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Edited by Grissefar

first

Wow thanks for the heads up, Brad. Not that there was need of one for this game. Ha ! Ha ! It is funny though that it is not even the best version, given the fact that the original doesn't exactly shine.

Edited by ttocs

@Grissefar: Ugh, don't do the whole first thing. Just make a comment and leave it at that. Especially when 7 minutes pass between the first comment and the second.

Edited by fisk0

Them removing the original games from the Steam store was expected and sad, I wonder how anybody thought it would be a good idea to take away some of the core mechanics of the game, as well as the mod support and graphics options.

What's happening with Id? They don't have the excuse some other studios can get away with - that none of the original members of the studio are left - aren't all the big names sans Romero still there? And he left well before Doom 3 originally shipped.

On the shadows/flashlight thing - monsters still cast shadows, it's just the environment that doesn't.

Oh, and by the way, doesn't it look like the BFG edition lacks bump/normal maps, or has much less detailed such than the original?

Posted by kennybaese

I keep going back and forth on whether or not to pick this up. I loved playing Doom 3 when it first came out, and I don't think that the flashlight thing will bug me much, but I don't have a PC that can run games. So, this is my only option for a console version of the game (unless I hunt down an XBox copy of the original game, I guess). All in all, I think I'll wait until the price drops a couple bucks and pick it up then.

Posted by CakeBomb

Veteran is not the hardest difficulty, it is the hardest civilized difficulty, for Nightmare is a gimmick that plagues many modern games unfortunately. 
 
I'm assuming you played on Veteran, as seen in the QL.

Posted by bkbroiler

The shadows are the coolest part of the game! What are they doing getting rid of them?

Posted by super2j

so i guess i better go find and buy all the copies of the original doom 3 for when the resurgence happens

Posted by charlie_victor_bravo

Flashlight thing could have been used were effectively for achievement. "I did not see the Aliens", 30 points - go trough the main game with "Classic flashlight" -option turned on.

Edited by Solh0und

So i should just play the vanilla version of Doom 3 then?

Posted by Grissefar

@ttocs said:

@Grissefar: Ugh, don't do the whole first thing. Just make a comment and leave it at that. Especially when 7 minutes pass between the first comment and the second.

Said second.

Posted by blastershift

PC no dosbox for doom 1 or 2

Menu system, plus achievements.

Most of the mods for Doom 3 aren't all that great anyways.

I am more than happy to buy it.

Posted by MooseyMcMan

While I haven't actually played Doom 3, I have to say that Dead Space 2 probably has better creepy colored lighting. Or at least better colored lighting.

Otherwise, it's disappointing that this version isn't so great.

Posted by Suigyoken

Wait they removed the original version of Doom3? Well at least you still can get a used copy off Amazon...

Posted by fox01313

Weird that they took just Doom3 off of steam somewhat, looks like you might still get it in the id superpack but not individually (like games in the Geneforge saga). Still don't understand why this is such a rather lackluster collection of such a landmark series in games.

Posted by TheCreamFilling

I am very disappointed by the fact the flashlight doesn't produce shadows, it makes everything look sterile rather than scary. I suppose the only upside to that is the 60 frames are cool.

Posted by MrFixIt

Was there nothing better to do then review Doom 3? No other games, I was just surprised to see this game get a review.

Posted by august

Removing dynamic lighting when that was the whole point of the original is kinda insane.

Posted by august

@fisk0 said:

What's happening with Id? They don't have the excuse some other studios can get away with - that none of the original members of the studio are left - aren't all the big names sans Romero still there? And he left well before Doom 3 originally shipped.

The only person left as far as I know is Carmack and he doesn't really play games and is only interested in building new engines.

Posted by iAmJohn

Brad, I'm going to venture a guess and say that there are far more than two types of people in this world, just saying. (Sorry, I really hate that rhetorical device. :P)

Great review. Disappointing to hear that this didn't live up to its full potential.

Posted by JoeyRavn

The PC port is pretty bad... Not on a technical level, really, but on the... I don't know. Common sense level. No mods (for the moment), no resolution configuration for the original Doom and Doom II, no subtitles... Piss poor job.

Posted by FuzzYLemoN

Unfortunate design choices, but this whole re-hype has gotten me to go back and play some original-ass Doom 3.

Posted by WarlordPayne

Letting you use the flashlight and guns at the same time ruins Doom 3. It's pretty sad that even the developers didn't get what made that game great.

Edited by punkxblaze

@blastershift said:

PC no dosbox for doom 1 or 2

Menu system, plus achievements.

Most of the mods for Doom 3 aren't all that great anyways.

I am more than happy to buy it.

On the contrary, there are countless excellent Doom 3 mods, especially ones that make it look significantly better than the BFG Edition. Also, sourceports for Doom 1 and 2 are far superior to the versions offered in Big Fuckin Gun Edition.

I would recommend Vanilla Doom 3 and Doom 1/2 on GZDoom or Skulltag long before I would recommend Doom 3 BFG Edition. Of course, the difficulty in finding Doom 3 now that it appears to have been pulled from Steam's store makes the BFG edition the only option for some people, which I doubt is a coincidence.

Posted by Rotnac

Good review. This release was a total disappointment across the board. I should have just bought Dishonored instead but now I'm stuck with BFG unless I wanna get ripped off and get a $14 dollar trade-in credit at EBGames.

Posted by ShuaReborn

I picked this up last week, and as someone who never really played Doom, I'm loving it. (Still playing through the first one.) I have to say though I have seen Doom 3 back in the day and lakc of shadows is a bummer, but I did get it to play in 3D. I hope that part rocks.

Posted by fisk0

@punkxblaze said:

@blastershift said:

PC no dosbox for doom 1 or 2

Menu system, plus achievements.

Most of the mods for Doom 3 aren't all that great anyways.

I am more than happy to buy it.

On the contrary, there are countless excellent Doom 3 mods, especially ones that make it look significantly better than the BFG Edition. Also, sourceports for Doom 1 and 2 are far superior to the versions offered in Big Fuckin Gun Edition.

I would recommend Vanilla Doom 3 and Doom 1/2 on GZDoom or Skulltag long before I would recommend Doom 3 BFG Edition. Of course, the difficulty in finding Doom 3 now that it appears to have been pulled from Steam's store makes the BFG edition the only option for some people, which I doubt is a coincidence.

God damnit. THAT'S what the BFG edition should've looked like.

Posted by civid

@ShuaReborn said:

I picked this up last week, and as someone who never really played Doom, I'm loving it. (Still playing through the first one.) I have to say though I have seen Doom 3 back in the day and lakc of shadows is a bummer, but I did get it to play in 3D. I hope that part rocks.

Same situation here. I completely understand Brad's problems with the game, but for someone who have never touched the Doom-series I'm kinda glad they released this, because I don't think I would have ever picked these games up if it weren't for the BFG edition.

Posted by august

@punkxblaze said:

I would recommend Vanilla Doom 3 and Doom 1/2 on GZDoom or Skulltag long before I would recommend Doom 3 BFG Edition.

FYI Skulltag is dead, Zandronum is the continuation of the project.

Posted by hanktherapper

I am a big fan of Doom 3. It has the best atmosphere of any game I've ever played. I almost picked this up until I watched the QL.

Posted by punkxblaze

@august said:

@punkxblaze said:

I would recommend Vanilla Doom 3 and Doom 1/2 on GZDoom or Skulltag long before I would recommend Doom 3 BFG Edition.

FYI Skulltag is dead, Zandronum is the continuation of the project.

Huh. Thanks for the heads up, I haven't touched Skull in a while, so I'm out of that loop.

Posted by Xealot42

I'm glad I picked up the Doom Pack during the Quake Con sale on Steam after seeing the lukewarm reception to this version.

Posted by OriginalGman

What about someone who never played Doom 3? Someone who enjoyed the Doom games up until Final Doom, but didn't have an Xbox or a good gaming PC when the Doom 3 hype was white-hot, and never got around to playing it because hell, who remembered that Doom 3 even existed until now?

Should I pick this up when it inevitably goes for $10 in a Steam sale? Or should I just take the shrink-wrap off that copy of Rage I bought when it went bargain bin and play that?

Posted by MrKlorox

Does it at least run in 60 FPS in 3D?

Posted by ToxicCurve

I'm pretty sure I saw Doom 3 for sale on steam by it's self for $14.99, but I think they killed it when BFG came out.

Posted by M_Shini

I think ill wait till someone makes a mod to remove the flashlight, wont be too long a wait im sure.

Posted by sofakingcool

I'd like a quick look of this

Posted by csl316

"No flashlight, no shadows, no sale." Sorry, but I've found the GB coverage of this to be extremely nitpicky. I can take or leave the shadows (and yes, I own the original version), but the flashlight thing... The reason they changed it is because of how much shit they've gotten for years and years. And now all of a sudden the flashlight mechanic is essential to the game's mood. This game just can't win. "Even in hell I get no respect."

Anyway, I've been having plenty of fun on the 360 and found it a worthwhile upgrade if you've only played the Xbox version (though the PC mods have made the original look absolutely fantastic). The whole health/ammo management mechanic builds a tension that modern games lack, and the thick atmosphere keeps you on your toes throughout. Good times.

Posted by wewantsthering

@MrKlorox said:

Does it at least run in 60 FPS in 3D?

Did you at least read the review where he specifically talks about this?...

Posted by tourgen

the lighting downgrade is a real bummer

Posted by evil_gordita

The process of using the stencil buffer to create shadows was called the 'Depth Fail' technique, or 'Carmack's Reverse.' Apparently, it was previously patented by a group of people at Creative Labs and even though he had come up with the idea independently, id software was sent a Cease and Desist letter. Creative was kind enough to allow him to use it as long as he included support for EAX in Doom 3.

I remember hearing him talking about the BFG port of Doom 3 at this year's QuakeCon keynote (I saw the three hour recording on YouTube), but I don't quite remember what he had to say about it. I'm under the impression that Doom 3's dynamic shadows were removed more for legal reasons than technical.

Edited by Rongaryen

I got the impression that the Doom3 isn't a port of the PC version but the original Xbox version. Is there anyone that can confirm this?

Posted by CaguamatorFK

The fact that the original Doom 3 for Pc is no longer available as a stand alone product on Steam is really messed up.

Posted by csl316

@sofakingcool said:

I'd like a quick look of this

Here ya go.

Posted by AsKo25

I've never played Doom 3, but I've been playing the BFG edition on PC and I'm really enjoying it. I don't think the flashlight being used with the gun is that big a game-changer; the original system seemed like it'd just be tedious after a while, and furthermore I haven't really needed the light much on Marine difficulty. I pretty much turn it on if the room goes completely black or if there are items somewhere, which you don't really need your gun out for anyway.

To everyone who's on the fence and has yet to play Doom 3, I'd check the game out. It's certainly not worth it if you've already played it and the expansion, because as previously stated this is not the optimal version of the game. Graphics options are not nonexistant, but they are very limited; it's only resolution, vsync, framerate, and motion blur toggles. Plus, the mods are all better with the original version. However, this is a great release for console gamers, though I would recommend getting it at a reduced price.

Posted by SpudBug

I bought it to support the series, was super disappointed to see how bright the game is, and how much easier they made it. Also not having shadows from the flashlight on pc is bizarre.

Installed sikkmod and a few other mods and am blown away by the vanilla doom 3.

Posted by mlarrabee

I bought the id pack a couple of years ago, so I guess it's time to go dig out my copies of Doom 3 and Resurrection of Evil for the original Xbox...

Posted by bigstrat2003

@csl316 said:

"No flashlight, no shadows, no sale." Sorry, but I've found the GB coverage of this to be extremely nitpicky. I can take or leave the shadows (and yes, I own the original version), but the flashlight thing... The reason they changed it is because of how much shit they've gotten for years and years. And now all of a sudden the flashlight mechanic is essential to the game's mood. This game just can't win. "Even in hell I get no respect."

There are people (me, for instance) who have been saying that the flashlight limitations added to Doom 3 literally since it came out. So why shouldn't we be disappointed? And come on, it's not like it would've been that hard to make it an option.

Posted by zombie2011

I built my first and last gaming PC back in the day specifically for Doom 3, so i had to convince myself that i really liked the game. Looking back now i'm soo pissed i wasted money building a PC for this game, when i could have waited a year to play it on my Xbox.

Posted by csl316
@bigstrat2003

@csl316 said:

"No flashlight, no shadows, no sale." Sorry, but I've found the GB coverage of this to be extremely nitpicky. I can take or leave the shadows (and yes, I own the original version), but the flashlight thing... The reason they changed it is because of how much shit they've gotten for years and years. And now all of a sudden the flashlight mechanic is essential to the game's mood. This game just can't win. "Even in hell I get no respect."

There are people (me, for instance) who have been saying that the flashlight limitations added to Doom 3 literally since it came out. So why shouldn't we be disappointed? And come on, it's not like it would've been that hard to make it an option.

I thought it made things more terrifying, it has its place. An option would've been nice. But Brad's Quick Look focused so much on shadows and a flashlight that it seemed to make the game worse than it is. It seems like his preference makes him write off this release when it's a pretty decent package. Especially for newcomers.
Posted by vinsanityv22

I will stay play this.

Thanks for the heads up though, Brad. It is baffling that they didn't include the "normal" Flashlight mode as an option. And the options in particular - what the heck is it with id that they're glossing that stuff over so badly lately? I am no PC gamer, and everything I DO have on Steam I can play with my 360 controller, but id is (was?) PC Royalty. Why not put 110% into those options?

Very weird. But Doom 3 is Doom 3. And, since I game on PS3, I don't have access to Doom 1 and Doom 2 otherwise - and I enjoy going back and playing old school shooters like that (I remember when the genre was called, "Doom Clone"). Also never played Resurrection of Evil.

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