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#1 Posted by Killroycantkill (1421 posts) -

So my friend recently linked me to this AMAZING google document which goes through the whole story of Kingdom Hearts so far, and even with a synopsis so simple this story is still confusing as shit. Here's the google doc for you to look at. Also as a question do any of you guys even care about Kingdom Hearts anymore or do you just want a console release again?

#2 Posted by TentPole (1858 posts) -

This is folly.

It cannot be done.

#3 Posted by Brodehouse (10107 posts) -

I really liked Kingdom Hearts 2. Maybe it was just that game came at the right time in my life (I had just met my first girlfriend) and I was home for a few weeks because of a workplace injury, and that game was just ... a wonderful time.

But fuck, everything about the overall fiction and story makes me think Testuya Nomura uses battery acid for mouthwash. What a bunch of nonsense.

#4 Edited by believer258 (12106 posts) -

Kingdom Hearts doesn't have a good story. The first one was decent, then the whole thing became overly dramatic, self-important, horribly written bollocks with no real end in sight.

I don't hate this series, honest! Really, I love the idea, but now the whole thing just tries to be darker and moodier than any Disney - Final Fantasy crossover has a right to be.

But your buddie's attempt isn't bad. Not bad at all. It's good at proving the idea isn't the issue with Kingdom Hearts, it's the fucking execution and tons of unanswered questions that makes it less than it could be.

#5 Edited by NegativeCero (3026 posts) -

Dude, I gave up during the second game. Good luck to you, but it's just nonsense at this point.

Edit: Actually I apparently understood less than I thought. Congratulations Square, you've written a convoluted thing that even people who've played them need help sussing out.

#6 Posted by Dallas_Raines (2200 posts) -

Yeah, I can't believe how massively fucked up Kingdom Hearts fiction became after the first game. Disney needs to take control with the eventual third game and force Nomura to reign it in.

#7 Posted by Sjupp (1910 posts) -

What a great timing! I think? I just started playing KH today. I never did play any of the games after the first one though.

#8 Posted by august (3861 posts) -

Allow me to summarize: crazy anime bullshit.

#9 Posted by Cloudenvy (5891 posts) -

Anything related to Kingdom Hearts' story is pretty much dead to me at this point, it's nonsense.

#10 Posted by BraveToaster (12588 posts) -

I care about Kingdom Hearts because I've never played and my brother keeps telling me that I need to.

#11 Posted by SpunkyHePanda (1720 posts) -

I've only played 1 and 2, and I really liked them. All I want from the story is a loose reason to fly around to different Disney worlds and fight stuff, which the first one pretty much gave me.

The second one was still a lot of fun, but the plot, holy shit. Hoooooly shit. If you're gonna turn the series into horrible fanfiction, at least have the characters bone down on each other. (Don't do that.)

#12 Posted by Phatmac (5726 posts) -

Yeah I don't care about KH. The people that love it to death probably never played an JRPG before, so they cling to this game as part of their childhood or some shit. Played both and they were alright, but nothing special. Also the story is bullshit.

#13 Posted by JackSukeru (5950 posts) -

I'm pretty sure I got all the vital parts memorized, not a hundred on all the Xehanort stuff but who is at this point?

I mean, the story makes complete sense.. according to its own inner logic and if you don't think about it for too long.

#14 Edited by Encephalon (1317 posts) -

God dammit KH has become such fucking nonsense. It's not that it doesn't make sense - within the bounds of its own lore, it at least manages to barely hold itself together, though it requires them to bend their own metaphysics into pretzel shapes to do so - but the fiction has become so terribly recursive and labyrinthine over time. It has no forward momentum.

I am interested to see, in a beautiful trainwreck sort of way, how KH3d makes any sense. I didn't think the series could fold back in on itself any more after BBS, but clearly that is not the case.

So yeah. This, guys, is why we should be thankful for just one TWEWY game.

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#15 Posted by Little_Socrates (5694 posts) -

Incomprehensible due to all the use of "this guy" in the writing.

#16 Posted by ToxicFruit (1718 posts) -

I have only played 1 and 2 so i guess i will never get the full story

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#17 Posted by N7 (3658 posts) -

Wow... what...
 
This is nuts.

#18 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5381 posts) -

Kingdom Hearts 1 and 2 were dumb fun. I never saw a reason for them to craft a good story because the concept of Final Fantasy + Disney classics make for some shitty fan fiction. I played those games because I liked the interaction with the Disney worlds, music, and the gameplay in 2. It always had a shitty story but I didn't really want a good story from Kingdom Hearts. I want to see what KH3 is and I want to play it but I'm not asking for it to be a satisfying conclusion to the trilogy.

#19 Posted by SpunkyHePanda (1720 posts) -

@SethPhotopoulos said:

Kingdom Hearts 1 and 2 were dumb fun. I never saw a reason for them to craft a good story because the concept of Final Fantasy + Disney classics make for some shitty fan fiction. I played those games because I liked the interaction with the Disney worlds, music, and the gameplay in 2. It always had a shitty story but I didn't really want a good story from Kingdom Hearts. I want to see what KH3 is and I want to play it but I'm not asking for it to be a satisfying conclusion to the trilogy.

That's what I want from Kingdom Hearts: dumb fun. I don't want a good story, I want a forgettable story. Just an excuse to check out all the different Disney worlds. Kingdom Hearts 1 almost had it right. I think that game should have just been Maleficent gathering all your favorite Disney villains and unleashing the Heartless whatevers on whatever, with a light "rescue the princess" love story with Kairi. They lost me with the Ansem shit. "Okay, Kingdom Hearts," I said. "Cut out this kinda stuff and Kingdom Hearts II will be dope." They went hard in the other direction.

#20 Posted by JJOR64 (19052 posts) -

I'm still a huge fan of the series. I agree that the story has gone completely bonkers and is kinda off the rails, but they are still enjoyable games to me. Really looking for to KH 3D this July.

#21 Posted by Ramone (2976 posts) -

From what I've seen of my flat mate playing the first Kingdom Hearts I have no desire to see anymore of the story. It just seemed like cutesy bullshit with really bad writing and characters.

#22 Posted by SlightConfuse (3963 posts) -

as long as there are marvel characters in KH 3 i dont care for the story.

as an aside anyone know if the DS game was any good?

#23 Posted by Monkeyman04 (1192 posts) -

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

#24 Edited by JJOR64 (19052 posts) -

@Monkeyman04 said:

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

Yeah. While some of the side games aren't too major, Birth by Sleep, the PSP one, was the last game to have major plot details. The next major one is KH 3D then hopefully KH 3 when that comes out in the year 2153.

#25 Posted by SpunkyHePanda (1720 posts) -

@Monkeyman04 said:

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

I think so. In fact, I think KH2 relied on you having played the GBA game. Just typing that sentence makes me angry.

#26 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5381 posts) -

@SpunkyHePanda said:

@Monkeyman04 said:

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

I think so. In fact, I think KH2 relied on you having played the GBA game. Just typing that sentence makes me angry.

Not really. Everyone has amnesia, no one remembers what happened in the GBA game outside of the villains who inform the character Sora of what happened in the GBA game anyway and in fact give you more information than what the GBA game gave you. The opening theme actually goes through everything that happened in Kingdom Hearts 1 and the GBA game. The game starts off with characters that you never saw in Kingdom Hearts before. You could miss the GBA game with nothing lost.

#27 Posted by Brendan (8028 posts) -

@Little_Socrates said:

Incomprehensible due to all the use of "this guy" in the writing.

I would have it explained in no other way.

#28 Posted by SpunkyHePanda (1720 posts) -

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@SpunkyHePanda said:

@Monkeyman04 said:

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

I think so. In fact, I think KH2 relied on you having played the GBA game. Just typing that sentence makes me angry.

Not really. Everyone has amnesia, no one remembers what happened in the GBA game outside of the villains who inform the character Sora of what happened in the GBA game anyway and in fact give you more information than what the GBA game gave you. The opening theme actually goes through everything that happened in Kingdom Hearts 1 and the GBA game. The game starts off with characters that you never saw in Kingdom Hearts before. You could miss the GBA game with nothing lost.

Well, okay. I guess I thought that would explain why I had no idea what the hell was going on in 2.

#29 Edited by SethPhotopoulos (5381 posts) -

@SpunkyHePanda said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@SpunkyHePanda said:

@Monkeyman04 said:

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

I think so. In fact, I think KH2 relied on you having played the GBA game. Just typing that sentence makes me angry.

Not really. Everyone has amnesia, no one remembers what happened in the GBA game outside of the villains who inform the character Sora of what happened in the GBA game anyway and in fact give you more information than what the GBA game gave you. The opening theme actually goes through everything that happened in Kingdom Hearts 1 and the GBA game. The game starts off with characters that you never saw in Kingdom Hearts before. You could miss the GBA game with nothing lost.

Well, okay. I guess I thought that would explain why I had no idea what the hell was going on in 2.

You couldn't understand what was going on in Kingdom Hearts 2 because it was fucking insane. I may like KH2 much more than 1 but it wasn't because of its coherent plot development.

#30 Posted by NegativeCero (3026 posts) -

@SlightConfuse said:

as long as there are marvel characters in KH 3 i dont care for the story.

as an aside anyone know if the DS game was any good?

Wow, I forgot Disney bought Marvel. If they do this, I'm back in.

#31 Posted by Soffish (139 posts) -

The story of Kingdom hearts would probably be fine if it wasn't for all the portable games. Continuing to add prequels and side-stories without really advancing the main plot tends to make a series' canon become excessively convoluted.

#32 Posted by asian_pride (1654 posts) -

I've played the first, second, and the GBA game. I still go back and enjoy the first one. However silly the story is, it was a good excuse to see the Disney worlds I've come to know when I was a kid, and I like it. Gameplay is still fun as I remember it. The second one really took a different direction, resulting in a pooly written, convoluted story that doesn't make any lick of sense, bad characters, etc. And I think that already started with the GBA game.

This is why I stopped caring for the series after the first one came out. You're not going to expect a google doc or a KH wiki to get you to understand 100%. Everything else is so melodramatic and dumb that I could care less.

Eh. If KHIII ever comes out, fine I guess I'll check it out. I just know the story is going to be fucking nonsense, but if they at least manage to keep the gameplay fun as it is, why the fuck not.

#33 Posted by the_OFFICIAL_jAPanese_teaBAG (4308 posts) -

This is why I honestly dont have any motivation to beat the last boss in the first game....  Like I dont even know whats going on!

#34 Edited by Vonocourt (2160 posts) -

Every once in a while I get the urge to try to give KH another chance, next time that happens I'll just look at this doc.

#35 Posted by JeanLuc (3605 posts) -

You know what? That was pretty accurate.

#36 Posted by phantomzxro (1583 posts) -

The story is fine if your not going into it expecting too much. Simple fun with characters you like and or grew up with. The story gets a little crazy but it makes sense to me in a round about way. I don't think that is the problem if you truly care, the real issue is cashing out kingdom hearts by having 5 handheld game with no proper console sequel on the horizon (i will say birth by sleep was great). The same could be said for assassin creed right about now but hey the games are fun and you get to stab dudes.

#37 Posted by SoldierG654342 (1805 posts) -

That quote from S7ven comes to mind right about now.

#38 Posted by Encephalon (1317 posts) -

Luckily (I guess?), the vast majority of the KH games are inessential to understanding the core plot, because half of them have some built-in mechanism wherein everyone conveniently "forgets" that that game happened.

Square needs a KH product on the books every X number of months, so poor Nomura's got to figure out how to do it without breaking the universe.

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#39 Posted by Monkeyman04 (1192 posts) -

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@SpunkyHePanda said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@SpunkyHePanda said:

@Monkeyman04 said:

Man, I've only played one/two and I don't remember half of what that was talking about. Was some of the story beats lost to me since I didn't play the non-PS2 games?

I think so. In fact, I think KH2 relied on you having played the GBA game. Just typing that sentence makes me angry.

Not really. Everyone has amnesia, no one remembers what happened in the GBA game outside of the villains who inform the character Sora of what happened in the GBA game anyway and in fact give you more information than what the GBA game gave you. The opening theme actually goes through everything that happened in Kingdom Hearts 1 and the GBA game. The game starts off with characters that you never saw in Kingdom Hearts before. You could miss the GBA game with nothing lost.

Well, okay. I guess I thought that would explain why I had no idea what the hell was going on in 2.

You couldn't understand what was going on in Kingdom Hearts 2 because it was fucking insane. I may like KH2 much more than 1 but it wasn't because of its coherent plot development.

Okay, so I shouldn't feel bad about not knowing what the hell is going on.

#40 Posted by ArbitraryWater (12008 posts) -

I'm on the "I like Kingdom Hearts ironically" train. Much like Final Fantasy X-2, the amount of stupid flowing from any given character's mouth (namely that of Sora) goes around in on itself and becomes entertaining rather than grating. The story itself though? Wow. It's even more incoherent and labyrinthine than I thought.

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#41 Posted by Hailinel (25203 posts) -

Jesus fuck, guys. it's not that convoluted.

#42 Edited by Azteris (810 posts) -

The writer of the google doc actually makes it more confusing due to terrible use of pronouns. As someone who played and understood the first two games, his shitty summary actually allowed me to piece in a bit of the backstory filled in the by the handheld games. I don't understand why everyone is acting like Kingdom Hearts became LOST at some point.

EDIT: Also, explaining what Heartless/Nobodies are and giving the names of the similar looking characters (who are usually Heartless/Nobody forms of their lookalikes) would help

#43 Posted by AngelN7 (2972 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

Jesus fuck, guys. it's not that convoluted.

Exaclty , the thing is that they made those spin off games ( 358 whatever, Chain of Memories and some other on the DS) wich tie into the main games so it's kinda hard to follow everything in them because they rely on your knowledge of what happened in those games , I've played most of them not that I enjoyed them all but I didn't feel like I was lost following the main plot or where certain characters come from it's not so much that the story is convoluted but instead to spread between all those games , but I do agree there's some anime bullshit specially in 358 and characters like Xion what a bunch of crap, wich too is bad because Birth By Sleep was really awesome and had a good story but it falls in the another Spin-off camp so people ignore it (even though that was almost a KH origins).

#44 Posted by RE_Player1 (7574 posts) -

The first Kingdom Hearts was simple and an incredible game. It wasn't dumbed down but you got what was going on and seeing these two universes along with new characters interacting was fascinating. After that the series became garbage in terms of story.

#45 Posted by acarab1981 (32 posts) -

@NegativeCero said:

@SlightConfuse said:

as long as there are marvel characters in KH 3 i dont care for the story.

as an aside anyone know if the DS game was any good?

Wow, I forgot Disney bought Marvel. If they do this, I'm back in.

I have to change my pants after this.

#46 Posted by Petiew (1355 posts) -

Fight Ansem in KH1. It wasn't really Ansem, it was his heartless. It wasn't really Ansem's heartless it was his assistant's heartless who thought he was Ansem. Fight fake Ansem assistant's nobody whose name is an anagram of Ansem. DIZ is Ansem, Ansem kills himself, but he's not really dead? Everyone has keys and the power of the heart.
Simple.

#47 Posted by Apathylad (3067 posts) -

While I do enjoy most of the Kingdom Hearts games, I still got a chuckle out of this.

#48 Posted by ZenaxPure (2569 posts) -

@Petiew said:

Fight Ansem in KH1. It wasn't really Ansem, it was his heartless. It wasn't really Ansem's heartless it was his assistant's heartless who pretended he was Ansem. Fight fake Ansem assistant's nobody whose name is an anagram of Ansem. DIZ is [the real] Ansem, Ansem kills himself, but he's not really dead(hanging out in the dark realm)? Everyone has keys and the power of the heart.Simple.

fix'd, but

Yeppppppppp, that literally covers the main plot for every story driven game in the series minus the part where Birth By Sleep reveals/explains who "the assistant" actually is.

If people can't follow it I am severely worried about life in general. It is seriously not that hard to follow because almost nothing happens. 90% of the games are just Disney filler nonsense.

#49 Edited by Encephalon (1317 posts) -

Really, the thing to remember about KH is it's a universe in which literally anything can happen. Because it runs on what I call touchy-feely heart power logic, there doesn't have to be any predictable mechanism that allows the metaphysical stuff to happen, except that it serves the maximum amount of drama. That's why Kairi's heart hid inside Sora. That's why everyone gets amnesia at the end of all the non-essential games. That's why the nature of Kingdom Hearts changes at the whims of the writing staff. That's why Ansem and the blue haired chick are still stuck in a purgatorial borderworld, but Sora and Riku got out because of Kairi's letter in a bottle and a door of light. Because!

Usually this is OK. Many of my favorite games are like this. What the google doc illustrates, I think, is that this slapdash brand of storytelling is untenable in a long-form narrative, and really begins to unravel over an extended period. If KH had just raced straight to the finish line within a reasonable time frame, and resisted the urge to constantly backfill its own lore, I doubt we would've noticed it was so crazy.

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#50 Posted by Jay444111 (2441 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

Jesus fuck, guys. it's not that convoluted.

Exactly!

The weird thing about KH series, if you try and explain it out loud you get confused, however if you just play the games in chronological order it makes sense... really weird really. It is just... hard as hell to explain but you come to understand it if you play them.