#1 Edited by Metal_Mills (3384 posts) -

After playing a few hours of this I was really surprised how heavy the racism themes are. Even going as far as having Klan members and "PROTECT OUR RACE" signs, every black person has been in filthy rags, and everything has a "pure white race" tone to it. Yet the one thing that stood out is there is zero misogyny. This is a time when both blacks and women were looked down upon yet there are even women soldiers. In 1912?! Considering the city is basically a very extreme christian(let's not kid our self here)/conservative place and full of controversial subjects that they would include that kind of thing too. Is sexism in games THAT touchy that it even takes presedence over other controversial things? It's just something that stuck out to me.

#2 Posted by Krullban (1471 posts) -

Sexism is the thing in videogames right now, so yes. It takes precedence over every other controversial thing.

#3 Posted by JasonR86 (10000 posts) -

Misogyny would hurt sales. Racism won't. So yes.

#4 Posted by mrfluke (5654 posts) -

@krullban said:

Sexism is the thing in videogames right now, so yes. It takes precedence over every other controversial thing.

#6 Posted by Metal_Mills (3384 posts) -

@krullban said:

Sexism is the thing in videogames right now, so yes. It takes precedence over every other controversial thing.

I feel like if a woman is complaining about sexism in a game that has full on racism and other touchy themes it seems pretty stupid. Almost like "Who cares about blacks? There should be female soldiers in 1912!!".

#10 Posted by oraknabo (1567 posts) -

It's also got a flying city. I don't think they were going for an accurate picture of the period. They picked the themes they wanted to focus on and left others to the side.

#12 Edited by FancySoapsMan (5877 posts) -

The racism in this case seems to be in service of the story, which is probably why nobody's making a big deal out of it.

#14 Posted by Winternet (8234 posts) -

Yeah, how could this documentary get this wrong? Oh wait.

#15 Posted by TheHT (12267 posts) -

emily is special to these folks right? maybe women are held in higher regard there than on the ground at that time. in a game that seems to go there with religion and race, i doubt they'd pull back on the sexism if it was important to the world/story.

#18 Edited by AlisterCat (6094 posts) -

The difference is between representing it, and purporting it. Some people think showing sexism = being sexist. Not the case, as any reasonable person would agree. The use of racism in Bioshock is very deliberate to highlight the values of a specific people in a specific time. The people crying misogyny, for the most part, are calling it out because they feel it is being purported through underlying sexism in the game designers and culture. Nobody is going to claim that showing people being racist is Bioshock is because the designers are racist.

It isn't the same thing, though I would agree that misogyny is just a hot topic at the moment, but that isn't the reason why. Don't confuse the issues.

#20 Edited by Nickieroonie (160 posts) -

@tobiass said:

@krullban: I don't hate gays, I have gay friends and relatives.

Most racist and intolerant people out there.

Just saying the truth. People go out there crying wolf and forget that they're not the only ones . It's like feminists disregarding racism over their own ideals.

Gays always use blacks and the civil rights movement to their advantage . When in reality they hate blacks.

I don't care if they get married, I'm all for it actually. This is the ''land of the free'' isn't it?

So because you have gay friends that are supposedly racist and intolerant, all gay people are racist and intolerant?

#21 Edited by searliat (4 posts) -

Gamers missing the point as usual. Carry on.

#23 Posted by Tobiass (160 posts) -

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

#24 Posted by Bwast (1376 posts) -

@tobiass said:

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

HAHAHAHAHA

#25 Posted by SlashDance (1862 posts) -

@tobiass: this is what you get for saying something nonsensical.

#26 Posted by TheHT (12267 posts) -

@tobiass said:

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

think of it as an opportunity to seriously reassess your 'observations'.

#27 Edited by JasonR86 (10000 posts) -

@tobiass said:

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

No. This is what you get for saying dumb shit and generalizing an ENTIRE group of people based off of these few, phantom homosexuals you "know".

#28 Edited by Jams (3043 posts) -

@tobiass said:

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

I think you need to elaborate more clearly. At least that's what I think. I'm curious as to how exactly you came to that thinking. I'm not saying you're right or wrong, I just want to know if you have an example or two you came across that lead you to that conclusion.

#29 Edited by ShaggE (7080 posts) -

@tobiass: You really don't see the glaringly obvious irony in what you're saying?

#30 Edited by Krullban (1471 posts) -

@tobiass said:

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

This is what you get for saying something completely stupid.

#32 Posted by Tobiass (160 posts) -

@jams said:

@tobiass said:

Well this is what I get for speaking my mind :(

I think you need to elaborate more clearly. At least that's what I think. I'm curious as to how exactly you came to that thinking. I'm not saying you're right or wrong, I just want to know if you have an example or two you came across that lead you to that conclusion.

I think I'm gonna let it die.

#33 Edited by AlexanderSheen (5148 posts) -

Well, this escalated quickly.

@searliat said:

Gamers missing the point as usual. Carry on.

Please, tell me about the point.

#35 Edited by JasonR86 (10000 posts) -

Of mice and men right?

#36 Edited by ArbitraryWater (12640 posts) -

Well, this thread went down the toilet quick.

#37 Posted by mrfluke (5654 posts) -

Yep, totally called it that this thread would catch on fire.

#38 Edited by TheDudeOfGaming (6116 posts) -

Is it okay for misanthropes to hate women?

#39 Posted by EXTomar (5024 posts) -

I don't think it is an issue of hate but more as ignored.

One thing that people forget is that "women's rights" is a totally modern idea that started in the 20th Century. Most women couldn't own property where if they were wealthy enough to matter they were merely "holding it" until they married or widowed passing it along to a husband or son. Women only held legal rights through their husband which made things like divorce out of reach. Women didn't have the right to vote in most of the world until the 20th Century, most post World War 1 and some even embarrassingly late.

Taken in the context of world history, a 1913 city probably didn't allow women much power to do anything not because they hated anyone but because most of the societal changes that forced the issue haven't landed in their lap yet.

#40 Posted by Krullban (1471 posts) -

Is it okay for misanthropes to hate women?

What about Lycanthropes?

#41 Edited by ripelivejam (5816 posts) -

should bioshock talk?

#43 Posted by Nickieroonie (160 posts) -

On-topic: I guess you could say that the world crafted for the game doesn't necessarily reflect real life in its entirety. Creative freedom. Regardless of whether or not Irrational was trying not to be misogynistic, it's unfortunate that we're in a period where games can be misinterpreted that way. It'll pass eventually!

#44 Edited by TheDudeOfGaming (6116 posts) -

@krullban said:

@thedudeofgaming said:

Is it okay for misanthropes to hate women?

What about Lycanthropes?

Yes. But only if the women in question are vampires, otherwise they'd be sexist lycanthropes.

#45 Posted by ripelivejam (5816 posts) -

should bioshock talk?

guys i really need an answer to this

#46 Edited by Gruebacca (652 posts) -

You just can't have a nice conversation about anything in the forums when there's big news out there screwing everything up.

#47 Posted by TheHT (12267 posts) -

should bioshock talk?

biochalks better as silent protagoainist.

#48 Posted by oldenglishC (1091 posts) -

Someone didn't pay attention in history class. Floating, steam-punk utopias in the early twentieth century were totally cool with women's rights.

Is the game good? It looks like it's fantastic.

(Also, gay racists would make a great Jerry Springer show.)

#49 Posted by MildMolasses (3189 posts) -

Someone didn't pay attention in history class. Floating, steam-punk utopias in the early twentieth century were totally cool with women's rights.

Is the game good? It looks like it's fantastic.

(Also, gay racists would make a great Jerry Springer show.)

There was the gay KKK bit that was on Chappelle's show

#50 Posted by AlexanderSheen (5148 posts) -