#1 Posted by edgework (73 posts) -

If you're a chat regular you know that things with chat haven't been so stable. We're sorry about sucking so hard at building a chat server that works. After last Friday's meltdown we took a long and deep look at the chat cluster and identified many of the problems. The TL/DR version of that is that support for Internet Exploder versions < 11, other fringe browsers and mobile browsers was causing a whole lot of server thrashing and making things hard for everyone else. If you want a more technical reason its that these old browsers either don't support websockets or would prefer not to and fall back to XHR Polling which adds a whole lot of work for the servers.

Because of this, for the time being we are reluctantly dropping support for browsers other than Chrome, Safari, Firefox and IE11. We are also dropping support for mobile devices. Our load testing and this mornings livestream show that doing so makes a huge impact for the better on performance.

We will run some tests this week with alternatives for IE < 11 and mobile. If in those tests we find solutions we'll apply them and bring back support but in the meantime, please upgrade your browser if you can.

Staff
#2 Posted by mrpibb (460 posts) -

just to follow up on edgework's post, we aren't completely dropping the support and based on talks with him, we may them back in the fold before UPF (just want to make sure that everything is working first through websockets).

Staff
#3 Posted by Chaser324 (6325 posts) -

Internet Explorer: forever the bane of web developers.

Moderator
#4 Edited by Frobitz (176 posts) -

Disappointing that you've dropped mobile support, as I was under the impression Mobile Safari supported websockets. Was there some quirk in the implementation that led to this decision?

#5 Edited by mrpibb (460 posts) -

@frobitz: if the mobile browser supports websockets you should be ok. A lot of mobile browsers don't do it by default, and like I stated we'll put long polling back in hopefully later on this week.

Staff
#6 Posted by Frobitz (176 posts) -

@mrpibb: Yeah definitely not working, and I'm on latest iOS version so should be covered if you guys are using feature detection to decide whether chat is enabled?

http://caniuse.com/#feat=websockets

#7 Posted by mattjam3000 (434 posts) -

Sadly non twitch live streams dont work at all on my Google Nexus 7 tablet. I find this especially stupid as google own youtube. Youd think theyd be able to play their own live streamer in their own damn tablet but no, thanks google.

#8 Posted by guanophobic (260 posts) -

@chaser324: legacy support of it atleast, it's really not that bad anymore

#9 Edited by Chaser324 (6325 posts) -

@guanophobic said:

@chaser324: legacy support of it atleast, it's really not that bad anymore

Yeah, IE10+ has gotten a lot better, but IE8 or earlier can be a bit of a pain if you for whatever reason have to support them.

Moderator
#10 Posted by Demoskinos (14562 posts) -

Shit, so no more Netscape Navigator? DAMN IT.

#11 Posted by edgework (73 posts) -

Update:

OK, for Patrick's Tuesday morning show IE9 and 10 will be allowed as will mobile browsers. Fringe browsers are still denied (sorry Scandinavian duders who use Opera). Android has known problems but IOS should work. I made some changes that will attempt to get these browsers into chat without thrashing the servers.

There will be another Vinnyvania (not sure when) when we'll test this too.

I'll be looking at the server stats during the shows to see if this can be permanent. Fingers crossed.

Staff
#12 Posted by budgietheii (155 posts) -

Hmmm, despite what it says here and on the live streams, IE11 (both full fat and Modern) is not giving any chat and instead pops up the apology.

#13 Edited by Bollard (5255 posts) -

@edgework: I have no idea what version of IE runs on the Windows Surface (under Windows 8 RT), but I can try and find out more info for ya if you could let me know if there is any chance of the new live stream player ever working on it? Still a bummer to not be able to watch any Live stuff in bed.

#14 Edited by cdon (17 posts) -

@budgietheii:

I'm in the same boat. Running IE11 in Win 8.1 on my desktop, but getting the Sorry! message.

#15 Posted by Frobitz (176 posts) -

Working ok for me on iPad, if a bit variable in video quality. I was streaming it to my TV via AirPlay though, so y'know, Future World Problems

#16 Posted by edgework (73 posts) -

@bollard said:

@edgework: I have no idea what version of IE runs on the Windows Surface (under Windows 8 RT), but I can try and find out more info for ya if you could let me know if there is any chance of the new live stream player ever working on it? Still a bummer to not be able to watch any Live stuff in bed.

I'm going to bet its a version that doesn't play well with websockets. You should be ok though for the next chat. The numbers from the Elder Scrolls chat were promising.

Staff
#17 Posted by edgework (73 posts) -

@cdon said:

@budgietheii:

I'm in the same boat. Running IE11 in Win 8.1 on my desktop, but getting the Sorry! message.

Did you try clearing your cache? We did have IE11 users in the chat today.

Staff
#18 Posted by budgietheii (155 posts) -

Always forget that. Will do so for next live stream then update back here.

#19 Posted by Bollard (5255 posts) -

@edgework: It appears to be some version of IE11. I can give the exact version number if you want.

Just to clarify, if I'm using an unsupported browser then will the video player also not work? I can understand getting the chat not available message but I didn't realise the player would be a no go too.

#20 Posted by edgework (73 posts) -

@bollard said:

@edgework: It appears to be some version of IE11. I can give the exact version number if you want.

Just to clarify, if I'm using an unsupported browser then will the video player also not work? I can understand getting the chat not available message but I didn't realise the player would be a no go too.

The player should work but it may be running into the same issue we have with Android. I'm not involved with the player so I don't know too much about what's going on there. @mrpibb?

Staff
#21 Posted by mrpibb (460 posts) -

@bollard: the player should work on surface, let me dig one up and we can test it.

Staff
#22 Posted by Bollard (5255 posts) -

@mrpibb said:

@bollard: the player should work on surface, let me dig one up and we can test it.

Oh nice to hear you have one to test on! Is that a Surface Pro or RT? And of course, thanks a bunch.

#23 Posted by edgework (73 posts) -

@bollard:

I talked with the video engineers today. We don't properly support Surface RT or Android for most videos. Its a wider issue that's kind of out of our hands. People are working on it. Sorry...

Staff
#24 Posted by Bollard (5255 posts) -

@edgework: No worries, kind of expected to be honest. Was just a shame since when it was through Twitch it was fine. Thank you though for going to the effort of finding that out for me, its appreciated.

#25 Posted by bdhurkett (49 posts) -

Trying to watch the 'PAX East Live Coverage' just now, I'm getting the 'Sorry!' message on IE11. However, changing the user agent string to IE10 gets the chat to show up fine (and work). And then changing it back to IE11 breaks it again, so I don't think caching is the issue (Private Browsing window also fails). For completeness, IE9 user agent also allows the chat.

My default user agent, which isn't accepted: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; Trident/7.0; rv:11.0) like Gecko

The IE10 user agent that works: Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; MSIE 10.0; Windows NT 6.2; Trident/6.0)

#26 Posted by Frobitz (176 posts) -

I don't think the live video is working in iOS again - I guess I'll see the PAX content when it eventually hits the site as Twitch archives don't work either unless they've switched their tech recently :-/

Have to admit I'm glad I don't work with video over the web, it sounds like its a bit of a nightmare!