#1 Posted by Fantus1984 (59 posts) -

Hey all giant bombers,

Last Sunday I got to try out the beta test so I thought I would share the changes I found in the beta and what has actually changed from the original game and less of a let's play of it for people just wanting detail.

#2 Posted by Cecil (21 posts) -

Thank for sharing! Game is looking great can't wait to play it.

#3 Posted by Fantus1984 (59 posts) -

Yeah - looking forward to getting another try this sunday and doing that boss I missed!

#4 Edited by Karkarov (3056 posts) -

I hate to say it, but every time I hear someone say "be prepared to die... (all over) again" I just want to punch someone in the face. The borked challenge which went from ninja gaiden cheap to actually pretty easy is not what makes the game good, and your death count is pretty much meaningless. Game does look improved though, being able to attack in different directions when locked was really needed.

#5 Posted by Fantus1984 (59 posts) -

@karkarov: That's fair enough, it is a cheesy line now but was a powerful one when the orginal Dark Souls came out.

Demon souls was unfair, Dark souls less so but felt like it at time. But it was mainly the players fault for not being overly caution. The difficulty of the beta wasn't to hard for the sorcerer but again I'm not sure if the characters were scaled right for this part of the game.

Game is very much improved and has been polished a lot more now. :)

#6 Posted by Carlos1408 (1495 posts) -

Some very interesting changes! Cannot wait for this game. I'm killing time by trying to S rank Dark Souls, just got the Knight's Honor achievement left.

#7 Posted by Tennmuerti (8059 posts) -

Some good info, appreciated.

#8 Posted by Zeik (2342 posts) -

@fantus1984: What was unfair about Demon's Souls? The game was balanced the same way as Dark Souls, where any real challenge derives from a lack of knowledge or skill over the game just punishing you for the sake of punishing you. If you go through that game a second time, or after playing Dark Souls, you'd have a dramatically easier time.

The way they handled the crystal lizards is the only thing that comes to mind as blatantly unfair. You miss one and it's gone permanently? Fuck that.

#9 Posted by Fantus1984 (59 posts) -

@zeik:

I should of been more clearer, the difficulty in Demon Souls was a lot harder than Dark Souls in the beginning. They were equally as mean as each other but took Dark Souls time to get there and I consider it being the Capra Demon. It just felt unfair the entry in to Demon Souls was a lot higher and crueler.

I enjoyed the hardness and was a greater reward of beating / exploiting the enemy because they seem so unfair. Using a bow and arrow to kill most of the bosses in the swamps in demon souls. Find that one angle I can't be hit.

Also every game is easier second time though :P

#10 Posted by TheHT (11099 posts) -

Great video. Perfect ending!

Might dabble more in magic this time around, looks like fun.

#11 Edited by BoOzak (902 posts) -

@karkarov said:

I hate to say it, but every time I hear someone say "be prepared to die... (all over) again" I just want to punch someone in the face. The borked challenge which went from ninja gaiden cheap to actually pretty easy is not what makes the game good, and your death count is pretty much meaningless. Game does look improved though, being able to attack in different directions when locked was really needed.

You mean Ninja Gaiden for the NES? or Xbox? because I wouldnt consider either cheap. But I agree about the tagline (I thought it was "go beyond death" but I digress) focusing on the difficulty seems like a gimmicky way to portray the franchise. But people have to market the game somehow and difficulty is what Dark Souls is known for at this point.

Anyway, good video. I completly ignored spellcasters when I played, as I never found them as satisfying to play as in the original game. But it's cool to hear that they've been given different variants on their attacks. The boss you missed was fairly easy and pretty early on. I'm not sure it's as caster friendly though because it involves quickly damaging necromancers while evading pinwheels. I also like how the UI clearly displays your character to the right of the screen so if you have to quickly swap out items you can even do it while moving.

My only complaint is that they brought back restorative health/mana items. Maby there's some rubber banding involved to make sure you cant pick up too many (like certain enemies not respawning as you pointed out) But that was one of the things that made Dark Souls a much better game than Demon's Souls. I practicly walked through Demon's Souls unscathed due to spamming spells and how easy it was to recover mana, and as you've said the AI sometimes cant handle being bombarded with magic. I also wasnt a fan of the gradually diminishing life bar but I understand why they brought back death nerfing. (probably not a term but i'm going to use it ;p) Most people need more of an incentive than online play to get out of hollow form.

#12 Posted by Zeik (2342 posts) -

@fantus1984 said:

@zeik:

I should of been more clearer, the difficulty in Demon Souls was a lot harder than Dark Souls in the beginning. They were equally as mean as each other but took Dark Souls time to get there and I consider it being the Capra Demon. It just felt unfair the entry in to Demon Souls was a lot higher and crueler.

I enjoyed the hardness and was a greater reward of beating / exploiting the enemy because they seem so unfair. Using a bow and arrow to kill most of the bosses in the swamps in demon souls. Find that one angle I can't be hit.

Also every game is easier second time though :P

Depends on what you mean. The first level of Demon's Souls (the one after the tutorial) is actually easier than Dark Souls IMO. The difficulty goes up fairly significantly after you're free to go where you want though, partially because you have a lot of options and little direction. Dark Souls does have a more guided and more gradual difficulty curve in beginning.

I definitely had a way harder time with my first run of Demon's Souls, since it was my introduction into the series, but having played both Demon's Souls and Dark Souls several times the difficulty is pretty equal once you know what you're doing. In fact I think Demon's Souls is actually easier in some ways.

#13 Edited by Zeik (2342 posts) -

@boozak said:

My only complaint is that they brought back restorative health/mana items. Maby there's some rubber banding involved to make sure you cant pick up too many (like certain enemies not respawning as you pointed out) But that was one of the things that made Dark Souls a much better game than Demon's Souls. I practicly walked through Demon's Souls unscathed due to spamming spells and how easy it was to recover mana, and as you've said the AI sometimes cant handle being bombarded with magic. I also wasnt a fan of the gradually diminishing life bar but I understand why they brought back death nerfing. (probably not a term but i'm going to use it ;p) Most people need more of an incentive than online play to get out of hollow form.

It's hard to say how it will affect the game as a whole, but I like their approach with the healing items in this game. The Estus Flasks are still there, and they heal a lot quickly, but they seem a bit harder to use mid-battle and are more restricted. The gems on the other hand are plentiful, but heal your HP slowly over time and don't get restored at bonfires, but you can move a bit while using them, making them a bit more viable in a pinch.

I think there's a good balancing act there of knowing when to use which type of healing in a given situation.

#14 Edited by Karkarov (3056 posts) -

@boozak said:

@karkarov said:

I hate to say it, but every time I hear someone say "be prepared to die... (all over) again" I just want to punch someone in the face. The borked challenge which went from ninja gaiden cheap to actually pretty easy is not what makes the game good, and your death count is pretty much meaningless. Game does look improved though, being able to attack in different directions when locked was really needed.

You mean Ninja Gaiden for the NES? or Xbox? because I wouldnt consider either cheap. But I agree about the tagline (I thought it was "go beyond death" but I digress) focusing on the difficulty seems like a gimmicky way to portray the franchise. But people have to market the game somehow and difficulty is what Dark Souls is known for at this point.

Maybe you didn't play much NES Ninja Gaiden? Those games had some down right BS'y segments, multiple get hit = die moments, long and easy to fail jump puzzles, death = redo almost whole level, etc etc. At least it wasn't Battletoads, maybe I should have said that? In the end you are right though, I meant more like recent iterations that have seen some lovable inclusions like ... enemies attacking you from off screen, camera angle switches/level design that make it hard to have a clue what you are doing, enemies attacking you from locations where you either can't hit back or can't realistically do so at the moment, stuff like that. In Ninja Gaiden taking a couple extra hit's to things like that isn't a big deal... in a Souls game it basically means you are dead.

Either way it sounds like they are going more towards the Demon's Souls balance style than the Dark Souls, which is a good idea. Dark Souls did start easy, but it had some very frustrating and hokey levels/moments later. Demon's Souls always felt pretty much fair... other than on that one ledge where if you used lock on you could accidentally throw yourself off a cliff.

#15 Posted by CptBedlam (4449 posts) -

Really enjoyed the video. This is the first time I got to see some of the sorcerer's spells (other than the first Soul Arrow).

May I suggest to use a little less intensive music tracks to accompany the voice-over? Something more soothing would be nice. ;)

#16 Edited by CptBedlam (4449 posts) -

@karkarov: Give him a break. You die a lot in these games, the tag line is not wrong. This is not really the place to discuss whether the challenge is fair or not.

#17 Edited by BoOzak (902 posts) -

@karkarov: Most platformers of that era were like that. And yes I have played all Ninja Gaidens to completion. (even the arcade version) Games I would constitute cheap are as you said, ones that are badly designed and dont give you a chance. But just because a game is unforgiving doesnt make it cheap.

EDIT: I do agree with you about later iterations of Ninja Gaiden. (epecially NG2 on the XB360 which was damn near broken on higher difficulties) But I dont consider any iteration of the original NG to be cheap. Even on the hardest difficulty Ninja Gaiden gives you a fair chance.

#18 Edited by Fantus1984 (59 posts) -

@cptbedlam: Cheers man, I will look in to calmer music next time - just gotten obsessed with the oc-remix album of FF6 of late :)

Also thanks for the complements as well everyone, it's why I enjoy doing videos. May not be as big as other you tubers but it's hobbie I enjoy doing.

#19 Posted by jakob187 (21662 posts) -

I've purposefully kept myself in the dark about anything related to the game. However, I really wanted to check this out just because my curiosity was peaked far too much.

So...are the classes a thing that are in the base game now, or is that just a thing for the beta? Is there any info of whether I can just start out as a no-class no-one and allocate my stats the way that I wish? That's the thing I loved the most about the game.

Beyond that, that was a good video. Thanks for the preview, mate.

#20 Posted by Fantus1984 (59 posts) -

Well classes have always been in Demon Souls / Dark Souls from what I can remember. It basically gives you starting gear / stats relevant to that class. But your free to do what you want from there. Unsure how Dark Souls 2 will do it however.

The setup has been the same as the one at trade shows but when I got to try it out there, they was no ranger. That was a new edition.

#21 Posted by Karkarov (3056 posts) -

@jakob187 said:

I've purposefully kept myself in the dark about anything related to the game. However, I really wanted to check this out just because my curiosity was peaked far too much.

So...are the classes a thing that are in the base game now, or is that just a thing for the beta? Is there any info of whether I can just start out as a no-class no-one and allocate my stats the way that I wish? That's the thing I loved the most about the game.

Beyond that, that was a good video. Thanks for the preview, mate.

It is just a beta, those are all characters already at soul level 20 specced in specific ways to let you try out various play styles. I doubt they are reflective of the actual class names that will be in game and while it isn't confirmed I doubt they will move away from the soul level 1 "blank" character concept.

#22 Posted by Krullban (1034 posts) -

Only buying for the cape physics.