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Posted by s10129107

what on earth can they possibly say in ten pages about a super mario game.?

Posted by vhold

When I was a kid I would have eaten something like that up, because I couldn't afford the games, so I'd live vicariously through the magazines.. Yea.. that's pretty sad, but that's how it was.

Posted by BadNews

10 pages? That must be some huge font. Does the nintendo fan base even have that kind of attention span? I know I don't.

Edited by jakob187
@Jeff: Hey, Jeff.  I'm happy for you and all, and I'ma let you finish... 
 
...but The Official Nintendo Magazine has the greatest Super Mario Galaxy 2 review of all time!!! 
 
T_T  Good write-up, man.  Sorry that Giant Bomb has now been deemed unworthy of giving a decent review of SMG2.  Maybe you could start up www.jeffshowsyouhowtotastewine.com?
Posted by RJPelonia

So... I'm assuming they liked the game?

Posted by chilipeppersman
@Anathem said:
" Reminds me of the time that that one site ran a whole BUNCH of advertising for a game and some reviewer gave it 6 out of 10...   Keep fighting the good fight, Jeff. "
straight up
Posted by StillVictor

You should know this, Jeff Gerstman. Giantbomb reviews will only matter if you write 10 pages AND if you let everyone know in advance about them in a FANTASTIC PRESS RELEASE. More press releases please.

Posted by FreakAche

FINALY PROOVEN ONCE ND 4 ALL THAT GISNT BOMB IS BIAS AGAINST NINTENDO!
 
Seriously though, this is pretty awesome.

Posted by Junpei

wow, can't imagine them ever giving anything Mario related a review below an 8/10

Posted by xionpunk

Mario pays our bills, Mario is amazing.

Posted by SeriouslyNow

C'mon Jeff, be fair.  It's an 'official' publication and this kind of PR bullshit has been going on for ages.  Yes, it's overhyped and yes it's annoying but the industry needs PR just as much as peer review.

Edited by Al3xand3r

Before you judge others, improve your own work, please. Bias goes both ways, not only the positive side, and judging colleagues in this manner is pretty poor form and sounds like a desperate attempt to go all "look at me, I'm objective, they are not" similar to the whole GameSpot fiasco which you offer no details on yet are happy to let people think it happened one way or another to promote your new work (as if that would have been the very first and only instance you were asked to change a score in your long history there, if it really happened at all). Let the audience be the judge of who is or isn't objective and do your job, which is games coverage and criticism, not competitor/magazine criticism. That you've barely covered Galaxy 2 in the past, with just one (article) instance in its forum (that is actually about the game, unlike this piece) and that this is a most frequent occurence for plenty high profile Wii titles (hey guyz, Sakaguchi & Mistwalker are working on an RPG for it, and Monolith Soft on another, and we've known and have gotten information for them for months, and for the latter even already have had 4 trailers or so) tells me more about this place than the official Nintendo magazine covering Galaxy 2 a lot. Shit, it's a Nintendo magazine. Did you expect them to ignore it like you've been doing? Any Mario release is an event for all gamers, let alone those who are meant to thoroughly cover Nintendo. At the very least there are plenty more games and news (for all platforms) to cover before you should feel confident in having time to spare by trashing colleagues.

Not to mention your FAQ says you only "highlight the stuff that we feel is significant" so I guess I don't need to read your articles either, only the headlines and go "oh, that's significant" then, right? Or like when you said that you'll only have ads for "good" games, I guess when/if we see an ad on here we won't need to read a review, we'll just know it's a good game, eh? I mean, that's what you're implying here, that they hype it so much so we don't need their review to know their opinion, right? Duh, everyone knows SMG2 is going to be a great game, but given the review will be out earlier, people (not me personally) will read it to find out more about it and get themselves more excited and pass a few more minutes pleasantly happy about what's coming to them, not to know if it's going to be a game worthy of purchase. It's Super Mario Galaxy 2, duh. Anyway, I take it that when you get any kind of (timing based or not) exclusive coverage of anything at all, if anything at all, you won't urge people to pay attention because that's so totally outrageous to do, eh? Okay then, I look forward to not seeing that! Again, yes, they have hyperbole in their promotion, but it's not your place to judge that since there's a certain conflict of interest going on. Let the audience judge.

Edited by GlenTennis
@Al3xand. Or like when you said that you'll only have ads for "good" games, I guess when/if we see an ad on here we won't need to read a review, eh? 
 
 
This is part of the problem. Reviews are meant to be read not for the score, but for the reviewers criticisms, good or bad. It's up to the reader to make his/her own opinions from it.
 
If a reviewer says something along the lines of "I  didn't like this game because it has too much of X and not enough Y. 7/10" You may love X and hate Y, and in turn love the game. So in turn, the review has given you a chance to make your own opinion of it.
 
I agree with some of your points, but personal attacks are not the way to achieve your point.
Posted by Swish

Obviously the magazine should give it a 7.7 and have an urban dictionary definition written about them, that is what the cool kids do

Posted by siavm
@myslead said:
" possibly one of the first game I'll get on the Wii since it's release lol "
People on the internet sure say the darnest things. You want this one but not the one that scored multiple 10's a few years ago.
Posted by Shaymarx

Well as the magazine is aimed at the 12 -15 demographic, and they don't have much to write about,  and ofcourse online reviews are free as long as you're connected, it's not really surprising.  His last comment about big changes happening at the magazine suggest that maybe it's going to be closed down.  Read similar editorials many times, from CRASH to Mega Power to Sega Saturn Magazine.  But I'm sure Nintendo wont that happen, will they?
Posted by Damian
Jeff said:

 Heck, for a release this monumental, they might as well just devote the entire book to it this month. And next month.    

lol
 
Well wrote!
Edited by takua108

This reminds me of reading a, like, six page review of Halo 2 in OXM back when I was in eighth grade and Halo 2 was coming out and holy shit it was the greatest thing ever. I enjoyed reading the review at the time, where Halomania (totally a word now) was at its peak. Then I played the game, and thought it was the best thing ever, and then, a couple years later, wanted to go back in time and punch my past self for being so foolish. Not necessarily because Halo is not as awesome as I thought it was back then (that too, though), but because I bought into the whole terrible mainstream "review score" thing.
 
What I'm trying to say is, while I agree with everything you wrote, Jeff, and I'm right there with you, 100%... think of who this is targeted at: the kind of people who staunchly defend the Wii as the greatest thing ever, were mostly born at least after the SNES came out, if not the N64, but wear triforce, NES controller "old school," and Super Mario Bros. 3 t-shirts from Hot Topic, and, who... well, got mad at your second-most-infamous review. These are the kind of people who will buy all six covers, read the entire ten-page review over and over and over until the game is released, play the released game once it comes out, and declare it to be the greatest thing ever. Anything less than the highest number on a given review scale will be considered heresy, and they will lash out against those who do so. 
 
Disclaimer: I've never played Super Mario Galaxy, but I'm sure it's pretty good, and the second one will probably be even better. Hell, now that I have a Wii, I may even pick it up. 
Another Disclaimer: It's after midnight here right now, and I'm prone to rant on the Internet during this time. Apologies in advance.

Posted by WickedCobra03
@Al3xand3r said:
" Before you judge others, improve your own work, please. Bias goes both ways, not only the positive side, and judging colleagues in this manner is pretty poor form and sounds like a desperate attempt to go all "look at me, I'm objective, they are not" similar to the whole GameSpot fiasco which you offer no details on yet are happy to let people think it happened one way or another to promote your new work (as if that would have been the very first and only instance you were asked to change a score in your long history there, if it really happened at all). Let the audience be the judge of who is or isn't objective and do your job, which is games coverage and criticism, not competitor/magazine criticism. That you've barely covered Galaxy 2 in the past, with just one (article) instance in its forum (that is actually about the game, unlike this piece) and that this is a most frequent occurence for plenty high profile Wii titles (hey guyz, Sakaguchi & Mistwalker are working on an RPG for it, and Monolith Soft on another, and we've known and have gotten information for them for months, and for the latter even already have had 4 trailers or so) tells me more about this place than the official Nintendo magazine covering Galaxy 2 a lot. Shit, it's a Nintendo magazine. Did you expect them to ignore it like you've been doing? Any Mario release is an event for all gamers, let alone those who are meant to thoroughly cover Nintendo. At the very least there are plenty more games and news (for all platforms) to cover before you should feel confident in having time to spare by trashing colleagues.Not to mention your FAQ says you only "highlight the stuff that we feel is significant" so I guess I don't need to read your articles either, only the headlines and go "oh, that's significant" then, right? Or like when you said that you'll only have ads for "good" games, I guess when/if we see an ad on here we won't need to read a review, we'll just know it's a good game, eh? I mean, that's what you're implying here, that they hype it so much so we don't need their review to know their opinion, right? Duh, everyone knows SMG2 is going to be a great game, but given the review will be out earlier, people (not me personally) will read it to find out more about it and get themselves more excited and pass a few more minutes pleasantly happy about what's coming to them, not to know if it's going to be a game worthy of purchase. It's Super Mario Galaxy 2, duh. Anyway, I take it that when you get any kind of (timing based or not) exclusive coverage of anything at all, if anything at all, you won't urge people to pay attention because that's so totally outrageous to do, eh? Okay then, I look forward to not seeing that! Again, yes, they have hyperbole in their promotion, but it's not your place to judge that since there's a certain conflict of interest going on. Let the audience judge. "
I kind of have a problem with your  definition of Giantbomb's definition of "significant".  Okay, so I am not sure what you are all lit up about here.  The thing that I think Jeff is trying to get across is that it is a weird way to advertise that this is their big game of the spring (summer as well now). 
 
 Anyways, I am pretty sure when these 4 guys kind of got the site going, they knew that they were going to have to do something different than most of the other outlets such as 1up(at the time), Gamespot, and IGN.  They don't have a huge staff, and it is no longer the year 2000 where the internet money train is loaded and parking in your train yard.  They can't cover all those shovelware games, Nancy Drew games, ect.  I mean I take it that we got a lot more than I expected when they recently took a Quick Look at the 2nd Endless Ocean.  I mean that game is more of the first which was not good at all.
 
And look at what they are doing with Deadly Premonition.  They are doing way more coverage on this game than any other mainstream site out there by a wide margin.  But for this kind of community, this is the perfect game to get around.  Weird, low production values, campy dialogue, borked; yet not broken where the game is unplayable, or just too much of a chore.  Look just how the community has gotten around this one game that should not usually be getting this kind of fanfare except from a bunch of niche gamers, which a majority of them reside here as users at Giantbomb, so it was a smart choice to do an Endurance Run on this game.
 
Trust me Alexander, they are going to totally cover this game here at Giantbomb.  I know the first Super Mario Galaxy came out while they were for the most part at Gamespot, but Alex Navarro (I think he was the one to review SMG) was gushing all over that game when reviewing it and Alex is kind of on the same level as these GB guys, so I am not sure what kind of coverage you are actually looking for them to do?  Any examples of games that they blatantly missed?
Edited by Bones8677

I hate the idea that individual platforms have their own magazines. It's a gigantic conflict of interests. Personally it should be illegal. Kids are going to read the review and think it will be a serious and objective article, and will be totally unaware that the review was bought long before the game was even announced.

Posted by Bones8677
@Al3xand3r: Dude, Jeff isn't aloud to criticize? There's no conflict of interests, he's a consumer too. Just like us. And because he is in the game industry, as a journalist, that should give him more justification to criticize.
 
If there's bullshit, you have to call it out, no matter what position you are in. And this campaign is bullshit. The game will be fine, and will sell fine. But this is drastic overkill. It's not the second coming of Christ 
 
Why are you even here? If you want up to the minute info on the latest Wii game, go to places were people actually give a damn about the Wii. Like Nintendo. Stop wasting our time with long winded whiny Fanboyism.
Posted by Unlogik
@Al3xand3r: "Let the audience judge." — Hell, if we were able to do that, this site wouldn't be nearly as popular now would it¡
Posted by TwoLines
@Al3xand3r said:
" Before you judge others, improve your own work, please. Bias goes both ways, not only the positive side, and judging colleagues in this manner is pretty poor form and sounds like a desperate attempt to go all "look at me, I'm objective, they are not" similar to the whole GameSpot fiasco which you offer no details on yet are happy to let people think it happened one way or another to promote your new work (as if that would have been the very first and only instance you were asked to change a score in your long history there, if it really happened at all). Let the audience be the judge of who is or isn't objective and do your job, which is games coverage and criticism, not competitor/magazine criticism. That you've barely covered Galaxy 2 in the past, with just one (article) instance in its forum (that is actually about the game, unlike this piece) and that this is a most frequent occurence for plenty high profile Wii titles (hey guyz, Sakaguchi & Mistwalker are working on an RPG for it, and Monolith Soft on another, and we've known and have gotten information for them for months, and for the latter even already have had 4 trailers or so) tells me more about this place than the official Nintendo magazine covering Galaxy 2 a lot. Shit, it's a Nintendo magazine. Did you expect them to ignore it like you've been doing? Any Mario release is an event for all gamers, let alone those who are meant to thoroughly cover Nintendo. At the very least there are plenty more games and news (for all platforms) to cover before you should feel confident in having time to spare by trashing colleagues.Not to mention your FAQ says you only "highlight the stuff that we feel is significant" so I guess I don't need to read your articles either, only the headlines and go "oh, that's significant" then, right? Or like when you said that you'll only have ads for "good" games, I guess when/if we see an ad on here we won't need to read a review, we'll just know it's a good game, eh? I mean, that's what you're implying here, that they hype it so much so we don't need their review to know their opinion, right? Duh, everyone knows SMG2 is going to be a great game, but given the review will be out earlier, people (not me personally) will read it to find out more about it and get themselves more excited and pass a few more minutes pleasantly happy about what's coming to them, not to know if it's going to be a game worthy of purchase. It's Super Mario Galaxy 2, duh. Anyway, I take it that when you get any kind of (timing based or not) exclusive coverage of anything at all, if anything at all, you won't urge people to pay attention because that's so totally outrageous to do, eh? Okay then, I look forward to not seeing that! Again, yes, they have hyperbole in their promotion, but it's not your place to judge that since there's a certain conflict of interest going on. Let the audience judge. "
First thing first- it's not about bias. They're the Nintendo magazine, no shit they're going to be biased.
It's the fact that they gave the game a 10 page review and six different magazine covers, and expect us to want to read the review.
10 pages? It's going to be all butterflies and sunshine through all of them, calling it masterpiece every sentence.
Why would anyone read that? It's pointless. They've told us what's the score right there, and that everything is perfect.
 
Also, arguing through the internet is just plain silly Goddamnit.
Posted by EndlessMike

You are being a dick but its well warranted and a funny read so no harm no foul.

Posted by Bigandtasty

JOURNALIST FIGHT!!!
 
I certainly don't envy the position of running a company-specific magazine, but I also wouldn't go as ridiculously far as ONM have.

Posted by simian

Wow what a pile of dicks. Then again it's not like they make any claim to being non-partisan.
For funsies pretend that instead of SMG2 their talking about Wii Music.

Posted by Meowayne

Al3xander: +1. Well said.

Edited by takua108

So it's late at night and I just read a stupid forum post and I'm going to respond to it, bit by bit! 
 
@Al3xand3r
said:

"Before you judge others, improve your own work, please. Bias goes both ways, not only the positive side, and judging colleagues in this manner is pretty poor form and sounds like a desperate attempt to go all "look at me, I'm objective, they are not"

He did say maybe he was just a dick :)

"similar to the whole GameSpot fiasco which you offer no details on yet are happy to let people think it happened one way or another to promote your new work (as if that would have been the very first and only instance you were asked to change a score in your long history there, if it really happened at all)"    

Giant Bomb wasn't started until after he was fired, so it wasn't a publicity stunt, don't be such a tinfoil-hatted conspiracy theorist. And he is not legally allowed to say anything about the incident. 

"Let the audience be the judge of who is or isn't objective and do your job, which is games coverage and criticism, not competitor/magazine criticism."    

I don't know about you, but I don't see Giant Bomb as a competitor to Official Nintendo Magazine in any way. Hell, if I was a hardcore Nintendo fanboy who gets mad at things like this, I'd stay the fuck away from Giant Bomb, given Jeff's past review "unfair" review scores. That's what official Nintendo magazines are for: to tell you that the AAA games that they're making are fucking incredible and absolutely flawless in every respect. (See my above post.) 

"That you've barely covered Galaxy 2 in the past, with just one (article) instance in its forum (that is actually about the game, unlike this piece) and that this is a most frequent occurence for plenty high profile Wii titles (hey guyz, Sakaguchi & Mistwalker are working on an RPG for it, and Monolith Soft onanother, and we've known and have gotten information for them for months, and for the latter even already have had 4 trailers or so) tells me more about this place than the official Nintendo magazine covering Galaxy 2 a lot."    

I don't know if you've noticed, but Giant Bomb is not Kotaku, Joystiq, etc. News coverage is not their forte. 

 "Shit, it's a Nintendo magazine. Did you expect them to ignore it like you've been doing?"    

This part leads me to believe that you're misunderstanding what Mr. Gerstmann is saying entirely, and you're honestly sounding a lot like the anti-8.8 crowd. Jeff is not criticizing ONM for putting SMG2 on its cover for the month that the review is going to be in the magazine. He's saying that, if you're an Official Nintendo Magazine, and you're calling SMG2 "Miyamoto's latest masterpiece," and you're going to have a ten-page review for the game, and your Goddamn magazine is going to have six different collectible covers for this event... not only is the game guaranteed a 100% review score, but you can be pretty damn certain it's not going to badmouth the game in any major way, regardless of whether it deserves it or not.

 "Any Mario release is an event for all gamers, let alone those who are meant to thoroughly cover Nintendo. At the very least there are plenty more games and news (for all platforms) to cover before you should feel confident in having time to spare by trashing colleagues."    

Again, this isn't Kotaku or Joystiq. Giant Bomb is a community-oriented video game website where we do fun stuff like Endurance Runs and Thursday Night Throwdowns and Bombcasts and Quick Looks and Video Reviews... and there's the occasional news tidbit. You're basically saying "Hey dog, how come you're not exactly like this cat?" 

 "Not to mention your FAQ says you only "highlight the stuff that we feel is significant" so I guess I don't need to read your articles either, only the headlines and go "oh, that's significant" then, right?"    

Uh...no? If Giant Bomb says they're only going to cover stories that they feel are significant, then you can be sure that... the stories they cover will be significant in their opinion. They're not telling you what to think, they're not a neutral party, they're a bunch of dudes with their own preferences and such. 

 "Or like when you said that you'll only have ads for "good" games, I guess when/if we see an ad on here we won't need to read a review, we'll just know it's a good game, eh?"    

If you're looking for a "position of the thumb" review, then yes, you should see an ad for Dragon Age: Origins, Halo 3: ODST, or whatever, and say to yourself "I'll bet this game is going to get a four, maybe five-star review." Now keep Giant Bomb's review system in mind: four stars is "pretty good" and five stars is "freaking awesome," whereas three stars is "alright, but not necessarily for everyone to go out and buy." Giant Bomb uses something similar to the Penny Arcade ad model. (I'm not sure if Giant Bomb is in the position to demand playables before advertising like Penny Arcade does, though.) They put ads up for games that they think will be good, because it's how the community works. Giant Bomb shows ads for a game they think is going to be good, GB community is influenced to by said good game, developer and publisher of good game make money from purchase, Giant Bomb gets money for advertising. Everyone wins. I can literally see nothing wrong with this system.

 "I mean, that's what you're implying here, that they hype it so much so we don't need their review to know their opinion, right? Duh, everyone knows SMG2 is going to be a great game, but given the review will be out earlier, people (not me personally) will read it to find out more about it and get themselves more excited and pass a few more minutes pleasantly happy about what's coming to them, not to know if it's going to be a game worthy of purchase. It's Super Mario Galaxy 2, duh."    

On this part, you and I more or less agree! If you don't want to read my above post, I likened this situation to back when I was in eighth grade and excited for Halo 2, read an OXM review of Halo 2 (~six pages, 10/10), and got only more and more excited for it. (Actually, come to think of it... didn't they give the single-player campaign a 9/10, and the multiplayer a 10? I can't remember.) So yes, this is great for Nintendo fans who were probably going to buy SMG2 already, and since Jeff is not in this boat, he's not really looking at it from the intended perspective. If your post consisted of this, I would not have bothered to reply. 

  " Anyway, I take it that when you get any kind of (timing based or not) exclusive coverage of anything at all, if anything at all, you won't urge people to pay attention because that's so totally outrageous to do, eh? Okay then, I look forward to not seeing that! Again, yes, they have hyperbole in their promotion, but it's not your place to judge that since there's a certain conflict of interest going on. Let the audience judge. "

I don't really know what you were saying up until the last two sentences, but I agree with those, pretty much. But I also agree with what  @Bones8677  said, which is that the idea of official platform magazines is just plain silly to begin with. 
 
Please don't "quote" this entire post, as I've made the comments look ugly enough as is. :)
Posted by Rasgueado

Cripes... 10 pages about a fucking Mario game? Why would anyone bother to even play the damn game at that point... it sounds like they're going to describe it in excruciating detail.  
 
10 pages of review... well now I'm curious what the word count is going to be. It'll either be 1000 words and a fuck-tonne of pictures, or 5000 words of shitty filler where some guy tries to say it's the video game equivalent of Casablanca. This madness needs to stop. 

Posted by JJWeatherman

lol, I like articles like this.

Edited by Al3xand3r

@takua, company specific or not, they're all 'journalists' in the same field, gaming, striving to keep a readership. Thus, they're competitors. Especially when we hear of so many mags closing down as users favor the free online media and we now have parts of said online media criticising print mags?

@twolines, I addressed that part as well.

@bones, what are you talking about? You do know the same company that publishes official nintendo mags has mags for all the companies as well as non-specific gaming mags, and the staff's paychecks don't come from Nintendo and the other first parties but from said company (which may, or may not, have agreements with all the first parties behind the scenes)? This isn't necessarily a "campaign" for the game, it's a campaign for the magazine, because said magazine needs a readership as well, thus they use a high profile title to attract readership. That is outrageous how? Because they have different covers to choose from and claim their mag/review is awesome? Wow, what a crime, noone else would ever think of pimping his product. Like Jeff said, they really want you to read it, ie buy the magazine, ie, ensure their paychecks, just like GB wants you to keep clicking these here pages. Again, everyone kows the game will be great, people like reading shit about shit they like and the mag is trying to offer that to keep running like any mag out there.

Posted by Brazzle
@takua108:  This entire comments section makes me want to cry, but you brought some much needed sanity to the proceedings - many thanks.
 
Also SMG 2 will probably be pretty good.
 
Also that Alexander dude is a nintendo fan boy and kind of a pompous ass.
Edited by takua108
@Al3xand3r said:

" @takua, company specific or not, they're all 'journalists' in the same field, gaming, striving to keep a readership. Thus, they're competitors.  

Well, not really. Joystiq and Kotaku report news. Sure, they do other things, such as reviews, and community features, and such, and yes, they editorialize the news a bit, but they're far more news-posty than Giant Bomb. Does that make them competitors? I'd say "not really." When I want to see the absolute latest breaking video game news, I don't go to the Giant Bomb homepage, I go to Kotaku. When I want to visit a fun community run by funny, cool dudes, that happens to be about one of my favorite topics, video games, I visit Giant Bomb. More on this in a second.

@bones, what are you talking about? You do know the same company that publishes official nintendo mags has mags for all the companies as well as non-specific gaming mags, and the staff's paychecks don't come from Nintendo and the other first parties but from said company (which may, or may not, have agreements with all the first parties behind the scenes)? This isn't necessarily a "campaign" for the game, it's a campaign for the magazine, because said magazine needs a readership as well, thus they use a high profile title to attract readership. That is outrageous how? Because they have different covers to choose from and claim their mag/review is awesome? Wow, what a crime, noone else would ever think of pimping his product. Like Jeff said, they really want you to read it. "

This doesn't lessen his point at all. @bones8677, like me, is against the idea of a magazine that just circlejerks over any given product. I hate Apple circlejerk magazines and websites. I hate Nintendo circlejerk magazines and websites. If there were a similar website for Valve products, something that I am a huge fan of, I would probably dislike it too, if it just 10/10'd every major release of theirs without anything resembling justification. 
 
I think the problem is not with the circlejerking, necessarily, but the fact that it's sort of pretending to be objective, by giving it a review score and framing it in the context of a review. I read reviews to see how a particular game turned out, and maybe consider purchasing it based on reading some reviews. If a review for a game by a magazine that patently says good things about a certain brand says that the latest flagship game of said brand is 100% awesome, no flaws, perfect, best thing ever, then that is not a review, but circlejerking disguised as a review. Sure, it's obviously impartial, but the fact that it exists as a "review" and not just an editorial piece outlining how great the game is makes it seem... I dunno, kind of misleading. 
 
It's just kind of sad that the sort of person who is going to pick up the magazine and read it needs to be told "yes, this game that is coming out from the company that you love and idolize, featuring one of your favorite recurring characters and settings, is FUCKING AWESOME, 5 stars, 10/10, 100%, A++, and your rabid fanboyism for the game, platform, and company is totally justified, great job, now buy more of that company's products and our magazine, too." I don't care who puts it out, it's this fostering of the console wars and fanboyism that is just disgusting.
Edited by Al3xand3r

Nice response in theory but as you haven't even read the review, and neither has jeff, or bones, how could this be what he and you lot are against with these posts? How do you know the review has nothing but praise? How do you know that, if it does have nothing by praise, the game's not actually worthy of it? The first certainly was, for most people, and for those it wasn't I'm sure they could at least understand why it was to others and thus not blame them of fanboyism for enjoying it that much. In any case, if that is what you want to be against, you'd think you'd have to both read the review and play the game to know that they are conforming to beliefs you do not approve of BEFORE publically accusing them, as even if you end up being right in the end, you went about it the wrong way.

And what is console warsy about their magazine and in particular this promotion? Do they trash other companies or call you a loser if you don't have a DS or Wii? As people with actual experience with the mag said, it's far from fanboyish despite paying for the right to be called "official" (unless there are shady deals behind the scenes, that's the extent of such relationships usually), but hey, they tried to pimp their Galaxy review so that apparently warrants such bashing from Jeff, you and bones, eh? The only console warsy stuff I see is from people who respond to this comments section that apparently believe the game's not worthy of praise (praise they have yet to read, even) without playing it, which means that the magazine's review (still unread, as said already) is biased.

Edge gave the game a 10/10, are they biased as well, are they off the hook because they don't have Nintendo in their title, or what? As for your last paragraph, eh, what did you want them to do? You wanted the Official Nintendo Magazine or whatever it's called to NOT review Super Mario Galaxy 2 because everyone knows it's good? Or did you want them to not put it on the cover but just stick it in a little corner and not mention it? It's a big game, people like reading stuff about big games, mags and websites try to offer that to get a readership. Just like GB posts the "significant" stuff only (like this article, lol).

Posted by buckybit
...scrolling thru walls of comments text, thinking ... hm, some guys have an attention problem. Need an editor, like John Davison...
Posted by Bones8677
@Al3xand3r: Dude, you're pathetic. We are criticizing Nintendo Power for the ridiculous ad campaign that it is. No one is even hinting that they shouldn't review the game. Just that 10 pages is fuckin' ridiculous for ANY game. 6 covers for it too? Of course the review will be nothing but praise, why else would they go through all this effort? Are you really so blind that you can't smell the snake oil and realize that this is all an obvious ploy to get people to buy the game?
Edited by takua108
@Al3xand3r: I don't give a damn about how the game turns out. I'm sure it'll be great. I just can't stand fanboyism taken to commercial extremes like this, and pretending that it's a review. This is why I love Giant Bomb and Jeff Gerstmann. Every Nintendo and Zelda fan is going on and on about Twilight Princess, and saying "best game ever, 10/10, 100%," and Jeff has the balls to say "Uh...no? It's seriously about... an 8.8 or so." Or take the Kane & Lynch thing. Gamespot had fucking full-page ads everywhere for the game, and, when it comes to review time... "Eh, the game kind of sucks, really. I didn't much care for it." 
 
Don't even try and play the "neither you, nor Jeff, nor anybody has even read the magazine's review yet" card. This is what Jeff and I were both saying. In a OFFICIAL NINTENDO MAGAZINE, with SIX COLLECTIBLE COVERS, and a TEN-PAGE REVIEW, it's going to be nothing but a fucking circlejerk! TEN PAGES! Do you know how many pages that is for a review, even giving three of them to images? Read any Giant Bomb review, or, hell, any Game Informer review, or any review by anyone on the Internet of relative sanity who isn't Tim Rogers? TEN PAGES?! OF COURSE THE REVIEW IS GOING TO BE NOTHING BUT PRAISE! 
 
Let me put things into perspective: 

I think Portal, as a whole, is probably the best video game I've ever played. I can't think of a single flaw in the game. It's definitely not my most favorite game ever, but it is, in my mind, undoubtedly the most perfect game I've ever experienced. I also love Valve. I love their games, their approach to making games, and their cavalier attitude to taking the PC gaming market by the balls, saying "we're going to save the PC market, so...digital distribution, motherfuckers!
 
Yes, I am a fan of Valve, and Portal.
 
Now, if there was a magazine called Official Valve Magazine, not only would I not subscribe to it, but I would definitely not purchase six copies (all of the collectible covers, you understand) of the issue where they have a ten-page review of Portal 2. I have no need. I am sure the game is going to be at least "pretty good," and I am mature enough to not need to read long bits of verbal circlejerk to justify my position of being a Valve fan. I am just going to buy Portal 2. I might read some reviews for perspective from other sources, but I am not going to sit down and read ten pages of nothing but telling me about how I should feel good about being a Valve fan, because holy fucking shit, this game is incredible. 
 
Now do you understand where I'm coming from?
Edited by Al3xand3r
@takua108 said:

"This is why I love Giant Bomb and Jeff Gerstmann. Every Nintendo and Zelda fan is going on and on about Twilight Princess, and saying "best game ever, 10/10, 100%," and Jeff has the balls to say "Uh...no? It's seriously about... an 8.8 or so." Or take the Kane & Lynch thing. Gamespot had fucking full-page ads everywhere for the game, and, when it comes to review time... "Eh, the game kind of sucks, really. I didn't much care for it."

1. Bullshit. Plenty Nintendo fans disliked TP. Plenty even disliked WW.
2. 8.8 is a pretty damn great score, he wasn't exactly going against the tide.
3. Yes, he did that with Kane & Lynch, shame that won't happen on GB ever since they'll only advertise good games eh. That will of course be okay with people here, say, Halo 4 gets 4/5 and a ton of ads, no problem, it's Jeff, he's cool and funny. Not to mention its far from the only instance of websites (even GameSpot) scoring games they have ads for low, many games get ads, you know, but most don't score great.

I wouldn't subscribe to an official Valve magazine either. Or Nintendo. I get everything I need online for free, I don't need to spend more money to read about a hobby that is already expensive. I'm not sure what our personal reading interests have to do with publically calling out ONM for reviewing a huge game in a huge way in an attempt to attract a readership like every outlet that wishes to be read does. Are we gonna have a number of pages rule or what? Sometimes I do like reading things in detail. Granted I wouldn't like reading a Mario review in such detail, since I already know most all about it, but not everyone does I suppose, with the way the audience expanded this generation. That the magazine isn't aimed to me, or you, or Jeff, doesn't make it bash worthy, not in this manner.

Enthusiast press seems pretty enthusiastic, news at eleven. God forbid you ever hear they'll write a Nintendo history/homage piece.
Edited by takua108
@Al3xand3r:  
  1. How are you seriously misunderstanding what I'm saying. Maybe I went too far in saying "every" fan, but every fan that was attacking the score was saying how it was heresy and the worst thing ever and how could you say that a game this great could only warrant a mere 8.8? (And who disliked WW? I'm no Nintendo follower, but I played WW and liked it a whole lot. Anyone who didn't at least like that game a little bit is truly crazy.)
  2. I KNOW! This is what I am saying! This is what I love about Gerstmann! "Yeah, the game was pretty good, but definitely not the greatest game I've ever played or anything, and it has its flaws, so... 8.8/10." A perfectly valid position to be in, which is why the people attacking that situation were wrong, and dumb, and these are the sorts of people who will read ONM like this. 
  3. If you see anything at all wrong with getting paid to pimp something that you think is cool, please, do tell. A few posts up I wrote this, but I guess I'll have to write it again: Publisher tells website to advertise game to users. Website likes game, agrees to do this. Website gets money, Publisher sells games, gets money, users, who have similar interests to website buy game, finding it to be good. Everyone wins! 
  4. Okay, now you're either really, really thick, or just trolling. I was putting myself in the shoes of the sort of person who would pick up this ONM, and be drawn in by what they're doing (six covers, ten-page review, etc.), by using a game that I feel comparably excited for, and have comparable fanboyism for. I was explaining how that, given that situation, I would find the magazine's attempts to further foster my fanboyism and profit from it to be absolutely reprehensible. 
 
I don't know how much clearer I can be, seriously. 
 
EDIT: Also, quit ninja'ing your pages, you make me feel bad when I don't respond to points you write because you edited them in after the fact. :(
Edited by Al3xand3r

1. So every fan who was displeased with the score was a fan displeased with the score. Ok, lol.
2. Great, I'm sure he loves you too.
3. Lol, nope, nothing wrong with that. Unless they have Nintendo in their title and write more pages than I care to read. I guess.

Get used to Ninjaing, I don't change my points, just add to them, or edit for formatting purposes. Anyway, I'm done here. I stand by my first post and do not feel you or the others said anything meaningful against my original points. Feel free to disagree, have fun with what you do.

Edited by takua108
@Al3xand3r: Alright, keep stepping around my main point and misinterpreting my responses to your responses to my responses to your post like half a page up (edit: and a page back :O), instead.
Posted by wolf_blitzer85

Damn, shit got heavy in here.

Posted by GetEveryone

I'd just like to point out that these are basically paradigms of games magazines. Phrases like "the only review that matters" and stating a basic opinion on the front cover is something that occurs a lot. Just look at GamesMaster, or any console dedicated rag for that matter.

Posted by atomhawk

The UK Official Nintendo Magazine does give away some sweet swag with each issue though. Sod the magazine content! Gimme Nintendo fridge magnets!

Posted by Linkyshinks
@GetEveryone said:
" I'd just like to point out that these are basically paradigms of games magazines. Phrases like "the only review that matters" and stating a basic opinion on the front cover is something that occurs a lot. Just look at GamesMaster, or any console dedicated rag for that matter. "
 
You speak the Truth.
Posted by myghart

And the month after, they will release a special edition of the magazine about just how awesome that 10 page review was. It will review that 10 page review in 20 pages, and there will be 6 different versions of that review of the review, each using a different icon for scores, like 5 of 5 mushrooms, turtle shells, stars, Mario hats, Princess Peach's Panties,  and most importantly, 5 of 5 power-gloves stroking a dick (which will look animated on the magazine if you tilt the fucker) indicating how big, superfluous and laughable a fucking circle-jerk this whole affair was.
 
Congratulations, Nintendo, (or to be fair, Nintendo's marketing/PR division), now go sodomize yourself, preferably with a fishing-rod shaped WiiMotion Plus controller and know that this shit didn't make me care one bit more for the shit you're putting out there.
 
Which doesn't mean I'm hating on Nintendo games per se. I'll happily try out Mario Galaxy some time and if it's anything like the previous title, it could be a lot of fun.

Posted by TUCKST3R

A staff member at Official Nintendo Magazine has responded in this thread: 

http://forums.officialnintendomagazine.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=65436
    
"Meh, whatever.

We'd rather wait for the opinions of people who actually read the magazine and then tell us if it's any good, rather than anyone giving the typical "official = biased lolz" reaction before the magazine's even out yet.

I'd respond further, but we at ONM actually care about professionalism and so it's not our place to comment on other sites or magazines."
 
He has a point, you can't judge something that you haven't read.
Posted by Meowayne
@TUCKST3R said:
"Meh, whatever.

We'd rather wait for the opinions of people who actually read the magazine and then tell us if it's any good, rather than anyone giving the typical "official = biased lolz" reaction before the magazine's even out yet. I'd respond further, but we at ONM actually care about professionalism and so it's not our place to comment on other sites or magazines."  He has a point, you can't judge something that you haven't read. "

owned.
Posted by oldschool

 @Jeff said:

"Lots of pointless stuff and this:  
Be sure to keep all that in mind when all of the other completely useless, unofficial, and non-exclusive reviews start hitting closer to the game's May 23 street date. "

 

What exactly is the point of this thread?  

 Someone actually spent time writing this?  Are we sure the office kid didn't write this whilst Jeff was having a dump?  Or perhaps this is the result of the dump.  
 
Hello Captain Bleedin' Obvious.  
Posted by TMThomsen

Screw you all, I'm gonna write the only review that matters. And I don't even own a Wii.