Microsoft changing terms of service

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows-live/microsoft-services-agreement

As of October 19th

"TheMicrosoftbranded services require that you sign into yourMicrosoftaccount periodically, at a minimum every 270 days, to keep theMicrosoftbranded services portion of the services active, unless provided otherwise in an offer for a paid portion of the services. If you fail to sign in during this period, we may cancel your access to theMicrosoftbranded services. If theMicrosoftbranded services are canceled due to your failure to sign in, your data may be permanently deleted from our servers."

"4.4. What happens if my services are canceled or terminated? If your services are canceled or terminated (whether by you or us), your right to use the services stops immediately and your license to use our software ends. You must then uninstall the software, or, alternatively, we may disable it. If your services are canceled or terminated, we may permanently delete your content from our servers and we have no obligation to return content to you."

That's a bit messed up, if they can delete access to your games through GFWL or downloads on xbox marketplace.

Meaning I have to log into my xbox at least once a year to not have it just turned off? 

Do I even have to post the Shin-Ra theme anymore? It's getting a bit tiring. For me.

@The_Laughing_Man: Pretty much, this would mainly be a concern for PC gamers with GFWL accounts, you could easily go for more than a year without playing a game on that service, and honestly, I haven't turned on my xbox in probably about 6 months now and I really don't see that changing much in the near future.

Just making it easier for me to continue avoiding anything GFWL-related.

@The_Laughing_Man: Pretty much, this would mainly be a concern for PC gamers with GFWL accounts, you could easily go for more than a year without playing a game on that service, and honestly, I haven't turned on my xbox in probably about 6 months now and I really don't see that changing much in the near future.

I imagin this is more for clearing up unused gamer tags.

Man this is worse than when my PSO Blue Burst account got deleted for inactivity.

I'm actually surprised that wasn't in the original Terms Of Service, but it just serves to draw attention to how egregious it is. Even though they will never publicly acknowledge such a practice, I'm sure they will still charge for any paid services that your account was previously using, even after they terminate or disable your account. Microsoft isn't going to miss out on money, and if you have a Gold subscription, they won't just terminate that. They're a corporation and as such, they like money.

I assume that this will also work if you just sign in at xbox.com. If not, that's a bit of a problem

Once every 9 months is reasonable I guess, but the sort of total annihilation that this could result in is extreme. I wonder if this is legally on the level of just a grey area or scare tactic like the clauses in EULAs that state that if you accept, you can't take part in a class action lawsuit.

@Dagbiker said:

I imagine this is more for clearing up unused gamer tags.

This. Large, network-centric companies have thousands of dormant accounts, and if a user isn't active on a service for three-fourths of a year they probably aren't planning on returning. Might as well free up hosting space and relinquish account names. It's a bit frustrating for people who have both a primary and secondary Windows Live account (which is Microsoft-sanctioned - I checked), or Xbox Live profiles associated with those accounts (like me, in both cases), but it really only adds the extra step of logging in with the secondary account every six months.

Ugh. Count me out of GFWl then

I can understand the account pollution issue, but losing your software is not cool.

Why not just lose your nick instead of the goods you purchased?

That seems reasonable. What does NOT is this (from the email I recieved):

Finally, we have added a binding arbitration clause and class action waiver that affects how disputes with Microsoft will be resolved in the United States.

Add one more to the list.

Makes sense. Why should they store your shit if you're never going to use it.

@Video_Game_King:

@mlarrabee said:

@Dagbiker said:

I imagine this is more for clearing up unused gamer tags.

This. Large, network-centric companies have thousands of dormant accounts, and if a user isn't active on a service for three-fourths of a year they probably aren't planning on returning. Might as well free up hosting space and relinquish account names.

That's totally valid and reasonable, but the wording seems to be broader than account names. It reads as though all content associated with the account, including which games you have purchased, would be lost. Loss of a gamertag is fine, but being unable to access stuff that you have purchased legally is pretty rough.

People take breaks from video gaming all the time, even ones as long as 9 months. To lose a gamer tag is fine, but purchased content or even stuff like achievements is kinda rough.

Just seems like a way to free up some usernames.

Seriously, coming from someone who has looked into changing my username, the options left SUCK

Are we still excited about an all-digital future, where Microsoft can revoke access to all your shit if they don't see you for awhile?

ugh, my 360 isn't hooked up to the internet... guess I'll have to sign onto GWFL then

I find this to be pretty unfair. Losing all excess to the games you bought? The only reason I'm not freaking out is because I log on almost everyday because of the 360, but I can see why some people would be pissed off.

I understand deleting accounts and stored content from services past 270 days. That's a long ass time and those dormant accounts will just clog up the servers. What I don't get is the clause that allows them to keep content from those who had lost it due to a dormant account. I get that they don't have to follow this clause and could give the consumer the services and product back. I hope that they allow this because I can imagine, with the economy being the way it is, people may not have internet access for 270+ days because they can't make those bills. If people in those circumstances can't get their services and product back then that is pretty fucked up.

It's things like this that make me weary for a service based infrastructure for future video games and media. There's no guarantee of service and the nature of the arrangement can change at the drop of a hat.

Are we still excited about an all-digital future, where Microsoft can revoke access to all your shit if they don't see you for awhile?

@mlarrabee said:

@Dagbiker said:

I imagine this is more for clearing up unused gamer tags.

This. Large, network-centric companies have thousands of dormant accounts, and if a user isn't active on a service for three-fourths of a year they probably aren't planning on returning. Might as well free up hosting space and relinquish account names.

That's totally valid and reasonable, but the wording seems to be broader than account names. It reads as though all content associated with the account, including which games you have purchased, would be lost. Loss of a gamertag is fine, but being unable to access stuff that you have purchased legally is pretty rough.

People take breaks from video gaming all the time, even ones as long as 9 months. To lose a gamer tag is fine, but purchased content or even stuff like achievements is kinda rough.

that's pretty stupid. yeah, people make accounts and never play them again but still deleting people's content.

if someone doesn't log in does that mean that you can't access xbox live anymore as in the console? or just the account?

Talk about dropping an anvil in the room. This screws more then just people who don't use their accounts or make fakes but also those who don't connect their systems to the internet daily, or use the services once in a while to buy content. Do they still get to use it on their system if it's installed on their? What if they apply this to the operating system? Etherway, it shows that they clearly are having problems with their service if they have to clean accounts every nine months.

@Dagbiker said:

@Triumvir

@mlarrabee said:

@Dagbiker said:

I imagine this is more for clearing up unused gamer tags.

This. Large, network-centric companies have thousands of dormant accounts, and if a user isn't active on a service for three-fourths of a year they probably aren't planning on returning. Might as well free up hosting space and relinquish account names.

That's totally valid and reasonable, but the wording seems to be broader than account names. It reads as though all content associated with the account, including which games you have purchased, would be lost. Loss of a gamertag is fine, but being unable to access stuff that you have purchased legally is pretty rough.

People take breaks from video gaming all the time, even ones as long as 9 months. To lose a gamer tag is fine, but purchased content or even stuff like achievements is kinda rough.

You don't own any of that content. You licensed it. Welcome to the all digital future.

Thankfully we have pirates, ironically enough. This is just going to make piracy worse, which as I said, is ironically beneficial to helping us own the content.

I don't know, I have a 360 with a bunch of games, and some GFWL games, and I don't care. If I go 9 months without logging in then I probably won't be all that upset anyhow.

I'm sure they have alot of REALLY old accounts they'd like to just cull at this point. Not to mention I have my windows phone so I'm logging in quite often. If I do end up getting windows 8 it'll be even more often.