@starvinggamer: yes I would call that "bad joke goes bad". Everyone just wants some, knowwhatimsaying?
@flipperdesert: More Citadel, Less Reapers could be the slogan of the whole generation lol
@demoskinos: yeah, you know, I always want to be the underdog, and prefer the idea of the underdog, but "the other side" takes over some times, and it is fun to just lay waste to things sometimes.
I like the feeling of becoming stronger with time, but I don't want to mow down a billion enemies, I just want an old enemy or two to show up and show me how kickass I am, while stronger monsters come and show that the top is from being reached.
But yeah honestly, being a hero or not, being strong or not, comes second to the feel of the world I am in. I pretty much always prioritize the main character or the player character lower than his surroundings.
I like it when a game strikes a good balance between the two. If I feel like I'm not going anywhere with my character's power and I'm always scraping by, then something's wrong. There needs to be something about the game that makes the player feel like they can kick ass, even if only for a moment before something comes along and wipes that grin off of their faces.
On the other hand, steamrolling through every encounter is simply boring.
I actually really dislike it when they try to make every battle challenging. This was one of my problems with Final Fantasy 13, because it made every fight take forever, and once I'd already figured out how to beat a group of enemies, it was just a matter of repeating the five minute process over and over again. When you get frustrated with those smaller fights, think of them as just one part of a whole. One of the smaller fights alone may be nothing, but they still get a few hits on you, and a dozen of those fights can put a major dent in your resources throughout a dungeon, and you want those resources for when the boss comes up. The way I've always seen it is that bosses should always be hard, minibosses should always be hard, but regular random encounters are like stepping stones between these fights.
It would be really cool to just play a farmer in Skyrim. You have to gather the necessary supplies to grow your crops while encountering the odd narrative hurdle (e.g. bandits/animals attack the farm, brother needs help in the city, a group of hedge knights need a place to stay). Make it so combat is extremely hard to reflect your character's lack of martial ability.
I love games that place me in the backdrop. Of course I want the story (if there is one) to be interesting. However, games that make you have to struggle for survival (throughout the entire game, not just the opening act) are the ones I enjoy the most.
@geraltitude: Have you played Final Fantasy 8? All of the enemies level up alongside you usually providing a pretty consistent challenge the whole way through the game. It also has what has to be one of if not THE toughest optional boss in Omega Weapon. Loved it all the way through and the junction system really makes you think before you cast magic because of how its directly tied to your stats. The 3D is pretty brutal to deal with though. But interesting game.
Dang I didn't think anyone replied to this forum.. didn't realize all my notification settings had been reset!
@tobbrobb: Yeah at the end of the day, hero or underdog is more or less justified by the world and the story. The problem seems to be that so many games take place in a world that just happens to have no available heroes. The early Final Fantasies (sp?) where my first exposure to this. There just seemed to be so many other, older, badass heroes in the world who just couldn't be bothered to, you know, save the world.
@believer258: Progression. For sure. Where do you stand on the Player XP vs Avatar XP situation? So for example in Action RPGs like Demon's Souls much of your progress is just you memorizing enemy patterns and coming to grips with the controls. Hotline Miami is that scenario on crack. On the other side you have something like FF, where leveling up = more power. I know it's not a "one is better than the other" but do you have a preference? One of my favourite things about FF games actually is the limit breaks. They were always a very nice measuring stick for progress. It was a cool way to see your character become more powerful while still keeping a general difficulty balance between you and the monsters in the game.
@professork: Man I don't know if you intended it that way but that post can be read as a pretty hilarious sob story lol. I'm totally with you. I really like co-op and group RPGs. But what does it say about me that I wish someone else was the leader and I was just the sarcastic make comments about stuff guy? Who's the best RPG npc?
@hunter5024: Ze hunt continues! Yeah you know the truth is I hadn't played an RPG like that in some time, but just this last super hot ass weekend I retreated to my basement and whipped out Chrono Trigger and a CRT. Your points are totally... on point. In CT you really get to practice your Techs and Combos on the weak enemies, and then put your skills to test on the bosses. When the minor fight - major fight system works, it works well. I remembered this being pretty excellent in FFXII too. Gameplay wise, I think turn-based RPGs suffer a lot less from "hero syndrome" than an Action RPG like Skyrim. The patience required of players in a traditional RPG means you expect to go a few rounds with even the most pathetic enemy. I only played the first few hours of FFXIII. I don't want to be one of "those guys" but I just couldn't get into the game. As someone who has played every other FF under the sun - would you recommend it? Is it worth getting past that first 30, linear hours (as I've heard it described)?
@patman99:That's what I'm talking about duder! Fucking yes! Someone make that mod already, jeez. Jumping off your survival point, my absolute favorite Skyrim mod is the Winter Survival one, where you need to warm yourself up at firepits, wear proper clothing/equipment, and falling into frozen waters = instant death.
@demoskinos: Have I ever! I'm one those idiots who loves FF8. Of the post-SNES FFs it's easily number 2 (after XII). I remember my friend and I preparing all day for Omega Weapon and laughing our asses of when he just killed us over and over again. I always really appreciated that enemies level up with you in this game. The junction part also made even the easy encounters more interesting. The longer you stuck around to draw magic the more damage you'd take. You always wanted your peeps in the yellow so they could limit break, but then of course you were living on the edge a little and sometimes even a stupid caterpillar would get you. Well, it got me.
B1 for me. It's the crux of all RPGs everywhere. You start out weak (or average depending on the game) and over time you accumulate strength and experience. By the end of the game you're a walking god of destruction and laying waste to the egregious fodder mobs sent to destroy you. It's a good arc and it's a satisfying arc. That's not to say I wouldn't enjoy some variety, but I would have to know that's what I'm getting into before hand.
@geraltitude: Well, I like it when a game gives the player more levels and power, but it also needs to be more difficult as it goes along. For the most part, Shin Megami Tensei Nocturne absolutely nailed this for me. The game slowly gives you more powerful attacks, buffs, debuffs, and healing spells, while also making the bosses more difficult in some really creative and sometimes downright cruel ways. The player knows that the in-game character is getting stronger, but the player himself has to master the game and think his way through things or he won't ever be able to beat it. An early, infamously difficult boss fight named Matador makes sure that the player knows they can't just grind out a few levels for all of the bosses in the game, if they want to beat it in any sort of timely manner.
Wow, that's a lot of choices that I can't limit myself to picking just one. B2 definitely caught my eye. I feel it's more realistic. Like, a dragon is going to be tough no matter what, and a month of adventuring is not going to grant you the strength to knock it out with one punch. I think it's your knowledge and experiences that make you stronger.
That's why I like the Monster Hunter series. Strong armor and weapons aside, if you're not careful, the monsters can still kill you with one swipe, but your intimate knowledge and familiarity of the monster is what makes them an easier target to hunt. I mean, you get stronger by learning how to fight them, but it doesn't make them any less dangerous.
@believer258: I really, really need to play Persona. Don't have a 3DS, PlayStation still broken.. so.. one day maybe. What you describe sounds exactly what I'm looking for far as JRPGs. A little off of the underdog topic now, but anyways, as much as I love FF I found the solution to far, far too many bosses is just "be a higher level, have more health, and attack". If SMT introduces more tactics than it sounds like the place for me to be.
@immortalsaiyan: I already copped to that being dumb ok! It's a bad joke. :(
@creepyunclebrad: Yeah for sure - I wonder if any exist actually? I mean, there must be one.
@happycoin: As soon as the Wii U goes down in price I am buying it and Monster Hunter. For exactly the reason you described, that series has been on my hit list for ages. I've always wanted the Witcher to borrow more "how to hunt" elements from that series rather than just the canned "you beat 5 of these, now you can beat them easier!"
@jay_ray: You... you win.