How Five Fellow Players Are Helping Retain Your Legal Rights

The choice is simple for any intelligent human being. Stop supporting EA and Sony products. I'm glad Patrick keeps posting material of this matter because he's stirring the sheeple from their slumber. Mad or not, they will have to face reality, and that reality is publishers only think of you as dollar signs.

EU wins! for once :(

The thing that's most depressing to me are the drones on both sides of the argument who keep on fighting with each other. You've either got tools who are following a fucking company line, telling everyone to bend over and take it, or tools lining up to give Klepek a handy, scared shitless that they've somehow given away the rights to their freedom by agreeing not to sue a consumer electronics company.

Anyone care to join me in the grey area here?

Man, I can only imagine the cost of postage on something like this. I'm glad they're doing it, though. Also, props to Giant Bomb and Patrick for keeping tabs on this issue.

Does this matter if you've signed up for Origin but never use it?

Automatic win for us brits then. I might just send them a letter saying' dear Sony, I renounce my ability to sue you so u won't have to ask. Love Rekt. P.s Just kidding Sony! see you in court ;)

I'm in UK, and I use to live in Spain. It sucks to be you... good luck in this fight against the companies that try to abuse legally of what law is.

This is fucking ridiculous. You shouldn't sue - it's a video game. Just sign the EULA and don't be a dick. It's common courtesy - not some sort of invasion of privacy. They're just doing these clauses so morons won't sue them because they can't play their Call of Duty online (one of the dumbest reasons ever to try to sue a corporation).

If these a**holes are going to be this stupid, perhaps they shouldn't be playing video games at all. There are REAL problems in the world, Patrick -- Stop making such a fuss about this crap! Someone should send you to Libya so you can get some damn perspective.

Fuck.

Remember when Giantbomb was awesome? And only Jeff, Ryan, Brad, Vinny and Alex used to post stuff? And all they did was play video games? And there wasn't a fucking, god-damn 30 second Dead Island ad in front of every video? Man...I fucking hate it when Patrick gets into "faux-journalistic crusade" mode - play some games and be cool about it, or stfu. You're part of Giantbomb!

@Rirse said:

Don't care, stop posting this crap, Patrick.

THANK YOU

@vinsanityv22 said:

This is fucking ridiculous. You shouldn't sue - it's a video game. Just sign the EULA and don't be a dick. It's common courtesy - not some sort of invasion of privacy. They're just doing these clauses so morons won't sue them because they can't play their Call of Duty online (one of the dumbest reasons ever to try to sue a corporation).

If these a**holes are going to be this stupid, perhaps they shouldn't be playing video games at all. There are REAL problems in the world, Patrick -- Stop making such a fuss about this crap! Someone should send you to Libya so you can get some damn perspective.

Fuck.

Remember when Giantbomb was awesome? And only Jeff, Ryan, Brad, Vinny and Alex used to post stuff? And all they did was play video games? And there wasn't a fucking, god-damn 30 second Dead Island ad in front of every video? Man...I fucking hate it when Patrick gets into "faux-journalistic crusade" mode - play some games and be cool about it, or stfu. You're part of Giantbomb!

@Rirse said:

Don't care, stop posting this crap, Patrick.

THANK YOU

I couldn't disagree with you more. I would also like to add that unless we are holding people accountable, our rights will slowly start to disappear. It's never bad to question something like this. It will at least garner some answers.

@vinsanityv22 said:

This is fucking ridiculous. You shouldn't sue - it's a video game. Just sign the EULA and don't be a dick. It's common courtesy - not some sort of invasion of privacy. They're just doing these clauses so morons won't sue them because they can't play their Call of Duty online (one of the dumbest reasons ever to try to sue a corporation).

If these a**holes are going to be this stupid, perhaps they shouldn't be playing video games at all. There are REAL problems in the world, Patrick -- Stop making such a fuss about this crap! Someone should send you to Libya so you can get some damn perspective.

Fuck.

Remember when Giantbomb was awesome? And only Jeff, Ryan, Brad, Vinny and Alex used to post stuff? And all they did was play video games? And there wasn't a fucking, god-damn 30 second Dead Island ad in front of every video? Man...I fucking hate it when Patrick gets into "faux-journalistic crusade" mode - play some games and be cool about it, or stfu. You're part of Giantbomb!

@Rirse said:

Don't care, stop posting this crap, Patrick.

THANK YOU

I couldn't disagree with you more. I would also like to add that unless we are holding people accountable, our rights will slowly start to disappear. It's never bad to question something like this. It will at least garner some answers.

@Enigma777 said:

I already mailed my letter along with a picture of my socks last week.

Were they argyle socks?

Damn  Xiaominmoo,  I may take you up on you offer of a "$33 AF tank woman" or a "$17 puma slipper woman". These chicks sound HOT!

I used the template that you posted Patrick (thank you for that by the way) and sent my letter a few days ago. Sometimes people think single-use websites are dumb but this was a great idea and I hope the people who use it donate a bit.

It's a great thing what these people are doing.

@TheSouthernDandy: At my ripe old age of 37, I have to triage things in life. I don't have the luxury and/or energy to fight and make a crusade out of everything. I fully support other peoples rights to do so, but I'm just not going to. So yeah, I'll freely admit that I don't always care about people taking away my right to do something that I'll never do. I fight things based upon how important I think it is in the big scheme of things. The money I spend on gaming could never justify me putting energy to collect on some broken game or platform. It's just not on my radar. I'll let popular opinion and the media tear them apart and affect their bottom line. So I get your point and other people's points about this, but it's simply just not something I can afford to worry about.

Just signed up.

Thanks Patrick for sharing this.

Why did you contact Microsoft? Shouldn't you have contacted EA?

I registered an account just to comment on this. In the vast majority of cases, class action suits benefit one group of people: Lawyers. So you buy a game and for some reason you feel butt-hurt enough to get in a big class action lawsuit (RAGE?). So the game company gets sued for 10 million dollars, the asshat lawyers take 50% and you get a check in the mail for $5. Wow. You really showed them. It seems like every few months I get some stupid class action opt-in form in the mail for something stupid. They go straight in the trash. The lawyers who set these thing up are straight-up extortionists and the idiots who join into class actions such as these do the gaming industry (or the world in general) a severe injustice. Supporting class action lawsuits supports bottom-feeding lawyers. It won't make you any money. It won't make companies change their behavior. It makes the BAD GUYS rich and the game companies charge you higher prices.

Why would I opt out of this EULA agreement preventing me from initiating a frivolous lawsuit over loss of access to an online gaming service? Class action law suits over such trivial things just waste money and tie up the court system. I would never sue Sony/EA over a gaming service nor would I support any lunatic who wastes time and money on doing so for such a trivial thing. There are much more important things in this world which need to be fought for. This is not one of them.

@Jonnyflash80: Apparently you an I are late to this corporate-hate-fest. It is nice to see at least a couple of thinking individuals on this forum. Sadly, "Rage against the corporation" seems to be quite the hot theme these days (unless that corporation happens to be Apple of course... they can do no wrong). Class action lawsuits are not your friends kids. By and large, the only people they benefit are the lawyers.

How would the people here feel if some much-beloved dev (such as Mojang for instance) were driven to bankruptcy by some jackass lawyer and a frivolous class-action lawsuit?

This is dumb!

@Rebirth1337: Losing your personal information to hackers & not wanting to take responsibility for it isn't enough?

I @vinsanityv22 said:

This is fucking ridiculous. You shouldn't sue - it's a video game. Just sign the EULA and don't be a dick. It's common courtesy - not some sort of invasion of privacy. They're just doing these clauses so morons won't sue them because they can't play their Call of Duty online (one of the dumbest reasons ever to try to sue a corporation).

If these a**holes are going to be this stupid, perhaps they shouldn't be playing video games at all. There are REAL problems in the world, Patrick -- Stop making such a fuss about this crap! Someone should send you to Libya so you can get some damn perspective.

Fuck.

Remember when Giantbomb was awesome? And only Jeff, Ryan, Brad, Vinny and Alex used to post stuff? And all they did was play video games? And there wasn't a fucking, god-damn 30 second Dead Island ad in front of every video? Man...I fucking hate it when Patrick gets into "faux-journalistic crusade" mode - play some games and be cool about it, or stfu. You're part of Giantbomb!

@Rirse said:

Don't care, stop posting this crap, Patrick.

THANK YOU

Oh my god, I feel dumber for having read this "response". Do you seriously have no idea what the context of this is?

To all who are complaining about this; you're right. Class action lawsuits are insane and only really exist within the US and it's fucked up legal system. BUT THAT IS NOT WHAT THIS IS ABOUT. The reason we post these letters is so big companies realise that consumers will take notice of what they put in their EULA's, so that in the future they won't try to take away rights that actually matter.

As a member of the EU, I'm glad we don't put up with this kind of bullshit.

Whether it actually matters that much in reality or not, this just seems like a sleazy move by the corporations and I'm glad these guys are sending an organized middle finger right back at them.

@patrickklepek: Those of us who agree with you, but at the same time aren't out to turn Sony, or any other company with these kinds of EULA's, into he-who-is-Satan? I'm firmly of the belief that this is totally down to whatever action one is willing to take, but does it need to be so extreme in one way or the other? Should those of us taking steps to retain our rights have to "stick it to the man!" and do those of us who've made the decision to say "fuck it!" necessarily have to be company zealots? I don't think so, but a lot of people on both sides of these arguments do.

@Plan6 said:

@Shakezula84 said:

Why would I sue either Sony or EA?

Wouldn't you like the option if they, I don't know, leak your credit card number and your credit rating gets ruined?

If you don't care, this is not for you. Likely for you, you don't have to be involved.

Thank you. I don't know how many times I've posted that. Its like all the kids on the website have no idea how the world works. Your credit is everything.

Not to mention if they get your debit card and your credit card info then you have no money to pay your bills thus your credit is ruined too. Then when you try to sue Sony or whoever you have no money to pay the lawyer because Sony or whoever just lost it.

Edit: Also why all the Patrick hate? Just about all the article's he puts up get hated on. When every single one of them has something to do with games and is something most people are interested in. Just curious, Patrick is not my favorite GB personality but he does a good job and puts up some great articles.

This is fucking ridiculous. You shouldn't sue - it's a video game. Just sign the EULA and don't be a dick. It's common courtesy - not some sort of invasion of privacy. They're just doing these clauses so morons won't sue them because they can't play their Call of Duty online (one of the dumbest reasons ever to try to sue a corporation).

If these a**holes are going to be this stupid, perhaps they shouldn't be playing video games at all. There are REAL problems in the world, Patrick -- Stop making such a fuss about this crap! Someone should send you to Libya so you can get some damn perspective.

Fuck.

Remember when Giantbomb was awesome? And only Jeff, Ryan, Brad, Vinny and Alex used to post stuff? And all they did was play video games? And there wasn't a fucking, god-damn 30 second Dead Island ad in front of every video? Man...I fucking hate it when Patrick gets into "faux-journalistic crusade" mode - play some games and be cool about it, or stfu. You're part of Giantbomb!

@Rirse said:

Don't care, stop posting this crap, Patrick.

THANK YOU

While its true there are certainly more important things to get riled up about, if you don't stand up for any of your rights you deserve none. The truth is Sony fucked up and are trying to cover their asses by exploiting people's malaise. Turns out gamers are a pretty solid choice for malaise-exploiting, and from reading these comments many are in fact violently defensive of their right to be lazy and thoughtless.

Good job Patrick, keep it up.

LOL, good thing I gave my ps3 to my mom. I haven't used it since heavy rain.

@vinsanityv22 said:

This is fucking ridiculous. You shouldn't sue - it's a video game. Just sign the EULA and don't be a dick. It's common courtesy - not some sort of invasion of privacy. They're just doing these clauses so morons won't sue them because they can't play their Call of Duty online (one of the dumbest reasons ever to try to sue a corporation).

If these a**holes are going to be this stupid, perhaps they shouldn't be playing video games at all. There are REAL problems in the world, Patrick -- Stop making such a fuss about this crap! Someone should send you to Libya so you can get some damn perspective.

Fuck.

Remember when Giantbomb was awesome? And only Jeff, Ryan, Brad, Vinny and Alex used to post stuff? And all they did was play video games? And there wasn't a fucking, god-damn 30 second Dead Island ad in front of every video? Man...I fucking hate it when Patrick gets into "faux-journalistic crusade" mode - play some games and be cool about it, or stfu. You're part of Giantbomb!

@Rirse said:

Don't care, stop posting this crap, Patrick.

THANK YOU

Or - God forbid - you could just simply direct the entirety of your complaint toward the people who selfishly and stupidly sue over absolutely nothing.

After that, you can realize that wanting to retain the rights to defend yourself (say Sony institutes something that limits access to all your own games somewhere down the line or leaks credit info) is perfectly understandable. If they have no fear of repercussion from consumers other than a lack of sales - and if gamers have proven anything, they're obnoxiously easy to exploit - they're perfectly free to dick us over.

But, sure. We can ignore that part and "just be chill" and not ever worry about losing our rights that might be important in the future. Or maybe you can stop misguidedly raging so hard and realize what the source of your problem is, direct it at the appropriate people, and otherwise be cool about it.

Giantbomb is just fine. Your thought process just isn't doing you any justice.

Edit: To be clearer: It's not like those of us who are against it want to sue Sony / EA and just haven't gotten around to it yet. It's more that it's rather foreboding thing to try to sneak into your EULA. I'm not a fan of the slippery slope argument, but I'd rather not sit down and let larger companies get the impression that we don't mind being having rights taken away for their benefit.

Yeah, they might want to contact an actual lawyer about this. This whole arrangement is full of holes that Sony and EA's $500 an hour attorneys could drive a legal truck through. My guess is all that happens because of this is both companies have a whole category of people who think they've opted out but have not actually done so. And they'll be easy to target since they'll be a series of form letters from the same address.

I also would be less than enthused giving all my personal information relevant to my accounts to a random website that wants to send a legal document on my behalf. That's like 17 kinds of Internet red flags. Even though they'll be using a "variety of security measures" to protect my information and super serious promise to delete it when they're done.

@Deathpooky: Technically Sony and EA don't have to let anyone opt out of this feature. This whole area is gray and uncertain, and the opt out is the $500$900 an hour attorneys knowing that this sort of mandatory arbitration/forfeit the right to join in a class action thing is often not upheld by courts if they feel like a plaintiff did not have a chance to properly object to the waiving of their rights. Its a brand new area just decided on by the Supreme Court so no one knows how lower courts will interpret the Supreme Court decision.

Giving people a 30 day window to "opt out" greatly increases the legitimacy of people who choose not to opt out, waiving their rights. So its not really about being some binding iron clad response to the EULA. This is just about preserving the right for any one who opts out to join in a class action.

I've never had a problem agreeing to Terms of Services/EULAs

My problem is having to agree to the changes to the EULA's once you've already invested in the company's services. THAT IS AN OUTRIGHT SCAM AND SHOULD BE ILLEGAL.

Why is changing EULA's legal? Users should be responsible ONLY TO THE ORIGINAL EULA/TOS THEY FIRST AGREED UPON.

That's why corporations these days are being villified. Open your damn eyes, internet children.

Is that the sum total of all nation states that are automatically excluded? Some places are assumed to be part of certain organizations when they're not, but they still maintain rights protection clauses. I guess a source would be nice for that.
 
This is fun! It's like a game within a game!

Cool. Just tried and I relized that these clauses do not apply in Canada. There is already precident that an eula cannot force you to give up your rights in Canada.

Thanks, Patrick.

It's a little unsettling to see so many people totally okay with corporations gradually taking away basic rights. The vast majority of players won't sue. Maybe no one ever will. But just having that option available for worst case scenarios in the first place is incredibly important.

Wow has anyone actually read the trash they are sending out?

"I am rejecting your changes to prevent myself from participating in any lawsuits and or bound to resolve disputes with any Electronic Arts entity through arbitration."

That's barely fucking English. God damn. Everyone do yourselves a favor and write your own.

I do not believe in the right to sue. Therefore, they aren't "taking away my rights". Lawsuits are not a privilege, they are an abomination that has slowly drove the United States towards ruin. Hate all your high medical bills? Blame lawsuits, because malpractice insurance for doctors is insanely high and has driven more than a few good surgeons to abandon the field altogether or switch to being a general practitioner (either way, they no long use their talents in the operating room). Sick of your car insurance rates going up? Lawsuits, again. Tell me you don't know someone who had a minor car accident that resulted in a big pay day.

If Sony wrongs me to the point that I feel I need to pursue legal action, that day will be the last day any Sony product graces my door (same is true of any major corporation). That's how I will "get back at them". Not by throwing in with some lawyer who is going to make a mint and give me a coupon for it. So, for me, I do not see it as Sony "taking away my rights", I see it as Sony attempting to "take away your ability" and, sorry folks, I am perfectly OK with that.

For the record, individual non-malpractice lawsuits in cases where death or life-changing injury are involved get a bit of a pass on a case by case basis. I have never seen a single class action lawsuit that I agreed with, however, and every single one that I've been invited to be a part of (at the age of 35, I've been notified of 3 or 4), I have ignored. The reason for that, beyond common sense and the lack of need for $10 off at the Sizzler, is it is my understanding that the lawyers get more money depending on how many people sign up. Seriously, folks, class action lawsuits are demonic, evil things and, if anything, we should be doing anything we can to prevent them from happening.

@BionicRadd said:

I do not believe in the right to sue. Therefore, they aren't "taking away my rights". Lawsuits are not a privilege, they are an abomination that has slowly drove the United States towards ruin. Hate all your high medical bills? Blame lawsuits, because malpractice insurance for doctors is insanely high and has driven more than a few good surgeons to abandon the field altogether or switch to being a general practitioner (either way, they no long use their talents in the operating room). Sick of your car insurance rates going up? Lawsuits, again. Tell me you don't know someone who had a minor car accident that resulted in a big pay day.

If Sony wrongs me to the point that I feel I need to pursue legal action, that day will be the last day any Sony product graces my door (same is true of any major corporation). That's how I will "get back at them". Not by throwing in with some lawyer who is going to make a mint and give me a coupon for it. So, for me, I do not see it as Sony "taking away my rights", I see it as Sony attempting to "take away your ability" and, sorry folks, I am perfectly OK with that.

For the record, individual non-malpractice lawsuits in cases where death or life-changing injury are involved get a bit of a pass on a case by case basis. I have never seen a single class action lawsuit that I agreed with, however, and every single one that I've been invited to be a part of (at the age of 35, I've been notified of 3 or 4), I have ignored. The reason for that, beyond common sense and the lack of need for $10 off at the Sizzler, is it is my understanding that the lawyers get more money depending on how many people sign up. Seriously, folks, class action lawsuits are demonic, evil things and, if anything, we should be doing anything we can to prevent them from happening.

I think you are being very narrow-sighted. I've been a part of numerous class action lawsuits, one with BMW and one with Mercedes. Both forced them to support or fix their defective products. There are many that are absurd, but there are also many that are entirely legitimate.

Hmmm, interesting but I'm a little timid on putting that much information into an online form that goes to a 3rd party. It takes all of 1 minute to print, sign, seal, and throw a letter into my stack of bills to send out. I'll just do it myself, but it is nice they are doing this for people.

@subyman said:

@BionicRadd said:

I do not believe in the right to sue. Therefore, they aren't "taking away my rights". Lawsuits are not a privilege, they are an abomination that has slowly drove the United States towards ruin. Hate all your high medical bills? Blame lawsuits, because malpractice insurance for doctors is insanely high and has driven more than a few good surgeons to abandon the field altogether or switch to being a general practitioner (either way, they no long use their talents in the operating room). Sick of your car insurance rates going up? Lawsuits, again. Tell me you don't know someone who had a minor car accident that resulted in a big pay day.

If Sony wrongs me to the point that I feel I need to pursue legal action, that day will be the last day any Sony product graces my door (same is true of any major corporation). That's how I will "get back at them". Not by throwing in with some lawyer who is going to make a mint and give me a coupon for it. So, for me, I do not see it as Sony "taking away my rights", I see it as Sony attempting to "take away your ability" and, sorry folks, I am perfectly OK with that.

For the record, individual non-malpractice lawsuits in cases where death or life-changing injury are involved get a bit of a pass on a case by case basis. I have never seen a single class action lawsuit that I agreed with, however, and every single one that I've been invited to be a part of (at the age of 35, I've been notified of 3 or 4), I have ignored. The reason for that, beyond common sense and the lack of need for $10 off at the Sizzler, is it is my understanding that the lawyers get more money depending on how many people sign up. Seriously, folks, class action lawsuits are demonic, evil things and, if anything, we should be doing anything we can to prevent them from happening.

I think you are being very narrow-sighted. I've been a part of numerous class action lawsuits, one with BMW and one with Mercedes. Both forced them to support or fix their defective products. There are many that are absurd, but there are also many that are entirely legitimate.

I wont deny that there are probably exceptions to the rule, but any of them I've heard or read about tend to be for petty things. If they would change the rules to limit the absolutely ignorant amount of money the lawyers can make off these class action suits, I would be all for them. I think they are a great thing in theory, but not so much in practice.

I wont deny that there are probably exceptions to the rule, but any of them I've heard or read about tend to be for petty things. If they would change the rules to limit the absolutely ignorant amount of money the lawyers can make off these class action suits, I would be all for them. I think they are a great thing in theory, but not so much in practice.

Cool that there doing this even though getting in on a class action lawsuit or the EULA holding up is unlikely. It doesn't hurt to be too safe though.

Thanks for this, Patrick.

Thanks for this! I do everything online and don't keep postage around so this took the cake. I just filled out the form for both my PSN and EA/Origin accounts. I was even nice and donated $10.

@BionicRadd:

I saw a documentary about these so-called frivolous lawsuits, and it pretty much changed my perspective on this whole thing (Hot Coffee). You have nothing to gain from letting companies take away your right to sue, but you sure as hell have a lot to potentially lose.