#1 Posted by regularassmilk (1398 posts) -

So, this post is pretty much a response to Duke Nukem, but its sort of about Black Ops too? (AH, Games.)

 
So, people been talkin'.
People been talkin' 'bout COD.
Been talkin' about Duke Nukem.
And I got to thinking about Too Human, which in case you were lucky and forgot, was a game that was in development for 35 years and after finally came out, was shockingly blah. But well, some people liked it. The people I knew who liked it, albeit not terribly intelligent and game savvy people, also didn't know it was in development for half a century. Obviously it was over hyped, but can overhyping kill even a good game?
 Someone call life alert.


 Now, ever since Modern Warfare came out Call of Duty has been massive, and this is no surprise. Modern Warfare 2 was as good, if not substantially better. But now Black Ops comes out, and yeah, it has flaws. All big games do at launch. But had this been just another FPS and not a part of some grand ensemble, would people be foaming at the mouth and overlooking the bugs?
Duke Nukem will be torn the FUCK apart, I promise you. And I can bet money that it can be attributed a large part to its massive dev. cycle.
Even if Duke Nukem is a masterpiece, it can never live up to its hype.
So, what do you think? Can overhyping kill good games? Or will games like Duke Nukem still have balls of steel?

 I'd rather not bet on Duke.
#2 Posted by Popogeejo (615 posts) -

Hype can kill games but I think the Duke has gone through that so much that now no one has any idea of what to expect so it should be okay. 
Other than that one case though, Hype can be a huge poison for anything. It's like the horror movie idiom "What you don't see is always scarier." There is a point of hype at which point no game can survive and it's no longer judged on it's own merits. It's really sad when it happens but even worse when you can see it coming.

#3 Posted by mylifeforAiur (3483 posts) -

Absolutely. Half Life Episode: 3 will prove this^^  

Online
#4 Posted by crusader8463 (14421 posts) -

They can, but it's always a personal thing. If you let the hype build up too much in your own mind you will always be disappointed. The key is finding the right balance of hype and realistic expectations. No game will ever be able to match the greatness that you can think up in your own mind, because the game in your own mind is tailor made for what you want out of a game while the real one is made for everyone.

#5 Posted by themangalist (1731 posts) -

Fable was a decent game. Peter made it an alright game.

#6 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5232 posts) -

I don't get into hype.  I stay away from things so that feeling in my stomach of "I want it now!!" isn't there.

#8 Posted by Bloodgraiv3 (2712 posts) -

I think it can yes. 
I try not to hype games, but sometimes I can't help it. 
#9 Posted by T4RTERS4UCE (58 posts) -

I don't think that hype really holds much value in the Video Game industry anymore, at least not in this realm of it. Games are so derivative and technical in nature that even one minute of unadulterated footage tells me almost everything I need to know about it. At that end, SO MUCH footage comes out of every game that genuine surprise is almost impossible.
As for Duke, I think that it has kind of transcended hype at this point. Does anyone seriously feel emotions about it? Opinions on its quality, for me, are completely reset with Gearbox taking the reigns.

#10 Posted by regularassmilk (1398 posts) -
@T4RTERS4UCE said:
" I don't think that hype really holds much value in the Video Game industry anymore, at least not in this realm of it. Games are so derivative and technical in nature that even one minute of unadulterated footage tells me almost everything I need to know about it. At that end, SO MUCH footage comes out of every game that genuine surprise is almost impossible.As for Duke, I think that it has kind of transcended hype at this point. Does anyone seriously feel emotions about it? Opinions on its quality, for me, are completely reset with Gearbox taking the reigns. "
Reset meaning the hope you had is gone, or heightened? 
#11 Posted by Gamer_152 (14072 posts) -

Within online video game communities it can definitely be seen that hype makes people far more critical of games upon release, but can it kill a good game? Definitely not. The pattern has always been that the more hyped games do sell well or at least better than they would have done without said hype. There seems to be a lot of criticism out there from forumgoers towards Black Ops but I still think that game is going to sell like hot cakes.

Moderator
#12 Posted by tourgen (4478 posts) -

Yay marketing.  Yes buying into massive marketing campaigns can ruin a game for you.  Best to sit back, play the games you have, and ignore the advertising campaigns as much as possible.  When the game comes out check out a few reviews (the actual review text..) and see if it's worth renting, buying, or waiting 8-12 months for a GOTY or Platinum edition.  Don't bother with pre-release footage, trailers, and whatnot.  For the love of god stop pre-ordering games.  Be an informed consumer and buy a game on it's merits rather than it's marketing campaign.
 
If the game is genuinely cool and fun you can buy it and have a good time without dealing with the manufactured emotions from some marketing department.

#13 Posted by regularassmilk (1398 posts) -
@Gamer_152 said:
" Within online video game communities it can definitely be seen that hype makes people far more critical of games upon release, but can it kill a good game? Definitely not. The pattern has always been that the more hyped games do sell well or at least better than they would have done without said hype. There seems to be a lot of criticism out there from forumgoers towards Black Ops but I still think that game is going to sell like hot cakes. "
Well I could go shit in a box, and if it was COD it would probably sell. Just because things do well doesnt necessarily mean their good though, I.E. Sex and the City the movie.
I just wondered if it wasn't a COD game, if people would still be picking it apart.
#14 Posted by Gamer_152 (14072 posts) -
@regularassmilk said:
" @Gamer_152 said:
" Within online video game communities it can definitely be seen that hype makes people far more critical of games upon release, but can it kill a good game? Definitely not. The pattern has always been that the more hyped games do sell well or at least better than they would have done without said hype. There seems to be a lot of criticism out there from forumgoers towards Black Ops but I still think that game is going to sell like hot cakes. "
Well I could go shit in a box, and if it was COD it would probably sell. Just because things do well doesnt necessarily mean their good though, I.E. Sex and the City the movie. I just wondered if it wasn't a COD game, if people would still be picking it apart. "
I'm not saying it's the case that sales figures are directly proportional to how good a game is, but you asked if hyping kills a game and I said believe it does the opposite. No, if this wasn't a CoD game though I don't think this would be happening, just like I don't think any game held in high regard would get the kind of criticism it does for tiny details.
Moderator
#15 Posted by Godites (105 posts) -

I remember the hype train for Halo 3 led to many mixed reactions. For some, it lived up to the hype, and didn't for many others. Despite critical acclaim, the game garnered a lot of undeserved backlash. I think if people looked past the massive marketing hype behind Halo 3, you can look at it as a perfectly good game. I'm not a Halo fan, but I can see it's appeal and understand why so many enjoy it. I'm more of a Call of Duty guy. 
 
Heh, I remember people kept comparing Halo 3 with Call of Duty 4, as a means to bash the game. I've seem people being insulted people for liking Halo 3 more than Call of Duty 4. While I didn't care for Halo 3, I wouldn't bash it by saying "it's shit compared to COD4" or attack people for liking a game more than a game that I actually like. I guess thats what hype does to games. It not garners mindless fanaticism, but a lot of mindless hatred.

#16 Posted by StillVictor (150 posts) -

Too Human was in development for 35 years? Are you sure? That seems impossible.

#17 Posted by benjaebe (2783 posts) -
@themangalist said:
" Fable was a decent game. Peter made it an alright game. "
Couldn't have come up with a better example. Molyneux actually makes a game seem worse because he promises so much and delivers on so little. I certainly think it can happen to any series. Alan Wake is a pretty good example - yeah, I loved the title, but it was hyped for such a long period of time and kind of overstayed it's welcome - by the time the game was released (and only on Xbox) I think a lot of people had simply ceased to be excited about it.
#18 Posted by KingBroly (1645 posts) -

Yup

#19 Posted by T4RTERS4UCE (58 posts) -
@regularassmilk: Reset, whatever Gearbox is working on is of a vastly different quality than what 3D Realms was codding together. 
 
But, I guess, reset kind of means heightened in this situation.
#20 Posted by Captain_Felafel (1568 posts) -

Overhyping can only kill a legitimately good game if people let the hype color their opinions before actually playing the game.

#21 Posted by Romination (2777 posts) -

Overhyping kills almost every big game. It's all the time, but people never learn, get rehyped, let down when it doesn't cure cancer and save the economy, and then go back and do it again. You expect too much. You don't get it. Then, you translate that 'it is not enough!' to "i hate it so much" and that's what internet forums are for.

#22 Posted by MordeaniisChaos (5730 posts) -

Duke Nukem will do well for sheer historic importance. People will buy it just because it has something to offer that is beyond anything else. I really don't think hype will kill that game, and I think Gearbox knows how to make themselves a game.

#23 Posted by CornBREDX (5129 posts) -

People will hate on a game regardless of hype, but I believe (from my long experience in gaming) that hype will create expectations that can NEVER (you can quote me on that if you want) be met. I was falling for hype for a few years, reading about the games i wanted and watching all the videos. I stopped doing that though, because after so long when you do play the game it's not quite as great as you thought (or built it up to in your mind).
 
I don't agree, though, with your Duke Nukem analogy. DNF has been in production so long some gamers around here weren't even playing games yet when development started. Duke Nukem isn't going to be torn apart because of hype. It will be torn apart because they took so long to put it out. I think this may actually make it sell more too because it's a game that never had a chance (due to unforeseen development circumstances) and its development is legendary at this point. The fact that the thought of reading a book talking about "why did the game take so long" is appealing to me speaks volumes for what the real appeal is for DNF. I don't think DNF can fail, if only because everyone JUST HAS TO KNOW. It has nothing to do with hype, but it will definitely get nit picked to death (that's already popular to do and the game hasn't even been released yet).

#24 Posted by csl316 (8488 posts) -

i was insanely hyped for the Starcraft 2 story, and the disappointment i felt almost ruined the game for me.  the missions were fun and i love the multiplayer, but my expectations on the story almost had me ignore the game upon completion.  glad i didn't!

#25 Posted by Supermarius (1196 posts) -

hype can never kill a game. It's the gamer's fault if they let themselves pay attention to hype, and it really should be ignored for any game.  All games should be judged on their own merits, when they actually come out. There are plenty of games available now that stressing about ones coming out in a year is pretty pointless.

#26 Posted by Skald (4367 posts) -

Hype can kill a game critically, but it does wonders for the amount of units it sells.

#27 Posted by skadbob (230 posts) -

I think too much hype can definitely make some people overly critical. I guess sometimes hype can ruin legitimately good experiences, though for me I think it's happened way more with movies and books than it has with games. 
 
For big franchises, I think the hype itself can be kind of fun so most of the time I just try to enjoy it. Hype is such an integral part of every CoD, Halo, GTA... etc. release that I honestly think I would be way more disturbed if there weren't any hype. It's kind of an douchey thing to say, but in a "you are what you consume" kind of world, those kind of hype-machine-set-to-11-type experiences also make slightly smaller gems like Vanquish seem that much better... because I get to feel like I'm more discerning. /gaminghipster

#28 Posted by Hot_Karl (3309 posts) -

Overhyping can kill literally anything which is why I usually distance myself from the hype when it comes to video games (one of the many reasons why I'm not gaga over Black Ops at the moment). Consider Duke Nukem Forever- it can come out and be a totally competent first person shooter. It might even be great, who knows? But it won't matter, because the 10+ years of hype (anti-hype?) will absolutely kill it. DNF will never, EVER live up to the expectations that its unfortunate timeline set up for itself, and it's kind of a shame.

#29 Posted by Icadae (103 posts) -

Duke Nukem is going to blow, one might hope revolutionize, the FPS genre.
 
You must consider that with "all those years of hype (and what hype? it's more of a cruel joke)" there's been actual development. This game has been 14 years in development. 

Fourteen! 

Even if that does not include actual coding-time since they've had to switch engine again and again, imagine what this can do to content and design? It's going to be abwsolutely HUGE if gearbox takes just fifty procent of what 3D has written down so far, and it seems like they have. This isn't going to be a 4-5 hour blockbuster that plays more as an interactive movie than an actual game. It's going to be polished at a level of which we've only seen Platinum Games exceed in, where the game just clicks. If anything, the hype starts now. 
It's here. It's playable. There was a Demo at PAX which when I read about it, completely side-jabbed me. There really cannot be any hype because it's a game from a different time of FPS, and the genre has gone through so many itterations of style and complexity, that Duke's story can make a strong impact on the realistic, gritty and grey world that now inhabits the future of FPS - Now that Halo's fairly colourful world has left us for now. Not only that but think of all the 'return-to-basics' games that has been here these past 2 years that have been smash hits. 
 
If you haven't seen the Demo, you should try to find it, or read about it. It's bound to jerk a reaction from you. 
 

TL;DR 

Duke Nukem can only really be hyped now, but it isn't since people cannot fathom a game that has been in development for so long, what it means and what it actually is. Needless to say, there hasn't been any realistic hype about DNF for the better of a half decade, unless you were the sad little person keeping the candle lit. I know I sure wasn't. But now that it's an actual reality, an actual real gamey-game game, I'm happy as hell.
#30 Posted by Guided_By_Tigers (8061 posts) -

Simple answer: yes

#31 Posted by AhmadMetallic (18955 posts) -
@crusader8463 said:
"  If you let the hype build up too much in your own mind you will always be disappointed."
i reached the extreme most ultimate stages of HYPE for CoD 4, GTA IV, Assassin's Creed 2, Red Dead Redemption, Crysis and a few other titles, without being disappointed after playing them. they always delivered..
#32 Posted by WinterSnowblind (7615 posts) -
@benjaebe said:
" @themangalist said:
" Fable was a decent game. Peter made it an alright game. "
Couldn't have come up with a better example. Molyneux actually makes a game seem worse because he promises so much and delivers on so little. I certainly think it can happen to any series. Alan Wake is a pretty good example - yeah, I loved the title, but it was hyped for such a long period of time and kind of overstayed it's welcome - by the time the game was released (and only on Xbox) I think a lot of people had simply ceased to be excited about it. "
I honestly don't understand these comments anymore.  This was true with Black & White.. and it was certainly true with the original Fable.
But he learned what he did wrong with Fable 2 and the only hype we had was accompanied by gameplay footage and examples of how said features work.  Does anyone think it was overhyped?  And the third game received very little advertisement at all before release.
#33 Edited by xyzygy (9953 posts) -

Too Human, while it was hyped, had good reason for it being what it was. 
 
But I still think "overhyping" is just a mindset and it's all in your head. It's your own fault if it "ruins" a game for you. 
 
The only instance that I actually gave into the hype and it met my expectations though, was Alan Wake. Man I can still go back to that game after 3 playthroughs and it's still just awesome.

#34 Edited by PenguinDust (12499 posts) -

No, overhyping can not kill a good game.  Good game will survive the hype and find a prominent place on our hard drives regardless of any marketing mayhem or misdirected consumer backlash.  If a game is well written, graphically pleasing, and has good mechanics, why would any gamer want to deny themselves the experience merely because they found the constant barrage of marketing aggravating?  Are gamers so weak willed that they can be so easily manipulated to the positive or negative?  I personally doubt it.  A good game may not find an audience due to a number of problems such a poor/ineffective ad campaign, being released at the wrong time of the year, or differing from what the audience expects from that type of game.  Otherwise, if a game fails, it's because there is something wrong with the game itself.  

#35 Edited by gamefreak9 (2358 posts) -
@Progn0sticator said:

" Overhyping can only kill a legitimately good game if people let the hype color their opinions before actually playing the game. "

i will finish your comment,it seems incomplete. Otherwise Hyping can be a great thing since it increases sales and pre orders and such. 
#36 Posted by Captain_Felafel (1568 posts) -
@gamefreak9 said:
" @Progn0sticator said:
" Overhyping can only kill a legitimately good game if people let the hype color their opinions before actually playing the game. "
i will finish your comment seems it seems incomplete. Otherwise Hyping can be a great thing since it increases sales and pre orders and such.  "
Which is exactly why businesses do it, it's great for them in their short-term sales. For game players? Not so much.
#37 Posted by LordAndrew (14426 posts) -
@StillVictor said:
" Too Human was in development for 35 years? Are you sure? That seems impossible. "
35 years and also half a century. Obviously he's exaggerating a bit.
#38 Posted by onarum (2066 posts) -

it definitely can, that happened to me with Half Life 2, I folowed the development of the game for like 4 or 5 years... then when it finally came out (after that infamous delay due to source code theft) I already knew every single thing there was to know about the game, the characters, a big chunk of the plot, 90% of the locations, all the weapons etc... it kinda felt like I was replaying it.
 
In a way it was nowhere near the same fantastic experience I had with the original Half Life, but only because in that case I played the game without having a clue of what it was about, I learned my lesson though, the same thing almost happened with Red dead Redemption, but I was able to get a hold of myself and stay clear of all the spoilers.

#39 Posted by nickux (1385 posts) -

In my experience, not really. Maybe I'm able to separate my expectations from the actual game when it comes out but I wouldn't say a game's hype has ruined it for me. I look back at MGS4. I've never anticipated a game as much as that. And I know some people disagree but I loved it. Was it the experience I wanted it to be at all times? Well no but Kojipro was making their vision and their game. In the end, it's an experience I was glad to have. Or how about a game like Ocarina of Time? Delayed and hyped up but when it came out- it stood up because it's a great game. They might not be everybody's cup of tea but I think most people should agree they have some objectively good qualities in regards to the craft of game development. My point is: if a game is actually good- the hype around it won't be able to hurt it.

#40 Posted by fearthephins (148 posts) -

Well that all depends on the person.... if you allow it to affect you then it will affect you.
 
For me, as long as I enjoy playing the game that is all that matters. I could care less what people rate the game or anything. I still do read reviews and sometimes I am curious to see what other people think about these games (even before I have played them myself) but I will never let it affect my own opinion of the game. So even if people hype up the game to be legendary but then it's just pretty good ... it's all good. If I had fun playing the game then I am happy :)

#41 Posted by Lydian_Sel (2486 posts) -

Overhyping doesn't kill games, it just kills your ability to objectively asses & analyse a product.

#42 Posted by KaosAngel (13765 posts) -

...what about GT5's situation?

#43 Posted by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -
@themangalist said:
" Fable was a decent game. Peter made it an alright game. "
There's a difference between hype and lying.  Molly lied and talked about features which never became part of the Fable series.  He did the same thing with Black and White as well.  Creature Arena with online play?  Never happened.
#44 Posted by CaptainObvious (2997 posts) -
@KaosAngel said:
" ...what about GT5's situation? "
You tell me, you've already spent 250$ on it.
#45 Posted by Arker101 (1474 posts) -

Halo Reach, Modern Warfare 2, and The Force Unleashed, really bummed me out because my expectations were too high, but I learned to keep my own personal hype down. 
 
That's how I was able to watch Avatar.
#46 Edited by phrosnite (3518 posts) -

I know you are talking about pre-launch hype but I would like to tell you about the post-launch hype. Bioshock is a game that was ruinned  for me by the hype. I played it a year since it was released and I liked it but imo it's definitely not a 96% game. It a good game for sure but  it's 80% imo. Hype, hype, hype and in the end I felt disappointed. Same thing with Half-life 2. Definitely not the best PC game ever made. The only game with 95% that didn't disappoint me was Baldur's Gate 2 (2000). Played it for the first time 3 weeks ago and I LOVED it.

#47 Posted by crusader8463 (14421 posts) -
@Ahmad_Metallic said:
" @crusader8463 said:
"  If you let the hype build up too much in your own mind you will always be disappointed."
i reached the extreme most ultimate stages of HYPE for CoD 4, GTA IV, Assassin's Creed 2, Red Dead Redemption, Crysis and a few other titles, without being disappointed after playing them. they always delivered.. "
Then you didn't build it up too much. You built it up just enough to make you happy when you got them. As I said, it's finding that balance.
#48 Posted by TheGreatGuero (9130 posts) -

Yeah, like others have mentioned, Peter Molyneaux is a fantastic example of overhyping hurting good games.

#49 Posted by AhmadMetallic (18955 posts) -
@crusader8463 said:
" @Ahmad_Metallic said:
" @crusader8463 said:
"  If you let the hype build up too much in your own mind you will always be disappointed."
i reached the extreme most ultimate stages of HYPE for CoD 4, GTA IV, Assassin's Creed 2, Red Dead Redemption, Crysis and a few other titles, without being disappointed after playing them. they always delivered.. "
Then you didn't build it up too much. You built it up just enough to make you happy when you got them. As I said, it's finding that balance. "
the only hype stronger than the one i had i imagine would be.. slitting your wrists waiting for the game, or masturbating while watching its trailers. is that the case here? :P