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Posted by Hailinel

@Mechabolic said:

@Hailinel: Though everyone loves a villain so I can see why everyone wants to make him out to be this horrible misogynistic asshole.

He doesn't need help to do that. He's done a fine enough job of that on his own.

Posted by Mechabolic

@NoelVeiga: No, by all means, he can write whatever he wants. Though when writing something like this he should know he was opening up a nasty can of worms.

Posted by YukoAsho

@thebrassthief said:

Wow. The ignorance this guy is showing makes my head hurt, from the basketball/football metaphor to what he thinks racism is. Capcom picked this guy up to do something for them? Like, under their name? What a mistake.

You know there are guys at Capcom who're like "Hey, thanks for fuckin' up the PR."

Posted by Mechabolic

@Hailinel: Cool opinion bro. I've seen the guy more than the clip that is on this article so I can see him as more than a "dirty, hillbilly, neckbeard, jerk, misogynistic asshole" that everyone seems to be yelling at here. The irony is palpable.

Posted by NoelVeiga

@Mechabolic said:

@NoelVeiga: No, by all means, he can write whatever he wants. Though when writing something like this he should know he was opening up a nasty can of worms.

But one that needs opening. Gaming "communities" have a bit too much license for people to be assholes to each other as a form of entertainment. You change that by calling it out and having this conversation. Say what you will about the "nasty", but most people have been civilized here and presented rational arguments. This is moving the state of gaming forward, and it wouldn't happen without the original article.

Edited by Brackynews

@KoolAidMan said:

@TruthTellah said:

This is a real shame. I've quite enjoyed Bakhtanians' commentary during tournaments for a while now, but he is quite wrong on this.

People certainly have a right to say whatever they like, but tournaments and eSports also have the right to enforce their own standards of conduct within a tournament environment. And language like this is simply unacceptable. High-level fight gaming does not need to be held back by things like this; instead, people should perhaps start acting like adults and take responsibility for their actions. Trash talking is one thing, but harassing someone and alienating people from feeling welcome in the fight scene isn't right. And if fight gaming plans on continuing its eSports rise, standards for how people act in tournaments must be encouraged and enforced for the betterment of the sport and the fighting game community at large.

QFT

No, QFTT -- Quoted From TruthTellah! Damn straight.

I can only wonder, imagine if Aris was the community manager for Twitch.tv, instead of Jared. (And one step further, let's say Twitch didn't fire Aris for these comments.) What state would the community OR the professional scene be in with locker room leadership like that? Jared can throw down and troll with the best of 'em, but he's aware enough to be asking the questions of what's appropriate for a venue.

The guy who taught me how to play Street Fighter II at the arcade when *I* was 15? One of the tallest, nicest and most respected dudes there. Other punks would talk some mess, and he would hadouken the smirks off their face. Shit went down at arcades, I have my own stories, I got my bruises. But that's the testosterone and braggadocio of immature kids who hate going home to face their parents, not a damn culture of delinquency that we can't grow out of.

Posted by Mechabolic

@NoelVeiga: Civilized? Really? The majority of posts have been "Screw that jerk! How dare he!" and have a general witchhunt vibe to it. Anyone that disagrees with the majority are instantly called nasty things. This is far from civilized.

Posted by linus_south

I'm a really big fan of this site. I am also, A very big stream monster, A dinosaur of the old arcade scene and, I really wish you would of just sat down and watched the full stream from each practice session. I watched it all and, there's a bunch of stuff that is cut out to paint a worse picture than what really went on. I am not going to harp on that and, I'm not defending anyone for running their mouth when they don't need to. But, I am going to say I'm very sad that this story is on giantbomb in this way.

Posted by Mechabolic

@linus_south: THANK YOU! An intelligent post in this sea of hate. I came here to unwind and end up in this sh*tstorm.

Edited by NoelVeiga

@Mechabolic said:

@NoelVeiga: Civilized? Really? The majority of posts have been "Screw that jerk! How dare he!" and have a general witchhunt vibe to it. Anyone that disagrees with the majority are instantly called nasty things. This is far from civilized.

I... really hope you get how ironic that post is.

But nope, that's not my experience of the thread. It's interesting to see how perspective filters perception, though.

Posted by Hardiharr

@NoelVeiga: Good Lord, how is this not the last word in this sordid, depressing "debate"? It was a great article. Aris may be a saint otherwise, but his opinions evidenced during the commentary are pretty thoroughly reprehensible, and it's hard to judge him by anything other than his words and actions in a given circumstance.

Posted by Jethuty

@Hailinel said:

@Jethuty said:

@Hailinel
@Jethuty
Just to clarify, Aris is a part of the tekken community, not the fighting game community. Its two seperate scenes, tekken/3d fighters and 2d fighters to be exact. If anything he represents them, not the bigger scene.
That distinction is pretty much the definition of bullshit. Tekken is a fighting game, therefore anyone competitively associated with it is part of the FGC. The community as a whole needs to wash their hands of morons like Aris regardless of the individual games or series they compete in.
Its not. You dont lump bf3/quake players witg cod players, and you dont blame the hon community for some shit a lol player did. Only thing thats bullshit is your pointed finger. The tekken community and the 2d community is two different things. Also stop blaming the community for the actions of one idiot. I dont go blaming the gb community because of your stupid comments, and neither should i.

They're all fighting games. From a distance, the specifics of which games are which don't matter. The FGC is comprised off all of the cliques and subcultures devoted to specific games and styles, whether it be 2D or 3D. It might look different to those down on the surface, but from up high, where people who are on the outside looking in, it's really all the same. Even more so considering that this supposed Tekken guy got in trouble for his antics at an event sponsored by Capcom devoted to the promotion of a Street Fighter-style game that just happens to feature Tekken characters.

So please, spare me the bullshit that Aris is specific to the Tekken community. He's not.

He is, what part of the arguement is it that you dont understand. The whole point of the cross assualt program was to try and get 2 different communities to fight. If you knew anything about what you were talking about, and not just looking at the surface as you said yourself, you would know the communities are vastly different. You're making generalizations that doesnt work. I could as well just say he is making the gaming community look bad, because its all games right? they are all the same from a distance, the specifics of the game doesnt matter, i mean, its played on a tv with a controller right? so yeah he speaks for our whole community, gb, moba/fps and fighting games a like. your mentality is part of the problem why games are percieved the way they are by the general public, and frankly thats bullshit.

my arguements still stands, stop generalizing.

Posted by Mechabolic

@NoelVeiga: What's that? Since you agree with the majority of the posts so it's ok? I don't think you know what irony means. Either way, i'm done with this political deb- er, discussion. Thanks for sensationalizing this molehill Patrick...

Posted by NoelVeiga

@Mechabolic said:

@NoelVeiga: What's that? Since you agree with the majority of the posts so it's ok? I don't think you know what irony means. Either way, i'm done with this political deb- er, discussion. Thanks for sensationalizing this molehill Patrick...

No, I meant that it's ironic that you find the tone of the debate lacking while also defending Aris' behaviour. Seems like a bit of a contradiction to me. Most people in the thread have stopped short of personally offensive stuff (not everyone, of course), which is what we're talking about in the first place. Hence, irony.

And Patrick's article is not sensationalist, really. It's pretty well researched and it quotes every side of the argument. It's not on him to avoid posting stuff that will cause debate, his job is to report thoroughly and fairly, and he's done that much.

Edited by Heartagram

Aris has always been like this from every single stream He has Been on. I wouldn't take any of his opinions as legitimate. I remember him talking about how he was going to ride away on his donkey on one stream because he was middle eastern. He's just a bit of a prick and I have no idea how he got to be the team tekken leader unless the people at capcom had literally no idea who he was.

Posted by OptimalPower

After reading through most of the comments, I still cannot comprehend how people can defend this guy.

Doesn't matter if his comments were in jest. Go try saying these things to someone and see what happens.

Posted by august

@Mechabolic: I don't think you know what irony means if you're sugesting we treat a man who is actively defending sexual harrasment with kid gloves.

Posted by YukoAsho

@Heartagram said:

Aris has always been like this from every single stream He has Been on. I wouldn't take any of his opinions as legitimate. I remember him talking about how he was going to ride away on his donkey on one stream because he was middle eastern. He's just a bit of a prick and I have no idea how he got to be the team tekken leader unless the people at capcom had literally no idea who he was.

Pretty much. Creepy mother fucker 100%

Posted by DocOc

saying SH is acceptable anywhere is shameful. So when Aris tries to explain it to be as something casual for him disturbs me. He can say the fight game community, but from the first video he seems to be the advocate.

Posted by myslead

I have no idea what's going on

Posted by actionTACO

@Mechabolic said:

@NoelVeiga: Civilized? Really? The majority of posts have been "Screw that jerk! How dare he!" and have a general witchhunt vibe to it. Anyone that disagrees with the majority are instantly called nasty things. This is far from civilized.

you're the one that waded into this thread and implied that posters that disagreed with you were angry, simpleminded, hypocrites that simply couldn't see the shades of grey with regards to someone making incredibly sexist remarks. not only that, but you also implied that the victim was "crying sexism" because she got her feelings hurt cause she's just some ~~*GaMeR GuRl*~~ that can't handle the pressure and not because, ya know, maybe she thought the dude was being sexist. then you have the gall to accuse people of trying to make "mountains out of mole hills" and accuse patrick of writing this article simply to stir up controversy and generate some MAD SITE HITTZZ.

you have continuously tried to attach spurious motivations to various groups and people in an sloppy attempt to deligitimize criticisms of someone that you seem to be emotionally attached to, for whatever reason. maybe you should look in the mirror before you accuse people of not being civil. or, at least, stop pretending to be some ultra-rational, independent free thinker that sees "the real picture" and is awashed in a sea of hyper-emotional, close minded, PC-minded people. basically, stop pretending to be stan in an episode of south park.

of course, instead you will probably just continue to argue your point harder. then, after enough people have told you that you're wrong, you'll make a parting shot or complain that people are being too rude, or bitch about "group think" and "political correctness" some more.

Posted by Zaxex

Realistically I think Aris has done more to ruin other peoples' experiences than his own. Spooky had a huge opportunity to work with Capcom and I think it'll be the last time that happens. He was instrumental in making Miranda want to leave a contest that offered $25,000, and the bad publicity alone will probably see the company refuse any such future risks.

The show is pretty flawed, but there might be potential in it; they will definitely sell some copies of the game because of the show.

I really would like the scene to grow and become more inclusive; and less incredibly fucking internet stupid. That said, I don't see much changing yet; especially when the closest it got has pretty much gone horribly for all involved.

I don't go to tournaments, so I'm only really interested in the FGC for entertainment, and information about the games. I'll probably keep doing what I have been, which is hiding the chat pretty much immediately when I open a fighting game stream, muting streams when the commentators decide to get racist and rolling my eyes whenever I inevitably hear or read something fucking stupid.

Posted by Gruff182

Oh, so the fighting game community is pathetic? Good to know.

Posted by optimusprime223

apart from lack of skill, this makes me NOT want to play fighting games and be part of that community...

Posted by outerabiz

Let me preface this by saying, sexism is bad.

"Previously, however, he did have his own personal Twitter account. What’s listed in his bio?

“Fuck you.”"

That ruined the whole article for me, that might be because i skimmed it and read that part before i read the whole thing, but it makes the article seem more like an opinion piece than any sort of real journalism, even though the journalistic workings and methods are there.

Sorry, im not a hater just pointing out something that stuck out to me.

Posted by 4outof5
Posted by Homeslice

Klepek -- shinin'!
 
Navarro's review and this piece are written so, so well. Love it. A little long-form textual business...goes down smooth with a video chaser.
 
Okay, it's late.

Posted by winstano

Whenever someone says "Whatever, this is America" to back up them being a dick, I just think of this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCKtfdVqK7c

Being an asshole =/= a prerequisite for being part of a gaming community.

Posted by Jethuty

@Gruff182 said:

Oh, so the fighting game community is pathetic? Good to know.

@optimusprime223 said:

apart from lack of skill, this makes me NOT want to play fighting games and be part of that community...

This is what im talking about. One douchebag doesnt represent the community, however the article is written in such a way that people believe he is a spokesperson for the communitty, doing harm to it.

Exactly what i was fearing. Aris is the asshole, not the community

Posted by Xpgamer7

Alright this is pretty similar to the internet, and though it's more of a strong image because it's in person and not a random user, you can see the parallels. They have crass humour and you have to accept it. I don't think it's the community in itself, but a large amount of users in the community.

I find you get almost desensitized. You start to tell the difference between humour and serious comments. It's still crass and rude, and not everyone can handle that. But you have to take one side or the other. Either allow people to make rude jokes, or stop them so that people like Jared can feel comfortable. It's a choice of freedom in the group vs. comfort levels. I remember a quote by Alex being about hanging a gutted body or something on an article. It was a joke referencing that something was trying to be violent but we've become so used to violence we expect something worse. But deeper than that the fact we all took this comment that viewed from one perspective is disturbing as a funny joke shows our nature as a community.

In this Jared made a reference to Phoenix being beaten in a game and someone yelling Rape that bitch! As it was a game, without actual intended harm, and the person's comment was intended as a joke not sexual harassment. We have to look at the desires of the people, not the actual meaning of the words. Otherwise a lot of what we hear online or on games would be horrible.

I don't subscribe to these actions myself but I see it in context. I'd rather things not be taken as seriously, because of our culture in general. I don't like hearing people make racist names on Mass effect or continuously swearing over Call of Duty. But I understand the point. I understand it's to take life lightly. We make the decision to join these competitions with that in mind. It brings it out in people.

I don't think either one is wrong per say, but more that both are opposite sides and you have to pick one. Thank you Patrick for showing us just the facts in the article and not a biased or opinionated view on it.

Posted by Christoffer

An interesting, sad, and yet hopeful, article. At least there's some people who want a change. Hopefully it's just a case of a "loud minority" wich will be fixed once everyone realizes this.

Aris use of metaphors is pure rhetorical comedy. If I don't like harrassments I should watch Starcraft instead of Street Fighter and the difference between these would be like a sandwich with or without onions? More like a sandwich and Kung Pao Chicken.

Posted by TheDudeOfGaming

@Mechabolic: I may or may not agree with you, but props for speaking your mind.

Anyway, when someone comes along and starts talking about sexism in video games, then he's a white knight defending chicks on the internet. Shit like this happens, and the guy is a retarded, inbred moron. But really, i don't care either way, the comments from youtube and posts on this thread are entertainment enough.

Posted by Bourbon_Warrior

Nice work Patrick havent seen this many hits on a article since the PSN meltdown.

Posted by Swoxx

@AnEternalEnigma said:

This Aris guy sounds like a gigantic idiot that needs to be slapped in the face repeatedly.

I may not like Jared's hair, but good for him for calling out this douche. Comparing misogyny to sports is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard.

This

Posted by TobbRobb

Jesus, what a fuckwad. Is he really gonna say sexual harassment is part of what makes fighting games unique? IS HE FUCKING RETARDED?

Posted by hunttis

@Pinworm45: Is it completely unfathomable to you that some people actually enjoy being offensive?

Dude, stop digging. Your hole is already deep enough. I'm SURE that assholes love being assholes.

Posted by Taefarinas

@unreal999: I didn't take this article to be about the fighting community as a whole at all. I saw it as a reflection on gaming as a whole still being a club that sometimes says really awful, offensive things. It is completely appropriate to draw attention to the way people are treated and it would be great if conversations like these eventually change what is appropriate to say to other gamers.

I know I'm oversensitive, but I still love to play games. It really detracts from my fun though when someone says they want to "rape" another player. I by no means am delusional and think that's actually what they want to do, but I still see one of my many friends that were raped and the pain they still have. It goes beyond name calling and into actual offense.

Edited by ZenTzen
Posted by Orbitz89

Women.. you can't live with them and you can't have heterosexual sex without them.

Oh i'm sorry was that sexist?

Posted by Bourbon_Warrior

This Threads Themesong

Posted by MideonNViscera

This sure got a lot of replies. Anyway, the fighting game community really sucks ass. Not because they're sexist, because honestly who cares, but because of the way they talk and act in general. Just a really annoying, mostly pathetic, group of people. Childish in so many ways. Just go to shoryuken.com and see for yourself haha

Posted by jkuc316

@Seroth said:

Would Aris forcing Kayo to marry him be considered harassment, too?

When it's a Tranny, it's totally ok! Just like how Mike Haggar can punch Poison because "she" isn't really a Woman!

Posted by jkuc316

@dudeglove: LOL they're just salty, Ignore them

Edited by CrimsonMoonMist

No Aris, it's a shortcoming of the community that needs to be weeded out.

How the hell would being more genderly open break a community?

There's a difference between freedom of speech and just being a fucking ass,

and it should be punished.

Posted by Kyodra

I think they should simply state in the rules of these tournaments that that saying that kind of crap in the tournament area gets you thrown out, whether you're a player or just in the audience. That would immediately help these people mature up a bit. This Bakhtanians seems to think freedom of speech exists to allow them to be a dick, what a complete idiot. Actions of people like him stop other people enjoying the same thing they do, thereby harming the whole community, and popularity of fighting games. If they want to act like immature idiots they can do it on the internet or in their parents' basements, in my opinion.

Good and informative article, I didn't realize this kind of culture was associated with fighting games.

Posted by optimusprime223

@Jethuty Your right he is, but he is also saying that his comments are deeply engrained into the fighting game scene, which is hard enough to break into without being alienated by that level assholery. IF the community does consider those types of comments and behaviour acceptable, it is not a community I want to be apart of. To be fair, I never will be as I simply do not have the time or reactions to make it to that level of fighting game play, and I am not labelling the entire community as sexist, racist assholes since I know a lot of them will be great people who talk a bit of smack. This guy isnt doing that and is bringing the entire community down and alienating people from joining when, especially as a spokesperson for the genre, he should be showing what a great community it is, even if it does get a little heated.

Posted by BuddyRevell1

ever wonder why most sexist guys look like a woman wouldn't go near them with a ten foot pole (unless she had a golem fetish) mother fucker is UGLY!!

Posted by GunslingerPanda

So basically, sexual harassment and teenage jokes are "a part" of the competitive fighting games scene?

Right. Glad I'm a StarCraft man.

Online
Edited by MachoFantastico

That was... rather disgusting. Not shocked though as most of them are total douches, try speaking to some of them.

I'm amazed that girl had the control to not beat the living crap out of him.

Edited by ZenTzen

@CrimsonMoonMist: One persons words doesnt mean he talks for everyone and besides what he said was taken out of context, heres what he has to say on the whole situation:

http://www.twitlonger.com/show/g65iqn

"What I was trying to communicate is that mild hostility has always been a defining characteristic of the fighting game scene. Back when arcades were more prevalent, people didn’t like newcomers, and players needed to fight and pay their dues to get respect. The debate I was in was with a person who supported professional leagues, who have intent to censor the community to make it more accessible. I think the sink or swim mentality is something that defined our culture, and if that succeeds it removes something which has been important to help create some of the best fighting game players of our time. I was unfortunately unable to make this point clearly. Again, I am deeply sorry for offending anyone. This was a combination of the people taking things out of context and my own inability in the heat of the moment to defend myself and the community I have loved for over 15 years. "