Remember Minerva's Den vs Shadow Broker?

@Humanity said:

Haha good luck there. We all know that when it comes to GOTY then Brad just removes his ears and common sense and is literally like a wall. When he was pushing Skyrim for GOTY he would not acknowledge ANY shortcomings even when they were technical nuances that hundreds of people had experienced, he flat out denied them. I'm just curious what will Brad champion this year. Also wondering who will defend Journey to hell and back - the easy answer is Patrick but I might be surprised.

No he didn't. He was acknowledging all of them and saying that the game deserved the award in spite of them since it was so good. Besides, the gang has even said in the official GotY video that the award did not apply to the PS3 version, which is where all of the severe problems were.

Except for him pushing Red Dead over Mass Effect 2 in 2010, Brad, to me, has always been the voice of reason when it came to award deliberations; not just for the GotY. Him siding with Minerva's Den over trigger-happy Shadow Broker is a good example of this. I honestly have no idea what game he's going to push for this year, but I am predicting that the major head-butting will not be between Jeff and Brad, but with Jeff and Patrick. Patrick has clearly hinted that he intends on pushing The Walking Dead while Jeff has clearly showed that he doesn't want any of it. I think he'll vouch for XCOM himself, so will Ryan. Now that I think about it, it's possible that Brad will push for Journey.

In any case, I don't want The Walking Dead to win the GotY award. People who are putting this game on the same level as old-school Sierra or Telltale games such as Monkey Island are insane. TWD is basically the Call of Duty of adventure games; it's a thrill-ride where the player doesn't do jack shit except push the stick in one direction with the occasional shitty QTE. XCOM is the clear 2012 GotY in my mind.

I'm even more excited for the GOTY discussions this year than in past years because I frankly have absolutely no idea what's going to win. Last year it was pretty clear that the only two games that had a chance at the top spot was Skyrim and SR3 (though those would not necessarily have been the only two I would've gone for), and I was fairly certain that Skyrim was going to take it.

This year though, there are many more games that could theoretically win; XCOM, Journey, The Walking dead and Far Cry 3 are feasible, plus a number of long-shots like Mark of the Ninja, Dust and Fez. I honestly have no idea which one of those top four will take it (though probably not Far Cry because of those "It's so close to being the game of the year!" comments). I personally wish Mass Effect 3 was part of the conversation (that's probably my game of the year, I even got the platinum trophy for it), but I understand and have learned to accept the crew's problems with it.

Also, I have a prediction: there will be more downloadable games than retail games in the top 10.

Brad's just unstoppable when he wants to do something, listening to the latest couple of podcasts this has become apparent, I don't care about spoilers for Mass Effect but after all this time him not wanting it to be spoiled and then as soon as he finished the game basically saying "I don't care if you care about spoilers now, I'm going to talk about it anyway" has really put me off him. Also going on about how shit Far Cry 3 is on the consoles compared to the pc has really soured me on his opinions, as it took Patrick to try and speak for a lot of people who only have consoles.  
 
/rant

I don't know why but one of my favorite moments was a couple of year ago when Brad got everyone to agree that Silent HIll: Shattered Memories should win best Wii game? They had to pause, let Brad talk about the games ending offf the record and when they got back they all seemed totally stunned and flabbergasted. I really thought that sense of supprise was a cool thing to happen in that podcast.

Anyone else remember that moment?

I'm going to find it amusing if Brad argues against FarCry 3 because the console versions were terrible(in his opinion, not mine). Cause of how he argued for Skyrim last year.

I think if he does that, he instantly loses most of his credibility.

@AuthenticM said:

@Humanity said:

Haha good luck there. We all know that when it comes to GOTY then Brad just removes his ears and common sense and is literally like a wall. When he was pushing Skyrim for GOTY he would not acknowledge ANY shortcomings even when they were technical nuances that hundreds of people had experienced, he flat out denied them. I'm just curious what will Brad champion this year. Also wondering who will defend Journey to hell and back - the easy answer is Patrick but I might be surprised.

No he didn't. He was acknowledging all of them and saying that the game deserved the award in spite of them since it was so good. Besides, the gang has even said in the official GotY video that the award did not apply to the PS3 version, which is where all of the severe problems were.

Except for him pushing Red Dead over Mass Effect 2 in 2010, Brad, to me, has always been the voice of reason when it came to award deliberations; not just for the GotY. Him siding with Minerva's Den over trigger-happy Shadow Broker is a good example of this. I honestly have no idea what game he's going to push for this year, but I am predicting that the major head-butting will not be between Jeff and Brad, but with Jeff and Patrick. Patrick has clearly hinted that he intends on pushing The Walking Dead while Jeff has clearly showed that he doesn't want any of it. I think he'll vouch for XCOM himself, so will Ryan. Now that I think about it, it's possible that Brad will push for Journey.

In any case, I don't want The Walking Dead to win the GotY award. People who are putting this game on the same level as old-school Sierra or Telltale games such as Monkey Island are insane. TWD is basically the Call of Duty of adventure games; it's a thrill-ride where the player doesn't do jack shit except push the stick in one direction with the occasional shitty QTE. XCOM is the clear 2012 GotY in my mind.

I agreed with him on Red Dead Redemption. I think you may be selling The Walking Dead a little short, but it is light on game and heavy on story compared to other GOTY candidates. Personally, I want to call The Walking Dead GOTY, but XCOM should probably get that title instead. It has far deeper game mechanics and is "more of a game" so to speak. I liked Journey, but it is even less of a game than The Walking Dead. ThatGameCompany's titles typically amount more to interactive experiences than straight up games, imo. Mark of the Ninja and Far Cry 3 should probably get mentions as well.

I think my biggest problem with GOTY this year is that there just isn't really any titles that I feel - at least not strongly - deserve GOTY. XCOM needed more story. The Walking Dead needed more gameplay. Far Cry 3 has a bad cast with a bland story (except Vaas, he's alright). Mass Effect 3, Assassin's Creed III, and Hitman: Absolution have been pretty disappointing or at least very divisive. There haven't been that many great games this year. And the best portable title I've played all year is a remake of Persona 4.

Brad spent all his energy early on that one and had no energy left for making a better case for Red Dead and Limbo.

Is still don't get why a game that only worked on 2/3rds of the platforms it was released on got GotY last year.

@Phatmac said:

I love these podcasts but the main thing for me is going to be the videos that they make. Last years GOTY vids were incredible. I want more of that stuff.

I want more The Making of videos like we got last year. That one was great.

Seeing all the names people throw around as Game of the Year candidates (Walking Dead, XCOM, Journey, Mark of the Ninja, Far Cry3, etc) makes me feel pretty good about 2012 in gaming. What a varied and weird mix of games that are on the running, I can appreciate that.

@AuthenticM said:

@Humanity said:

Haha good luck there. We all know that when it comes to GOTY then Brad just removes his ears and common sense and is literally like a wall. When he was pushing Skyrim for GOTY he would not acknowledge ANY shortcomings even when they were technical nuances that hundreds of people had experienced, he flat out denied them. I'm just curious what will Brad champion this year. Also wondering who will defend Journey to hell and back - the easy answer is Patrick but I might be surprised.

No he didn't. He was acknowledging all of them and saying that the game deserved the award in spite of them since it was so good. Besides, the gang has even said in the official GotY video that the award did not apply to the PS3 version, which is where all of the severe problems were.

Except for him pushing Red Dead over Mass Effect 2 in 2010, Brad, to me, has always been the voice of reason when it came to award deliberations; not just for the GotY. Him siding with Minerva's Den over trigger-happy Shadow Broker is a good example of this. I honestly have no idea what game he's going to push for this year, but I am predicting that the major head-butting will not be between Jeff and Brad, but with Jeff and Patrick. Patrick has clearly hinted that he intends on pushing The Walking Dead while Jeff has clearly showed that he doesn't want any of it. I think he'll vouch for XCOM himself, so will Ryan. Now that I think about it, it's possible that Brad will push for Journey.

In any case, I don't want The Walking Dead to win the GotY award. People who are putting this game on the same level as old-school Sierra or Telltale games such as Monkey Island are insane. TWD is basically the Call of Duty of adventure games; it's a thrill-ride where the player doesn't do jack shit except push the stick in one direction with the occasional shitty QTE. XCOM is the clear 2012 GotY in my mind.

The thing about XCOM is that it only has one thing going for it and that's gameplay. TWD is on the opposite end of the spectrum with story as its main focus. The difference is that TWD executes on its main focus like no other game has done before while XCOM runs out of steam on its gameplay about halfway through the game. I feel like the people praising XCOM as GOTY played a completely different game from me.

@sixpin: I agree with this assessment pretty much entirely.

This year's a fun one to discuss because of the relative parity amongst titles, but none of these games are "modern classic" good the way games in recent years have been.

@Dogma said:

I don't know why but one of my favorite moments was a couple of year ago when Brad got everyone to agree that Silent HIll: Shattered Memories should win best Wii game? They had to pause, let Brad talk about the games ending offf the record and when they got back they all seemed totally stunned and flabbergasted. I really thought that sense of supprise was a cool thing to happen in that podcast.

Anyone else remember that moment?

I remember it, but what I don't remember is if I had beaten the game before or after that discussion. The game has an amazing ending and it literally left me with my mouth open as I stared in disbelief. I can't think of any other game that had a twist ending that well crafted. All the story beats supporting the ending where in the game and I just didn't see them until I knew the truth.

Minerva's Den was better. Anyone who denied that was crazy. I didn't listen to them but plain and simple Minerva's Den was the best DLC ever released by someone other than Rockstar. It has the dubious honor of being significantly better than the game it was expanding. Lair of the Shadow Broker was good and all, but it was just nowhere near as good as Minerva's Den.

@dr_mantas said:

It's like going to see how a sausage is made - I might not like some bits of the process, and one of the Bomb Squad might act like a tosser at some point, but in the end it's better to know.

It's like going to see what a stripper does in the day time - I might not like some bits of their time, and one of their children might act like a tosser at some point, but in the end it's better to know,

Yeah I remember it and Shadow Broker is still better. I kinda hope they get into yet another long stupid argument this year since its just kind of what always happens and id find it far more boring if they just agreed or came to an agreement rather quickly.

@AuthenticM said:

@Humanity said:

Haha good luck there. We all know that when it comes to GOTY then Brad just removes his ears and common sense and is literally like a wall. When he was pushing Skyrim for GOTY he would not acknowledge ANY shortcomings even when they were technical nuances that hundreds of people had experienced, he flat out denied them. I'm just curious what will Brad champion this year. Also wondering who will defend Journey to hell and back - the easy answer is Patrick but I might be surprised.

No he didn't. He was acknowledging all of them and saying that the game deserved the award in spite of them since it was so good. Besides, the gang has even said in the official GotY video that the award did not apply to the PS3 version, which is where all of the severe problems were.

Except for him pushing Red Dead over Mass Effect 2 in 2010, Brad, to me, has always been the voice of reason when it came to award deliberations; not just for the GotY. Him siding with Minerva's Den over trigger-happy Shadow Broker is a good example of this. I honestly have no idea what game he's going to push for this year, but I am predicting that the major head-butting will not be between Jeff and Brad, but with Jeff and Patrick. Patrick has clearly hinted that he intends on pushing The Walking Dead while Jeff has clearly showed that he doesn't want any of it. I think he'll vouch for XCOM himself, so will Ryan. Now that I think about it, it's possible that Brad will push for Journey.

In any case, I don't want The Walking Dead to win the GotY award. People who are putting this game on the same level as old-school Sierra or Telltale games such as Monkey Island are insane. TWD is basically the Call of Duty of adventure games; it's a thrill-ride where the player doesn't do jack shit except push the stick in one direction with the occasional shitty QTE. XCOM is the clear 2012 GotY in my mind.

My issue with his arguments wasn't with ignoring the technical issues, cause I accepted "minus the PS3 version", it's that many of his arguments about the negatives of SR3 also applied to Skyrim, like "The core thing you are doing in this game is repetitive and boring". Really brad, shooting is repetitive and boring? The entirety of the combat in Skyrim for me, as a melee warrior, was holding down the "w" key and mashing the left mouse button to swing my sword.

And it's less about the specifics of his arguments than how he's literally won every argument he's chosen to take a stand on not by convincing the other party but by refusing to acknowledge anything they say until they give up and let him have his way. I love Brad until it comes to the GOTY discussions really.

Man, I need to play Minerva's Den. I actually really liked BioShock 2, and I own the DLC, but...stuff happens.

2012 has been such an interesting year for games, and I think the GOTY contenders will reflect that. An interesting note is that this may be the first time in the 5-year history of GB GOTY deliberations that Jeff and Vinny haven't been on the same side. Jeff is not going to go to bat for TWD, and I definitely get the feeling that Vinny is going to be the main one championing it. Remember that Vinny values narrative in games more than most, and he's actually played adventure games in 2012 that weren't TWD (at least one example being The Book of Unwritten Tales). This ends a four-year streak of Jeff and Vinny arguing against Brad and Ryan. Let's look at the history:

2008: Team JV for GTAIV, Team BR for MGS4, JV wins by split decision (definitely the closest battle yet; at one point Ryan was saying that Jeff and Vinny were starting to convince him that GTAIV should win...to which Jeff replied that Brad and Ryan were selling him on MGS4 as the winner)

2009: Team JV for Arkham Asylum, Team BR for Uncharted 2, BR wins by split decision (The biggest factor here is that Jeff wasn't as passionate about Arkham Asylum as anyone else was about their choice - Jeff was Modern Warfare 2 all along. This one was close to, but Uncharted 2 was sweeping the awards scene at the time, and maybe that helped tip the scales)

2010: Team JV for Mass Effect 2, and a split for Team BR as B backs RDR and R backs AC:B, JV wins by forfeit (This one wasn't even close; Jeff hated RDR, everyone loved ME3, and no matter how much Brad felt that RDR was better, he knew it was never going to go that way. Most lopsided GOTY by a wide margin)

2011: Team JV for Saints Row 3, and, amazingly, Team BR reunites and recruits P to back Skyrim, BRP wins by knockout (Oh yes, we all remember the dramatic twist. Of course a new factor was added this year with the addition of Patrick, and this was actually a case where Ryan and Patrick backing Skyrim created a numerical advantage for Team Skyrim. Ultimately, the conversation was over when Ryan backed Skryim right at the start - but that didn't prevent a long, brutal, and in many ways, even war of words between the two camps...with Drew and Alex on the sidelines championing Portal 2)

Aside from overall GOTY, one also has to wonder where Journey falls into the equation. If TWD wins GOTY, will the GB crew give a nod to Journey by picking it as best downloadable game? Conversely, if XCOM or Far Cry 3 wins, will there even be a discussion between Journey and TWD, or will they just hand it to TWD and move on? Will there even be a best downloadable category this year, considering how so many of the games that the crew has been enthusiastic about have been download only or download first?

I love how we all take this trivial and entirely subjective thing and take it really seriously. I'm definitely guilty of it, but it's all in good fun really. It's like predicting an election; it's exciting even if you don't necessarily have a dog in the fight (will TWD win Ohio? Will Governor Gerstmann and Senator Davis hand California to Far Cry 3? Will North Carolina swing to Journey or XCOM? Can Governer Klepek secure Illinois for Team TWD? Is New York as safe a TWD stronghold as predicted with Governor Caravella and Senator Navarro? And will less significant states like Maryland, and wherever Drew and Alexis are from, be a factor?)

@pornstorestiffi said:

I hope they won't drag it out like they have done previous, cause honestly is annoying to listen to. And for something as insignificant as a GOTY there is no reason why to do it in the first place.

Here's the thing though. These GotY podcasts aren't necessarily for the listener's enjoyment. All these podcasts are editors discussing who they should give their awards to. It just so happens that the GB guys record them having this discussion and then put it up for us to see how they got to that decision. When rants happen in regular podcasts, then I agree with you that they can get annoying from time to time, but these are special podcasts, and I feel that they should be held to a special standard.

@pornstorestiffi said:

I hope they won't drag it out like they have done previous, cause honestly is annoying to listen to. And for something as insignificant as a GOTY there is no reason why to do it in the first place.

I hear ya it can be grading but i like the knock out drag out filibuster discussions for the sole reason of the kid gloves are off. So often do they support each other on games they may not like to keep the peace and flow.

So we don't get the team true feelings on games often time so its nice to get that "Say what you really think" moment.I find it refreshing to hear them battle it out and call each other on the games they have fan boy out on and clear the air if you will.

I hope they won't drag it out like they have done previous, cause honestly is annoying to listen to. And for something as insignificant as a GOTY there is no reason why to do it in the first place.

@Humanity said:

Haha good luck there. We all know that when it comes to GOTY then Brad just removes his ears and common sense and is literally like a wall. When he was pushing Skyrim for GOTY he would not acknowledge ANY shortcomings even when they were technical nuances that hundreds of people had experienced, he flat out denied them. I'm just curious what will Brad champion this year. Also wondering who will defend Journey to hell and back - the easy answer is Patrick but I might be surprised.

Yes, Brad is notorious apologist for flaws in games he likes. All the same, his obstinence is part of the reason the goty podcasts are so hilarious.

@DystopiaX said:

@AuthenticM said:

@Humanity said:

Haha good luck there. We all know that when it comes to GOTY then Brad just removes his ears and common sense and is literally like a wall. When he was pushing Skyrim for GOTY he would not acknowledge ANY shortcomings even when they were technical nuances that hundreds of people had experienced, he flat out denied them. I'm just curious what will Brad champion this year. Also wondering who will defend Journey to hell and back - the easy answer is Patrick but I might be surprised.

No he didn't. He was acknowledging all of them and saying that the game deserved the award in spite of them since it was so good. Besides, the gang has even said in the official GotY video that the award did not apply to the PS3 version, which is where all of the severe problems were.

Except for him pushing Red Dead over Mass Effect 2 in 2010, Brad, to me, has always been the voice of reason when it came to award deliberations; not just for the GotY. Him siding with Minerva's Den over trigger-happy Shadow Broker is a good example of this. I honestly have no idea what game he's going to push for this year, but I am predicting that the major head-butting will not be between Jeff and Brad, but with Jeff and Patrick. Patrick has clearly hinted that he intends on pushing The Walking Dead while Jeff has clearly showed that he doesn't want any of it. I think he'll vouch for XCOM himself, so will Ryan. Now that I think about it, it's possible that Brad will push for Journey.

In any case, I don't want The Walking Dead to win the GotY award. People who are putting this game on the same level as old-school Sierra or Telltale games such as Monkey Island are insane. TWD is basically the Call of Duty of adventure games; it's a thrill-ride where the player doesn't do jack shit except push the stick in one direction with the occasional shitty QTE. XCOM is the clear 2012 GotY in my mind.

My issue with his arguments wasn't with ignoring the technical issues, cause I accepted "minus the PS3 version", it's that many of his arguments about the negatives of SR3 also applied to Skyrim, like "The core thing you are doing in this game is repetitive and boring". Really brad, shooting is repetitive and boring? The entirety of the combat in Skyrim for me, as a melee warrior, was holding down the "w" key and mashing the left mouse button to swing my sword.

And it's less about the specifics of his arguments than how he's literally won every argument he's chosen to take a stand on not by convincing the other party but by refusing to acknowledge anything they say until they give up and let him have his way. I love Brad until it comes to the GOTY discussions really.

Thats actually what I felt as well. It has been a while but what I meant was exactly this. Jeff would clearly give examples of how basically you go into a cave and the game throws a certain type of enemy at you depending on your class and thats all you ever see. In the end they are all JUST caves. Some of them turn left, some turn right, but apart from the few special instances for unique quests - they were all quite forgettable. Now I'm not saying Saints Row the Third should have won, despite having had a TON of fun in that game, but Brad was just stubbornly ignoring any criticism of Skyrim. Jeff would say one thing and Vinny would chime in with that pleading fatherly tone of "cmon Brad you gotta admit.." and Brad would just say "nope"

So in a way it is quite hilarious, and I don't place any weight in these awards because to this day Skyrim is a boring, dead game to me full of lifeless cardboard NPC's and throw away quests. I've beat it, the main storyline is somewhat pathetic for an RPG of such grand scale, and even though I love open ended RPG's I cold never get into Bethesda made games because they lack any sort of vibrance or life to me. All I see is the TES Construction set and a portal door here, an NPC there - not real people or real places. Hey thats just my opinion though and it winning the GiantBomb Game of the Year certainly did nothing to change it. It's just fun to listen to them bicker for a few hours.

@golguin: You're not alone about XCOM. I think it's an excellent game and all but when I got near the end I completely lost interest at one point. One downed UFO too many. One abduction site too many. Not sure what did it but it just felt too much of the same. Get my heavies out, position my snipers etc etc. I had a solid crew that I kept alive for almost the entire game. Tons of fun. Not enough variation with ship design and levels. Wouldn't it be cool if a downed UFO in Russia near Syberia would have a frozen over level with snow and tracks and limited visibility because of a snowstorm? Of if you landed in Morocco and your doods had short sleeve armor and there were sand dunes and whatnot? I make it a point to finish all games I start, mostly to know what happens in the end, but in the case of XCOM I don't know if I ever will because I just don't really care.

@Winternet: I actually credit the GB guys with making inroads as far as treating videogames seriously. I remember when I was listening to GotY 2008 and it had come down to MGS4 vs GTA4, a discussion that went on...around 2 hours, I think. My now-fiancee/then gf had come over and, despite not playing videogames in any major way, slowly became ENRAPTURED in the discussion and even felt she came away with a basic understanding of both games' fundamentals. Personally, I can't WAIT for this year's GotY as I stated in another thread, cause just HEARING about how this one's already gone, I think we're in for a treat. AND because for the last two years I've gotten it somehow into my head that it's going to be brief since the guys all seem to feel the same way about a lot of the major releases this year.

I'll never understand why people like to argue over things that can't really be compared in the first place

@Undeadpool said:

@Winternet: I actually credit the GB guys with making inroads as far as treating videogames seriously. I remember when I was listening to GotY 2008 and it had come down to MGS4 vs GTA4, a discussion that went on...around 2 hours, I think. My now-fiancee/then gf had come over and, despite not playing videogames in any major way, slowly became ENRAPTURED in the discussion and even felt she came away with a basic understanding of both games' fundamentals. Personally, I can't WAIT for this year's GotY as I stated in another thread, cause just HEARING about how this one's already gone, I think we're in for a treat. AND because for the last two years I've gotten it somehow into my head that it's going to be brief since the guys all seem to feel the same way about a lot of the major releases this year.

Yep. That's the best thing about these podcasts, is how they often tear down a came and get to the core of that particular experience and pit it against another. Sure, in the wittling process you get the shallow "nah, it just OK *cut*" but when you get to the top five things get really really interesting. I wish other places would lay down their deliberation process so candidly.

All the love for Minerva's Den seems so strange to me. It doesn't play any differently than the main game, it doesn't add anything meaningful, it's just a tiny Bioshock 2.

I get that some people loved the story, though I found the story in the main game far more interesting, but the praise seems really disproportionate to the quality of the DLC.

@TheHT said:

@Undeadpool said:

@Winternet: I actually credit the GB guys with making inroads as far as treating videogames seriously. I remember when I was listening to GotY 2008 and it had come down to MGS4 vs GTA4, a discussion that went on...around 2 hours, I think. My now-fiancee/then gf had come over and, despite not playing videogames in any major way, slowly became ENRAPTURED in the discussion and even felt she came away with a basic understanding of both games' fundamentals. Personally, I can't WAIT for this year's GotY as I stated in another thread, cause just HEARING about how this one's already gone, I think we're in for a treat. AND because for the last two years I've gotten it somehow into my head that it's going to be brief since the guys all seem to feel the same way about a lot of the major releases this year.

Yep. That's the best thing about these podcasts, is how they often tear down a came and get to the core of that particular experience and pit it against another. Sure, in the wittling process you get the shallow "nah, it just OK *cut*" but when you get to the top five things get really really interesting. I wish other places would lay down their deliberation process so candidly.

They almost HAVE to be, though, when you really get down to it. If they got too invested in the whittling process, they'd have no energy for the finalists AND the podcast would be 6 hours.

@thabigred said:

From the sounds of it Patrick was exhausted by the end of it. So I'm thinking The Walking Dead got torn apart by the end of it. XCOM probably won, which sure that game was great but it's the safest choice.

walking dead is the safest choice, don't be silly

@SSully said:

@Cold_Wolven said:

When an unstoppable force (Jeff) meets an immovable object (Brad) for GOTY discussions I swear The Walking Dead better not win the award. I really liked the game too but compared to other games that play a hell of a lot better all TWD has going for it is characters and story and that's not good enough in my eyes. Jeff will definitely make sure it won't even with Alex, Patrick and Brad who all are goo goo eyed for it.

What Walking Dead has done in terms of story telling in a video game makes it deserve at least a consideration for GOTY. Saying it plays worse then some games is kind of moot when very few, if any, games told a story as well as it. It's all a matter of give and take, and I can think of very few games this year that I would consider better then WD in terms of complete package. It should be a good discussion this year.

I would bet it'll be a showdown between XCOM and Walking Dead, pure gameplay against pure narrative. I think it'll be super interesting to hear both sides of the discussion, I can't even say for myself which one I think is gonna take it. Of course that theory might be moot if Far Cry is the other main contender.

@Winternet: I actually agreed with jeff on LA Noire, couldn't stand that game.

I actually like when the discussions get exhausted, I'll listens to days of that if I could.

@TheSouthernDandy: it's actually an interesting contrast to last year, where it was story (SR:TT, although less story and more setpieces) vs. mechanics (Skyrim); and story lost.

I'd just like to say that I love the back and forth but more importantly, LA Norie did not deserve a top 10 spot. That was the most disappointing game I've played in recent history. So terrible.

@Undeadpool said:

@TheHT said:

@Undeadpool said:

@Winternet: I actually credit the GB guys with making inroads as far as treating videogames seriously. I remember when I was listening to GotY 2008 and it had come down to MGS4 vs GTA4, a discussion that went on...around 2 hours, I think. My now-fiancee/then gf had come over and, despite not playing videogames in any major way, slowly became ENRAPTURED in the discussion and even felt she came away with a basic understanding of both games' fundamentals. Personally, I can't WAIT for this year's GotY as I stated in another thread, cause just HEARING about how this one's already gone, I think we're in for a treat. AND because for the last two years I've gotten it somehow into my head that it's going to be brief since the guys all seem to feel the same way about a lot of the major releases this year.

Yep. That's the best thing about these podcasts, is how they often tear down a came and get to the core of that particular experience and pit it against another. Sure, in the wittling process you get the shallow "nah, it just OK *cut*" but when you get to the top five things get really really interesting. I wish other places would lay down their deliberation process so candidly.

They almost HAVE to be, though, when you really get down to it. If they got too invested in the whittling process, they'd have no energy for the finalists AND the podcast would be 6 hours.

And even if they tried and forced it, the discussions probably wouldn't be of the quality you get when they argue about things they actually care about.

@Animasta: Yeah for sure. As much as I loved SR I think they ultimately made the right choice. If I had to guess for this year I would bet it'll come down to Ryan and Vinny. Patrick is probably gonna be on Walking Dead's side along with Brad and Jeff will be on the other. Ryan is such a wild card and I can't really remember which Vinny seemed to dig more. I could be completely off though. Personally if either of those games take it I'll be totally fine with that I think they both did some pretty amazing and completely different things.

@Winternet said:

Even more than last year's LA Noire almost missing the top 10 list.

If only you knew my pain of Dark Souls missing the top 10. I mean seriously what the fuck. Even if you don't like it you have to admit that it's absolutely a great game.

I have problems with letting things go.

@TheHT: That too.

People who think Brad alone steamrolled Skyrim to the GOTY need to go back and listen to last years deliberations. It was a 2.5-2 split in favor of Skyrim (I say .5 because Ryan's vote was pretty explicitly "SR3 should be #2" rather than "Skyrim should be #1"). Brad had numbers on his side, it was not 4 on 1.

@Animasta said:

@thabigred said:

From the sounds of it Patrick was exhausted by the end of it. So I'm thinking The Walking Dead got torn apart by the end of it. XCOM probably won, which sure that game was great but it's the safest choice.

walking dead is the safest choice, don't be silly

It really isn't, the game had bad technical issues. There have been many great game disqualified for this in the past that were frontrunners.

@thabigred said:

@Animasta said:

@thabigred said:

From the sounds of it Patrick was exhausted by the end of it. So I'm thinking The Walking Dead got torn apart by the end of it. XCOM probably won, which sure that game was great but it's the safest choice.

walking dead is the safest choice, don't be silly

It really isn't, the game had bad technical issues. There have been many great game disqualified for this in the past that were frontrunners.

As far as I know it was only the save game issue that occurred for TWD? Skyrim was not discounted for its bad technical issues and I feel TWD is up there that it equally wont with whatever problems it had.

I think it's going to be Ryan, Vinny, Patrick vs Jeff for Walking Dead and it will be ugly. Brad will be a bit torn I think.

Maybe X-Com will win because of Jeff's opposition and everyone else liked it a lot too.

We know Alex hinted at GOTY it being quite heated via a tweet.

@Sless said:

People who think Brad alone steamrolled Skyrim to the GOTY need to go back and listen to last years deliberations. It was a 2.5-2 split in favor of Skyrim (I say .5 because Ryan's vote was pretty explicitly "SR3 should be #2" rather than "Skyrim should be #1"). Brad had numbers on his side, it was not 4 on 1.

Yeah that's totally a fabrication. Annoying to read because it's as if Skyrim wasn't liked by the guys and it was all Brad. Brad just gets very vocal in the GOTY (in contrast to much of the Bombcasts where he is quiet).

@EvilKatarn said:

@Winternet said:

Even more than last year's LA Noire almost missing the top 10 list.

If only you knew my pain of Dark Souls missing the top 10. I mean seriously what the fuck. Even if you don't like it you have to admit that it's absolutely a great game.

I have problems with letting things go.

I do think it's very good but it wasn't quite for me. I have to say I find it quite amusing/annoying that Souls fans love their game niche and decry it trying to become accessible and then also whine when it's not up there for broad, industry wide awards (and not singling you out here or even saying you are doing this, just funny to see).

@Optix12 said:

@thabigred said:

@Animasta said:

@thabigred said:

From the sounds of it Patrick was exhausted by the end of it. So I'm thinking The Walking Dead got torn apart by the end of it. XCOM probably won, which sure that game was great but it's the safest choice.

walking dead is the safest choice, don't be silly

It really isn't, the game had bad technical issues. There have been many great game disqualified for this in the past that were frontrunners.

As far as I know it was only the save game issue that occurred for TWD? Skyrim was not discounted for its bad technical issues and I feel TWD is up there that it equally wont with whatever problems it had.

Skyrim didn't effect any of the duders so it was overlooked. Brad had the save game bug in TWD.

@BlatantNinja23: I actually think LA Noire is an underrated game and that got unfairly penalized for the stories that came out about the working conditions of Team Bondi and such. Their take on the setting, the atmosphere, the characters, the pace and the themes of LA Noire are, in my opinion, vastly more adult, mature and well-thought than pretty much any other game comparable to LA Noire. And I think that in some years from now, people will have a different look at it, maybe call it "a game ahead of its time".

@EvilKatarn said:

@Winternet said:

Even more than last year's LA Noire almost missing the top 10 list.

If only you knew my pain of Dark Souls missing the top 10. I mean seriously what the fuck. Even if you don't like it you have to admit that it's absolutely a great game.

I have problems with letting things go.

Dark Souls is way more understandable, because that's a game that only Vinny played. It doesn't matter how good a game is, if the duders did not play it, it can't really be a part of a top 10 list. LA Noire, on the other hand, everyone played and probably all finished it.

@Animasta said:

@TheSouthernDandy: it's actually an interesting contrast to last year, where it was story (SR:TT, although less story and more setpieces) vs. mechanics (Skyrim); and story lost.

Saint's row had story? HAR HAR HAR c'mon son. Saint's Row had crazy set pieces, ridiculous moments and great humor, it didn't have story, or whatever story it had was run of the mill and done better in many games within (and outside of) the open world sandbox genre.

I just hope the people backing TWD can come up with a better argument than "It had such a great story" because that is the most subjective shit ever. It's probably going to be a good 4 hour podcast again :)

@TheSouthernDandy said:

@SSully said:

@Cold_Wolven said:

When an unstoppable force (Jeff) meets an immovable object (Brad) for GOTY discussions I swear The Walking Dead better not win the award. I really liked the game too but compared to other games that play a hell of a lot better all TWD has going for it is characters and story and that's not good enough in my eyes. Jeff will definitely make sure it won't even with Alex, Patrick and Brad who all are goo goo eyed for it.

What Walking Dead has done in terms of story telling in a video game makes it deserve at least a consideration for GOTY. Saying it plays worse then some games is kind of moot when very few, if any, games told a story as well as it. It's all a matter of give and take, and I can think of very few games this year that I would consider better then WD in terms of complete package. It should be a good discussion this year.

I would bet it'll be a showdown between XCOM and Walking Dead, pure gameplay against pure narrative. I think it'll be super interesting to hear both sides of the discussion, I can't even say for myself which one I think is gonna take it. Of course that theory might be moot if Far Cry is the other main contender.

I'm with you, it's going to come down to XCOM vs. TWD for the top spot and I really like the fact that the argument comes down to the paradigm of mechanics vs. story. It's notable for how it will shape the final arguments that we're probably going to see a lot of other games in the Top 10 that are (almost) pure gameplay: FarCry 3, Hotline Miami, Mark of the Ninja, Forza Horizon, and Jeff will probably argue for Syndicate. I'm also curious to see if we'll see any mention of Diablo 3, which matters much more because of its gameplay than its story. I think Journey is really the game that married gameplay and narrative together the best this year. Though its gameplay wasn't challenging like a lot of the games I loved this year and the narrative wasn't as fleshed out as well as TWD's, the experience of playing Journey is so gratifying and it tells its story in a beautiful and affecting way. I don't necessarily think that Journey deserves GOTY over my personal pick, XCOM, but I hope that it gets some support from the dudes. If Journey doesn't do well, I'll have to wonder how it might have performed if it was released in October instead of March.

Anyhow, I don't know if the discussion is going to be as close as everyone thinks if it does actually come down to XCOM v. TWD. All signs point towards Jeff hating TWD, and Patrick said that XCOM was probably the best game he played all year just after the release of TWD Ep. 4. I can't say for sure how the battle lines are going to be drawn, but I think that it will begin with more people in TWD's camp but end with Jeff gradually convincing enough people to join his side.

Also, @Animasta, I'm not on the same page with you about this coming down along same lines as last year. I think Skyrim and SR:3 were both setpiece-focused but Skyrim brought exploration to the table and SR:3 dealt mostly in sheer craziness. Both had relatively weak mechanics and stories in the end.

The worst was absolutely Jeff and Red Dead Redemption.

@pornstorestiffi: the arguing is why i love the goty podcast

As brutal as it sounds, I am really looking forward to the discussions for the actual Game of the Year. There's not many other categories I can see a lot of arguing over, but that particular category...and to an extent, Downloadable Game category...should be fucking merciless. I think this is the one year where the guys latched onto some games that they weren't expecting, and in turn, there are at least four strong contenders that will lead to this gnarly bloodbath of debate: Journey, The Walking Dead, XCOM, and Far Cry 3.

Last year's discussions over Saints Row The Third and Skyrim almost tore me apart. I felt like I was having to choose sides so much because I felt that Saints Row The Third deserved it over Skyrim. Listening to that battle go on...to the point that Ryan straight up walked out of the room... You could tell just how hard it was hitting them. I did find it somewhat odd, however, that Jeff backed Saints Row The Third SOOOO HARD when in 2008 after talking about GTA IV, he said (paraphrased):

When I finished that game, I sat down and I had to really think about it for a while, "what did I really take away from that?" It was that I'm kinda done with the big open world sandbox kind of thing. GTA was very focused and, yeah, you could go out there and wreck cars and kill cops and do all of the same kind of dumb stuff that you could before, but that stuff just felt meaningless because there was so much power to the storyline and the missions that all of that stuff just felt like child's play. That was the significant change and that has changed my view of the genre. I like what Saints Row 2 did by being all crazy and over the top...but that's not what I'm looking for in these games anymore.

It's just interesting to see him back something he basically said he was over. It almost makes me wonder if the general idea of Giant Bomb being a kind of over-the-top website that likes some good dumb fun helped lead him back to that stuff. I also wonder what his opinions at this point are on GTA IV.

Jeff mentioned that next year might have some changes to stuff. Curious about all that stuff and if it gets outlined within the GOTY podcasts.

The only thing I remember from years past is Ryan's heel turn on Saints Row, and Jeff dismissing Minerva's Den by guessing the exact plot and twist without having played it.