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Posted by JasonR86 (9707 posts) 1 year, 6 months ago

Poll: IF The New Xbox Doesn't Play Used Games Would That Be Enough To Keep You From Buying It? (309 votes)

Yes (Explain) 47%
No (Explain) 53%

So this is a big if but if the new Xbox doesn't play used games would that single fact, regardless of anything else including software, keep you from buying that new console? I personally don't buy a ton of used games but, at times, I still do. But that isn't why I find this concept gross. I'm not even that insanely "don't be anti-consumer!" about issues with the game industry or any other industry.

But this fact would be enough to keep me from buying the new Xbox because it is an example of Microsoft inserting themselves forcefully into a scenario in the worst way possible with a dumb solution. Used games are a problem for developers and publishers. But simply cutting off used games from consumers isn't a good way to fix this problem. That is a slap in the face to consumers who will then turn on those developers, publishers, and Microsoft. Instead offer them an alternative. Be creative and dynamic. Don't just lay the hammer down and expect that everyone will fall in line.

So that's why, if this rumor turns out to be true, I wouldn't support Microsoft and their new console regardless of anything else.

#101 Edited by JasonR86 (9707 posts) -

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@unilad said:

These threads need to die.

I'm sick of the next Xbox already.

Why did you come in here then?

cause this

Figured.

#102 Edited by bluefish (461 posts) -

Guys/Gals

The reason you see Steam doing such aggressive pricing and why you see Amazon doing such aggressive pricing is that they are competing with the used game market. Ubisoft/EA/Whoever agreeing to throw their stuff up on Steam for %75 off is because new sales have largely died off and this is a way to continue getting revenue. Same with amazon.

When you remove the ability of the customer to find a better damn deal (even if it comes from just buying it off a friend or something) the publisher then has %100 control of the market. When any dollar spent anywhere on their game goes to them guess what, those %75 off deals die off. Why would a publisher allow steam to sell their stuff at bargain bin prices when the customer has no other option?

I'm no big believe of capitalism ability to self correct but that very pillar of the game economy is being hacked at here. When every game sold everywhere requires the publishers ok, they have a %100 monopoly and the ability of the system to self correct is thrown out the window. And the customer loses.

#103 Posted by pw2566ch (480 posts) -

I understand people not buying games used. A lot of people like the feel of newer games and the awesome feeling of being the first one to play that game. However, I can't see used games going away. Most of the games that I've purchased are used. And I'm not talking about a slap in the face to developers, pay $55 used. I'm talking about the most I've spent was $20, kind of used. This was for Tales of Symphonia Dawn of a New World. I don't even think they're printing that game anymore. I do this a lot. I wait a really long time to get a game and find it in the $15 or below used bin at Gamestop. Unless it's a game I really want. Then I would buy it new and that's is I can afford it at the time.

You see, there are quite a few reasons why people buy used. The top 2 being the game isn't printed anymore and people are on a tight budget. The sad part is that whenever I bring up budgeting as a topic, the immediately argue that if you can't afford it new then you shouldn't be buying games at all. If people can wait until they find someone selling their copy of say, Halo 4, for $30-40 after a month, then why not let them buy it? I mean, this is something that has been going on for years.

Who really cares?

#104 Posted by AiurFlux (902 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

You know all of you have raised a lot of good points. I hadn't even really considered any ramifications of this business model besides hurting used game sales. But really, as @MetalBaofu mentioned Gamefly would no longer work as it is currently. Game rentals would have to fundamentally change. And you couldn't borrow games. Plus if PS4 doesn't have this business model why would Gamefly or game rental companies change for one console (if they even could change). Plus, though I know Steam has sales constantly, without used games around there would be one less thing that would force new game prices to drop.

The thing that really makes you think is if the next XBox does do this, but the PS4 doesn't, will developers continue to develop for the PS4. I mean why would they when they can shoehorn people into their way or the highway and get all the rewards. If it happens it will remove something that should be there to prevent a monopoly and encourage a free and open market. You'll get this weird game of chicken where developers and publishers might develop for the next XBox because of the money and people won't buy the next XBox because of the whole aura of getting bent over and fucking railed against your will repeatedly.

Removing an aspect of the free and open market like used games could lead to rampant piracy. It could lead to another console crash even. I mean the world pretty much crashed in 08... it's not out of the picture. Consoles have crashed in the past and history will always repeat itself.

To put it bluntly and keep it short and sweet, if by some chance Microsoft does this they are the most retarded, boneheaded, moronic sad sacks of shit on this fucking planet. And to be honest I kind of expect this rumor to be true at this point.

#105 Posted by JasonR86 (9707 posts) -

@aiurflux said:

@jasonr86 said:

You know all of you have raised a lot of good points. I hadn't even really considered any ramifications of this business model besides hurting used game sales. But really, as @MetalBaofu mentioned Gamefly would no longer work as it is currently. Game rentals would have to fundamentally change. And you couldn't borrow games. Plus if PS4 doesn't have this business model why would Gamefly or game rental companies change for one console (if they even could change). Plus, though I know Steam has sales constantly, without used games around there would be one less thing that would force new game prices to drop.

The thing that really makes you think is if the next XBox does do this, but the PS4 doesn't, will developers continue to develop for the PS4. I mean why would they when they can shoehorn people into their way or the highway and get all the rewards. If it happens it will remove something that should be there to prevent a monopoly and encourage a free and open market. You'll get this weird game of chicken where developers and publishers might develop for the next XBox because of the money and people won't buy the next XBox because of the whole aura of getting bent over and fucking railed against your will repeatedly.

Removing an aspect of the free and open market like used games could lead to rampant piracy. It could lead to another console crash even. I mean the world pretty much crashed in 08... it's not out of the picture. Consoles have crashed in the past and history will always repeat itself.

To put it bluntly and keep it short and sweet, if by some chance Microsoft does this they are the most retarded, boneheaded, moronic sad sacks of shit on this fucking planet. And to be honest I kind of expect this rumor to be true at this point.

I was kind of thinking that this business model would keep developers and publishers away from the Xbox. More games are going to be made for the system that sells the best. If this rumor turns out to be true I imagine most consumers will buy the PS4 over the new Xbox. So more of the games will be on the PS4 not Xbox.

#106 Edited by LucidDreams117 (394 posts) -

I said no for the a very simple reason: I buy 99% of my games new. Very rarely do I buy used or borrow a game from a buddy. I'm connected enough with the video game world and the news coming from it and learning about upcoming games that I know at this point if I want a game or not. At the very least, I pick up games that I'm not so sure about like Dead Space 3, in the bargain bin for like 20 bucks. And even then it's new. Obviously this isn't the way everyone goes.

End of day, though, this isn't going to happen. There are just too many cons that out way the pros. Also this is a way for Microsoft to really get into the digital download business and take a few pages from Steam's book. Be aggressive and push sales online. Let retail slowly die on its own. Now, if I can't play my 360 games on this new console... that might be a problem for me.

#107 Posted by hawkinson76 (370 posts) -

No, my PC will keep me from buying it.

#108 Posted by cruxking (204 posts) -

no it doesn't matter to me. i love shrink wrap. it's awesome.

#109 Edited by ConfusedOwl (942 posts) -

Not being able to borrow games from friends or even play the game on their system if I'm over at their house is a deal breaker. I'm not bringing an entire console with me every time I want to play games with someone.

#110 Posted by masternater27 (918 posts) -

I buy used games when I missed a game and its not being printed new anymore. I also trade in games to buy my new games. How consumers being less able to purchase games benefits the industry I don't know. Especially given recent comments by ea saying they'd like to further raise game prices.

#111 Edited by HeyImPhoenix (169 posts) -

I wouldn't buy it! I have never even bought a second hand game but it still feels like a slap in the face! I have however taken a games to a friends house to play! Which would not be possible.

#113 Edited by chrissedoff (2106 posts) -

@bluefish said:

Guys/Gals

The reason you see Steam doing such aggressive pricing and why you see Amazon doing such aggressive pricing is that they are competing with the used game market. Ubisoft/EA/Whoever agreeing to throw their stuff up on Steam for %75 off is because new sales have largely died off and this is a way to continue getting revenue. Same with amazon.

When you remove the ability of the customer to find a better damn deal (even if it comes from just buying it off a friend or something) the publisher then has %100 control of the market. When any dollar spent anywhere on their game goes to them guess what, those %75 off deals die off. Why would a publisher allow steam to sell their stuff at bargain bin prices when the customer has no other option?

I'm no big believe of capitalism ability to self correct but that very pillar of the game economy is being hacked at here. When every game sold everywhere requires the publishers ok, they have a %100 monopoly and the ability of the system to self correct is thrown out the window. And the customer loses.

I disagree with that. There is no used PC game market to my knowledge. Prices get lower over time to match consumers' willingness to pay. The people who are very eager to play Tomb Raider will buy the game in the next few weeks for $60. The people who are less eager to play it will happily wait and buy it when it's $40, some will wait for it to be $20, and some will get the game a couple of years from now when it's on sale on Steam for $5. The strategy behind Steam's pricing is to get everyone who's even a little bit interested in the game to buy it in the long run rather than pass on it completely because Valve and the publisher have nothing to gain by completely icing out the people who want to buy the game, but want to do so for much less than $60.

#114 Posted by Branthog (5562 posts) -

I don't buy a ton of used games, but I would probably refuse to buy it on principle and Microsoft and their ilk would lose the $13,000 to $16,000 I've spent this generation just on XBox 360 new game purchases, XBLA subscriptions, and XBLA games.

#115 Edited by Branthog (5562 posts) -

@animasta said:

really though anyone who says "oh but steam" like that's a argument needs to realize that steam deals are way better than console games get, and sooner too

Price aside (which makes getting anything but the newest games on Steam more reasonable across multiple accounts, versus buying one console game to share with everyone in your home), Steam is very difficult to compare. With a console, I will pretty much not be able to access any physical content I have paid for just a few years before (or only months, if bought near the end of the cycle). I'll potentially lose access to purchased digital content (and almost certainly purchased full-games from on-demand, I suppose).

You can play Steam games on any PC you want, without worrying about licenses or if enough months have passed since doing a license transfer or if you've exceeded your number of devices.

While Steam has its broken shitty games and titles eventually fade out of playability due to operating system advances that render them incompatible with any system you could run the Steam client on (and they don't bother to do the maintenance work for the titles that GOG does), I can generally also play most games over many generations of hardware. A game I buy on the 360 today will probably not be playable on the console bought at the end of this year. A game bought on Steam today will probably be playable after I've built and gotten rid of a dozen brand new rigs with a dozen generations of high end video cards over the next fifteen years. Sure, someday almost everything on it will probably be rendered unplayable, but it'll be a hell of a lot longer than one console cycle. Or even two. Or maybe even three or four.

This would be a serious fault on Microsoft's part and I find it incredibly unlikely that they would do it.

And, unlike a lot of internet "i'm gonna boycott durp durp!" guys, I would have every intention of doing it. The same way I have not bought a CD that was in any way covered in the umbrella of the RIAA since the late 90s, haven't seen a movie in a theater since X-Files in early 1998, and haven't bought a DVD that is under the MPAA umbrella in over a decade.

#116 Posted by ajamafalous (11994 posts) -

I literally could not give less of a shit about used games. I haven't bought a used game or used a rental service since the N64 was current. I can count the number of games I've borrowed from a friend this generation on one hand. I'm good.

#117 Edited by Quipido (636 posts) -

My main issue with this would be: what would happen with all my games tied to the hardware if the box breaks? I mean I am on my third X360 at the moment.

#118 Posted by HellknightLeon (467 posts) -

I don't shop at Gamestop so I dont care about this. Also I have a fulltime job and get paid a lot.... So I might be the odd man out. 5-7 years ago... yeah this would have been a deal breaker. Also If I dont want to pay full price for a new or full price game I just get it off a Steam sale or Amazon.

#119 Posted by RobotHamster (4171 posts) -

Put yes because I wasn't planning on buying the new xbox, but even though not playing used games would only bother me a little because steams has already got me used to this idea. But there are a ton of consumers who would be bothered by this so it's hard to say of much of a backlash there will be, plus if microsoft does do this will it open the door and lead to more bull shit stuff from them?

#120 Edited by MooseyMcMan (11021 posts) -

No. I don't buy used games. BUT, I still, even to this day, find myself in situations where I am doing things like bringing a game over to a friend's house to play it, or I'll borrow a game that I want to play, but don't want to pay for. And blocking used games would block this. Well, I suppose it'll probably block it at an account level, but then I'd have to go through the hassle of bringing my account with me, and I still wouldn't be able to borrow games.

But that wouldn't deter me. What'll deter me will be things like forced use of Kinect to use the system and a lack of exclusives that I care about (which is, of course, totally unknown until they start revealing info about the system).

Moderator
#121 Posted by Gamer_152 (14078 posts) -

I'm not going to say I'd definitely never buy one, but if that was the case it would seriously make me think about ditching the Xbox and just buying a PS4 once that's out.

Moderator
#122 Edited by CoolMarquis97 (8 posts) -

If used games were blocked, I probably won't buy the NextBox. Sometimes I kind of left games die in stores so that I can pick them up for about $10-$20 used. Not allowing me to play used games would be a probably for me just because I usually go back and pick up old games for dirt cheap and by the time I go to pick them up, they are out of print.

#123 Edited by xyzygy (9992 posts) -

Yes. I am a student and can't afford to buy new games all the time. All the games I buy are either used or from the bargain bin. Usually, bargain bin or sales, but there are some games that are older that I would not have been able to find if I didn't buy used. I don't know. It's kind of a big issue for me.

#124 Edited by mylifeforAiur (3484 posts) -

It's unsettling to see the almost blithe disregard for consumer clout evident in this thread. PC user or not, the mere suggestion that this is a possibility should frighten any consumer. Options serve to benefit the customer. Those are our weapons.

Online
#125 Edited by bluefish (461 posts) -

@chrissedoff: They do it to remain competitive. Steam doesn't just do it to 'get those people' they do it when allowed by publishers when those publishers believe that the revenue they'll see from that sale is more than they will see from slow-but-still-going sales at the standard price. Not only will those lingering sales greatly increase when the used game market is dead but there will also be nothing left to compete with.

That publisher then has much less motivation to reduce their games prices so dramatically on the scale they do today.

Granted they do think there is a customer base that will ONLY buy their game when it hits the $5 mark but the entirety of the console market is now forced into this system that group is comparatively minute. They will be tailored to only after the millions of people that are happy to buy most games at $25.

#126 Edited by SuliPatchouli (18 posts) -

I like to rent games, so it most likely would.

#127 Posted by guiseppe (2841 posts) -

Probably, the deciding factor for me right now though, is whether or not they keep XBL the way it is. Meaning that if they continue to force me to pay to play games online, I'm not interested. Make online play available to everyone and just rip off what Sony is doing with psn+ and I'm a happy camper. If they keep me from playing used games as well, that's just the nail in the coffin for me.

#129 Posted by Rebel_Scum (712 posts) -

I don't buy used games but if I can't take a game like Fifa to a mates house to play it then I would avoid that console.

In saying that though I'm avoiding Microsft next gen anyways because of poor exclusives (Halo, Gears) and exclusives that don't stay exclusive (ME1).

#130 Posted by Bane122 (789 posts) -

Nope. It would suck a bit as I do buy some older games used or borrow one now and then but I would cope. It would cause me to wait for deals more before buying though. I already buy less day 1 than I did a year ago so I'd just continue that trend even more.

#131 Edited by lettuceman44 (109 posts) -

I would not like it one bit.

There are older games I like to play sometimes, so I have to buy it used if I want it.


Also, how will this affect borrowing friends games and such? If it can't play used games, it can't play any games you don't own right? So if a friend comes over with a game to play, how would that work?

#132 Posted by TheUnsavedHero (1255 posts) -

Nope. I'd still buy one. I haven't bought a used game for a current gen console since '09. I either buy games I really want new, or games I'm mildly interested in at a discount or sale.

#133 Posted by Caustic_Fox (112 posts) -

I'd say No. Even if it does happen, I'm sure the hacking community will get to it... eventually.

#134 Posted by brownsfantb (393 posts) -

Nope. Right now I have a good job with a good salary and I don't have any kids to support so I can afford to buy new games. And with how quickly games drop in price, it's not a huge deal to wait a month or two to get a game for cheap.