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Edited by falserelic

I've been playing Defiance lately.

It's a repetitive MMO, but I do enjoy it. I like grinding through the game and playing with other people. Even though it has issues there's something addicting about it. For 10 bucks on psn you get a bang for your buck.

Posted by wemibelec90

I think repetition was the reason I played MMOs. Something about mindlessly completing quests and grinding was appealing to me. It still can be, but now the world has to intrigue me in some way (such as in The Secret World) for me to give it a shot.

Edited by Omnomnivore

@falserelic: It's not a bad game, by any stretch. However, after a while I think the jankiness just feels too apparent.

Posted by falserelic

@ccfox said:

@falserelic: It's not a bad game, by any stretch. However, after a while I think the jankiness just feels too apparent.

It does overtime, but I can looked past it. Shooting stuff up while looting, and working with other people is alot of fun. Some of the small things makes the game abit more enjoyable such as..

-No fall damage

-Can spawn your car anywhere

-No invisible walls (For most part)

- Having other players help you while doing an objective.

- Making up different ways to use your tactics.

On top of that there's always something to do in the game. Unlike borderlands 2 (Which I found boring) I'm actually enjoying my time with the game. Then again I only paid 10 bucks for it on psn.

Posted by TruthTellah

I'm a little surprised you didn't mention Animal Crossing in all of this, as it illustrates well how seemingly repetitive tasks over an extended period of time can actually feel rewarding and sometimes even comforting in many ways. That flow between long periods of needing little focus while still having progression and shorter moments of greater focus with high progression is an aid to many genres, and in a game intent on long-term investment, it's near essential.

While I do believe that MMORPGs have to continue to strive for improving their content, I can appreciate the continued existence of repetitive tasks within a game that just feels like another part of your life with its own ups and downs in excitement and personal investment.

Posted by Humanity

While Warframe isn't an MMORPG and is a Free to Play it does suffer a lot from grinding that overshadows the many positive aspects of that game. Since it uses a F2P model, literally everything is a grind - some are positive but many aren't. For instance using any of your equipment levels it up, allowing you to stack more modifications on it that increase damage and add elemental effects like fire or shock. That is a good kind of grind, because you are constantly progressing your weapons and characters from simply playing the game. The bad kind of grind comes from the crafting system which relies entirely on random resource drops. To create a single "Warframe" which is the space suit you wear with 4 unique abilities, you will have to attain a blueprint for the specific Warframe followed by a helmet, chassis and systems part blueprint - and they all have to be crafted individually and use quite a few resources each. To get these resources you have to visit different missions in different sectors which have their own specific resource drops - but you can sometimes do 10 missions in a row without ever getting that one resource you need, leading to hours of grinding without any reasonable indication of how long it will even take before you finally get 600 of whatever you need.

Posted by Gamer_152

@falserelic: I can see what they were going for with Defiance, but the game doesn't look incredibly appealing to me. Maybe I'll try it out some day.

@truthtellah: There were a lot of games I could have mentioned, but Animal Crossing didn't seem that relevant as I was largely talking about MMOs here, and what you're describing isn't just to do with grinding. That'd be something for a whole other blog.

@humanity: I've played a little of Warframe already and wasn't blown away by it. Sad to hear it goes down such a crappy route with its repetitive gameplay.

Thanks everyone for the comments.

Posted by deivid_okop

I play Lord of the Rings Online, and yeah, quite a few times it fells soooo shallow :'(

"Cool! You collected 10 broken swords from the orcs! Now I need 15 wolf hides"

What breaks that boredom is that LOTRO has got sooo many different systems that you can give up one to do the other, then come back. Questing, Skirmishes, Instances, Crafting, Legendary items. Works for quite awhile really :)


Agree on many points. I've always thought that basic movement is most important thing to a 3D character game, and mmo's aren't an exception. Wouldn't it be amazing if elves or whatever ran through the woods like Connor from AC3 while still engaging in tactical combat? To me the basic principle of mmo combat is that, at some level, every move should count. If new mmos can significantly boost the basic movement mechanics (and better yet, class-diversify them for replayability & strategic value) and make combat decisions more meaningful (fewer enemies, more interesting encounters vs. hundreds of the same enemies) rather than plentiful then I will rejoin the fold.

I also played Warframe for a long time recently, and while it was generally super awesome and fun that's just not the kind of game I can play for hours upon hours. I can't do constant balls to the wall(s?) action for 150 hours and while I believe it is fair to pay for expansions etc, I don't think the way WF is doing it is right.

Posted by bgdiner

Great piece. I've always had trouble getting into MMOs, even when I was really interested in the source material. I've played WoW three times over seven years, and could never really get into that "MMO high". I really wanted to like SWTOR, as I did with Galaxies for a time, but I just couldn't get over the mechanics. Add in subscription and expansion fees, and you've got a definite challenge ahead of you if you're an MMO developer.

Posted by tourgen

Good article, and some good points. I agree that grinding can be fine given the right game and group of friends.

My biggest problem with MMOs these days is that they aren't even MMOs. They are ~8 player instanced encounters with a lobby system. Hell, I've seen at least one subscription "MMO" use P2P for the instanced dungeons reducing server costs to almost nothing. Yeah. Pretty easy to abuse with client-side hacks too.

And they just aren't as raw as they were in the beginning. Very little to no real death penalties, worlds that feel like a cheap plastic Disneyland with lines for the rides, even gating off world monster encounters to prevent kill stealing & dropping loot for everyone that's player-locked.

No inter-party debates about loot drops, no real reasons to have meaningful interactions with players in the world. Everything is tagged and surrounded by safety nets that sparkle and direct you back to the proper path. Everything is just so safe and mundane. A game world clutched in the iron fist of uptight, fun-hating, D&D nerds and assholes in suits.

I liked the fear of losing EVERYTHING to corpse decay. I liked grinding and gearing up with friends enough to pass the loot-check encounters in some remote dungeon or area. Even USA v. Europe boss spawn camping and raid ganking could be a good time. I like a system that allows for individual expression, skill & tactics combos that feel like borderline exploits, economic backstabbery, and most of all the fear of real failure.

Eve might be the only one left out there doing anything interesting.

I believe there is a massive gaping hole that could be filled by a new, dangerous, and awesome MMORPG. I'd prefer a sci-fi setting with some surrealistic aspects. Someone could get insanely rich. I don't think MMOs are dead, I just think we haven't seen a real MMO in years.

Posted by Chaser324

Finally I've got an explanation for why you've been playing so much APB recently.

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Posted by MrCaptain


have you tried day-z? I haven't, but it seems to be somewhat what you are looking for.