#1 Posted by Slag (3345 posts) -


#2 Posted by Slag (3345 posts) -

I don't know if this has been proposed before, I apologize if my Google-fu failed to uncover a similar thread

To add some context to my poll question.

I've been working my way through the ole Bombcasts and just listened to the really fun GOTY 2009 casts and it got me thinking back to the 2011 cast with the whole Skyrim vs Saints Row thing that got frankly unpleasant to listen to.

I can't help but wonder if these debates are truly pointless and that there is a better way to recognize great games. Being a Baseball fan I can't help but think that adopting a Hall Of Fame format might actually be more useful and actually make for better entertainment.

Pluses

  1. You can have as many or as few inductees as appropriate. Some years are great, some are bad. Maybe some years no games that deserves to get in, maybe some years have a dozen. This allows for some flexibility for the staff to exercise their judgment and great games don't get punished for being published in a competitive year. And gives some looking over the past probably a more realistic picture of the time period. In my mind I think in practice you probably wouldn't more than ~5-6 max per year. Otherwise it would get too diluted
  2. Handheld, download and Indie games would have more of a chance of getting recognized. As it is now anything that's not a AAA console release basically has little to no chance to get GOTY. Which makes sense given the budget disparities.
  3. Largely Eliminates impossible to win Apples to Oranges debates like Skyrim vs Saints Row (Or Batman vs Uncharted 2 etc), that can be occasionally annoying to listen to. And Possibly allows discussion to return commetning about the games on their own merits and faults without comparisons that aren't really useful.
  4. Allows GiantBomb to recognize games from the past, prior to its' founding. A Veteran's committee if you will.
  5. GiantBomb sort of already does something similar in some respects on the Games page with the "Major games" tab.
  6. If GiantBomb grows staff wise, this format can allow games to recognized with having to drag a holdout into agreement. GOTY discussions could get really cumbersome say in a future where GiantBomb has ten personalities or so.
  7. Degree of greatness could still be measured by those who care by aggregating staff opinion ala Heisman voting. (e.g. Game A got in with 100% of the vote while B got in with 80%).
  8. There's some drama, instead of who wins it becomes who gets in.

Negatives

  1. Might seem kinda Wishy Washy since no one game wins (although nothing says they still can't honor on anyway if they want to)
  2. Might be prone to too much inclusion
  3. Category winners may somewhat address this already.
  4. Perhaps less drama/suspense than Winner format.
  5. other things I didn't think of?

What do you think?

#3 Posted by LiquidSwords (2739 posts) -

Don't change a thing! Seeing the GB community go full retard because the staff didn't choose their personal picks is awesome!

#4 Posted by Vinny_Says (5630 posts) -

@LiquidSwords said:

Don't change a thing! Seeing the GB community go full retard because the staff didn't choose their personal picks is awesome!

word!

#5 Posted by Godlyawesomeguy (6375 posts) -

The GOTY talks they have now is some of the best content on the site. If they should change anything, it should be something having to do with bringing back TANG.

#6 Posted by EpicSteve (6442 posts) -

They're a really creative bunch of dudes I would trust to change the format if it was needing change. Right now, I'm fine with it. Ultimately, the discussion of "Game of the Year" needs to happen, and is a fun debate to boot. Yes, it's weird to compare Skyrim to Saints 3 on paper, but one of them did provide you with a more enjoyable experience. Just because two things are different, doesn't dictate they can't be compared on a quality level.

#7 Edited by Brendan (7518 posts) -

@LiquidSwords said:

Don't change a thing! Seeing the GB community go full retard because the staff didn't choose their personal picks is awesome!

That is a treasure.

Personally I like your (the OP's) idea, but I love the content of GOTY as it is, with the long debates and hilarious conversation. I am different than many others, however; in that I don't get made at any discussion. I didn't feel scared when the debate got a little heated a couple of years ago and everyone on the forum wet their pants (remember that? ugh) and I have never gotten frustrated when my opinions grated against the bomb crew's.

This idea is great if you are the type of user that finds themselves frustrated with polarizing conversation, and I won't fault you for that.

#8 Posted by 71Ranchero (2580 posts) -

I dont care much about what games they pick or how they pick them. I just want to see what they come up with for the videos =)

#9 Edited by TheSouthernDandy (3629 posts) -

I like the idea of a Hall of Fame but not as a replacement. The debates and arguments are part of what makes the end of the year stuff great. As for mobile games getting recognition, I think if one stands out enough that it's a good game on its own merits, it'll get a shout out. For example, Hero Academy is for damn sure going on my top ten. That game's awesome. And indie/dl games have gotten on lists, Limbo is a recent game that comes to mind, and I'd bet good money Dust will be on at least Brads list for this year.

#10 Posted by BraveToaster (12590 posts) -

I think I like the way it is. A lot of good discussion goes on in the Bombcast and on the forums around that time of the year.

#11 Posted by Slag (3345 posts) -

I should note I wasn't trying to suggest that the videos (which are fun) or epic podcast discussion and such should (or would) go away, just basically the criteria and process would change for how they select what they select.

Anyway looks like people like GOTY overwhelmingly as it is, so far. So it's kind of a moot point, but figured I'd throw that out there if there was any confusion by what I meant in the poll question.

#12 Posted by itsVASH (172 posts) -

Wheres the option for both??? A hall of fame would be cool... but a GOTY is really needed... we need something to sum up the year and they do a good job of paying tribute to game in ways they deserve, IE Soulja Boy Award to Games to Play if you drink and get drunk or smoke and get high, Best Big Ass Ramp, Best Use of FMV, or "Best Trucks" Which never happend but you get the point. Still a Hall of Fame type deal would be cool to have to.

#13 Posted by SmilingPig (1337 posts) -

I dont really care one way or the other.

P.S. Slag your Dino kind a looks like a penis.

#14 Posted by MikkaQ (10225 posts) -

I kinda like the crucible format the GOTY podcasts have of like "we've been in this sweaty room for 5 hours, oh god just shut the fuck up and let the game I want win GOTY, or not, I don't care, whatever!" where otherwise friendly coworkers turn completely against each other.

So I vote to keep that. Although that new podcasting room looks too comfortable, so they should up the heat ever so slightly in there just to rile everyone up more.

#15 Posted by Slag (3345 posts) -

@itsVASH said:

Wheres the option for both??? A hall of fame would be cool... but a GOTY is really needed... we need something to sum up the year and they do a good job of paying tribute to game in ways they deserve, IE Soulja Boy Award to Games to Play if you drink and get drunk or smoke and get high, Best Big Ass Ramp, Best Use of FMV, or "Best Trucks" Which never happend but you get the point. Still a Hall of Fame type deal would be cool to have to.

Ah crap, You're right I should have had an option for that. Oh well too late now.

yeah the fun awards are my personal favorite part of GOTY, if there were this hypothetical GHOF I don't see why you still couldn't have that as those don't really impact the actual GOTY at all.

But given the voting so far I don't think it's going to matter.

@SmilingPig said:

P.S. Slag your Dino kind a looks like a penis.

Damnit, I can't unsee that now.

now I'm going to have change my avatar

#16 Posted by Athadam (638 posts) -

I really like your idea - but I feel we can also have a GOTY and a Hall of Fame. The reason why we have to keep GOTY is because it produces a lot of wonderful discussion. Because it is so competitive, it really makes you evaluate games as a whole - more than just story, graphics, or gameplay mechanics but in terms of how much enjoyment you got out of the game.

If we only had a Hall of Fame, I don't think these critical debates would happen anymore.

#17 Posted by Terramagi (1159 posts) -

Saints Row 3 was a better game than Skyrim and I will cut anybody who says otherwise.

#18 Posted by WiqidBritt (569 posts) -

I think it's fine as it is. We get a top 10 list, so it's not like all but one great game gets ignored, no shame in taking 2nd or 3rd if it's been a solid year for games.

That said, a GiantBomb hall of fame that's separate from the GOTY stuff would be interesting. Most 'Hall of Fame' things tend to reach back into the history of the industry and most of the time only honor one or two entries a year. Standing the test of time is usually a requirement, which you can't really do with games that have been out less than a year.

#19 Posted by Ghostiet (5153 posts) -

The last two Bombcasts where extremely uncomfortable for me to listen, due to Jeff's and Brad's hard-headedness, but it's not such a major issue.

If anything, I would like a change just to spice up things a little.

#20 Posted by ThePickle (4149 posts) -

Don't change it, but add it. Remember when Jeff Gerstmann's Hall of Fame was going to be a thing?

#21 Posted by ThePickle (4149 posts) -

@Terramagi said:

Saints Row 3 was a better game than Skyrim and I will cut anybody who says otherwise.

You can cut me all you want, it doesn't make what you're saying correct.

#22 Posted by Slag (3345 posts) -

some overdue replies, started on these last night and accidentally deleted them.

@EpicSteve: No doubt their judgement far exceeds mine and I don't think GOTY is broken by any means (I enjoy quite a bit), just wondered if this might make it better. The way I look at it, I guess I don't find find the argument whether Skyrim is a 99 and Saints Row to be a 98.5 or vice versa to be that interesting. To me what's more interesting is that they are both are really sweet games. I'd rather know what games makes the cut than which is the best of the best. But it looks like I'm in the minority on that. Which is ok.

@Brendan: Thanks for the kind words! Heated Debates don't bother me at all, but shoutfests aren't really my thing, which is kinda of what the GOTY 2011 seemed like it dissolved into ( I haven't heard 2010 GOT yet is that the one where the community got upset that you refer to?). Everybody's different though. Ultimately it seems like based off the comments here the guys got it right for what the community wants.

@TheSouthernDandy: Yeah they do get shout outs and some props. But can they ever win? I really really doubt it. Limbo as you mentioned is a good example of this, One of the downloadable/indie games probably ever put out. Had no chance of winning GOTY.

@Castermhief117: That's a very fair point

@WiqidBritt: You are right about a lookback period being needed for a true HOF to see if it holds up. What I was trying to advocate was more the selection method, not necessarily the actual Hall of Fame status if you will. Perhaps you're right and this if implemented at all would be best as a separate thing.

@ThePickle: No I don't. Is there a thread or video about it somewhere?

#23 Posted by Oldirtybearon (4282 posts) -

I don't think they should change the format, but maybe lay down some ground rules to prevent another Skyrim vs Saints type thing. Man, was that shit brutal to listen to.

#24 Posted by ThePickle (4149 posts) -

@Slag said:

some overdue replies, started on these last night and accidentally deleted them.

@EpicSteve: No doubt their judgement far exceeds mine and I don't think GOTY is broken by any means (I enjoy quite a bit), just wondered if this might make it better. The way I look at it, I guess I don't find find the argument whether Skyrim is a 99 and Saints Row to be a 98.5 or vice versa to be that interesting. To me what's more interesting is that they are both are really sweet games. I'd rather know what games makes the cut than which is the best of the best. But it looks like I'm in the minority on that. Which is ok.

@Brendan: Thanks for the kind words! Heated Debates don't bother me at all, but shoutfests aren't really my thing, which is kinda of what the GOTY 2011 seemed like it dissolved into ( I haven't heard 2010 GOT yet is that the one where the community got upset that you refer to?). Everybody's different though. Ultimately it seems like based off the comments here the guys got it right for what the community wants.

@TheSouthernDandy: Yeah they do get shout outs and some props. But can they ever win? I really really doubt it. Limbo as you mentioned is a good example of this, One of the downloadable/indie games probably ever put out. Had no chance of winning GOTY.

@Castermhief117: That's a very fair point

@WiqidBritt: You are right about a lookback period being needed for a true HOF to see if it holds up. What I was trying to advocate was more the selection method, not necessarily the actual Hall of Fame status if you will. Perhaps you're right and this if implemented at all would be best as a separate thing.

@ThePickle: No I don't. Is there a thread or video about it somewhere?

I believe it was part 3 of the 2011 SNES party. It was definitely in there somewhere.

#25 Posted by mlarrabee (2760 posts) -

The insanely-deep and personal arguments are why the GOTY podcasts are my favorites. [not kidding]

They're like my own little version of the gladiators! [kidding]

#26 Posted by BrockNRolla (1702 posts) -

I'm with a lot of these folks: the GOTY stuff is consistently some of the funniest, most entertaining content GB puts out all year. I hope they keep at it the way they have been. I literally get excited just thinking about it.

Is that sad? That might be sad.

#27 Posted by falling_fast (2144 posts) -

gamespot had a pretty cool hall of fame page.

I think they should keep game of the year, and do way more retrospective videos, and most especially they should bring back random ass pc videos!

#28 Posted by TheSouthernDandy (3629 posts) -
@Slag no but it's rare a dl small budget title can compete with a high quality big budget game for winning goty but that's a whole other issue. To your point the way they do it is great and is super popular I don't think changing it would help. Introducing a hall of fame is a great idea though something along the lines of Screened's besties. Surprised they haven't done it.
#29 Posted by Slag (3345 posts) -

@ThePickle: Hunh thanks I'll check that out. I'm really curious now to see what happened now. Wouldn't surprise me if the guys were just stressed out given the uncertaintt over whole impending sale of Giantbomb at the the time.

@TheSouthernDandy: Well that's kinda my point. Using sports as an example again, GOTY is more like Heisman voting than it is HOF. Now you know there is no way any body other than Wideout, RB or QB realistically is going to win (with a couple very rare exceptions). If you just look at the Heisman candidates that really distorts the picture of what College Football was like that year and basically is inaccurate since so no position in football can excel without decent performances by 10 other players minimum. So What does the Heisman really tell you nothing? Not much imho.

So yeah no 3DS game is likely to win GOTY ever, but I don't feel gaming would be the same without them. These "lesser" games are vital parta of the gaming ecosystem and should be recognized as such.

anyway the people have spoken pretty loudly here and I accept that people's opinions differ from mine. If GB ever wants to add a HOF in addition to GOTY, I'd be pretty happy with that too.

#30 Edited by Hunter5024 (5173 posts) -

GOTY are some of the best podcasts all year so I wouldn't want them to change that a bit, especially with the new awesome top ten format they adopted in 2011. Though a Hall of Fame feature separate from GOTY would be welcome and interesting.

Edit: Though upon further reflection I have trouble seeing all of the guys agreeing on which games should go in. It would be a delicate balance between personal preference and quality of game/impact, and they've always preferred the former approach. What interests me about this idea is hearing them discuss older games that should be included.