And Now... The Rest Of The Story

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ragnar_mike

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#451  Edited By ragnar_mike

I guess I'll throw my two cents into this thread.

I like Jeff. And the GB crew. I still remember all the hoopla that came from when Jeff got fired. It wasn't quite as ridiculous as what happened to 1UP, but I recall thinking it was big news and being angry. It's always been a bit of a general anger towards "the man". Corporate entities I didn't really know who changed things I loved in a way I didn't like.

I never really blamed Gamespot, I mean my general "eh" feeling towards them didn't change. I like a lot of their writers and staff, but I'm not a huge fan of their design and how they run reviews and things, but they're not IGN or anything (oh snap).

What really came off from the whole divorce was that when you put young or traditional management in charge of something independent and awesome, it gets ruined. Jeff is an editor who likes "Real Talk" and that scares marketers. I think that's the core of a lot of people's worries about this deal. People are worried that once GB has a larger corporate backing that some of the magic will be workshopped out because large corporations still run websites by page views and ad revenues and not by building a community of loyal fans.

I like that GB will be closer to Gamestop and can have their friends on the quick looks and podcasts. Gallup was always fun and I like Davison's dry, British sense of humor. My only concern is CBSi. Mainly because they are an unknown entity to me. I don't know who runs them, I don't know their practices and I don't know how they will react to whatever craziness Vinny, Jeff and Ryan can come up with a tricaster and a giant greenscreen. Someone there is smart enough to realize GB is great otherwise this deal wouldn't have been made, but not everyone in a corporate environment will "get" Happy Hour or Luchadeer or Uh Uh Uh Uh Uh Uh, and I worry that someone with the power to effect GB's funding now will take one look at them and ask "Why are we paying for these crazy assholes?" instead of saying "I love these crazy assholes! Lets send them to Leipzig!"

That's about it I guess. Giant Bomb is full of cool guys, Gamespot is full of cool guys, CBSi has at least one cool guy, probably more. And Jeff gets to eat more curry. So far everyone wins.

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JakJ

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#452  Edited By JakJ

To all the bitching newbies: I'm someone who got to know these guys listening to The Hotspot w/ Rich Gallup. I've been a member on GB since day one, and I think this change is both good and exciting. Jeff and (most) of the crew have come back to the place where their careers began.

The old ignorant management is gone. I don't think the guys would be so down with this deal if they didn't think it would help expand what they've been doing for the last 4 years. I for one am excited and looking forward to the future of Giant Bomb.

These guys have passed the test of time (in Jeff's case almost two decades); they love video games. Anyone who thinks that they'd change all that over night is retarded.

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deactivated-6050ef4074a17

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@UnrealDP: I'm amazed that people are really this naive on this. Having faith in Giant Bomb and the bomb crew has nothing to do with this. If there is ever conflict between CBSi and Giant Bomb, the former wins, and wins every time. There's nothing Giant Bomb can say or do to truly protect their independence except make empty, completely powerless promises to fool the gullible people of their audience into thinking that everything will always and forever be the same. It can't possibly end up like that. Things are going to change, they're going to change negatively, and it's only a matter of time until that happens. I love Giant Bomb, but they have very little to do with it at the end of the day. They can't do anything about it.
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rm082e

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#454  Edited By rm082e

@Marokai said:

@UnrealDP: I'm amazed that people are really this naive on this. Having faith in Giant Bomb and the bomb crew has nothing to do with this. If there is ever conflict between CBSi and Giant Bomb, the former wins, and wins every time. There's nothing Giant Bomb can say or do to truly protect their independence except make empty, completely powerless promises to fool the gullible people of their audience into thinking that everything will always and forever be the same. It can't possibly end up like that. Things are going to change, they're going to change negatively, and it's only a matter of time until that happens. I love Giant Bomb, but they have very little to do with it at the end of the day. They can't do anything about it.

If they and CBSi signed legal paper work giving GB creative control, they certainly can protect their independence. It all depends on how the deal was structured. Given they said they have creative control over the site just yesterday, there is good reason to think that is the case. Unless of course your just saying they lied.

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miles64

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#455  Edited By miles64

@Marokai: I said this in another thread, but CBSi bought GB, not Jeff or Ryan or anyone else. Unless you think that these guys lost integrity since 2007 (which would be pretty ridiculous), then wouldn't it make more sense for them to bail if CBSi started pulling shenanigans? They've done the same when management last tried to fuck with their creative control, and founded this website. Btw, when this happened, the content they produced was still beyond awesome. Unless you can give me a good reason why, after 15 odd years they'd lose their passion and integrity for this line of work all of a sudden, I don't have any reason to expect them to do anything but either produce the same or better quality content than before, or bail and become independent again.

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miles64

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#456  Edited By miles64

btw, there are no certainties in life. people need to take managed risks in order to grow. is there anything protecting GB completely from interference from CBSi? most likely there isn't, unless the CBSi guys are beyond retarded, I mean then technically there would be nothing stopping this site to put up illegal material and CBSi as a parent company would be held responsible ultimately - it isn't realistic that a major corporation would sign something like this. but there was also not a damn thing protecting them from interference from Shelby Bonnie either.

remember Jeff talking about how there were multiple other 'bidders' for GB but they didn't go with them? this is what he was talking about. they took a hard look at all of them, and decided that a company like BB would carry a far higher risk than CBSi when it comes to interfering with content. considering the apocalyptic shitstorm gamespot went through in 2007, I'm in really serious doubts that there's any risk on this front btw. but even if there was, like I said, they can always bail.

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Tr1cky1

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#457  Edited By Tr1cky1
@KidA
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Tr1cky1

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#458  Edited By Tr1cky1

Well the gamespot uk podcast needs to up its game now as it had become an annoying flaky affair lacking in decent humour. I would love to see Jane and Guy guesting in the GB podcast though; Alex can remain in the backroom editorial staff where he should be. The GB podcast is the model that all other podcasts should be measured on!!!

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UnrealDP

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#459  Edited By UnrealDP

@Marokai said:

@UnrealDP: I'm amazed that people are really this naive on this. Having faith in Giant Bomb and the bomb crew has nothing to do with this. If there is ever conflict between CBSi and Giant Bomb, the former wins, and wins every time. There's nothing Giant Bomb can say or do to truly protect their independence except make empty, completely powerless promises to fool the gullible people of their audience into thinking that everything will always and forever be the same. It can't possibly end up like that. Things are going to change, they're going to change negatively, and it's only a matter of time until that happens. I love Giant Bomb, but they have very little to do with it at the end of the day. They can't do anything about it.

Whoa, I just got back from Saint Patties and this is how you treat me internet? Oi!

Well, I think you're taking some pretty big leaps here, mate. It's not like we know what they signed or how they signed it, for all we know, they could of sold their souls or they could of signed for full creative freedom. All we know is what we've been told by the GB guys and I'm not so jaded as to jump to the conclusion that they're ham-fistedly lying to our collective faces.

Things are going to change, they're going to change negatively, and it's only a matter of time until that happens.

Way to be optimistic, man! I bet saying things like that will totally help! I bet if we all just accepted the harsh "reality" you just conceived, it'd actually be helping anything! Sarcasm!

Bottom line, if you really believe that, then what the hell is moping around and bring others down going to do about it? For christ's sake, man. You could at least except your "reality" quietly and not try to bring others down, too.

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yukoasho

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#460  Edited By yukoasho

@JakJ said:

To all the bitching newbies: I'm someone who got to know these guys listening to The Hotspot w/ Rich Gallup. I've been a member on GB since day one, and I think this change is both good and exciting. Jeff and (most) of the crew have come back to the place where their careers began.

The old ignorant management is gone. I don't think the guys would be so down with this deal if they didn't think it would help expand what they've been doing for the last 4 years. I for one am excited and looking forward to the future of Giant Bomb.

These guys have passed the test of time (in Jeff's case almost two decades); they love video games. Anyone who thinks that they'd change all that over night is retarded.

Yeah, if people haven't figured out who the fuck these people are, they're high. Jeff Gerstmann, Ryan Davis, Vinny Caravella, Alex Navarro may rub me the wrong way at times, but they're honest and have all sorts of integrity. If anyone thinks that Jeff and Co. wouldn't start over again if CBS tried anything funny, they're out of their minds. I can't see how anyone on this site doesn't understand who these people are.

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yukoasho

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#461  Edited By yukoasho

@Xeiphyer said:

Everyone just needs to remember that Gamespot isn't a bad place, it was one bad dude and a bad situation that started all that drama years ago, and he got fired 6 months later. A lot of people forget that prior to that incident, the GB crew were all working there together being crazy.

Exactly. This isn't the death knell of Giant Bomb. This is Jeff Gerstmann's final vindication. He's strolling back into the building as the victor, and Josh Larson or whatever his name is will likely never run a popular website again.

Jeff won. And he did it through hard work and integrity.

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Johnny5

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#462  Edited By Johnny5

@YukoAsho said:

@Xeiphyer said:

Everyone just needs to remember that Gamespot isn't a bad place, it was one bad dude and a bad situation that started all that drama years ago, and he got fired 6 months later. A lot of people forget that prior to that incident, the GB crew were all working there together being crazy.

Exactly. This isn't the death knell of Giant Bomb. This is Jeff Gerstmann's final vindication. He's strolling back into the building as the victor, and Josh Larson or whatever his name is will likely never run a popular website again.

Jeff won. And he did it through hard work and integrity.

This is a great way to put it. Although people need to know he's not a victor over Gamespot, but to management who screwed him. Gamespot was always on his side. Anyone who watched Ryan Mcdonald basically break down on live air knew that (hell I was close to doing it too lol). Although the content has definitely suffered since they've left, I've never had anything against Gamespot and to hold a grudge against them is pretty malaligned.

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ragnar_mike

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#463  Edited By ragnar_mike

@Johnny5: Is there footage of that? I wasn't really watching the stuff they did at the time (more of a 1UP man).

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TheHT

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#464  Edited By TheHT

@Ragnar: Here's the On The Spot episode after Jeff was fired.

Also, notice Brad looking ready to throw down.

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InsaneGenis

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#465  Edited By InsaneGenis

I just signed up and will be posting more, but as a reader since Jeff was with Gamespot, I'm glad this happened. Hopefully this improves Gamespot to compete better against IGN. I've always read IGN, but lately they have been writing articles about articles they will be writing and Damon is awful. His attempt to make a signature style by saying his name as if it's a statement, makes me hate his videos. In any case, I haven't really paid attention to gamespot and I hope this move makes me go to them before I go to ign.

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superfriend

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#466  Edited By superfriend

@InsaneGenis said:

I just signed up and will be posting more, but as a reader since Jeff was with Gamespot, I'm glad this happened. Hopefully this improves Gamespot to compete better against IGN. I've always read IGN, but lately they have been writing articles about articles they will be writing and Damon is awful. His attempt to make a signature style by saying his name as if it's a statement, makes me hate his videos. In any case, I haven't really paid attention to gamespot and I hope this move makes me go to them before I go to ign.

Well, you should probably come to Giantbomb before going to IGN or Gamespot... but yeah, maybe Gamespot can return to a fraction of the greatness that it once had. The Kasavin-Gallup-Gerstman-and-crew times were the greatest.

Too bad a lot of the staff left, because I would like to see some sort of On the Spot reunion show. THAT would be a fitting conclusion to the whole affair, because man- that On the Spot episode after he left was a real downer.

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InsaneGenis

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#467  Edited By InsaneGenis

I come here daily. Giant bomb just lacks reviews.

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warxsnake

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#468  Edited By warxsnake

I'm actually looking forward to maybe having KVO on the bombcast or quicklooks

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ShadowKirby

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#469  Edited By ShadowKirby

@TheHT said:

@Ragnar: Here's the On The Spot episode after Jeff was fired.

Also, notice Brad looking ready to throw down.

Oh man, I wasn't following Gamespot back in the days and never saw that. Brad and Alex looked pissed.

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ragnar_mike

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#470  Edited By ragnar_mike

@TheHT said:

@Ragnar: Here's the On The Spot episode after Jeff was fired.

Also, notice Brad looking ready to throw down.

Cheers man. Wow. Knowing Alex well enough from all the videos and reviews I just imagine him screaming fuck over and over again through that whole clip, on the inside.

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yukoasho

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#471  Edited By yukoasho

@Johnny5 said:

@YukoAsho said:

@Xeiphyer said:

Everyone just needs to remember that Gamespot isn't a bad place, it was one bad dude and a bad situation that started all that drama years ago, and he got fired 6 months later. A lot of people forget that prior to that incident, the GB crew were all working there together being crazy.

Exactly. This isn't the death knell of Giant Bomb. This is Jeff Gerstmann's final vindication. He's strolling back into the building as the victor, and Josh Larson or whatever his name is will likely never run a popular website again.

Jeff won. And he did it through hard work and integrity.

This is a great way to put it. Although people need to know he's not a victor over Gamespot, but to management who screwed him. Gamespot was always on his side. Anyone who watched Ryan Mcdonald basically break down on live air knew that (hell I was close to doing it too lol). Although the content has definitely suffered since they've left, I've never had anything against Gamespot and to hold a grudge against them is pretty malaligned.

Thanks for the expansion. I went back to looking at GameSpot soon after I heard Larson had been fired and you can tell people were feeling hella more free, but mostly were new. It's like it was a new site, and after I let go of the enmity that I felt from the firing, I found that they were an OK site. In many ways, GameSpot's recovery is a victory in and of itself. As you said, the few people who remain from that time probably thought their lives were going to be miserable from there on out, stuck between a kowtowing management and a bunch of newb staff. But yeah, lots of lessons learned all around.

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alcamin

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#472  Edited By alcamin

@Ragnar said:

@TheHT said:

@Ragnar: Here's the On The Spot episode after Jeff was fired.

Also, notice Brad looking ready to throw down.

Cheers man. Wow. Knowing Alex well enough from all the videos and reviews I just imagine him screaming fuck over and over again through that whole clip, on the inside.

I had forgotten that this episode existed. Thanks for the reminder. At the time, while watching this and considering all of the flak that GameSpot had received, I found it hard to really criticise them when faced with the obvious emotion on display from the core team that made GameSpot what it was. They were obviously hit hard by Jeff's termination. I simply couldn't bring myself to vilify the team after watching this, especially when there was so much raw emotion and angry flying around, often mistakenly directed at these individuals. Now that the full story has been made public, I feel that stance was justified and hope that everyone will be able to move on from those dark days. It certainly sounds as if Jeff and the rest of the GB team have.

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Chemin

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#473  Edited By Chemin

I look forward to seeing this video, yo.

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eXists

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#474  Edited By eXists

Just a matter of time until there's a clash with CBS's political correctness, wait and see... and like with every merger after a few months there will be some consolidation and a few Ppl on both sides will be fired, anyone wants to bet? I give it 6 months. Having said that, good luck guys!

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eXists

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#475  Edited By eXists

Also does anyone notice that you don't really see much if any excitement from Jeff, it feels like he was forced into this situation and wants to make it look ok... my 0.02

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Claude

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#476  Edited By Claude

    

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rockhardalibi

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#477  Edited By rockhardalibi
No Caption Provided

Hope it's good.

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P00hfLinger

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#478  Edited By P00hfLinger

Giantbomb is the first gaming site that I have ever loved. I love the content and the videos you guys produce. Please, keep up the great work!!!

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spartanlolz92

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#479  Edited By spartanlolz92

@TheHT said:

@Ragnar: Here's the On The Spot episode after Jeff was fired.

Also, notice Brad looking ready to throw down.

he looks like hes in shock really

but hes back and best of luck must feel good jeff to be vindicated :)

i just hope the community doesnt change giantbomb has always had the best community sure there are still trolls and stupid forum posts but its far less than any other website ive seen.

but the forums here are exactly what they should be a forum for people to discuss videogame related content with fellow duders instead the usual crap that ive seen on other site. and the content is awesome

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Xarash

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#480  Edited By Xarash

As someone who had a paid subscription at Gamespot all those years ago, and then canceled it in protest over what happened and not looked back since, this is weird.

But as it seems things have changed, and with the financial power of CBS Interactive behind it, I fully expect the content of the site will only improve.

Also a big thanks to those that are not going over to the new era. I personally know how hard and expensive it is to run a popular web site. Hope you guys got a good deal!

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mathkor89

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#481  Edited By mathkor89

@brassmarsh: its not too late

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unsolvedparadox

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#482  Edited By unsolvedparadox

Must be a huge relief for Jeff to get this off his back, even though the answer was about what most of us had heard/suspected. I'm happy for all of the Giant Bomb crew, but especially Jeff for this reason.

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myslead

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#483  Edited By myslead

@YukoAsho said:

@Xeiphyer said:

Everyone just needs to remember that Gamespot isn't a bad place, it was one bad dude and a bad situation that started all that drama years ago, and he got fired 6 months later. A lot of people forget that prior to that incident, the GB crew were all working there together being crazy.

Exactly. This isn't the death knell of Giant Bomb. This is Jeff Gerstmann's final vindication. He's strolling back into the building as the victor, and Josh Larson or whatever his name is will likely never run a popular website again.

Jeff won. And he did it through hard work and integrity.

how did he win anything?

he got bought off

that's more of a lost to me.

"hey look, I can buy anything, even the guy I fired 5 years ago."

@UnrealDP said:

@Branthog said:

Do you know what the talent at one FM radio station said when CBS took them over?

Hurrah! We have more resources, now! And more stability! And health insurance! And more money! And more advertising dollars! And we'll eventually get a better studio! And we'll get an even larger audience! This is what we've been working so hard for so many years for and our effort is finally being rewarded!

Less than one year later, every single on-air talent was exhausted and beaten down and betrayed and eventually fired and most of the off-air staff were fired and the station underwent a new imaging campaign and really douchey (like, would repulse Howard Stern) radio guys from across the country were brought in to replace everyone. Less than a year after *that*, those people were fired, almost all of the staff remaining was fired, the station became an FM simulcast for the AM sister-station's right-wing blow-hards, and the radio station's building was bulldozed. (This was a thirty-year old power-house of a station with a huge reputation broadcasting out of one of the top markets).

So, the lesson to learn here is that the talent has less input than you think, the talent often is kept more in the dark than you think, and just because employees buy into the "hey guys, stuff is gonna be thuper awethome over here!" pitch from the new parent company doesn't make it true. Are you going to badmouth your new employer? Are you going to tell the employees from your new acquisition the truth, when you might not have everything planned out just yet and you might still need them in some capacity? Of course not.

See "Burned" for more... Mate, it's looking like you've already made up your mind, but don't be like this. Look at how GameSpot was before any of this even happened. Everything was great and they were honest with the community and given lots of freedom. There was a mistake, but now they're back and here you are being as negative as possible about how this could turn out. It could go totally bad and the GB guys could just be lying to our faces to try and herd us into their new evil overlords, but hey, I'm not gonna try and see that. The GB guys are saying it's not like that and seem genuinely happy. They've always been super honest with the community and they haven't betrayed our trust before. You can be this way and try to put everyone around you down, or you can maybe try to support the GB guys and the community instead of trying to spread the hate.

and Gamespot wasn't great, it was fine back then, but it's just that there wasn't alot of other options around.

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bandro

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#484  Edited By bandro

This makes me happy

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mithhunter55

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#485  Edited By mithhunter55

And that was E3!

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Xeiphyer

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#486  Edited By Xeiphyer
@myslead said:

@YukoAsho said:

@Xeiphyer said:

Everyone just needs to remember that Gamespot isn't a bad place, it was one bad dude and a bad situation that started all that drama years ago, and he got fired 6 months later. A lot of people forget that prior to that incident, the GB crew were all working there together being crazy.

Exactly. This isn't the death knell of Giant Bomb. This is Jeff Gerstmann's final vindication. He's strolling back into the building as the victor, and Josh Larson or whatever his name is will likely never run a popular website again.

Jeff won. And he did it through hard work and integrity.

how did he win anything?

he got bought off

that's more of a lost to me.

"hey look, I can buy anything, even the guy I fired 5 years ago."

Uhhh, no?  The guy who was responsible for firing him was fired himself 6 months later, so whoever your 'Mr. Mysterious Evil Gamespot Villain CEO' is, doesn't exist.
 
Also, if getting "bought off" means getting to keep complete control of your site while being given money, then that's a pretty fuckin' sweet deal.
 
I know you think that there is a mysterious shadow council running gamespot and they're still evil, but in reality it was just one dude and a bad situation that caused the original incident. Jeff and gang are all from gamespot originally, and are still friends with most of the people that work there, I think that alone speaks to the credibility of that site and its employees. After all, it was gamespot that originally put the gang together in the first place.
 
Really though, its a moot argument. Giantbomb isn't changing any, we aren't going to have to go to gamespot or anything, the only thing that changed is the office and the amount of money they now have to do dumb stuff with. They still have complete control over the site and everything they do, so we aren't really losing anything.
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Insectecutor

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#487  Edited By Insectecutor
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Boopie

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#488  Edited By Boopie

money talks and bullshit walks

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medacris

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#489  Edited By medacris

Can someone explain what went on with GB and Tested? The videos weren't loading for me, and I'm admittedly not that familiar with the backstory of the site.

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yukoasho

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#490  Edited By yukoasho

@medacris said:

Can someone explain what went on with GB and Tested? The videos weren't loading for me, and I'm admittedly not that familiar with the backstory of the site.

Whiskey Media is gone.

Giant Bomb and Comic Vine went to CBS Interactive, and are presumably going to be much the same as they are now.

Anime Vice, Screened and Tested went to BermanBraun, with the first two looking like they've been left to die while the last is being used as a MythBusters promotional vehicle.

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#491  Edited By markdarkness

This was actually pretty cool... calmed me down somewhat.

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#492  Edited By BigMike

Here's to swift transition and staying true to who you are! You guys still keep me laughing during my death commute in Southern Ontario, I hope it only gets better.

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#493  Edited By Vlad_Tiberius

@Xeiphyer: Dude, grow up, pull off your rose-tinted glasses, take a good look around you and get this through your brain: EACH and EVERYBODY in this so-called "media"/ "journalism" is, more or less, on the take, ok? EVERYBODY!

Why? Because that's the nature of the business and they can't survive otherwise. Don't you see that everybody knows everybody and everyone is connected to everybody in this business, whether it's PR, publisher, developer or "journalist"? Do you think all these relations happened just like that? These people work in this biz, they're meeting people, they know all the inside stuff, they know how the market will evolve, they know which are the players that need to get their product pushed. It's all about the money, advertising and propaganda for f*ck sakes! Hey, why don't you invite Schafer for an interview and see if he bothers to even respond to you?

Here's the business circle: these dudes make a website and put out ad space for sale ---->the companies/publishers/retailers offer to buy that space for exposure/advertising---->me , you and other sheep visit the site for gaming info and thus get to know about those products of those publishers/ the retailers and such----->the"media" dudes get revenue because of our traffic on their site. Easy as that,with the kindergarten level of explaining just for you to understand.

Again, I don't blame anyone for this, because this is the biz and that's is life and we aIl have to eat,ok?

On the other hand, sure, I like these guys, and I enjoy their humor, their Bombcast and the quick looks, but that doesn't mean I trust them with my hard-earned money when I'm buying games and all the propagnada crap they sometimes pull, especially when they invite certain company guys that have plug their shit to us.

Now, MY opinion on that Gerstmann - Kane & Lynch - GameSpot crap is that the company guys got cheap and bypassed Jeff and the money reached somebody else with higher power at GameSpot - a simple misunderstanding, while all the drama that went afterwards was just for show to rebuild their credibility as a a gaming website. The real important thing is that deals like that are the norm and happen on daily bases on every media outlet, especially on mainstream ones that also have the habit of selling their ad space along with favorable reviews for a better future business relationship, meaning exclusive interviews, previews and all that shinny propaganda we all love to swallow from these "journalists".

Also, mind you that the business was different back then when this incident happened, reviews mattered more, there were fewer gaming websites, compared to now, when a certain dude's opinion or a certain website's review on a game is worth like a drop of water in an ocean.

Sure, back then, when I was a kid, I used to consider GameSpot or IGN's review scores crucial when buying games, simply because there weren't so many "professional"opinions on the market. But, nowadays, there are hundreds of websites, the exposure is immense and even children post their reviews on Youtube. Plus I, like many others, grew my own taste in gaming since then.

I know it may sound cynical, but my advice is to get over the "righteous", "honest" and "unbiased" journalism bullshit (such romantic terms don't apply when you're referring to a business and you're paid to do it!) and enjoy their jokes, their banter on everyday crap on their podcasts. That's why I've listened to them since almost the beginning of GB!

But hey, when it comes to games, look for more than one opinion, look on independent, non-mainstream reviews and opinions when you want to get more honest opinions or reviews for games, especially for the ones you look forward to buy and you're not 100% sure.

In short, don't idolize these guys and their opinions by painting them incorruptible heroes, gaming prophets and savants or shit like that. Just treat them as they are, like regular people with their own opinions, problems, bills and families to feed, and appreciate them for their humor. That's it. I'm out.

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#494  Edited By Xeiphyer
@Vlad_Tiberius said:

@Xeiphyer: Dude, grow up, pull off your rose-tinted glasses, take a good look around you and get this through your brain: EACH and EVERYBODY in this so-called "media"/ "journalism" is, more or less, on the take, ok? EVERYBODY!

Why? Because that's the nature of the business and they can't survive otherwise. Don't you see that everybody knows everybody and everyone is connected to everybody in this business, whether it's PR, publisher, developer or "journalist"? Do you think all these relations happened just like that? These people work in this biz, they're meeting people, they know all the inside stuff, they know how the market will evolve, they know which are the players that need to get their product pushed. It's all about the money, advertising and propaganda for f*ck sakes! Hey, why don't you invite Schafer and see if he bothers to even respond to you.

Here's the business circle: these dudes make a website and put out ad space for sale ---->the companies/publishers/retailers offer to buy that space for exposure/advertising---->me , you and other sheep visit the site for gaming info and thus get to know about those products of those publishers/ the retailers and such----->the"media" dudes get revenue because of our traffic on their site. Easy as that,with the kindergarten level of explaining just for you to understand.

Again, I don't blame anyone for this, because this is the biz and that's is life and we aIl have to eat,ok?

On the other hand, sure, I like these guys, and I enjoy their humor, their Bombcast and the quick looks, but that doesn't mean I trust them with my hard-earned money when I'm buying games and all the propagnada crap they sometimes pull, especially when they invite certain company guys that have plug their shit to us.

Now, MY opinion on that Gerstmann - Kane & Lynch - GameSpot crap is that the company guys got cheap and bypassed Jeff and the money reached somebody else with higher power at GameSpot - a simple misunderstanding, while all the drama that went afterwards was just for show to rebuild their credibility as a a gaming website. The real important thing is that deals like that are the norm and happen on daily bases on every media outlet, especially on mainstream ones that also have the habit of selling their ad space along with favorable reviews for a better future business relationship, meaning exclusive interviews, previews and all that shinny propaganda we all love to swallow from these "journalists".

Also, mind you that the business was different back then when this incident happened, reviews mattered more, there were fewer gaming websites, compared to now, when a certain dude's opinion or a certain website's review on a game is worth like a drop of water in an ocean.

Sure, back then, when I was a kid, I used to consider GameSpot or IGN's review scores crucial when buying games, simply because there weren't so many "professional"opinions on the market. But nowadays there are hundreds of websites, the exposure is immense. Plus I, like many others, grew my own tastes in gaming since then.

I know it may sound cynical, but my advice is to get over the "righteous", "honest" and "unbiased" journalism bullshit (such romantic terms don't exist when it's a business and you're paid to do it!) and enjoy their jokes, their banter on everyday crap on their podcasts. That's why I've listened to them since almost the beginning of GB!

But hey, when it comes to games, look for more than one opinion, look on independent underground reviews and opinions when you want to get more honest opinions or reviews for games, especially for the ones you look forward to buy and you're not 100% sure.

In short, don't idolize these guys and their opinions by painting them incorruptible heroes, gaming prophets and savants or shit like that. Just treat them as they are, like regular people with their own opinions, problems, bills and families to feed, and appreciate them for their humor. That's it. I'm out.

First of all: 

WHAAAAAT THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?!


You're responding to some opinion that I don't have, that you seem to have made up at some point. 
 
Secondly, I understand the fucking business cycle. No fucking shit, advertisements make money? REALLY? Crazy, you must have some insider tips!
 
As far as the incident goes, its clearly documented by people on the internet as far as what happened, and was confirmed by Jeff without mentioning the person by name, so you're free to imagine the conspiracy as much as you like, just don't forget your tinfoil hat. That goes double for your other conspiracy theories.
 
I'm not sure who you think you're talking to, or what about, but you're clearly very confused or in some way lacking in mental faculties.  
 

Why? Because that's the nature of the business and they can't survive otherwise. Don't you see that everybody knows everybody and everyone is connected to everybody in this business, whether it's PR, publisher, developer or "journalist"? Do you think all these relations happened just like that? These people work in this biz, they're meeting people, they know all the inside stuff, they know how the market will evolve, they know which are the players that need to get their product pushed. It's all about the money, advertising and propaganda for f*ck sakes! 

WHAT? People talk to each other in the same industry? People network?! WHAT? I had no idea. People get PAID to do their JOB?!?!!?! Where did this entire paragraph even come from?
 

Hey, why don't you invite Schafer and see if he bothers to even respond to you.

Uhhhh, what the fuck are you talking about?! Why would I care? Why does it matter? How is this in any way relevant to anything?
 

Here's the business circle: these dudes make a website and put out ad space for sale ---->the companies/publishers/retailers offer to buy that space for exposure/advertising---->me , you and other sheep visit the site for gaming info and thus get to know about those products of those publishers/ the retailers and such----->the"media" dudes get revenue because of our traffic on their site. Easy as that,with the kindergarten level of explaining just for you to understand.

Any idiot knows and understands how the business works, clearly. Not sure why you felt the need to explain this to me, or maybe you just discovered it yourself and had to tell somebody? I'll come back to this part in a minute when I explain some common sense to you.
 

I know it may sound cynical, but my advice is to get over the "righteous", "honest" and "unbiased" journalism bullshit (such romantic terms don't exist when it's a business and you're paid to do it!) and enjoy their jokes, their banter on everyday crap on their podcasts. That's why I've listened to them since almost the beginning of GB!

You put words in quotes as if I said them, which I never have and never will, so that's pretty cool too. Are you familiar with the idea of a strawman argument? Google it, i'll wait. Done? Okay. That's what your entire post is. You trying to make up a fake argument for me so that you can rebuttal it with flawed 'logic', baseless claims, and your opinion.
 

But hey, when it comes to games, look for more than one opinion, look on independent underground reviews and opinions when you want to get more honest opinions or reviews for games, especially for the ones you look forward to buy and you're not 100% sure.

Not to get away from my main theme of explaining why you're speaking complete fucking nonsense, but actually indie review sites are a lot worse. Large gaming sites have accountability with their reviews, small indie sites don't. Plus they are all trying to butter up publishers with favourable review scores in order to get free review copies of games. So, that's actually bad advice to give and to follow. The correct advice is to check multiple sources and reviewers you trust and are familiar with their tastes. 10/10 from some nameless fuck means nothing to me, I don't know if he worked on the game, or wants a free copy of their next game, or whatever.
 

In short, don't idolize these guys and their opinions by painting them incorruptible heroes, gaming prophets and savants or shit like that. Just treat them as they are, like regular people with their own opinions, problems, bills and families to feed, and appreciate them for their humor. That's it. I'm out.

Again, what the fuck are you talking about? Feel free to quote me when I described them as "incorruptible heroes".
 

Now, MY opinion on that Gerstmann - Kane & Lynch - GameSpot crap is that the company guys got cheap and bypassed Jeff and the money reached somebody else with higher power at GameSpot - a simple misunderstanding, while all the drama that went afterwards was just for show to rebuild their credibility as a a gaming website. The real important thing is that deals like that are the norm and happen on daily bases on every media outlet, especially on mainstream ones that also have the habit of selling their ad space along with favorable reviews for a better future business relationship, meaning exclusive interviews, previews and all that shinny propaganda we all love to swallow from these "journalists".
 

Saving the best for last. Lets really break this part down. You are partly correct in how it went down, as I said above, it is documented, the story was told anonymously by various people, and confirmed by many others, along with Jeff. Marketing team was inexperienced with how to handle pressure from publishers, new exec in charge caved to the money/pressure, shitstorm ensues. That particular person involved was fired 6 months later.
 
Now, for somebody who thinks he knows a lot about how simple things work and feels the need to explain them to people, you really, honestly, think that "...all the drama that went afterwards was just for show to rebuild their credibility as a a gaming website.", seriously? All that drama destroyed their credibility completely, along with having a very large portion of their editorial staff quitting, creating that "drama". If you think that's how you rebuild credibility, you're pretty dumb. Go investigate other businesses, or look at politics. The LAST thing anybody wants is to air their dirty laundry in public.
 

The real important thing is that deals like that are the norm and happen on daily bases on every media outlet, especially on mainstream ones that also have the habit of selling their ad space along with favorable reviews for a better future business

Oh really? The norm you say? On a daily basis?! Please back that up with some evidence, because that's total bullshit. If this was as common an occurrence as you say, then it wouldn't have been such a huge news clusterfuck. If you think mainstream outlets are all selling favourable reviews, please back that up too. Otherwise, keep the conspiracy theories under the tinfoil hat, and lets stick to facts in reality. I mean really, if that were true, every AAA title would score perfect scores on tons of review sites, but those things bomb all the time. I'm not saying its a perfect incorruptible system, I'm just saying that its not some crazy widespread conspiracy, much to the chagrin of marketing people everywhere. While i'm here, you should probably also know that Obama isn't actually a muslim nazi terrorist. Though that might be part of this conspiracy, and I might be in on it too.
 

Now, MY opinion

This is your opinion, and you're free to think it, but you should spend less time thinking about how everything must be evil and a conspiracy, and more time looking at the facts. In the same way you think people should not take a review as gospel, you shouldn't take things at face value, or assign a simple explanation for things that are often very complicated processes. Corruption is always possible, but I think the sheer number of people that walked out of gamespot prove that they're not all in on it. There will always be that accountability.
 
 
Anyways, the fact is, CBSi purchased Giantbomb. Giantbomb is a growing website, having a larger financial backer is good for that. CBSi likes money, and has the ability to secure better advertisements for Giantbomb, thus making everyone mo' money. Giantbomb retains complete creative freedom, the crew get to work with old friends as well, some of whom are rather awesome people. The spooky gamespot boogeymen don't get anything because they no longer exist, or are in a position in which they cannot do anything to affect the review process. Essentially, this is a very good thing for Giantbomb, because they lose nothing (other than a super sweet office), and gain better financial backing, access to more employees (MORE VIDEO FEATURES!), and better targeted ads for the site. CBSi gains a new website with a dedicated fanbase, veteran employees, and a unique appeal that can coexist with gamespot comfortably. All I ever did was state the facts about the business deal, examine the pros and cons, and declare that thus far, this is a very good deal for Giantbomb, and barring any future fuck ups, should continue to be good.

So,in summary, thanks for... not reading whatever I wrote, an then responding to what you imagined I wrote, or something? Thanks for constructing a strawman argument and then explaining things (poorly), that I already knew and seem to understand better than you. Thanks for writing a bunch of nonsense.
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#495  Edited By Vlad_Tiberius

@Xeiphyer: Sorry, but I was under the impression that you were trying so passionately to protect these guys and their credibility. I was just trying to remind you the basic things. Must've been a wrong impression, so excuse me.

Again, I was just saying my opinion on the incident, and,frankly, I don't give a shit. I remember reading about this issue somewhere and made some logical connections, therefore I didn't spend time searching for dirt like you did, gathering information, because I didn't give a rat's ass about it. This incident just proves that there is bullshit even here, in an industry that some folks think it addresses the kids.

But I don't know why you seem so confident that things went this way. Why? Because some guys on the internet said so and he confirmed? Is that a strong argument to you? And what are those "clearly documented" arguments that you talk about? Come on, if somebody could've or, more importantly, wanted to prove something, this thing would have been finished long time ago. All you got is suppositions,opinions and half truths. But again, it really doesn't matter anymore.

And don't act like you didn't understand what I was implying, ok? By having relations and strong ties in the industry can also mean they are not as impartial as some may think and this brings them certain benefits. That's why I gave that Schafer example-because that guy doesn't go to people he doesn't know, that could criticize him or make him look bad.

That's why I said everybody knows everybody and they're friends- because they work hand in hand. Because in real journalism you have people conducting campaigns, inquiries, challenging and criticizing certain policies or conducts, people with different opinions arguing. But here- everybody's backing everybody: I promote your publication , you promote my product, one hand washes the other and so on. And don't tell me you didn't knew that ...

I partially agree with the indie sites "kissing up" argument, but here the exposure matters the most. Usually, a big corporation doesn't even look, let alone need some niche , small site to give them exposure. They go to the big fish, the big mainstream outlets 'cause that's were the majority of people look for info. Why bother with some small, unknown , basement outlet?

I already said and I agree with checking out multiple opinions reviews. That's the basic thing. And also to be mindful of the tone of the review, the way it treats the product and so on. But that's a matter of taste, here, so it's highly subjective.

Again with the incident: so what the editorial staff quit? GameSpot still functioned and is still functioning as we speak, whether they lost a type of audience or gained a new one

Big deal- we've all seen major editorial staff quitting news outlets because the management refused to publish an article that criticized business associates or contributors or certain political figures. So? Nothing has changed. Also, Fox News and MSNBC are still broadcasting, right?

Did Rupert Murdoch lose anything with the phone hacking scandal? Come on..

What is credibility worth? Crap. Audience, sales, adverts..that's what matters. Credibility is something subjective.

Bottom line is that if you really cared and had the balls, you would have gone out in public, saying exactly who, how, where and when everything happened, without having to resort to a fuc*king soap opera scene remembering good ol' times at GameSpot and how cool it was prior to the incident. No, you should have ended that shit the next day. That is if you weren't afraid that some other, probably more ugly shit would come to the surface and sink other dudes and/or companies as well. Or not. Who the fuck knows?!

And, upon seeing the way it ended surprisingly hush-hush, like a fart in the storm, one can also presume a lot of other things.What if that shit became public precisely because it went wrong and because not everyone involved was properly"buttered up"? That's why I said is the norm in the business. But that's my opinion about it.

What I don't understand is why people need to take sides and act as defenders of the guy, when nothing courageous has been said or done about it. One thing is to refuse the bribe, to grab your toys and walk away in silence and a whole other thing is to bring the entire deal to the light for the public to see these practices in all their "splendor", making a big fuss about it, naming names, the exact value of the bribe, bringing witnesses and all that jazz. I, for one, would have expected to see all that if he's claiming to be a righteous, professional guy with strong principles. And no doubt he would've acted that way if the biz was indeed clean and that incident only an isolated one.That's why I stand by my assumption that the biz is corrupted.

And no, it's not a conspiracy, just an opinion. Why can't you admit corruption as something normal in this biz, when on more important, crucial aspects of our lives it has been proven time and time again that it IS the norm? Is it because they don't outright tell you how it really is? Do you need that kind of confirmation, for them to spell it out for you?

Why are you under the assumption that the videogame industry is something cleaner, with higher principles and that is way above practices of other industries? Look at pharmaceutical industry with Pfizer scandals; look at the oil business . Look and the Rupert Murdoch "News of the World" I mentioned above. Just because it's about entertainment doesn't mean it's all shinny and bright. Corruption is so widespread and so complex that is out of the ordinary for someone NOT to be corrupt. Don't you read the papers? Don't you watch the news? Don't you work and live in this society?

And I don't give a shit about your Obama and all that conspiracy theories crap you might think I promote. You assume too much..and poorly. And don't act superior avoiding the subject, ok? See, I made some wrong assumptions about what you've said and I apologize for that, but you also went really idiotic with some of your assumptions as well.

Did I ask you to tell me what happened between CBSi and GB? What, do you want me to celebrate and open a bottle of champagne? It's just business as usual. Today is CBS, tomorrow is back to flippin' burgers, recording in a basement or garage or acting PR for some studio somewhere...Who gives a fuck!? Have you seen me fearing that they might be going PG, all nice and censored? And what if they actually do that? How can I or somebody else change it? It's like I said: they need to put food on the table.

I don't care about their revenue, advertisements and their fanbase. I don't work in the games industry and I don't look forward to, but what I do know is from a buddy of mine that works. Again, dude, you're assuming that I care about all that.

All I care about is that they don't lose their humor on the Bombcast. And even if that happens, I'll go somewhere else for my humorous chatter about games and life. Big fucking deal.

That's it- I've had enough of this stupid old subject that doesn't even matter anymore.

Take care.

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#496  Edited By CyleMoore

Glad I finally got to watch this.

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#497  Edited By binarypie

Welcome guys!

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#498  Edited By zero_

@binarypie said:

Welcome guys!

Hi, who are you?

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#499  Edited By I_smell
@Vlad_Tiberius
A) I dont get ads on GiantBomb.
B) You can't buy a Quick Look. Or an Endurance Run, or anything.
C) Everyone knows each other cos they all go to the same press events and stay at the same bars and hotels you fucking dope.
And the GiantBomb guys are friends with the Trenched guys, but that got 3 stars.

You've connected too many dots and jumped to too many conclusions.
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#500  Edited By I_smell

If they were that desperate for money they wouldn't be ignoring the 200 sports games that come out every year you fucking bonehead.