Do you ever think about cardinal direction in games?

It also makes me wonder if someone's perception, just in something such as this can change someone's feeling of it compared to someone else's thoughts on it. I mean, I would assume it would actually.

Like, you think what the game calls North is actually South, according to you? I can't say that I've ever experienced anything like that. Most of the times I internalize the game map pretty quickly when I see it, unless there isn't one.

@rorie: Yep, I can't really internalize it, as it's just not how I imagined it, and it's not easy to get what I imagine out of my head, as that's a way I perceive the environments, and either like, or dislike a games setting actually (at least, that's a part of what goes into me liking or disliking it). It seems minor, but I guess it's a big thing for me. Also, not necessarily the opposite, just a different direction, and that's based off the game, as not all games are the same, because sometimes with games I play, I would see it as the way the game presents it. A lot of the time, I don't really pay attention to a games compass, other than when I have to go to a mission for instance, like in Fallout 3 here; sometimes when I see it, and look around and it's not matching with the way I personally saw it, it just seems off to me. Sometimes in a game, I can also see it correctly depending on the place, and incorrectly in other areas of the game. That all said, my issue isn't the thing I want to discuss, ha ha. I'm interested, now in your case, if you imagine the directions in games that don't have compasses, since you acclimate to games with compasses well.

Outside of the first Far Cry I haven't noticed the compass much but I guess most game environments are near equator or on the northern hemisphere so I don't notice the sun's path.

I have trouble immersing myself in games with low FOV or the twisted perspective that Gamebryo has. 90's PC FPS games seemed more believable. Sometimes it's like the distant mountains don't get bigger as I get closer or something weird like that.

@thesquarepear: That's an interesting point; I never really think about where the sun is in the games setting and go from there, then again, that wouldn't work for when there's an interior. I also use cardinal direction even when there isn't any, like in games that are on space ships, or the feeling of what direction it seems to be going in.

If the game has a map then I have to know my directions.

On a side note it really annoys me when the mini map's default mode is to turn with the player's direction so that north is always changing. For me up has to be north on a map otherwise I completely lose my sense of direction.

PS your first post has waaaay too many commas. I really struggled with it! Might just be me though.

How can you even come up with something other than what the game tells you? I generally just go by the map and if there isn't one then I don't even think about it.

Also I have never played a game where up on the map wasn't north.

@devil240z: Some games have north change with player direction on the mini-map (not the big map), i.e. the player arrow is always facing up.

@caska: That doesn't mean North changes. That means the direction the player is facing has changed. North is always North. Usually the mini-map will have a red line or something to indicate what is North. If your player arrow is facing away from that, you're probably going South.

I can't say I've ever experienced anything like what the OP says. If a game that needs directions has a map, and they nearly all do, then North is always North and the rest fall into line. Even games where maps are optional, like Minecraft, you can tell where North is by looking at the direction the clouds are going, they always go West so it's easy to figure out what way you're going by just looking at them.

Here's a cardinal for each cardinal direction. You'll never be lost again. Enjoy!

@jesus_phish: Don't get me wrong, I absolutely know what's going on when the north sign is on the left side of the minimap instead of on the top because I as a player have turned to face right. All I mean to say is that it really disorientates me and I always go digging through the settings to see if I can change it so that north will always be on the top of the minimap no matter which direction I'm facing. Do people often use minimaps the other way around because I don't remember the names of the games but it seems like there's a few that default to like the player orientated type of map?

I'm a little bit confused about what you mean by the wording of this poll. I've definitely had trouble in games where I was running in one direction, only to discover that I was completely mistaken about it (usually when the map rotates), but I've never found it to be particularly game breaking. I rarely ever have trouble in open world games even if they don't have a map, because if I can see the sun I can figure out East/West. In games without explicit directions I tend to consider the highest static point on the map to be North, unless it's a space game when I just throw out all directions and think about it in radial co-ordinates.

Do you just find yourself constantly checking your map and going along fine without actually internalising anything, or do you find yourself internalising the wrong thing and then feeling overwhelmed?

I've certainly played a few games that feel incredibly claustrophobic and I find myself following the critical path blindly without really knowing where I'm going, but I'm not really sure what it is about those games that invokes that feeling.

@devil240z: It's not about the map, and how N is up, S is down, E is right, and W is left. This is about perception. I only brought up Fallout 3 as an example of when games do have a compass, but it's not really the main topic, it's about perceiving the direction one faces when they are put into an environment of a game; it can even be when there is no real direction based on the setting. For instance, in Dead Space you're on the Ishimura; there is no cardinal direction, but I perceive just by the look of the environments which way I am going. I'm pretty sure there was a map in Dead Space, though I don't remember it. My point was about perception only, and I mentioned how games don't always align with the way I imagine it, when games have compasses. It's not about looking at a map or compass and then not knowing if it's true or not, that's just goofy. For me, looking at an environment and thinking about which direction I am looking in, helps me understand the world in which things are placed, and when it's incorrect, it feels awkward. It can also happen in reality when it's in a place I haven't been before, far away enough from home anyways, or when you're driving and you keep going on winding roads; I still have a thought in which direction I face, even if it's incorrect. If you were helping someone play a game that had no compass or map, and you had to describe to them which way to go, only by cardinal direction, it makes me wonder if your directions would differ from how they perceive which way things are, and why they perceive it differently than you, as well as if you both perceive it differently, does the setting mean anything differently between either of you? I guess it's about relating oneself to the world they inhabit.

@ohnooh: I never said game breaking. Also, overwhelmed is a stretch. And, I made it a bit clearer in my most recent post. Yeah, as I said earlier in another past post, when it's a game that takes place on Earth, I don't always think about the sun/moon placement. I never have trouble in games, I don't lose my place in a setting in that sense. Plus, any game, like Fallout 3 for instance, will always have a marker placed, or it even has the directions displayed, so that can never be an issue. The topic isn't about the issue I have, but yes, I suppose I don't internalize the direction I face after I check the map, as after a while, I go back to what I thought it was, how I imagined it.

My point would be, would we all assume the same direction we face in a game if say, Fallout 3 had no compass or map, and if not, why? Then again, the whole sun/moon thing covers that, though that just makes it clear as to where things actually are, it doesn't actually change my perception of how things seem to be placed. When I play a game, I look into a direction and imagine 'my place of living is that way' for instance, if I am imagining it in one way, and it's not correct in a game that has actual locations, then it seems weird to me is all, as if the environment I'm in doesn't match with the way I imagine a place farther away is. That's why I brought up G.R.A.W. 2 and Fallout 3.

I'm even more confused now. How can you perceive that something should be South when it's actually North? Especially in something like Dead Space, which takes place on a ship. What about the corridors would make you think "I'm heading East now" but then you open the map and it tells you you were actually going North. Do you just decide arbitrarily that you where going East?

I have no idea what you are talking about. You make up your own cardinal directions for games? I guess I'd assume a game with a colder area would place that up north, but that might be giving the game too much credit in a lot of cases.

But it does bother me when maps don't feel like they fit together properly. One of my favorite attributes of good metroidvania games is how they tie the environment into itself like a frankensteinish jigzaw puzzle to complete a world with a logical consistency of it's own. Same can be said for games like Dark Souls. And less so for it's sequel.

@ntm: Thats weird man. I don't get it at all I guess.

Side note. I'm a big fan of the Pleiades star cluster. Its not like anything else you can see with the naked eye.

I'm always aware of direction. A lot of my early game experiences were with flight simulators and RPGs where you had to draw a map and that kind of cemented navigation concepts in my brain such that it's an automatic reaction for me now.

@jesus_phish: It's just about how the setting looks in which I decide, and I go based off how I see the real world really. I know the difference between north, south, east, and west in reality, and I can easily point into a certain direction from where I sit right now, but in games, the way things are environmentally placed I suppose makes me assume it's a certain way. I don't know if random would be the correct word for it. Also, I don't just disregard the actual direction games have them set as, but it doesn't mean I don't imagine it another way if that's just the way I feel about it. Let's say for instance, in Half Life 2, there is no compass, but when you start the game, and you're facing a certain way in the train, and the direction the monitor is in which you head toward, with Dr. Breen on the big monitor, I imagine you're facing East, and that may or may not be correct, but it's the way I interpret my surroundings. I guess it is random, but it's not like I go 'okay, I am facing north, now I turn slightly right, and I'm south all of a sudden', that's not really how it works. I place an imaginary map in my head with the cardinal directions in games that don't have maps or compasses (though subconsciously), and I do it in games that do, and sometimes it clashes with the way I imagined it. If Fallout 3 had no map or compass, but it told me to go in one of the cardinal directions, I wouldn't know which way I'd have to go at first, though again, as others brought up, the whole sun/moon thing is a good way to go about it.

I guess instead of that I just navigate using landmarks. I feel like in real life I think about what direction I'm facing all the time but it never happens in games. Like in real life when I park my car at work I know its facing west. when I drive home I know I'm heading north. But when I play a game I am just going toward the next waypoint.

If there's no compass/map and I can't work it out using the sun/geography then I won't even try to guess which way is which 'cause it's probably completely useless to know.

Certainly not to the point that I'm thrown off by errors or stuff like that, but it's always fascinating to compare the skybox to the angle of the shadows to what it should be given the time of day, direction and location where the game is set.

@fisk0: When I said I was befuddled, I didn't necessarily mean I was thrown off and I became lost. Becoming lost isn't an issue, it's just that for me, I look at a place and imagine where I am, and if the games compass is showing something different, I find it hard to imagine how it is actually facing that specific direction, that's all. It's probably incorrect, or I can't remember, but in Fallout 3, again as an example, when you step out of the vault for the first time, I imagine the way one is facing is pointing west, or north west.

@alexw00d: Oh, yes, it is definitely useless in terms of where one needs to go in the game, but for me, it's something I think about, though somewhat subconsciously. I say somewhat, but that's mainly because as I notice it throughout, I am not actively thinking or saying to myself 'I am facing and going this way'. I've already said it, but it's just a way for me to familiarize, and relate the environment to where things are in real life honestly, as that for me builds immersion.

@devil240z: Hm. Yeah, I think about it in games as well. To me, it's not about knowing what direction you face, but about where you imagine which direction you face in games.

@ntm so you're saying that, when you load up a game, based on some criteria it seems to you like you're facing east (for example) but then if the game has a compass which says actually you're facing north, that's what takes away some of the immersion for you? I can't say that I've ever experienced that, that's interesting.

It genuinely sounds like you have some sort of condition I've not previously heard of. Something along the lines of synesthesia.

@hark: It doesn't necessarily take away from the immersion, at least not to a large degree that lasts, but yes, I guess it does in the instance I notice the compass is facing a direction that isn't going the same way I imagined it. Like I said though, it hardly takes away from the experience.

@cthomer5000: I don't have a condition, otherwise it would affect me in reality and not just games. I guess I just look at it a bit differently than some others.

You'd use landmarks as reference points instead of worrying about cardinal directions?

I dunno man , whatever you experience has to be incredibly confusing. I can barely understand what you are even attempting to describe, I can only imagine it's got to be incredibly disorienting for you.

I mean I do have somewhat unconscious associations with cardinal directions probably influenced to living in the US (e.g. North is Cold, South is hot, West is dry, East is wet etc) that probably lead to my initial best guesses. But if the game says X way is North, then that becomes North to me.

The only way I know how to determine where true North is in a game without a map is to use the location of the in game Sun (if there is one). Assuming it rises and sets, then you know where East and West are. If there is no sun and especially if you are not on Earth, the idea of even worrying about which way is north seems pointless to me.

If anything I can relate a little bit in real-life terms. I moved to a new area a few years ago, and sort of assembled a mental map of key locations i would drive to. After like 6 months i remember looking at a map and thinking "i thought that was straight north but it's almost directly west." I also remember being surprised to see how pieces of the area I had visited independently actually fit together - if i had to draw a map prior to seeing some of this stuff on a map my perception would have been way off.

That being said - as soon as I see an actual map (real world or in a game), I can't visualize the stuff any other way. Because new information has been provided, and it no longer makes sense to think of it in some abstract "feeling" based way to me.

@slag: My point was if you had to use cardinal directions, and nothing else to go on, so no mention of landmarks, would their north be different to yours? If their sense of north or what have you, is the same as yours. Also, it's not confusing to me, nor disorienting. It's everyone's understanding of what I am describing that's making it seem as if I am having a hard time, when that's not really the case. I would also say 'worrying' about which direction things face is not a concern, but it can still be something to think about, well for me anyways. I do think about it more than never, but I think people are assuming I put much more emphasis on it than I am, but that's only the case because I keep trying to describe what I mean. I don't think I am alone on this, because I feel everyone when they are exploring a games environment is imagining they're heading in some sort of direction rather than simply ahead, even when it comes to games that don't take place on Earth. I think I've confused everyone here more so than everyone feels I am, ha ha. A recent game in which I played, and there is no way to know which direction you are going in, and yet I imagined which direction I was heading in each moment, was SOMA.

Alright, I find it an interesting topic, but I am kind of done explaining what I mean now.