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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Dalai: 
 
Really? I loved the controls, they worked well for me. Except for pointing at the screen, but even then, I partially blame myself for that.
Posted by animateria
@Video_Game_King: 
 
Man this stuff is spilling all over the place now haha... Even on our walls.

Anyways, it doesn't need to be Pirates, they just popped up in my mind. But the act of fleeing gives off a sense of weakness. It just seemed like a natural way to create a sense of vulnerability.
 
Sorry about the MGS4 spoilers about being sexy. But man, they sculpted Snakes ass with extreme care... Makes sense I guess.... Since you're staring at it for most of the game.

Anyways, played a bit of Halo Reach... They sure go for equal opportunity for butt shots of the Noble members female or not. I'm conflicted on that particular issue now, if there are enough butt shots either way, is that cool?
Posted by Video_Game_King
@animateria: 
 
Like what they did in Fusion? Wait, we covered that. Moving on...
 
Didn't Vinny or Dave or Drew or one of the GB guys say something about staring at asses for a whole game?
 
Seems oddly irrelevant.
Posted by mylifeforAiur

Damn VKG, 53 posts, hitting the big time now my friend. Anyway, glad to see you like Metroid, I'm probably going to be playing this soon, the Wii needs more good games^^

Posted by Video_Game_King
@mylifeforAiur: 
 
Big time? This isn't uncommon for me; Singularity got 44, Silent Hill 2 got me 52, and don't get me started on Halo 3. Seriously, don't get me started on Halo 3; that game must be left dead.
Posted by animateria
@Video_Game_King: 
 
It is irrelevant... I dunno why I said that.
 
I played quite a bit of Halo Reach last night and I guess that was on my mind a bit too much. 
 
Anyways back on topic... 
 
I got nothing.
Posted by Video_Game_King
@animateria: 
 
Same here. I could feel this fading back in my "GB guys" post.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King said:
" @Hailinel: 
 
Sounds like you repeated one of my responses :P.
 
This is where we split. I don't like Squall, mainly because he and Rinoa pave the path for a predictable "p-word for story." He's this gruff loner who doesn't care for anybody, but by the end of the story, aw, how cute, he's learned to love, and to care about people other than himself! Your description of him as a "jerk, a self-centered brat, a fucking asshole" doesn't exactly persuade me, especially since that describes me so damn well.  I don't have any major problems with Zidane.  Unless she grows high heels and flips the fuck out :P. "
But Squall still shows actual growth of character.  While the path of his growth may be cliche, it's that he grew in any way at all that's important.  Squall isn't the type of character that one normally associates with being the lead in an RPG.  in any other game, he'd be the Vincent Valentine-like side character at best.
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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel: 
 
I see growth in a lot of characters, so the growth itself is irrelevant. The change that happens becomes more important, so when you have a cliche growth, things aren't going to be enjoyable. The only condition under which I like Squall is when he's dead, since it's consistent with the narcissist introvert we've known for all of one disc.
Posted by Hailinel
@Dalai said:
" The story made just enough sense for me to accept the whole thing. Honestly, the story is pretty secondary for me. My problem is with the controls which simply are too awkward for a 3D game. It needed that Nunchuk more than anything else. "
I disagree.  The game plays just fine with the D-pad.  I honestly don't see what it is that makes the lack of analog movement so damning to the experience.
 
@Video_Game_King said:
" @Hailinel: 
 
I see growth in a lot of characters, so the growth itself is irrelevant. The change that happens becomes more important, so when you have a cliche growth, things aren't going to be enjoyable. The only condition under which I like Squall is when he's dead, since it's consistent with the narcissist introvert we've known for all of one disc. "

Ah, but to go back to my first point, how many central protagonists in videos prior to Squall actually experienced a similar growth arc?
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Posted by mylifeforAiur
@Video_Game_King said:
" @mylifeforAiur:   Big time? This isn't uncommon for me; Singularity got 44, Silent Hill 2 got me 52, and don't get me started on Halo 3. Seriously, don't get me started on Halo 3; that game must be left dead. "
Damn, unfortunately I missed the Halo 3 blog. I might actually check it out right now!
Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel: 
 
You mean from a gruff, antisocial introvert to some sensitive guy? Alright, I like a challenge.
 
  • Shadow, even if FF6 does sort of reverse it.
  • Rune at least showed hints of this. Also, I realized that the Phantasy Star IV page needs MORE characters.
 
That's all I got. But counter-point: "not done before" does not mean good. It means original, but not good.
Posted by Video_Game_King
@mylifeforAiur: 
 
No, that blog must remain dead! Besides, I didn't attach it to any pages, so you're kinda screwed.
Posted by DoctorWelch
@Video_Game_King said:
" @antikorper:   Huh? If communism isn't cool, then why do you want me to stop bashing it? "
DAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMN, You just got skooled sun... 
 
I should probably never talk again?
Edited by mylifeforAiur
@Video_Game_King: Just realized that! Damn you, King. Damn you and all your Lunarian (?) friends!
Posted by Video_Game_King
@mylifeforAiur: 
 
Yes, it's Lunarian. Besides, even if I had attached it to the page, that blog had to be more than a year ago; searching for it through Halo 3 would prove a poor move, since it'd inevitably be buried by now.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King said:
" @Hailinel: 
 
You mean from a gruff, antisocial introvert to some sensitive guy? Alright, I like a challenge.
 
  • Shadow, even if FF6 does sort of reverse it.
  • Rune at least showed hints of this. Also, I realized that the Phantasy Star IV page needs MORE characters.
 That's all I got. But counter-point: "not done before" does not mean good. It means original, but not good. "
Shadow wasn't the central character of Final Fantasy VI.  As for Rune, I'm not familiar enough with the Phantasy Star games to properly discuss them.
 
Did I say that Squall's characterization was perfect?  No, but given that a character with his personality and growth was especially a rarity in gaming back when Final Fantasy VIII was released, it's noteworthy, and something that other developers should learn from.  And while you may not find his characterization good, there are others that disagree with you.  Some might go overboard in their defense, but Squall is still a well-written character.
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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel: 
 
Go play Phantasy Star. It's good, except for 3. Generic as hell.
 
Protagonists? Damn it. I'd come back with more, but I'm stuck between Venture Bros. and Japanese, so fuck it.
 
No, they should not learn from that, at least how Squall was executed. If we're going with JRPG examples developers should learn from for character development, Fragile Dreams is a bit overlooked in that department. I don't know how to explain it, but Seto's quest to find some type of human companion hits a really good note in general. Squall, on the other hand, is pretty cliché; I've already pointed out how predictable he is in the rainbow-puking post.
Posted by Symphony
@Hailinel: The comic (let alone Samus as a character) was out before Master Chief was even an idea on a drawing board. People need to stop comparing her to him. SHE IS NOT A FEMALE COPY OF HIM. I found her interesting in the comic She was a strong female character in a leading role showcased in a magazine aimed almost directly at boys. She was one of the few characters I could look at and think, "I wish I could be like that". She still had an emotional side that was expressed at the end of the short-run series, but also looked in the face of danger and laughed. 
 
Excuse me for wanting a character like that to look up to in a medium where most women at the time were helpless princesses. I'm sorry you already have master chief and Gordon Freeman and that you're sick and tired of those kind of characters. 
Posted by Video_Game_King
@Symphony: 
 
Not to beat a dead horse, but I can see this spawning as many posts as my Halo 3 blog. Also:
 
Posted by Hailinel
@Symphony said:
" @Hailinel: The comic (let alone Samus as a character) was out before Master Chief was even an idea on a drawing board. People need to stop comparing her to him. SHE IS NOT A FEMALE COPY OF HIM. I found her interesting in the comic She was a strong female character in a leading role showcased in a magazine aimed almost directly at boys. She was one of the few characters I could look at and think, "I wish I could be like that". She still had an emotional side that was expressed at the end of the short-run series, but also looked in the face of danger and laughed.  Excuse me for wanting a character like that to look up to in a medium where most women at the time were helpless princesses. I'm sorry you already have master chief and Gordon Freeman and that you're sick and tired of those kind of characters.  "
Sorry if I touched a nerve.  I know of the comic of which you speak; it was well written as I recall, but it's not what I consider Samus to be, nor do I necessarily want her to be that character.  While the characterization may have supposedly been accurate at one time, later games following Super Metroid (Zero Mission, Fusion, Other M) all state otherwise, to one degree or another.  (Well, that, and I can't accept any interpretation of the Metroid universe that comes complete with that useless tag-along imbecile Houston.)
 
The Samus of Other M, despite being referred to as one by one of the characters, is not a princess.  To suggest that the weakness she exhibits in the game suddenly makes her another Princess Peach or Zelda is not an accurate assessment in the slightest.  Samus has always been the opposite of those characters, and nothing that occurs in Other M or any other Metroid game changes that.  She's neither an unstoppable badass, a weak little girl, or an empty shell masquerading as a character.  She's a character with more than just one or two dimensions, and despite what weakness she does show, she still has strength enough to do what it takes even when it hurts.  That isn't weakening or cheapening her character.  Ultimately, it adds to it because it makes her more relatable as a human being.  Someone capable of overcoming her problems rather than never having any problems at all.
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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel said:
" @Symphony said:
" @Hailinel: The comic (let alone Samus as a character) was out before Master Chief was even an idea on a drawing board. People need to stop comparing her to him. SHE IS NOT A FEMALE COPY OF HIM. I found her interesting in the comic She was a strong female character in a leading role showcased in a magazine aimed almost directly at boys. She was one of the few characters I could look at and think, "I wish I could be like that". She still had an emotional side that was expressed at the end of the short-run series, but also looked in the face of danger and laughed.  Excuse me for wanting a character like that to look up to in a medium where most women at the time were helpless princesses. I'm sorry you already have master chief and Gordon Freeman and that you're sick and tired of those kind of characters.  "
Sorry if I touched a nerve.  I know of the comic of which you speak; it was well written as I recall, but it's not what I consider Samus to be, nor do I necessarily want her to be that character.  While the characterization may have supposedly been accurate at one time, later games following Super Metroid (Zero Mission, Fusion, Other M) all state otherwise, to one degree or another.  (Well, that, and I can't accept any interpretation of the Metroid universe that comes complete with that useless tag-along imbecile Houston.)  The Samus of Other M, despite being referred to as one by one of the characters, is not a princess.  To suggest that the weakness she exhibits in the game suddenly makes her another Princess Peach or Zelda is not an accurate assessment in the slightest.  Samus has always been the opposite of those characters, and nothing that occurs in Other M or any other Metroid game changes that.  She's neither an unstoppable badass, a weak little girl, or an empty shell masquerading as a character.  She's a character with more than just one or two dimensions, and despite what weakness she does show, she still has strength enough to do what it takes even when it hurts.  That isn't weakening or cheapening her character.  Ultimately, it adds to it because it makes her more relatable as a human being.  Someone capable of overcoming her problems rather than never having any problems at all. "
You've been compiling all my responses, haven't you :P?
Posted by Symphony
@Hailinel said:
" @Symphony said:
" @Hailinel: The comic (let alone Samus as a character) was out before Master Chief was even an idea on a drawing board. People need to stop comparing her to him. SHE IS NOT A FEMALE COPY OF HIM. I found her interesting in the comic She was a strong female character in a leading role showcased in a magazine aimed almost directly at boys. She was one of the few characters I could look at and think, "I wish I could be like that". She still had an emotional side that was expressed at the end of the short-run series, but also looked in the face of danger and laughed.  Excuse me for wanting a character like that to look up to in a medium where most women at the time were helpless princesses. I'm sorry you already have master chief and Gordon Freeman and that you're sick and tired of those kind of characters.  "
Sorry if I touched a nerve.  I know of the comic of which you speak; it was well written as I recall, but it's not what I consider Samus to be, nor do I necessarily want her to be that character.  While the characterization may have supposedly been accurate at one time, later games following Super Metroid (Zero Mission, Fusion, Other M) all state otherwise, to one degree or another.  (Well, that, and I can't accept any interpretation of the Metroid universe that comes complete with that useless tag-along imbecile Houston.)  The Samus of Other M, despite being referred to as one by one of the characters, is not a princess.  To suggest that the weakness she exhibits in the game suddenly makes her another Princess Peach or Zelda is not an accurate assessment in the slightest.  Samus has always been the opposite of those characters, and nothing that occurs in Other M or any other Metroid game changes that.  She's neither an unstoppable badass, a weak little girl, or an empty shell masquerading as a character.  She's a character with more than just one or two dimensions, and despite what weakness she does show, she still has strength enough to do what it takes even when it hurts.  That isn't weakening or cheapening her character.  Ultimately, it adds to it because it makes her more relatable as a human being.  Someone capable of overcoming her problems rather than never having any problems at all. "
That's not even the point I was making. I'm done here.
Posted by bonbolapti

All I know is that samus is a girl, and everyone is freaking out about it 'now'.

Posted by Video_Game_King
@bonbolapti: 
 
Everybody already knew Samus was a girl, myself from firsthand experience.
Posted by bonbolapti
@Video_Game_King said:
" @bonbolapti:   Everybody already knew Samus was a girl, myself from firsthand experience. "
"and everyone is freaking out about it now."
 
(and of course she is, don't act like you're the first to know :P)
Posted by Video_Game_King
@bonbolapti: 
 
I think it's just the perceived sexualization of her. I think. I don't know, all this knowledge about Other M being divisive is completely new to me. I honestly had no idea.
Posted by bonbolapti
@Video_Game_King:  Don't worry, I'm probably in the same boat with you about it.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King said:
" @bonbolapti:   I think it's just the perceived sexualization of her. I think. I don't know, all this knowledge about Other M being divisive is completely new to me. I honestly had no idea. "
Well, it's been that way since the game was released.  I honestly don't think that there's been a more divisive game released all year.  Possibly the past several.
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Edited by Apathylad

I blame G4 for starting this whole sexism debate...I should also point out that in their Starcraft 2 review Webb took issue with the dancing stripper hologram, even though it was placed in a bar surrounded by men, and it was intended as an nod to WoW players. Instead, she goes off on a rant implying that Blizzard employees have issues with women.  
 
 
Oh, and as for the high heels, this is artwork from Super Smash Bros. Brawl: 
 
 
         

^^^^
Posted by Video_Game_King
@Apathylad: 
 
Putting the hologram in a bar full of guys doesn't exactly help. 
 
Those are high heels? They look more like regular heels.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King said:
" @Apathylad:   Putting the hologram in a bar full of guys doesn't exactly help.   Those are high heels? They look more like regular heels."

What difference does it make who's in the bar?  The inclusion of the dancer was an in-joke Easter egg, not a sign that Blizzard is filled with sexist pigs.
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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel: 
 
I don't play a lot of Blizzard games (or Halo, which is the first thing I think of when I hear "hologram girl"), so I'm lacking some context.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King: The dancer in the bar is just a modified female Night Elf WoW character model that's using the female Night Elf /dance emote.
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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel: 
 
That sounds like a crappy Easter egg, then. Also, the fact that I consistently want to read "Night Elf" as "Night Elf Mohawk" only helps to underline how little I know about Blizzard games.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King:   It's not the only Easter egg, though.  Blizzard put a number of little winks and nods to their other games in Starcraft II, and even through one or two Easter eggs from other games, like a Metroid that's visible in one stage (to bring this topic full circle).
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Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel: 
 
Starcraft II? I was thinking WoW. And to link this blog with my next, Konami Wai Wai World has Metroid looking thingies in it, as did Mega Man 2. Not that I'll be playing the latter.
Posted by Hailinel
@Video_Game_King said:
" @Hailinel:   Starcraft II? I was thinking WoW. And to link this blog with my next, Konami Wai Wai World has Metroid looking thingies in it, as did Mega Man 2. Not that I'll be playing the latter. "
Yes, Starcraft II.  What made you think I was talking about WoW?  It's a WoW-related Easter egg in Starcraft II.
Online
Posted by Video_Game_King
@Hailinel said:
" @Video_Game_King said:
" @Hailinel:   Starcraft II? I was thinking WoW. And to link this blog with my next, Konami Wai Wai World has Metroid looking thingies in it, as did Mega Man 2. Not that I'll be playing the latter. "
Yes, Starcraft II.  What made you think I was talking about WoW?  It's a WoW-related Easter egg in Starcraft II. "
Take your pick :P.