This topic is locked from further discussion.

Posted by Shinryujin (19 posts) -

2 Controversial names in title, heh.

The almighty link of inevitable doom

Anonymous versus Sarkeesian

I had recently discovered through someone I subscribed to on Youtube, that Anonymous had gathered and released information regarding Anita Sarkeesian. Many separate videos had been made over the past year or so dismantling Anita's criticism regarding sexism in video games. Things got more interesting a few months ago when new information surfaced that hints towards Anita's ulterior motives. What we found out was...

Anita is a scam.

Well, the main message ends here. What follows is my personal opinion.

Something Doesn't Click

I watched her Tropes vs Women series so far, and some things had always bugged me, some things that simply didn't click for me. I wasn't really sure, but I've been watching other people's critique of her videos and they had put it into words for me. A lot of great points have been brought up, thus I only have these few to add.

Why Kickstarter?

Why does she need money for this? Video game studies, insight, opinion, etc. writings and videos has been done for free and voluntarily so. This is my first giant red flag in this matter.

I suspected that Kickstarter served a dual-purpose for her, as a marketing scheme and to make money, any amount of money; which is brilliant and thoroughly devious. Think about it; normally, a producer pays a marketer to bring customers to him / her, essentially buying customers. Anita reverses this by making the customers pay her to bring themselves to her, thus making herself the producer and marketer, giving her all the benefits, and shouldering none of the cost.

Professional Victim

Referring mainly to her TEDxWomen speech. She plays the victim card really hard. The mentality is that, "I'm being persecuted, therefore I must be right". Plus the term really fits her marketing tactic; "professional" meaning being really good at it and she makes money by doing it. Anita abuses society's perception regarding gender to further her cause.

Ironically, she then turns around and speaks out against the Damsel in Distress trope, yet she uses it when it suit her. Hypocrisy.

Female Logic

Her critique against the Damsel in Distress trope is basically this. We generally accept that not saving people is bad, but then she tries to explain that saving people is also bad. Thus, there is no way to satisfy her; she has set up the situation in such a way that there is no winning move. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Are Video Games Sexist?

No.

Or rather, depends on how you define sexism.

The way I see it, sexism presumes the intent to discriminate with the result of harm done to the target of discrimination. In general, video games are not that. It just so happens that most game developers and players are straight male, and they / we do what we are most familiar with. It's not a boys' club, or a sausage fest (picked up that term somewhere). We don't prop up a "No Women Allowed" sign. Everyone is welcome. It just so happens that percentage wise, more men are interested in video games than women are. Men are not to blame. We do not go out of our way to stomp on women.

Yes, more can be done to better represent the rest of the spectrum of humans; but at the same time, don't attribute to video games what isn't there. Yes, video games do have the potential to gain wider acceptance and achieve greater things; but at the same time, sometimes we just want to have fun.

#1 Posted by martyarf (250 posts) -

My god, can you guys get any more pathetic?

#3 Posted by CustomOtto (440 posts) -

Yes, video games do have the potential to gain wider acceptance and achieve greater things; but at the same time, sometimes we just want to have fun.

"we"

#5 Posted by JasonR86 (9579 posts) -

lol

#6 Posted by martyarf (250 posts) -

FYI if you're trying to prove that sexism doesn't exist in games maybe don't make a section called FEMALE LOGIC and then insinuate that women are irrational. Just a lil' pro-tip from someone that thinks you are an idiot and should go away forever into a pit full of piss.

#7 Posted by Uranium (31 posts) -

This is just sad man, go take your garbage somewhere else.

#8 Edited by SpaceInsomniac (3532 posts) -

In my opinion, this would be a good example of how NOT to make a case against Anitia Sarkeesian. Also, I'm pretty sure that the internet group known as "Anonymous" isn't involved in this issue in any way. She was just criticized by someone who wanted to remain anonymous. There's a huge difference, there.

Lastly, THIS is why I would like to see a debate forum that could be filtered out. Threads like this. As for the rest of you people, flag and move on. I saw this and wasn't going to post in this thread until you people just HAD to reply.

#9 Posted by mlarrabee (2868 posts) -

@martyarf said:

FYI if you're trying to prove that sexism doesn't exist in games maybe don't make a section called FEMALE LOGIC and then insinuate that women are irrational. Just a lil' pro-tip from someone that thinks you are an idiot and should go away forever into a pit full of piss.

"I think of a man, and I take away reason and accountability."

#10 Edited by AmatureIdiot (1061 posts) -

I find the fact that she has engineered by complete accident, a massive, free publicity machine out of her most vehement opponents amazing. Her detractors both publicise almost every thing she does to the point I see her name at least once a week, but also happily paint themselves as obsessive strawmen who just come off as creepy.

#11 Posted by Milkman (16481 posts) -

Finally! Anonymous is going after a REAL threat!

#13 Edited by Marokai (2785 posts) -

@spaceinsomniac said:

In my opinion, this would be a good example of how NOT to make a case against Anitia Sarkeesian.

^ This.

#14 Posted by Animasta (14633 posts) -

the case for anita sarkeesian:

her earrings are awesome

QUID PRO QUO MOTHERFUCKERS

also

@jasonr86 said:

lol

#15 Posted by nsmb2_mario (72 posts) -

This is why I voted for Obama.

#16 Posted by ShaggE (6290 posts) -

No, on second thought, let's not go on the internet. 'Tis a silly place.

#17 Edited by NmareBfly (39 posts) -

The way I see it, sexism presumes the intent to discriminate with the result of harm done to the target of discrimination.

This is wrong. Wrong wrong wrong. So wrong that it makes the little hairs on the back of my neck stand up with stunned disbelief. The whole problem with institutionalized sexism is that there is no conscious intent to discriminate, but it happens anyway. THIS IS THE POINT OF MOST OF THE VIDEOS. It's a subconscious thing that people -- game developers and non -- take for granted and/or don't realize they are doing in the first place. Well-intentioned people are perfectly capable of being massively sexist or racist, and often even think they're doing people a favor by acting like they do. All that anyone can do is point out when they are and hope they're not too close-minded to see that an alternative viewpoint is valid and the things they think are acceptable are in fact hurtful. Like in the post above, the section called 'Female Logic' is incredibly sexist, and does a very good job of making the whole thing pretty worthless.

#19 Posted by tsiro (214 posts) -

go away

#20 Posted by joshwent (2047 posts) -

Thanks OP! It makes me all the more confident that I can almost completely disagree with Anita, whilst also thinking that just about everything you said is destructive baseless nonsense.

She doesn't deserve this rage, and (as you even highlight) it only makes her stronger. Forget about her, and the internet (sans Kotaku, Polygon, and Patrick) will eventually forget too.

#21 Posted by WesleyWyndam (134 posts) -

Fuck.

#22 Posted by davidwitten22 (1708 posts) -

It's amazing how much you care about this insignificant documentary that no one outside of video game forums even knows exists. By amazing I of course mean pathetic and sad. You and Darji should start your own forum and we can send all of our oblivious idiots there. That would be super.

TLDR: You are a moron.

#23 Edited by RollingZeppelin (1908 posts) -

The funny thing is that if the idiots that hate her so much didn't decide to berate and threaten her during the kickstarter, she would have likely failed to raise enough money and barely anyone would know who she is. But instead we have to constantly be reminded about how terrible and hypocritical and blah blah blah she is.

The people that hate her and want her to fail so much are probably more integral to her success than anything else! It's actually pretty hilarious. In fact, if I didn't know how utterly devoid of intelligence people can be on the internet I could almost see those original threats and derisions being orchestrated by her and her colleagues.

#24 Posted by LiquidPenguins (181 posts) -

Any valid criticism you could throw at Anita you could throw at this site. She is giving her opinion about video games while showing footage of video games. You could not be more pathetic.

#25 Posted by skipper00 (57 posts) -

I just... don't care.

Also what the fuck is Anonymous doing? Granted I don't keep up to date with their recent activity but I thought they only went after terrible people like The Westboro church? Why are they going after a lady who talks about games?

#27 Edited by Kevin_Cogneto (991 posts) -

@skipper00 said:

I just... don't care.

Also what the fuck is Anonymous doing? Granted I don't keep up to date with their recent activity but I thought they only went after terrible people like The Westboro church? Why are they going after a lady who talks about games?

Because they're a group of infantile bullies who are quickly running out of paper dragons to slay that will justify their collective existence?

#28 Posted by Chaser324 (6256 posts) -

Is this actually Anonymous or just someone claiming to be with them? I thought those guys did important stuff like saving people from dangerous cults and defending human rights.

Moderator
#29 Posted by punkxblaze (2948 posts) -

Can we fucking stop, already? Just fucking ignore her. She's not hurting any of us, I don't like her either, but the difference is I'm not giving her my time or attention.

#30 Edited by Hailinel (23676 posts) -

Is this actually Anonymous or just someone claiming to be with them? I thought those guys did important stuff like saving people from dangerous cults and defending human rights.

Anonymous is a decentralized group. Anyone can be part of Anonymous simply by claiming that they are. So while this might not be the same group that harasses Scientologists, they are part of Anonymous.

#31 Edited by Confirm4Crit (138 posts) -

I flagged this.

I also would like to make a statement.

If you're uneducated, work on that, please.

If you are educated, and you still want to defend your opinion like this, good luck.

God damn.

#32 Edited by PollySMPS (220 posts) -

The internet really is a sad and fucking pathetic place.

#33 Posted by Pr1mus (3775 posts) -

Anita Sarkeesian came into my house yesterday to kick my puppy.

#34 Posted by Chaser324 (6256 posts) -

Locking this down because this clearly isn't headed anywhere.

Thank you, GB community. I still love you guys.

Moderator