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#1 Edited by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

I'm serious. We value individuality, going right back to the Greeks. The right to say 'fuck you' is our highest tradition. This whole trend toward forcing people to authenticate, and effectively having to ask someone's permission to play, is ridiculous - where is the spontaneity that freedom requires?

If you have to access the internet to play with a thing you own, you don't really own it, do you?

#2 Posted by laserbolts (5311 posts) -

You're "free" to not buy the xbox one.

#3 Posted by CircleNine (381 posts) -

Previously undiscovered Greek tragedies about not being able to play video games are being found daily.

#4 Edited by MentalDisruption (1618 posts) -

Ah, yes, the Greeks.

#5 Edited by Vinny_Says (5686 posts) -

The right to say 'fuck you' is our highest tradition.

Can you clarify what that's even supposed to mean?

#6 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

@laserbolts: A right I will be exercising.

Not a right that kids bought this thing by their parents will have, or millions of consumers who are too dumb to realise the implications. If we have been taught anything by Simcity 5 and Diablo III - it's that this is inevitable.

#7 Edited by MooseyMcMan (10479 posts) -

Vote with your dollars. Don't buy it.

#8 Posted by believer258 (11640 posts) -

You could just not buy One.

...oh, God. That means it's time to get off the internet.

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#9 Edited by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

What about the ancient romans?

#10 Edited by CircleNine (381 posts) -

I recently read Virgil's epic poem about a kid who was grounded and wasn't allowed to play on his PC for a week. It was really profound.

#11 Edited by bigjeffrey (4792 posts) -
ALWAYS ON, THANKS OBAMA

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#12 Edited by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

Cue the snarky comments :-)

But I have a point, for anyone who looks at it soberly for a moment - the paternalism involved in the idea of is remarkable - it's not even a form of rental like the internet, since you have the physical product.

#13 Posted by EpicSteve (6471 posts) -

That's like being pissed at cell phones because they require a signal. A lot of folks are pissed about the online thing, but there are better ways arguments against it.

#14 Posted by TheSouthernDandy (3786 posts) -

Uh. So like PC games then? You're not a big fan of PC games I'm guessing?

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#15 Edited by redelectric (153 posts) -

A.) I'm not so sure on your grasp of western culture. Show your work, young man.

B.) Saying 'fuck you' is all well and good, but you cannot espouse this then get upset when someone says 'fuck you right back'.

#16 Posted by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

Uh. So like PC games then? You're not a big fan of PC games I'm guessing?

But that's entirely incorrect

#17 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

@shell_kracker said:

The right to say 'fuck you' is our highest tradition.

Can you clarify what that's even supposed to mean?

I can, although I'm not sure I should, since my drunken rant is unintentionally melodramatic and Alex Jones like :-)

Ill try anyway, at the risk of further hilarity --------- basically, mystical cultures value 'paternalism', so for example an 'intrinsic respect' is asked for when talking about religion, or leaders, or elders, or family members - leading to abuses of power, such as husbands who tell their wife they love them, whilst beating them - our own culture has advanced so far partly because nothing is so sacred you can't question it, in the most vulgar terms, if necessary.

So every time I hear some uncle tom quipping about how 'I'm always online anyway, this doesn't effect me', it strikes me as being a completely moronic thing that fundamentally misunderstands why always online is such a bad idea - it's nothing to do with whether or not you are gonna be effected in the short term - and everything to do with your right for potential choice being removed bit by bit. Reason I mentioned the Greeks is because that idea was first articulated by Socrates, and it's the basis of how we (however badly) question shit.

#18 Edited by TheSouthernDandy (3786 posts) -

@thesoutherndandy said:

Uh. So like PC games then? You're not a big fan of PC games I'm guessing?

But that's entirely incorrect

Is it? Don't you need to authenticate PC games when you install? You can't purchase anything from Steam if you're not online.

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#19 Edited by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

@thehumandove said:

@thesoutherndandy said:

Uh. So like PC games then? You're not a big fan of PC games I'm guessing?

But that's entirely incorrect

Is it? Don't you need to authenticate PC games when you install? You can't purchase anything from Steam if you're not online.

There are alternatives depending on the game, and steam games can be played offline once downloaded.

#20 Edited by JasonR86 (9608 posts) -

lol

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#21 Edited by TheSouthernDandy (3786 posts) -

@thesoutherndandy said:

@thehumandove said:

@thesoutherndandy said:

Uh. So like PC games then? You're not a big fan of PC games I'm guessing?

But that's entirely incorrect

Is it? Don't you need to authenticate PC games when you install? You can't purchase anything from Steam if you're not online.

There are alternatives depending on the game, and steam games can be played offline once downloaded.

Yeah there are but digital downloads are becoming more the norm and my point still stands if you wanna buy games on Steam, you gotta be online.

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#22 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

@thesoutherndandy: Depends on the PC game. I can load my original copy of UFO: Enemy Unknown or Syndicate 20 years later. What happens to people dumb enough to buy SimCity 5 when the authentication servers go down?

#23 Posted by TheSouthernDandy (3786 posts) -

@shell_kracker: definitely a valid point but I think that's becoming a industry wide problem as we go further down this road.

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#24 Edited by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

ALWAYS ON, THANKS OBAMA

Your snarky political reference has no effect on my foreign knowings :-)

#25 Posted by punkxblaze (2957 posts) -

I'm exercising my right to say fuck you by not buying an X1.

#26 Edited by GnomeonFire (696 posts) -

Why does it always have to be a "fuck you"? I just don't want XBone if the current news going around is true.

#27 Edited by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

@punkxblaze: Okay, if we go deep, and get really analytical about this - we have the short term ability to say fuck you to MS - but the overall trend is toward extreme management of how we get to use our products - the market will close down - big franchises we love will be held to ransom - we will have the choice: accept the industry's terms, or don't play game five in a series you have loved since childhood.

Thats the nature of corporatism - you can't escape it in the long run if they want a thing - you have the choice of playing the odd indy obviously, but the saturated games, which are cultural touching stones, and get talked about at work - they are the monopoly of big companies - people seem confused as to why MS would do this after the SimCity and Diablo controversies - but there is no great mystery to it - they know people will accede to their terms in enough numbers that it becomes an inevitable feature.

#28 Posted by rebgav (1429 posts) -

Why does it always have to be a "fuck you"? I just don't want XBone if the current news going around is true.

The lines have been drawn. We are at war, you must pick a side. Everything is either a fuck you butt-hump or all kinds of banana-pancakes awesome. There is no middle ground.

#29 Posted by Clonedzero (4091 posts) -

It's illegal to drive a car on the road without a license in the US.

is that against our western culture as well?

#30 Posted by Oscar__Explosion (2197 posts) -

The right to say "fuck you" is to not buy it and vote with your wallet. If you want it you have to play by their rules.

#31 Posted by GnomeonFire (696 posts) -

@rebgav said:

@gnomeonfire said:

Why does it always have to be a "fuck you"? I just don't want XBone if the current news going around is true.

The lines have been drawn. We are at war, you must pick a side. Everything is either a fuck you butt-hump or all kinds of banana-pancakes awesome. There is no middle ground.

I guess I'll just be Swedish.

Bork Bork Bork.

#32 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

@rebgav said:

@gnomeonfire said:

Why does it always have to be a "fuck you"? I just don't want XBone if the current news going around is true.

The lines have been drawn. We are at war, you must pick a side. Everything is either a fuck you butt-hump or all kinds of banana-pancakes awesome. There is no middle ground.

Thats the spirit ;-)

A.) I'm not so sure on your grasp of western culture. Show your work, young man.

B.) Saying 'fuck you' is all well and good, but you cannot espouse this then get upset when someone says 'fuck you right back'.

Which is why I don't ;-)

#33 Posted by Bribo (592 posts) -

I'm surprised by the number of DRM/big corporation apoligists here.Games are not a service, they are a product. Do you have to call Parker Bros. for permission before every game of Monopoly?

Also, Gabe Newell won't live forever. Forty/fifty years from now, you Steam guys are gonna get a stern wake-up call.

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#34 Edited by punkxblaze (2957 posts) -

@punkxblaze: Okay, if we go deep, and get really analytical about this - we have the short term ability to say fuck you to MS - but the overall trend is toward extreme management of how we get to use our products - the market will close down - big franchises we love will be held to ransom - we will have the choice: accept the industry's terms, or don't play game five in a series you have loved since childhood.

Thats the nature of corporatism - you can't escape it in the long run if they want a thing - you have the choice of playing the odd indy obviously, but the saturated games, which are cultural touching stones, and get talked about at work - they are the monopoly of big companies - people seem confused as to why MS would do this after the SimCity and Diablo controversies - but there is no great mystery to it - they know people will accede to their terms in enough numbers that it becomes an inevitable feature.

You make a good point. I suppose right now I'm just kind of petulantly waving my arms and hoping Microsoft takes all the negative feedback in to account and backpedals on this, since it's at a software level.

I don't think they will, but damnit, I can hope.

#35 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

well said

#36 Edited by Video_Game_King (36017 posts) -

Why is the new Xbox announcement drawing out all the hysterical crazies?

#37 Posted by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

Why is the new Xbox announcement drawing out all the hysterical crazies?

It's because the information sucks and is a terrible step for modern gaming.

#38 Posted by Video_Game_King (36017 posts) -

@video_game_king said:

Why is the new Xbox announcement drawing out all the hysterical crazies?

It's because the information sucks and is a terrible step for modern gaming.

I'm not sure that's enough, especially for something like this.

#39 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

Of course, nothing said was particularity crazy either, but im not even gonna bother lol.

#40 Posted by bigjeffrey (4792 posts) -

Why is the new Xbox announcement drawing out all the hysterical crazies?

Don't ask questions, the hatred is totally justifiably. Grab a pitchfork and join in on the HATE.

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#41 Edited by rebgav (1429 posts) -

@thehumandove said:

@video_game_king said:

Why is the new Xbox announcement drawing out all the hysterical crazies?

It's because the information sucks and is a terrible step for modern gaming.

I'm not sure that's enough, especially for something like this.

The unknown future rolls toward us. I face it, for the first time, with a sense of hope. Because if a machine, a Lunarian, can learn the value of human life, maybe we can too.

#42 Posted by Video_Game_King (36017 posts) -
#43 Posted by rebgav (1429 posts) -
#44 Posted by TheHumanDove (2523 posts) -

@rebgav said:
@video_game_king said:

@thehumandove said:

@video_game_king said:

Why is the new Xbox announcement drawing out all the hysterical crazies?

It's because the information sucks and is a terrible step for modern gaming.

I'm not sure that's enough, especially for something like this.

The unknown future rolls toward us. I face it, for the first time, with a sense of hope. Because if a machine, a Lunarian, can learn the value of human life, maybe we can too.

Seems reasonable enough

#45 Posted by Video_Game_King (36017 posts) -

@rebgav said:

I will cut you.

How? My cloak is made of tough material, and I wear a light chain mail underneath all that.

#46 Posted by sirdesmond (1234 posts) -

This just in: You don't have to buy it and if you really don't agree with it, you shouldn't buy it.

#47 Posted by audioBusting (1477 posts) -

I guess I don't care because I'm Asian? And thanks for posting this on an always-online authenticated-users-only forum.

#48 Posted by rebgav (1429 posts) -

@rebgav said:

I will cut you.

How? My cloak is made of tough material, and I wear a light chain mail underneath all that.

I refuse to RP this scenario (or any other scenario). In a hypothetical conundrum based on this scenario, I suppose that I would opt for some sort of piercing weapon or bludgeoning tool as a direct counter to chainmail and hefty textiles. Or I would slash at your face area. This, you understand, is a hypothetical and not an actual scenario which is becoming increasingly more likely.

#49 Posted by Video_Game_King (36017 posts) -
#50 Posted by shell_kracker (71 posts) -

I guess I don't care because I'm Asian? And thanks for posting this on an always-online authenticated-users-only forum.

As someone elsewhere said:

I'm so sick of hearing this shit.

The auto industry doesn't whine when I sell my car saying they think they're entitled to a cut. The same thing with selling my blu rays, or music CDs or any other physical property I own.

All the whining is coming from game developers and publishers who only care about finding ways to fatten their wallets at our expense.

Corporate entitlement - and many people, by being snarky and making illogical false-comparisons with services such as the internet, are just acting as an apologist for it - even though they stand to lose out in the long term - just like a good consumer they defend the big guy, instead of thinking about how the trend effects them.