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Posted by FUMN

@groin: Cool. How does does that make him a spokesman for the community?

Posted by groin

@FUMN said:

@groin: Cool. How does does that make him a spokesman for the community?

Find a quote of me saying that.

Edited by FUMN

@groin: Ok. He's done that. Wonderful.

That doesnt qualify him to respond to an interview as a representative of the FGC.

And it sure as hell doesnt make me ignorant.

Posted by groin

@FUMN said:

@groin: Ok. He's done that. Wonderful.

That doesnt qualify him to respond to an interview as a representative of the FGC.

When did I say he was? Present a quote please.

Posted by FUMN

@groin: I was responding to the person critiquing me for saying that lordofultima has only done a eryu tutorial. Why would Patrick expect a response from him?

Posted by Legendary

@FUMN: I'm not acting like you don't understand. I can tell you don't. You're assuming lots of shit, friend.

I have a question for all of you, which been on my mind for quite awhile. Do we include Stream Monsters as a part of the FGC? I've heard Aris catered to the stream's trolling.

Posted by groin

@FUMN said:

@groin: I was responding to the person critiquing me for saying that lordofultima has only done a eryu tutorial. Why would Patrick expect a response from him?

Then direct the reply whoever you are actually talking to.

Edited by FUMN

@Legendary: Being a stream monster has nothing to do with being part of the FGC.

A stream monster would say: That Nigger is GOOD!? :D :D D: :D

A Fgc member would say: holy shit, that guys reactions are sick.

And OFC pretend like I dont understand the FGC.

I in no way defend Aris actions.

Posted by FUMN

@groin: Keep calling me ignorant then.

Posted by Gaff

People really do presume too much, too often...

@FUMN said:

From the select links that I checked, Patrick has asked via Twitter for a direct response from Team Sp00ky, LordOfUltima, and various faces that form the FG community. The problem is that none of the aforementioned names represent any large part of the FGC. They are not spokesmen, they are members. Their opinion is moot. Their opinion is just that; THEIR opinion. NOT the opinion of the FGC.

First, Patrick never solicited most of them first.

LordofUltima:

nycfurby AvoidThePuddle Super__Yan As a big giantbomb and patrickklepek fan that article really upsets me. Sensationalized is right.

https://twitter.com/#!/lordofultima/status/174588540687089668

Arturo Sanchez:

Thankfully AvoidThePuddle and Super__Yanlistened to me and did not talk to dtoid or Giantbomb since I knew it would be sensationalized :(

https://twitter.com/#!/nycfurby/status/174587589486055424

If you want to prove something is wrong, you should come up with counter-arguments. If you claim that a story is sensationalized, point it out. If you call someone's integrity in question, you should back that up with proof. What you don't do is talk smack and walk away. And again, we won't know who has responded until the follow-up article hits, but judging by Patrick's frustration it doesn't look too good. The most promising "positive" reaction has been Mark Julio, aka MarkMan, founder of SDTekken and now Community and Sponsorship manager at Madcatz. Not really a man with plenty of free time (launching the new SFxT Stick, representing Madcatz at major tournaments, commentating, single father) and he still found time to offer a talk with Patrick.

Also, assuming that Patrick is looking for the end-all-and-be-all declaration from the fighting game community is, again, presuming too much. He's not going, nor intending, to ascend a mountain, speak with the fighting game gods and come down with giant marble slabs that speak for all of the gaming community. Has the idea ever crossed your mind that the prominent "faces" of the fighting game community:

  1. Have been in the fighting game community for a long time, before this shitstorm happened?
  2. Have seen their fair share of smack talking from spending all those years in the FGC?
  3. Have a unique perspective on the historic development of said smack talking?
  4. Have plenty of heart-warming, positive stories about the FGC that prove that those people aren't all that bad?

Apart from all these points being direct answers to the big question (do Aris' claims about the nature of the FGC hold water?), they would be fascinating historical accounts about the FGC as a whole. Imagine the Cannon brothers and Seth Killian talking about the very early days of EVO, the first tournaments, getting international players and its explosive growth. Alex Valle about playing in the early days of the scene, his first tournaments, playing well into his 30s (?) and the difference between the players then and the players now. There are probably tons of stories out there, but no one is telling them because no one is engaging the mainstream press.

If Capcom followed the Tekken scene with a slight bit of interest, they would understand that giving Aris a live microphone was like giving a child a handgun.

Again, Madcatz' Mark Julio is a prominent figure in the Tekken community, a regular at major tournaments and Madcatz is one of the main sponsors. I find it hard to believe (though not impossible) that a main sponsor would be kept out of the dark in these matters.

The idea of Phoenix being a bitch is completely accurate, and it was a bad analogy by the questioner. Phoenix was a character in MVC3 that, after out playing her for 90 seconds, could destroy you in less than five seconds without an ounce of skill. She was a bitch. If Phoenix was a male character, she would be a bitch. There is no way around it. If you played Vanilla MVC3, you would understand how that this character could completely undermine your skill with pure luck.

Whether or not Phoenix' Dark Phoenix super was completely overpowered in Vanilla MvC3 is not the point. People could argue that pre-nerf Sentinel with his life lead, damage output and reach was a better fit? Never mind. The problem is equating bitch - a very gender specific word - to the character, and by association the player, and far worse, the word "rape", again, a very gender specific word.

Last thing: I would refer to David Sirlin's age old book "Playing to Win". In short, there is no such thing as cheap. Whether it is Magneto x Storm x Sentinel in MvC2, or Dark Phoenix x ANYTHING in MvC3, you're unnecessarily hamstringing yourself to win. Throwing isn't cheap. Fireball spam isn't cheap. Dark Phoenix + full level 3 X-Factor isn't cheap. Whether you like it or not: You were outplayed.

What has the FGC done in response?
W-

Stop, again, stop. Again: You can't claim that there is no UNITED FGC and then point to two statements on two of the FGC's major websites as proof of a concerted effort by the FGC to clean its act. Of course, you could've mentioned IPlayWinner's banning of Marn and another commentator, SRK's subsequent pulling of WNF's first season EVO seeding points(trying to help here), so, yes, something is happening. Is it too late to start, after almost 25 years in isolation? Maybe, then again, is treating each other with respect and dignity that much to ask?

I guess there's always the MLG, if things don't pan out?

Posted by Brewmaster_Andy

@FUMN said:

@Legendary: So LordOfUltima has done tutorials. How does that make him the face of a community?

SkiSonic was never directly asked by Partrick for a interview. So what about that. Yeah he does a podcast. But why should it be focused on this one issue in the FGC? Aris is a nonissue among the SF community. The SF community doesnt give a shit about a tekken player. Why now? SRK has voiced their opinion on how they feel, which is who sponsors SkiSonics podcast. What else is there to say.

Auturo does talk about how he wants the community to grow. But he also broke the story that Jago and Mike Ross might be fixing matches. He's a little busy because hes balancing ostracism by the FGC and responding to Patrick's questions on this different controversy.

Keep acting like I dont understand the FGC. Shut the fuck up.

You're not exactly doing much to change the stereotype of "FGC" members.

Posted by ZeForgotten
@Brewmaster_Andy said:

@FUMN said:

@Legendary: So LordOfUltima has done tutorials. How does that make him the face of a community?

SkiSonic was never directly asked by Partrick for a interview. So what about that. Yeah he does a podcast. But why should it be focused on this one issue in the FGC? Aris is a nonissue among the SF community. The SF community doesnt give a shit about a tekken player. Why now? SRK has voiced their opinion on how they feel, which is who sponsors SkiSonics podcast. What else is there to say.

Auturo does talk about how he wants the community to grow. But he also broke the story that Jago and Mike Ross might be fixing matches. He's a little busy because hes balancing ostracism by the FGC and responding to Patrick's questions on this different controversy.

Keep acting like I dont understand the FGC. Shut the fuck up.

You're not exactly doing much to change the stereotype of "FGC" members.

He's the heart and soul of "the FGC". Last I checked some troll/orgre looking guy said that shittalking and making fun of women because they're women = what fighting games are all about
Online
Posted by FLStyle

@Gaff: MLG have been trying to get Capcom onside with the whole eSports thing for at least the past year to my knowledge, but Capcom is staying away with the claim that they're focusing on the community. So MLG had to look elsewhere to begin their introduction of fighting games to eSports. Enter NetherRealm Studios, Namco Bandai and Atlus.

@Brewmaster_Andy: @ZeForgotten: May I invite you to check out the following recording of last night's UMvC3 Grand Final at Final Round? I hope you find it a more accurate representation, thanks.

Online
Posted by GlenTennis

I just got to this post. Very well done.

Posted by Hailinel

@FLStyle: I know you want to keep peddling this side of the community as the "true" side, but the truth is that despite all the positives, there are some terrible elements to it as well; elements that are too exposed to even classify as an underbelly. And it doesn't help when figures like Arturo are actively dissuading people from going to members of the press to talk about it.

Edited by ThePhantomnaut

So how about that Japanese Marvel Tech?!

 ボオヤ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by FLStyle

@GlenTennis: Thanks!

@Hailinel: The fact that you believe there are positives in the FGC is good enough for me. I fully accept that nothing is perfect, as shown in the media over the past week. I can only hope that the negatives are worked upon over the next 12 months and that in turn that the positive side is also given its time of day too and then the likes of Arturo won't be put off by the media.

@ThePhantomnaut said:

So how about that Japanese Marvel Tech?!
ボオヤ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No way! If only there was a log in the background haha

Online
Posted by Hailinel

@FLStyle: I never thought nor claimed that there weren't. But this community cheerleading over the past week has gotten tedious. There's only so many times I cans see the I Heart the FGC video reposted before I wonder if the FGC is in fact willing or able to discuss its faults with people outside the community.

Posted by FLStyle

@Hailinel: If Tom Cannon has agreed to speak with Patrick as it seems he has you may get your answer.

Online
Posted by Brewmaster_Andy

@FLStyle: I should have added in my original post, but I definitely agree that there are positives in the community. I just found it ironic that one of the most ardent defenders of the community over the last few pages is also acting toward the stereotype he seems to be trying to get rid of. I think you did a great job with this post, very informative.

Posted by Gaff

@FLStyle: http://www.giantbomb.com/profile/newmarcom/mlg-vs-the-street-fighter-community/30-51762/ http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=430842

From looking at the GAF thread, in 2005 MLG partnered with EVO. FGC shat on the FPS community, and vice versa. SRK blew a gasket, Capcom Japan caught wind of it and barred MLG from ever doing Capcom games for fear of "harming the community". The last couple of years has seen the MLG taking up non-Capcom fighting games, in what I presume to be a gesture of good will and competence towards Capcom Japan. Of course, the FGC is having none of that. And around that time Justin Wong and Marn had to resort to asking for donations to go to ESWC, Electronic Sports World Cup in France. Mind you, I think this was before Justin Wong got a sponsorship deal with Evil Geniuses. And whether sponsorships are still a part of "being grass roots" is a question for another time.

I distinctly remember this, because, at its core, it was the same discussion: keep things grass"roots, warts and all, or get professional and organised.

Posted by Hailinel

@FLStyle said:

@Hailinel: If Tom Cannon has agreed to speak with Patrick as it seems he has you may get your answer.

I'll wait and see on that. For now, I'm still skeptical.

Edited by Dan_CiTi

@PixelPrinny said:

Personally, I think that if the community didn't tolerate, let alone play up to, the retarded "stream monsters", this really wouldn't even be an issue. But somehow "stream monster" has become an endearing term for assholes trying to outdo each others attempts at trolling and being as despicable as possible. I hope this media attention might actually be a wakeup call for the higher ups in the community to start telling these morons to shut the fuck up.

If you're watching the stream and with the chat, you're a stream monster. Obviously there are levels of it, like people who make fake accounts to troll, but even Ultra David, one of the most mild-mannered and popular commentators, a part of the ST community, and a lawyer has troll accounts.

Posted by Hailinel

@Dan_CiTi said:

@PixelPrinny said:

Personally, I think that if the community didn't tolerate, let alone play up to, the retarded "stream monsters", this really wouldn't even be an issue. But somehow "stream monster" has become an endearing term for assholes trying to outdo each others attempts at trolling and being as despicable as possible. I hope this media attention might actually be a wakeup call for the higher ups in the community to start telling these morons to shut the fuck up.

If you're watching the stream and with the chat, you're a stream monster. Obviously there are levels of it, like people who make fake accounts to troll, but even Ultra David, one of the most mild-mannered and popular commentators, a part of the ST community, and a lawyer has troll accounts.

Then Ultra David needs to set a better example.

Posted by FLStyle

@Hailinel: Understood.

@Brewmaster_Andy: Yeah, I won't lie when I say that there's been some poor choice of words spoke on behalf of defending the FGC when this whole thing started and I've been a bit disappointed with some of it. The only saving grace was that the Aris thing happened just before Final Round, giving the internet a chance to see the FGC at its best as well as its worst. Thanks for reading.

@Gaff: Ahhh I've often suspected that something must have already happened to set things off. And here we are again with bad news and no Capcom games at MLG. But at least I now I believe the FGC is in a position to get rid of its worse tendencies. Thanks to the greater exposure of the internet, the good points are being seen by more and the bad points are getting exposed and punished.

Online
Edited by Dan_CiTi

@Hailinel: To be fair, stream monsters have been slipping lately. They used to have good discussions and come up with some good stuff, but honestly now they have devolved into this majority of mindless trolls & spammers. It sucks, because the chat at big tournaments used to be pretty fun, now I just turn it off most of the time. The only good thing lately has been some of the names, particularly the Empire Arcadia mock names and even those are inconsistent. The whole #teammirandasthighs thing was sad, pathetic, and horrible. I couldn't even stand it before it blew up. Like really, low res screen caps of this girls legs on a dedicated tumblr? Pathetic. No offense but it is not even like Miranda is a model or anything...you can find better looking girls at the mall any given day of the week.

Posted by Hailinel

@Dan_CiTi said:

@Hailinel: To be fair, stream monsters have been slipping lately. They used to have good discussions and come up with some good stuff, but honestly now they have devolved into this majority of mindless trolls & spammers. It sucks, because the chat at big tournaments used to be pretty fun, now I just turn it off most of the time. The only good thing lately has been some of the names, particularly the Empire Arcadia mock names and even those are inconsistent. The whole #teammirandasthighs thing was sad, pathetic, and horrible. I couldn't even stand it before it blew up. Like really, low res screen caps of this girls legs on a dedicated tumblr? Pathetic. No offense but it is not even like Miranda is a model or anything...you can find better looking girls at the mall any given day of the week.

You had a good argument going until you decided to insert your own commentary regarding Miranda's physical attractiveness.

Edited by Dan_CiTi

@Hailinel said:

@Dan_CiTi said:

@Hailinel: To be fair, stream monsters have been slipping lately. They used to have good discussions and come up with some good stuff, but honestly now they have devolved into this majority of mindless trolls & spammers. It sucks, because the chat at big tournaments used to be pretty fun, now I just turn it off most of the time. The only good thing lately has been some of the names, particularly the Empire Arcadia mock names and even those are inconsistent. The whole #teammirandasthighs thing was sad, pathetic, and horrible. I couldn't even stand it before it blew up. Like really, low res screen caps of this girls legs on a dedicated tumblr? Pathetic. No offense but it is not even like Miranda is a model or anything...you can find better looking girls at the mall any given day of the week.

You had a good argument going until you decided to insert your own commentary regarding Miranda's physical attractiveness.

It is just that if you refused to be on the side of the people on mirandasthighs thing, you were "gay" according to the mob in the chat. I know it is an immature sentiment, but that is why I included it. I just do not understand the mentality very well. I understand parts of a woman are attractive, but I did not get the obsession because it is not like Alysha Nett or Christina Hendricks came on the show. This is a girl who has been on streams before(competitive Catherine is oddly interesting) and at plenty of tournaments. I have said it a couple times to kind of frame it in reality and give the girl a break. She's just a girl in a game community, not a model in the public eye and should not be treated like that at all. Even though no one should be harassed, it is more expected for a lady who poses for the camera to be a target of such things and be more prepared for it. The only thing is, that whole public eye thing totally changed these past few weeks.

At least I think that's my thought...kinda juggling five things at once right now.

Posted by chocolaterhinovampire

Jared Rae is a total hipster wiener....but what Aris did was disgusting...everyone is a wiener in my books...anyone with me on the whole Jared thing? Does it annoy anyone else?

Posted by S0ndor

@groin said:

@dungareeshiraz said:

I just wanted to say something about the Larry video. He looks like an amazing guy who works hard to bring people together to share their hobby.

At the same time I couldn't take my attention off the sidebar chat. It was like a volcano of racism erupting in real time. The only thing that (briefly) stopped the slurs was the announcement that his mother died.

Well I certainly agree that Larry would be an ideal model for how the FGC could behave, the live stream chat is the true representative of the community.

Leaders can be extremely virtuous, but that does not mean their constituents are.

Terrible stream chat is a problem with every community on twitch.tv. People like iNcontrol and Destiny (SC2 players) are constantly attacked while streaming. This type of shit also happens on XBox live, PSN, battle.net and etc. It is not exclusive to the FGC.

Indeed, even TNT, with its relatively limited amount of viewers, attracts a significant amount of random assholes who mock and bash the Bombsquad in the chat. These are people who know nothing about the site, and yet are extremely vocal with their bashing. We could safely assume that this is a universal problem.

Posted by Giacomito

@chocolaterhinovampire: I'm 100 % with you!! never liked Jared, don't understand why everybody on GB seems to

Posted by Hailinel

@Giacomito said:

@chocolaterhinovampire: I'm 100 % with you!! never liked Jared, don't understand why everybody on GB seems to

Jared is a friend of members of the Giant Bomb staff. He's been on the Bombcast a couple of times and was the one responsible for introducing the GB community to Jackie Chan in Fists of Fire.

Posted by Giacomito

@Hailinel said:

@Giacomito said:

@chocolaterhinovampire: I'm 100 % with you!! never liked Jared, don't understand why everybody on GB seems to

Jared is a friend of members of the Giant Bomb staff. He's been on the Bombcast a couple of times and was the one responsible for introducing the GB community to Jackie Chan in Fists of Fire.

I understand why the staff likes him. But just because he's their friend and has been on the bombcast a couple of times doesn't mean everybody in the GB community has to like him too and I don't understand why they do. He comes across as someone who thinks he's better than everybody else (that's just the feeling I get from him).

Posted by Jumanji

@Hailinel said:

@Dan_CiTi said:

@Hailinel: To be fair, stream monsters have been slipping lately. They used to have good discussions and come up with some good stuff, but honestly now they have devolved into this majority of mindless trolls & spammers. It sucks, because the chat at big tournaments used to be pretty fun, now I just turn it off most of the time. The only good thing lately has been some of the names, particularly the Empire Arcadia mock names and even those are inconsistent. The whole #teammirandasthighs thing was sad, pathetic, and horrible. I couldn't even stand it before it blew up. Like really, low res screen caps of this girls legs on a dedicated tumblr? Pathetic. No offense but it is not even like Miranda is a model or anything...you can find better looking girls at the mall any given day of the week.

You had a good argument going until you decided to insert your own commentary regarding Miranda's physical attractiveness.

WOOW

Posted by dungareeshiraz

@S0ndor said:

@groin said:

@dungareeshiraz said:

I just wanted to say something about the Larry video. He looks like an amazing guy who works hard to bring people together to share their hobby.

At the same time I couldn't take my attention off the sidebar chat. It was like a volcano of racism erupting in real time. The only thing that (briefly) stopped the slurs was the announcement that his mother died.

Well I certainly agree that Larry would be an ideal model for how the FGC could behave, the live stream chat is the true representative of the community.

Leaders can be extremely virtuous, but that does not mean their constituents are.

Terrible stream chat is a problem with every community on twitch.tv. People like iNcontrol and Destiny (SC2 players) are constantly attacked while streaming. This type of shit also happens on XBox live, PSN, battle.net and etc. It is not exclusive to the FGC.

Indeed, even TNT, with its relatively limited amount of viewers, attracts a significant amount of random assholes who mock and bash the Bombsquad in the chat. These are people who know nothing about the site, and yet are extremely vocal with their bashing. We could safely assume that this is a universal problem.

Good points guys. I follow Starcraft 2 streams and the hate is just as predominantly there. But maybe that means many communities just haven't had their controversy moment like the FGC had.

Posted by FLStyle

The issue of sexism in competitive gaming has come to the forefront recently, but it's been a problem for many years. David and James speak with four guests, Monique Mendoza, Kara Leung, Sherry Nhan, and Tricia Sugita, about what it's like to be a woman in a competitive gaming community, how women in gaming are treated, and what can be done to provide a better atmosphere for women gamers.

Sorry for the lack of editing, I just transferred it here directly from Twitch because my download and upload speeds would have made a file like this take forever.

Please subscribe here, follow us at http://twitch.tv/ultrachentv, and like us at http://facebook.com/ultrachentv. Also follow David on Twitter at @UltraDavid, James on Twitter at @jchensor, and the show at @UltraChenTV.

  • Show starts about 3 minutes into the video
  • There's a big loud noise at 5:58 and a few more into the video, watch out for that
  • James and David's volume does vary because they're sharing a mic
Online
Posted by MordeaniisChaos

@Sooty said:

Every time people call it the FGC I just hear Michael Bluth saying "Don't call it that."

Posted by EliminatoR

I have huge respect for the fighting game community, mostly because they break the nerdy gamer stereotype and also bring more diversity to the gaming scene as well.

I started watching a lot of fighting game tournaments and really liking them, especially when they are backed up by some great commentary (loud, hype, over the top, slang)

All I can say is that I am looking forward to further events, and seeing these guys respecting each other and building a great community around a great genre.

Posted by James_Giant_Peach

@EliminatoR said:

I have huge respect for the fighting game community, mostly because they break the nerdy gamer stereotype and also bring more diversity to the gaming scene as well.

Trust me, to the average Joe Public out there, seeing someone who devotes a lot of their life to video games and seriously plays them for money, is NOT breaking the 'nerdy gamer stereotype'.

Posted by CaptainCody

@James_Giant_Peach said:

@EliminatoR said:

I have huge respect for the fighting game community, mostly because they break the nerdy gamer stereotype and also bring more diversity to the gaming scene as well.

Trust me, to the average Joe Public out there, seeing someone who devotes a lot of their life to video games and seriously plays them for money, is NOT breaking the 'nerdy gamer stereotype'.

Hey, it's better that actual hardcore gamers fit the stereotype rather than annoying drones who play CoD an hour a day calling themselves nerds.