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This topic is locked from further discussion.

Posted by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

Hello guys. I basically spent 45 hours on this thread. This is it:

http://na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3570391&highlight=ryokishine#post38911186

This is another good conversation about the topic to bring into the picture:

http://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/1huyc8/a_new_sight_on_the_tribunal_image_in_post/

How can we take the ideas from these posts about Tribunal and turn them into a successful Tribunal re-work?

A lot of negativity that wasn't logical. A lot of downvotes. Anyone have (edit) constructive thoughts on this?

Edit: BEFORE YOU GO ANY FURTHER - This blog was created ONLY for the purpose of improving the League of Legends Tribunal System. If you're here to flame me or to be strictly negative, leave immediately. Otherwise, thoughts are greatly welcomed and appreciated, even if they are along the lines of negative, constructive feedback.

Thank you.

@demoskinos A Note About Links I've Provided: I am not a giantbomb.com member. So, when I hyperlink things, they send you to the front page if you simply click the hyperlink. DO NOT click the hyperlink. Simply copy and paste the URL I provide, put it in your browser's navigation bar, and press enter. That will take you to the correct links I believe. I was unaware that was happening, nice catch Demoskinos!

#1 Posted by Cloudenvy (5891 posts) -

That sounds like a bad use of your time.

#3 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

That sounds like a bad use of your time.

Plus, It's a pretty bad idea, thus worsening the effects.

#4 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@canteu, @cloudenvyA lot of negativity, and no thoughts. Why is it a bad idea? Why is it a waste of time to make a game that's free more enjoyable for those that play it? It's like making Maple Story the best MMORPG (bad example, but same concept) ever. We're just doing it for MOBA games instead of MMORPGs.

#5 Posted by EXTomar (4641 posts) -

What are we supposed to think?

#6 Posted by Irvandus (2875 posts) -

@ryokishine: Because it has a large fan base that is actively spending money.

#7 Posted by Freshbandito (678 posts) -

you don't actually want opinions though do you? you came here hoping to find people to agree with you so that your time spent on those posts didn't feel so wasted right?

#8 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@freshbanditoI, @extomar I only want people to think about this. If you agree with some of the ideas, point them out. If you think some are bad, point them out. That's all I'm asking for :)

Please notice that I kept the first two comments despite the lack of useful content. I'm reading all of it. And keeping it. I want more INPUT though, I want thoughts. I want constructive thinking.

Obviously people blog because they are passionate about something. I'd love if some of the ideas from my thread make it into the game. I think anyone would. However, maybe my ideas suck. Tell me WHY that is. Tell me WHY this system would be bad, or good, or if it's just not an improvement at all. All I'm asking is that you be constructive and respectful. I will not disrespect anyone here.

#10 Posted by mrpandaman (864 posts) -

So you want to change the Tribunal system and by coming up with this idea you want to be employed by Riot?

You were met with negativity due to disapproval of your suggested change. Reading the thread, it seems that those who responded are fine with the way the Tribunal works. Of course, there can be minor tweaks and changes (can say that about anything), but what you propose is a complete reworking seen as unneeded.

Upon that, a vast majority of your posts make it sound like you are talking down to everyone and that you're better than them. I also have to say that the way you word some of your posts make you seem a little delusional and a tad pretentious; That you and only you can bring the community together and fix the problem. I'm not trying to be mean or anything, but an outsider looking in that is what it looks like.

Everything in that thread, how people responded to you, was due to how you presented yourself and responded to others.

#11 Edited by EXTomar (4641 posts) -

@freshbandito said:

you don't actually want opinions though do you? you came here hoping to find people to agree with you so that your time spent on those posts didn't feel so wasted right?

Basically this. I have no idea what to make of this because I have no idea what is going on, what the problem is or why I should even care because someone basically said "I read this link...what do you think?"

#12 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@mrpandaman: Awesome response! Very insightful and completely correct. I'm new to forum posting, and this is my first blog ever. I have a lot to learn about how to present myself, and my ideas. I'd actually appreciate a private message with your tips on how I can do a better job, or you can skype me at Ryokishine sometime.

My thread was met with negativity for multiple reasons - here's what they are:

1.) Only 1% of the LoL Community got to read it before it was locked.

2.) It was my 3rd forum post, ever.

3.) I was too overconfident.

4.) I provided too much personal, unrelated information.

5.) Because of 3 and 4, most of the responses in the thread were towards ME and not the ideas about the Tribunal system. Notice that. The only post worth reading is the first one. I edited the living hell out of that.

6.) I was hospitalized after my counseling appointment towards the end... and never got to do anything else with the thread.

@extomar You probably won't know what to think until you read these two threads, at least the first post of each. Then all I want you to do is this - ask yourself: How can we merge these ideas together and make a better Tribunal? Answer that question with this information, and probably some of your own too, and that's all I'm asking of everyone.

To everyone: Anyone can change LoL. I'm just trying to speed it up and start getting people thinking about how we can change it, faster, better, stronger. That's all I'm doing. Let's stop focusing on me and start focusing on the Tribunal. :)

#13 Posted by EXTomar (4641 posts) -

If you spent no time explaining what the problem is then why would I spend thinking about it either. I have no reason to go to a message board I never visit to possibly read something I could care less about.

I don't play LoL and already see why people rage in that game. :)

#14 Edited by Cloudenvy (5891 posts) -

@extomar: Don't worry, you are better off not knowing. He's delusional, arrogant, misinformed, his writing is bloated, his formatting is the worst, and after reading through his thread he might be my least favorite person on the internet. :D

#15 Posted by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@extomar: If you don't play LoL you shouldn't be on this blog.

@cloudenvy: If you're going to continue to respond to the person and not the system the person is trying to fix, then you also do not belong on this thread. You're insulting my formatting when all you did is a run-on sentence of useless crap.

Good day.

#16 Edited by Cloudenvy (5891 posts) -
#17 Posted by DoctorWelch (2774 posts) -

Imagine what you could have done with that 45 hours. You could have read any number of books. Probably played through a bunch of games or one extremely long RPG. Started learning something productive. Literally anything but spending that many hours on forums talking about pointless shit.

Oh wait...what the fuck am I doing? I GOTTA GET OUT OF HERE!!! AHHHHHH!!!

#18 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@doctorwelch: Same as I said to the two before you. Start responding to the actual topic, please. Good day.

#19 Posted by Cloudenvy (5891 posts) -

@doctorwelch: Nooooo! Don't leave me alone in here with him!

#20 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

How did this thread turn into someone asking for opinions about a system within a videogame to a personal attack on that person? You all need to ask yourselves that. Don't come back until you have a valid answer.

@mrpandaman Hint - This time it has little-to-nothing to do with me. I'll give you that the first post on this blog wasn't guided enough, but that's about all I'm going to budge on this one. I've been completely respectful of everyone here, and have only gotten neutrality-disrespect in return.

#21 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

@ryokishine: I said it was a bad idea, simply because the changes you suggested are all bad ideas.

If every time I finished a game, a popup appeared that was anything other than the invite to my next game, it would simply irritate me, which would make me ignore the tribunal more than I already do.

I don't report people, because frankly I find all the rage and toxicity hilarious (I do not however, contribute to the toxicity). Perhaps that's because I have better things to think about than "hey that guy was a bit mean on the internet", but either way I choose not to engage in the tribunal as it is now anyway.

As far as I understand the tribunal works quite well the way it is now, with something like a 0.5% false punishment rate.

The part that made me laugh the most was your suggestion of letting people who are banned keep skins. Or the part where you suggested to take skins away as punishment. Frankly that has to be the most retarded shit I've ever heard with regards to punishment. You don't get less of a punishment just because you've spent more time or money. If you're banned, you're fucking banned and you deserve it as far as I'm concerned.

The tribunal is currently effective at what it does. This however, does not mean that all toxic players will go away, even if the system was changed (especially if it was changed to your system). Consider prison, people get reformed, some people stay in prison forever. There are still a shit ton of bad people on the street and prison will not change that.

Next time you want opinions on something you ask opinions for, you have no right to refute ANY of those opinions (especially when they tell you the same thing everyone else has told you), as they are just that, opinions. Which you requested.

#22 Posted by Corvak (983 posts) -

First off, 45 hours in the League of Legends forums would probably turn my brain into quivering goo.

The league community needs help, but it's got to help itself. You can't simply expect randoms to stop being complete shitbags to each other just because of a virtual kudos system. The people purposefully being jerks don't care, and the people who are "playing badly" or whatever are probably being dragged through the levels in botmatches because they simply dont want to deal with the jerks.

- More diverse matchmaking filters. Let players choose how serious they want to be. A friendlier casual game could be more lenient towards dropping out of the game, where a more serious match could be more punishing. This would sort the random solo queue into more like minded players, and eliminate some personality clashes.

- Player clans. MMOs have this same problem, and the workaround is usually clans or guilds. A group of people that might not be close friends, but who have similar motivations and goals. League of Legends is much improved when playing with a group like this.

#23 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

Posted by Corvak - July 20, 2013 at 11:44 AM

First off, 45 hours in the League of Legends forums would probably turn my brain into quivering goo.

The league community needs help, but it's got to help itself. You can't simply expect randoms to stop being complete shitbags to each other just because of a virtual kudos system. The people purposefully being jerks don't care, and the people who are "playing badly" or whatever are probably being dragged through the levels in botmatches because they simply dont want to deal with the jerks.

- More diverse matchmaking filters. Let players choose how serious they want to be. A friendlier casual game could be more lenient towards dropping out of the game, where a more serious match could be more punishing. This would sort the random solo queue into more like minded players, and eliminate some personality clashes.

- Player clans. MMOs have this same problem, and the workaround is usually clans or guilds. A group of people that might not be close friends, but who have similar motivations and goals. League of Legends is much improved when playing with a group like this.

@corvak: This is my blog, this is my profile. It is a choice to come here. I can set the expectations in my own space, and that's what I've attempted to do here. I agree with your logic, however, we're still not talking about the topic. I'll recreate the topic with the first post in mind. We need to start at square one again.

I love your idea about the matchmaking settings... Doesn't really deal with tribunal, but still a fantastic idea. May I put that on the forums?

Edit: On that note, I have to leave and go do real work in a Pharmacy. Peace friends (and other not-so-friendly acquaintances).

#24 Edited by Canteu (2821 posts) -

@ryokishine: You cannot use the excuse of "it's my blog" when you attach your blog to the forums. Nobody would read it otherwise, of course, but this is the trade off you make. When you attach a blog to the forums it's not yours anymore, it's a forum thread, which must follow the forum rules, not your own.

If you ask for opinions with expectations, and the response does not meet your expectations, it is your own damn fault for "expecting" anything at all, especially agreement.

edit: the reason people are acting so incredulous is your own doing. You're acting as if people disagreeing with you are wrong, simply because they disagree with you. This is something you need to get over very quickly if you ever hope to change anything for the better.

#25 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@canteu:

The forum thread is locked. My blog was not put on the forums anywhere. I simply referenced a past, locked thread that I created. It's still a valid argument. You had to come here first. You didn't come from the LoL forums.

Your argument is invalid and your opinions were of me, not my blog topic. Get out. Go away. Good day. Good bye.

#26 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

@ryokishine: You're not on that website right now, in case you didn't notice. You posted this as a blog, attached to the forums, which simply linked to another forum post you made on another site.

My argument is not an argument at all, it is simply disagreeing with your fantasy ideas which simply would not work. I provided no opinions of you, but the ideas you presented. I actually read the damn thing believe it or not.

Follow our rules, not the rules of the other website. This is not how shit works here.

#27 Posted by Slag (4225 posts) -

@ryokishine 45 hours? holy shit kid. I appreciate the passion, but maybe you should have done some more research into why Riot has designed things the way they have if you are going to spend that kind of time on this? I think you'd see why most of your suggestions probably are probably not optimal in their mind.

Fwiw I'm glad you care about this problem. But please understand this problem is not yours to solve and the odds are extremely high that you cannot solve it. I'm not saying you should accept the current situation, but be aware of what it is you are facing. And more importantly what it might take to actually fix it.

Bad behavior and incivility on the internet is major problem. It's prevalent from the biggest websites and communities to the smallest. In short you are trying to fix a problem nobody in the last twenty years has come close to solving on the internet. Many people have tried, many have spent millions upon millions of dollars to try and fix it.

It's even worse for a place like League which is financially dependent on their users, many of whom young men who are immature for one reason or another (age etc).

Ultimately as the entity that hosts the community and establishes the rules of engagement it's up to Riot to figure this out. And to their credit they have made a lot of changes that are making a difference. As Much as people complain about them, the MOBA community is actually better behaved today than when I first started playing nearly ten years ago. The difference is the bad actors seem more obvious now since the games are so much more popular.

I know you meant well, but your tone in that thread there and here is extremely unhelpful. And before you say to me "address the suggestions not the person", let me tell you this . That is not how the real world works, kid. Likable people get listened to and they get the benefit of the doubt. If you came into my workplace with this kind of attitude that you displayed to @cloudenvy and @doctorwelch, I would send you home for the day with a reprimand. It doesn't matter who started it, who is right or who is wrong, it's always on the employee to take the high road. So yes your attitude is 100% relevant.

Chastising people is also not going to help you build the type of consensus you'd need to even attempt meaningful change. Change of this magnitude requires buy-in from large numbers of people, no one man can achieve this by himself. The responses there and here should be your first clue that is something very wrong with your approach to this problem.

I'd also consider asking a mod to delete your original thread. I hate to be the one to break this to you kid, but that thread may have ruined your chances of getting employed at Riot. That sort of post usually does not usually win you many friends inside a company and hiring you given the response to your thread might create a minor PR headache they don't want to deal with.

#29 Posted by Patman99 (1573 posts) -

I have played a little League of Legends but I read your post here and on the LoL forums.

The problem is with player votes. Play any FPS that has a vote kick system and you will understand. It probably takes 3 or 4 tries to kick someone (barring the most vile offenders) simply because people in the match have to vote on it. For the most part, I imagine that people will more likely vote "no" so as to avoid wrongful punishment. Secondly, it requires people who are not privy to the situation to offer their opinion (through a yes/no vote). If you have a guild where one player is being a total dick, it is nearly impossible to kick that player. His guild mates will simply step up and vote no.

With that considered, I would imagine that most people would vote no to a pop-up window at the end of the match unless they directly experienced the trolling or "toxic" behaviour. I am not familiar with the "Tribunal" situation but after reading the LoL thread, I can assume that most people are fine with it. Not saying it's perfect but it is maybe not nearly as busted as you are saying it is.

#30 Edited by mrpandaman (864 posts) -

@ryokishine

Since this comment doesn't exactly have to do with the topic that the OP is asking, but addresses the OP's tone and others in the thread I put it in spoilers.

I think by attaching the older LoL thread to this current thread, people are now locking you to how you appear in that thread in this one as well. As @slag (most of his post I would agree with) pointed out and as I have as well your tone in the previous thread and as well as here is not doing you any favors. Again, the way you are wording posts are coming off as confrontational. That being said, certain people in this thread are not helping this to be a constructive conversation and if this thread becomes way off topic than what you want it to be, request a mod to close this down.

#31 Edited by EXTomar (4641 posts) -

I don't play LoL but I'm always curious what goes on in the game. I click on one of the few threads (for whatever reason they are rare here) and find out there is no information, point out some problems, then I'm told to go away. Put a mirror up to yourself and maybe you'll see the issue.

If you want to foster respect or discussion (or both) you need to present clearly and concisely. I still don't know what your complaint is beyond the perpetual nebulously defined "player community sucks" and a post was locked for what I assume was bad behavior. What is the actually discussion here?

#32 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

Posted by Slag - July 20, 2013 at 12:12 PM

@ryokishine 45 hours? holy shit kid. I appreciate the passion, but maybe you should have done some more research into why Riot has designed things the way they have if you are going to spend that kind of time on this? I think you'd see why most of your suggestions probably are probably not optimal in their mind.

Fwiw I'm glad you care about this problem. But please understand this problem is not yours to solve and the odds are extremely high that you cannot solve it. I'm not saying you should accept the current situation, but be aware of what it is you are facing. And more importantly what it might take to actually fix it.

Bad behavior and incivility on the internet is major problem. It's prevalent from the biggest websites and communities to the smallest. In short you are trying to fix a problem nobody in the last twenty years has come close to solving on the internet. Many people have tried, many have spent millions upon millions of dollars to try and fix it.

It's even worse for a place like League which is financially dependent on their users, many of whom young men who are immature for one reason or another (age etc).

Ultimately as the entity that hosts the community and establishes the rules of engagement it's up to Riot to figure this out. And to their credit they have made a lot of changes that are making a difference. As Much as people complain about them, the MOBA community is actually better behaved today than when I first started playing nearly ten years ago. The difference is the bad actors seem more obvious now since the games are so much more popular.

I know you meant well, but your tone in that thread there and here is extremely unhelpful. And before you say to me "address the suggestions not the person", let me tell you this . That is not how the real world works, kid. Likable people get listened to and they get the benefit of the doubt. If you came into my workplace with this kind of attitude that you displayed to @cloudenvy and @doctorwelch, I would send you home for the day with a reprimand. It doesn't matter who started it, who is right or who is wrong, it's always on the employee to take the high road. So yes your attitude is 100% relevant.

Chastising people is also not going to help you build the type of consensus you'd need to even attempt meaningful change. Change of this magnitude requires buy-in from large numbers of people, no one man can achieve this by himself. The responses there and here should be your first clue that is something very wrong with your approach to this problem.

I'd also consider asking a mod to delete your original thread. I hate to be the one to break this to you kid, but that thread may have ruined your chances of getting employed at Riot. That sort of post usually does not usually win you many friends inside a company and hiring you given the response to your thread might create a minor PR headache they don't want to deal with.

@slag: Very insightful. But, you've missed a crucial detail. These are forums and blogs. I'm a fellow consumer, just like the rest of these people. I'm not bound by a company policy yet. Neither are these people. I treated them with the respect they deserved, at first. After they decided to make it personal, I gave them a little salt in return. In no way did I insult their intelligence. I politely discouraged the from continuing to post on my blog or, in the other situation, on the thread that I created. As a fellow League of Legends player, I did my best here to be constructive. That's all Riot can ask of me.

I think you telling me to delete my original thread is the most amazing idea ever. I'll go ahead and do that. Thanks for your time and your thoughts. I appreciate your perspective greatly.

In my defense, Riot should realize that it takes a special person to give fellow consumers this much grace... These people should think about grace and what it means. Reflect on it. I've done the best I can as a peer in this blog.

#33 Edited by Demoskinos (14733 posts) -

Am I crazy or do both of those links just lead to the FrontPage of Giantbomb when you click them?

#34 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@extomar: I am really sorry that you're not familiar with the game... I didn't make this blog with an unfamiliar audience in mind. The game is a Massive Online Battle Arena (MOBA) game very similar to DOTA. Each match you start level 1. For kills you get gold. There are various items you can build.

Before the match you choose bonus stats including masteries and runes, and there is also a banning phase so that you can get rid of champions you don't want to play against. It's a 5 vs. 5 match. All of that in mind, you get in the game, there's neutral monsters to kill hidden in fog of war, and towers that players need to defend in order not to lose. If you lose all your team's towers, you lose. If you destroy the enemy team's towers, you win. As you can see, this is a very team-dependent game.

The Tribunal System is the system that Riot Corporation has in place to punish bad behavior. That is a basic understanding of the game.

If you're interested in the game,I suggest making a free account, and downloading the free game. That can all be accomplished at this link (assuming you will be playing on NA servers): https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/en/signup/index

@demoskinos A Note About Links I've Provided:I am not a giantbomb.com member. So, when I hyperlink things, they send you to the front page if you simply click the hyperlink. DO NOT click the hyperlink. Simply copy and paste the URL I provide, put it in your browser's navigation bar, and press enter. That will take you to the correct links I believe. I was unaware that was happening, nice catch Demoskinos!

@canteu: You keep editing everything you said so now none of my responses seem well-founded (lesson learned, I will be quoting people in the future). You never explained why anything was a bad idea at the beginning, just that it was simply a bad idea and not worth my time.

If you're ready to explain then we're finally ready to move forward... Awesome. Stop focusing on fixing your previous posts. Post to the topic from now on. This isn't about e-peen, it's about the Tribunal :)

#36 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@canteu

Posted by Canteu - July 20, 2013 at 11:43 AM

@ryokishine: I said it was a bad idea, simply because the changes you suggested are all bad ideas.

If every time I finished a game, a popup appeared that was anything other than the invite to my next game, it would simply irritate me, which would make me ignore the tribunal more than I already do.

I don't report people, because frankly I find all the rage and toxicity hilarious (I do not however, contribute to the toxicity). Perhaps that's because I have better things to think about than "hey that guy was a bit mean on the internet", but either way I choose not to engage in the tribunal as it is now anyway.

As far as I understand the tribunal works quite well the way it is now, with something like a 0.5% false punishment rate.

The part that made me laugh the most was your suggestion of letting people who are banned keep skins. Or the part where you suggested to take skins away as punishment. Frankly that has to be the most retarded shit I've ever heard with regards to punishment. You don't get less of a punishment just because you've spent more time or money. If you're banned, you're fucking banned and you deserve it as far as I'm concerned.

The tribunal is currently effective at what it does. This however, does not mean that all toxic players will go away, even if the system was changed (especially if it was changed to your system). Consider prison, people get reformed, some people stay in prison forever. There are still a shit ton of bad people on the street and prison will not change that.

Next time you want opinions on something you ask opinions for, you have no right to refute ANY of those opinions (especially when they tell you the same thing everyone else has told you), as they are just that, opinions. Which you requested.

1.) If the system irritates you, toggling it off would be an available option. That is detailed in the post.

2.) Finding the toxicity and raging hilarious is subjective, that's why we need a system that people can opt-in and opt-out of.

3.) A figure about false punishing is sort of weak. We are trying to make the system better. Just because it's good now doesn't mean it can't be better after some changes.

4.) The punishment system is still inclusive of being fully banned. However, we're simply adding an extra step to being fully banned. An extra material loss before the complete and total material loss of a person's entire account. Insulting my intelligence in your post is not helping you.

5.) We're not debating that Tribunal is serving a function and is somewhat effective at that function. We're trying to improve its effectiveness. Appealing to its current effectiveness is not getting us farther.

6.) I can respond to your opinions with my opinions. Where did I limit myself to that stipulation? You expect me to sit here and be called a retard and to not respond to you at all? Very funny. Funny indeed.

#38 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

Posted by Anwar - July 20, 2013 at 3:57 PM

@ryokishine: Calm down a little, where did he call you a retard? And you're suddenly saying 'we', do you have royal blood? And how is the figure about false punishing weak? It's a pretty strong argument which shows why your changes aren't needed.

@anwar: "Frankly that has to be the most retarded shit I've ever heard with regards to punishment." - Canteu

Look at the attitudes of people on this thread. Clearly the changes are needed.

Note: This is how people are acting about the topic OUT OF GAME. Think about how much worse it is in game where people don't censor everything they say.

"We're not debating..." is a mannerism I am using to describe all of the people participating in this blog discussion. No "royal blood" necessary. I am not on a high-horse, I am simply the person that initiated the discussion, that is all.

#40 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

@anwar: I'm asking you to think about how players are behaving on this thread, in a place where they are being respected, their intelligence is not being insulted. They've responded with angsty, angry, disrespect in most of the replies. This is a place where they have time to think about how they reply. It's an appeal to a hypothetical situation:

- - - - - - - - -

Think about how snappy and quick-to-judge these people have to be in an objective-based, team-game like League of Legends. If one person says one wrong thing, guess what happens? The rest of the match is spent bitching at each other having a "pissing-match" in chat.

- - - - - - - - -

That's why we need to change the Tribunal system. It all starts there. If it's a more reactive system and people can see exactly what they did wrong right after a match (immediately), instead of days, maybe even weeks later in an e-mail (a retroactive system)... It's going to be better than what it is now. That's all I'm trying to say.

As the LoL Community currently stands, if a player feels their "e-peen" shrinking, then they perk up and the chat sets aflame. If we can keep that from happening by changing the "common attitude" towards other players, then we will have people who are getting better at the game because they are spending more time playing and less time having a "pissing match." We will have more people playing the game and enjoying it because they didn't have to deal with all of the behavioral annoyances that are currently commonplace in the LoL Community and aren't being dealt with (since we will be dealing with those behavioral annoyances immediately after games and not weeks later - since players will be provided logs immediately after a game under the system I am describing). The immediate feedback will allow for more accurate AND informative / effective punishment of player behavior.

With this system in place, we'd need the material loss buffer in place (whether it be a loss of skins, or of champions owned, etc.) to prevent the initial losses of an entire accounts so that the community has time to adjust right after the patch that changes the Tribunal system is put into place. This is a well-thought out plan to change the "common attitude" of the LoL Community - not just the Tribunal system.

#41 Edited by Canteu (2821 posts) -

This guy is like some kind of jehovah's witness or something...

You're pretty lucky the people here are actually polite, because from what you think we're raging barbarians. You've essentially gotten nothing but civil responses. Maybe you have no idea how the community works here, but as you can tell, it doesn't work for you.

edit: for the record, I never called you anything. Simply the ideas presented to me, as requested.

#42 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

Edited by Canteu - July 20, 2013 at 4:30 PM

This guy is like some kind of jehovah's witness or something...

You're pretty lucky the people here are actually polite, because from what you think we're raging barbarians. You've essentially gotten nothing but civil responses. Maybe you have no idea how the community works here, but as you can tell, it doesn't work for you.

edit: for the record, I never called you anything. Simply the ideas presented to me, as requested.

How did this post benefit the function of improving the Tribunal system? That is all that this thread is about. I'm not sure why it's taking you so long to understand that.

Simply insulting someone's ideas is enough to insult them, especially in a situation where you know little-to-nothing of that person. We're not even considered acquaintances and you're calling my ideas "... the most retarded shit..." you've ever heard. You're rude. I don't appreciate it.

You're not getting the last say on my blog, period. Even if you contribute something useful, I will approve that it was good or provide a valid argument for it being possibly a step in the wrong direction. Your e-peen is not going to grow here - at all - by acting the way you have on this blog. You're free to stop wasting Your time on My blog at any time.

As you will notice, I have given constructive feedback to those who have given it to me on this blog. I've shown appreciation for thoughts that have truly been constructive to me. You've done none of that. You've been strictly rude. It's getting old - and fast.

Ah, and I'm not a Jehovah's witness - but, I do act quite a bit more professionally towards people I don't know than you do. That's the difference. It has nothing to do with ethnicity, creed, religion, or race. Nothing. It has everything to do with mutual respect (or, just simply, respect in your case since it has been so one-way).

#43 Edited by TruthTellah (8725 posts) -

@ryokishine: I appreciate your interest in trying to improve things in LoL, and whether your ideas are half-baked or not, it's nice that you're trying. I would simply suggest that you try to cool it down a bit. It appears that your intent is to sound respectful, but you're coming off a bit pedantic and condescending. Everyone around here is an equal with you, and they don't need to be talked down to, regardless of whether they're responding to your blog post or not. People on Giant Bomb tend to not appreciate someone sounding so controlling or above them. If you instead courteously come to them as someone asking for something(in this case, input), then they'll usually be more than happy to provide you with some comments.

We have fun around here; so, just be friendly and roll with it. Some people may be snarky at first, but if you just respond to those addressing your topic, you should get some fine discussion. I have a feeling this thread is already a wash, but I wish you the best for the future. :)

#45 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

MY E-PEEN IS HUUUUUUUUUGE

#46 Posted by TruthTellah (8725 posts) -

@canteu said:

MY E-PEEN IS HUUUUUUUUUGE

Dude, I just watched Drew land a helicopter. His e-peen is considerably bigger than any of ours.

#47 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

@truthtellah: This is 100% accurate. That M60 is pretty sweet too!

#48 Posted by mrpandaman (864 posts) -

@slag: Very insightful. But, you've missed a crucial detail. These are forums and blogs. I'm a fellow consumer, just like the rest of these people. I'm not bound by a company policy yet. Neither are these people. I treated them with the respect they deserved, at first. After they decided to make it personal, I gave them a little salt in return. In no way did I insult their intelligence. I politely discouraged the from continuing to post on my blog or, in the other situation, on the thread that I created. As a fellow League of Legends player, I did my best here to be constructive. That's all Riot can ask of me.

In my defense, Riot should realize that it takes a special person to give fellow consumers this much grace... These people should think about grace and what it means. Reflect on it. I've done the best I can as a peer in this blog.

Riot if they needed/wanted to would look at your blogs and forum posts if they considered hiring you; It would be part of a background check of sorts.

The part I italicized, makes you seem like you think you're above everyone.

On to your actually suggestions/argument:

- Your system relies on the honesty of all players involved. Because of this, it allows too much bias for premade teams to abuse the system. It would also allow trollish players/groups to abuse it as well by means of tilting votes.

- The system you ask for is an extra layer that doesn't need to be there. In theory, your idea may be golden (like the No Child Left Behind Act), but in practice won't work or is actually not good at all (like the No Child Left Behind Act). The reason it won't is because not all players care, most players will want to move onto the next game. Those that do simply press the report button.

- If a player has invested into the game and they fear of a permaban due to being reported for bad behavior, then if they do get permabanned they have no one but themselves to blame for losing access to all their paid for items. Knowing a ban could come, they should have reformed their attitude sooner.

I would also like to make note, so that you realize this yourself that in the second page of LoL thread, you say that you are not doing this for selfish reasons, yet that wall of text you have on that page screams I'm being selfish. You're trying to garner community support but you seem like you would take all credit for it without crediting the community.

#49 Edited by Ryokishine (32 posts) -

Edited by TruthTellah - July 20, 2013 at 4:42 PM

@ryokishine: I appreciate your interest in trying to improve things in LoL, and whether your ideas are half-baked or not, it's nice that you're trying. I would simply suggest that you try to cool it down a bit. It appears that your intent is to sound respectful, but you're coming off a bit pedantic and condescending. Everyone around here is an equal with you, and they don't need to be talked down to, regardless of whether they're responding to your blog post or not. People on Giant Bomb tend to not appreciate someone sounding so controlling or above them. If you instead courteously come to them as someone asking for something(in this case, input), then they'll usually be more than happy to provide you with some comments.

We have fun around here; so, just be friendly and roll with it. Some people may be snarky at first, but if you just respond to those addressing your topic, you should get some fine discussion. I have a feeling this thread is already a wash, but I wish you the best for the future. :)

@truthtellah I've not been treated as an equal in this thread. Looking back, I think you'll realize that. And, there's also a flaw with that logic... They're on an equal level to me in regards to the respect we deserve.

However, my brain is different from their brain. We are completely different people with completely different logic and reasoning abilities. I have asked courteously for input since the beginning of this thread. I had to go through all of this to get that. That's just how it has been. I've been trying to roll with it. This is what rolling with it looks like for me. That's just how I am. And I wish you the best in the future as well.

@anwar: I'm not asking you guys to be LoL fans. This is My Blog. It Can Be Whatever I Want It To Be.

@canteu said:

MY E-PEEN IS HUUUUUUUUUGE

Obviously... Dealing with its size certainly ate up a lot of my time today.

#50 Posted by Canteu (2821 posts) -

@ryokishine: You can be whatever you want to be.

Nighty night.