesn't fit that mold.

How doesn't it fit that mold? Do these 85 levels change in a significant way on different difficulties and with different classes? Can you expand on what you're saying instead of just cryptically saying "it's about progression, man!" and "it just doesn't fit that mold, man!" and "you just don't get it!"

@believer258: I cant really. For me beating a game like halo on any difficulty would be enough, I would feel accomplished and probably never need to play the game again. but edf is different. In a halo you don't really get any substantial rewards for beating it on whatever difficulty. I guess edf is more like an MMO doing raids for high level gear and such. I guess its similar to borderlands where beating the game once is just barely scratching the surface of the game.

@devil240z: Yes, but beating Borderlands twice is still beating Borderlands twice, and going back into an EDF level is still going back into an EDF level. Playing the same level twice doesn't make it a different level.

Giant insects?!

Hmm. I just don't see it that way. If you beat borderlands once on normal and thats it I would say that you didn't really play it at all.

How so? It's the same game a second time, only your weapons have bigger numbers.

@believer258: I just don't know how else to say it. Beating borderlands on normal is not beating borderlands. That might as well be the tutorial. Beating raid bosses and getting the sickest possible loot is what its about.

That's a long fucking tutorial.

I fucking hated playing Borderlands on New Game Plus. Everything took so many bullets to kill and I took so little. It was frustrating, not fun. It turned into a game of watching numbers pop out of things, which can be fun (see: Power Charge + God's Hand with Chie in P4) if it's the end result of something else fun (P4's excellent combat). Curious: Have you ever played Disgaea?

If that's what you enjoy, though, then don't let me stop you. Just don't go claiming that something has 1700 levels when it just has 85 levels and some difficulty options.

@believer258: It was mostly just a catchy title to draw people in. Wasn't trying to make a claim. Its still fact that to get 100% you have to complete 1700 missions. Each mission literally has 20 checkboxes to fill. One for each character on each difficulty.

@devil240z: Yeah I'm with @believer258 on this one, play a game any possible way you want to with any number of ways of re-playability you choose to partake in, but making a topic title statement of '1700 missions' is flat out a misleading statement.

I once set out to beat every single map (including the noncampaign ones) in Advance Wars with an S rank using every character available. Needless to say I never did it, cus that shit's nuts.

Now it's a question of wording. You have to complete one mission twenty times, not twenty missions one time. Please, note the difference.

I still think because the game presents it that way they are different levels.

Now if the game were structured differently, where you had to start a game on a particular difficulty and see that through to the end linearly, I would agree with you.

@believer258 said:

Though I get your point, I don't think it fits what the OP is talking about here. Halo was designed to be played through once, the difficulties and skulls are optional to seeing the game to its end. Moving on to higher difficulties and getting better loot is part of EDF 2025's design. You can argue you're playing the same mission, but it's not "playing the game again". Technically you are seeing more content that is not deemed optional in the progression of the game.

Your Borderlands 2 example is exactly that, and that is why i didn't play the new game plus. NG+ is integral to the game, as you can only level up to half-way through in the first playthrough. To get legendary guns and perks, and enormous end-game boss fights, you have to play through the same content again to get to that point. Same with EDF; you play through the same content again to get better loot and achievements. You can argue it's bad/lazy "copy-paste" design, but you can't compare that with Halo.

As for the argument of replay value, I got enough enjoyment out of playing Borderlands 2 one time, and because there is actually more to squeeze out from the second playthrough, which the content for me is optional, i would consider it having more replay value than challenging a harder difficulty on Halo. I think that is what the OP is getting at.