Why must we be so cynical and sarcastic?

I wouldn't say I'm cynical. They are showing me things and wanting me to be impressed and what they are showing me is unimpressive.

Microsoft doesn't give a shit about new IP and barely gives a shit about video games in general.

Sony apparently is already admitting the Vita's defeat as they gave the Move and the eyetoy more time than they did the Vita.

Nintendo was trumped by two other systems doing most of what they are doing with cheaper, existing tech and they also hate new IP.

I came in wanting Sony to wow me with Vita announcements. I wanted Microsoft to get me excited with surprises or new games. I wanted Nintendo to make me care about the WiiU and want to buy it. Sony at least gave me new interesting IPs to look forward to.

Most of the complaints seem to stem from sequels, or to be more accurate sequels to sequels

A large amount of games shown fall under a list of "what number is this one" games.

@Jimbo said:

@Christoffer said:

The reason why anyone is cynical and sarcastic is because they're mortally scared of sounding stupid. Anyone who approaches anything with automatic dismissal or salty humor would, at worst, be called snobs, but never stupid.

That's very cynical of you. And stupid.

Yes, I read all your fine arguments of me being stupid and you're probably right.

In fact, I'm just kidding. Although I know some people shield themselves behind sarcasm quite frequently. I used to do it a lot when I was younger.

It's a culmination of things really. We're at the end of a console generation, so the Microsoft and Sony are trying to squeeze the last bit of money they can out of the 360 and PS3. Nintendo's success with the Wii has caused the industry to focus on the casual market which doesn't even care about E3. There are barely any new IPs coming out because developers are dropping like flies, so the only thing being published either has a broad appeal or a huge budget behind it or both.

I'd like to say that I'm certain next year will have everything we're looking for, but after seeing Nintendo's stock actually rise after their conference, that tells me that they'll get away with dumping the enthusiasts and going with the casuals. Just like they did this generation. It's hard to not be jaded and cynical when you've been around long enough to see that all signs point to utter doom(That's a bit extreme, but you get my point).

Y'all can speak for yourself. I was pretty excited for Halo 4 and Black Ops 2. I dont need everything to be new each time. If Halo 4 is fun regardless of how "New" it is then who cares?

• Sequelitis
• Brown and bloom
• Preorder DLC
• Retailer exclusive DLC
• "Premium" subscriptions
• "AAA" games
• Many disparate genres (survival horror, stealth, tactical shooters, fuck...even strategy games) getting melted down into the same putrid puddle of linear, overly scripted shooters.
• Every genre getting dumbed down in an attempt appeal to people who only have a passing interest in games and ultimately don't care.

Enthusiast gamers are cynical becauseby and largedevelopers and publishers give them every reason to be.

@Christoffer said:

The reason why anyone is cynical and sarcastic is because they're mortally scared of sounding stupid. Anyone who approaches anything with automatic dismissal or salty humor would, at worst, be called snobs, but never stupid.

This seems insightful to me. Thanks. You can "never" be mislead as long as you trust nothing.

@Arker101 said:

It's a culmination of things really. We're at the end of a console generation, so the Microsoft and Sony are trying to squeeze the last bit of money they can out of the 360 and PS3.

I think it would almost be more apt to say they're attempting to squeeze a satisfying amount of money out of these systems before moving on. Seven years in and the Xbox 360 has still only sold HALF the number of units that the Playstation 2 did at the same point in it's life cycle (60 odd million vs 118 odd million). Sony isn't that far behind Microsoft at this point and they have to be looking at those numbers with a worried look on their faces. It's almost indicative of a market in decline.

Edit: God damn typo's.

If you think its negative hear go to /v/, its nothing but people bitching about "GAMEZ ARE DIEING" over and over again and constant negativity.

Majority of us are in the 18-34 demographic.

@Brunchies said:

If you think its negative hear go to /v/, its nothing but people bitching about "GAMEZ ARE DIEING" over and over again and constant negativity.

/v/ isn't that bad. It's pretty funny.

On topic, people are cynical and sarcastic because they're sick of the sameyness of every game, or, those are my reasons at least.

In other years I would be exited for so many games that I would moan that my wallet wouldn´t be able to handle it , but that was good this year is only 4 games , yes Halo 4 (I like the series) , but also Last of Us , Watch Dogs and ..... I guess that it :/ also seeing that they catter E3 to the fuckin people that dont give a damned about E3 is what pisses me the most

You have to understand that the internet is like pure concentrated opinion. So feelings and opinions will be hyperbole quite a bit. But there is an underlining truth that this e3 really did not bring the heat minus a few great showings here and there. Call it an end of a gen cycle or the dangers in releasing new IPs over proven successful genres and franchises. But the lack there of is showing big time this e3.

This may be a super generalized way of looking at the question . .but I think that the reason so many people are so sarcastic and cynical is much simpler than just your opinion...it mostly just feels better to shit all over everything than it is to see sunshine and rainbows in everything. I personally don't understand how someone can see how Watch Dogs looks like it sucks . .but I have seen a lot of negativity (definitely a minority) about it and I think its just because a lot of people like to be negative about stuff no matter how positive something is.

Shooter, sequel, tired franchise, quick time event fest, annoying banter, bullshit dancing game, old up-resed GameCube games at the Nintendo booth, and bored gaming press. Follow us on Facebook and Twitter to hear more!!

There, I summed up E3.

@Korwin said:

@Arker101 said:

It's a culmination of things really. We're at the end of a console generation, so the Microsoft and Sony are trying to squeeze the last bit of money they can out of the 360 and PS3.

I think it would almost be more apt to say they're attempting to squeeze a satisfying amount of money out of these systems before moving on. Seven years in and the Xbox 360 has still only sold HALF the number of units that the Playstation 2 did at the same point in it's life cycle (60 odd million vs 118 off million). Sony isn't that far behind Microsoft at this point and they have to be looking at those numbers with a worried look on their faces. It's almost indicative of a market in decline.

I think the poor economy and the rise of social/casual/mobile gaming are large contributors to this phenomenon. In order to chase the rest of those millions of dollars MSFT and Sony are gunning for those same crowds. That's why I think we had Smart Glass and Sony Mobile at E3 this year, along with the larger focus on "entertainment" and less on core games.

Because we've seen the high points in games?

Medal of Honor doesn't quite seem as great after beating, say, Ghost Trick.

Cuz people are bitches and think they deserve that every game pitched at them reinvents the wheel which is god damn impossible...

Honestly, if you can't poke fun at your hobby, you're a jackass. Embrace the sarcasm

Because people think their opinions actually matter, so they voice their disdain at anything they don't like when in reality if they really should not comment at all if they don't like it and allow those who are excited to be happy. But as usual, people have inflated views of themselves and the views they hold when in reality no one cares.
 
That and people keep buying crappy sequels and then getting angry when companies keep making said sequels because they see that these sequels sell consistently and would rather just make another sequel than an original IP because it is less risky. 

I'm not against people being opinionated about their hobby, but I share the sentiments of those who don't understand others (like those who have posted in this thread) who only express themselves in extremes. It's immature, and most of the time probably isn't even indicative of their true opinion. When everything is only either "totally shit and lame" or "incredibly amazing put it in my body" then they probably aren't very centered people.

@ManlyBeast said:

If you're impressed with ms and Nintendo press conferences then you have no standards. I don't want halo 324342342342. See the company's love people like you cause they know you'll eat whatever they shit out. It's about being an individual and having your own standards.

Shouldn't that be Halo 343.

On topic a lot of gaming people on the internet (e.g people on these forums) are sick of sequels and iteration and rightly so to a degree. Sure Halo 4 and whatever looked cool but they aren't really doing anything new on the other hand I'm genuinely excited for AC3 because it looks like it does something different to the previous games. Also you have to remember that these people are the loudest people on the internet, you will hear their opinions wherever you go, just keep in mind that for every person making threads like 'GAMING IS DEAD E3 WAS SHIT ' there are 10 people who are much more positive and reserved about the whole thing.

@Arker101 said:

@Korwin said:

@Arker101 said:

It's a culmination of things really. We're at the end of a console generation, so the Microsoft and Sony are trying to squeeze the last bit of money they can out of the 360 and PS3.

I think it would almost be more apt to say they're attempting to squeeze a satisfying amount of money out of these systems before moving on. Seven years in and the Xbox 360 has still only sold HALF the number of units that the Playstation 2 did at the same point in it's life cycle (60 odd million vs 118 off million). Sony isn't that far behind Microsoft at this point and they have to be looking at those numbers with a worried look on their faces. It's almost indicative of a market in decline.

I think the poor economy and the rise of social/casual/mobile gaming are large contributors to this phenomenon. In order to chase the rest of those millions of dollars MSFT and Sony are gunning for those same crowds. That's why I think we had Smart Glass and Sony Mobile at E3 this year, along with the larger focus on "entertainment" and less on core games.

You could also argue that the PS2, GameCube and Xbox generation had less overall sales if you combine everything. Games are growing not dying, in spite of the failing world economy...

To the original post: People who follow games passionately are probably on a site like Giant Bomb and will have stronger opinions than someone like your brother, who by your admission, "doesn't follow video games". There's plenty of complainers, like the dicks who think "HALO SHOULD DIE!!!" when they don't even play it... if it makes someone happy who cares? But if you're a fan of a series like the Elder Scrolls, I think you can voice your frustration that the MMO looks like it's going to suck...

Most gamers aren't that negative, the vocal whiners are though.

Because people failed to realize that if games weren't just stuff we had already seen before we would only have around 10 different games in existence.  
Then they bitch and moan like they've been doing it all through their teenage years. Most of them are usually still in the middle of those years. 

Because there needs to be innovation in games these days way to many COD clones man EA press conference was a perfect example of generic shit with shiny graphics it's to bad about Dead Space 3 single player will probably suffer from co op.And that MOH game looked like the same old shit they should just remake medal of honor allied assault that game had great MP I'm so tired of perks and upgrades fuck em.

@spartanlolz92 said:

whoever thinks there shitting out halo games is deluding themselves the game engine look gorgeous. when was the last time call duty even looked remotely better. plus a new enemy and new guns and new mp.

id say that right there isn't the same old game. Mario does the same thing every generation yet you usually don't hear people b******** about that.

Because Galaxy and New Super Mario brothers Wii were the exact same thing. And because getting a Mario game every couple years equals getting over a hundred FPS/TPS in the same time frame.

Hell, I like Ratchet and Clank, and those games are always the same. But if every game that came out was Ratchet and Clank with a different skin and a couple new guns I'd get mighty sick of the formula.

The internet is filled with introverts who see the internet as their outlet where they can rage. Normal people don't get online and cry about video games.

@Ben_H said:

Because people think their opinions actually matter, so they voice their disdain at anything they don't like when in reality if they really should not comment at all if they don't like it and allow those who are excited to be happy. But as usual, people have inflated views of themselves and the views they hold when in reality no one cares. That and people keep buying crappy sequels and then getting angry when companies keep making said sequels because they see that these sequels sell consistently and would rather just make another sequel than an original IP because it is less risky.

Ithink this is kind of wrong to be honest. I voice my opinion not because I think my opinion matters, but for a far more basic reason: I can. I write my thoughts on the latest trailer on Giant Bomb & hundreds will see it. Whether they care or not isn't really massively important in the equation: message boards across the web would have many magnitudes less of posts if people only wrote what they thought mattered & other people would genuinely care about. But that said, think how terribly dull the internet would be to read if people only every spoke to people who held the same opinions as themselves. While there's a difference between whining & bitching and actually having a proper grown-up discussion on why you don't like something, if I have to take the former to get the latter then that's preferable to only reading positivity.

On the latter point about people buying sequels & then moaning about sequels & then buying more of the same franchise is certainly accurate. Had this discussion with a friend who was moaning about EA being terrible. Citing Battlefield 3. Which he bought of course, because he apparently had no choice? Because his other friends bought it & so he has to get it to play it too. I do not understand that attitude, maybe because I'm almost exclusively a single player gamer with only a couple of exceptions, but the the idea of buying a game just because everyone else has bought it is barmy to me: I won't spend money on anything that I dislike for any number of reasons because my money is the only power I have as a consumer.

There's no single reason. There are so many reasons stacked on top of each other, it's really hard to make a salient insight that can sum it up for everyone. Although Louis C.K's speech about how "everythings amazing and nobody is happy" always springs to mind when this topic comes up.

The internet is a place to vent your frustration. Well, actually it's not but that's what people mainly use it for haha

I would ignore the majority of stupidity said in most any chat room =P

Because E3 had some charm to it that I feel like is lost ever since everything gets leaked prior to the show. That and the show was almost entirely known commodities, which is disappointing for such a big trade show.

Well, 2 things.

1. This is the internet
2. And we're humans...kind of.

To expect reasoned discourse from a rapidly-moving chat window is ridiculous. Nobody has time to read long, well-considered statements, so those with reasonable opinions don't bother to write. Also, while it's difficult to compose a pithy and entertaining compliment, it's easy to produce hilarious criticisms, spout memes, type in ironic all-caps: so people are sarcastic and jokey, and go for quick, dumb laughs, because the medium sort of demands it.

Oh yeah, and E3 sucked. Call me a cynic, whiner, whatever - but it's become evident that big-budget gaming has some major creativity problems, and this worries me.

Its because they think theyre clever

@RadioFlyer said:

If you're paying any attention to E3 this year, it's hard not to notice the intense negativity surrounding almost everything at the show. While I'll readily admit, not everything I've seen has been an A+, I don't really get all the hatred people are showing. Last night, I was watching the Sony Press conference, and all anybody said in the chat was "boring" or "this looks fucking dumb". I have no problem with people not liking things, but I think if you take a step back you realize just how amazing these games are. I mean when I told my brother who doesn't really follow games that new Halo, Dance Central, and Forza games were coming out, he was super excited even though he played all the previous games in those series

So I guess my question is, why can't we approach games with the same enthusiasm? Why must a game always be on the cutting edge and incredibly unique to make us happy? We don't go into movies with those expectations. I saw The Avengers and thought it was awesome, even though it was just another super hero movie. E3 is full of awesome games this year, why can't we appreciate them?

There's not really a single answer. I have, however, noticed a few trends, both in gaming and in humanity at large.

Firstly, there seems to be a belief that the lack of creativity is somehow new in this generation. It's no secret that many people on gaming forums, in chat rooms, writing blogs, and especially in the media, are veteran gamers who've been at it for quite the while. As such, many seem to have developed a habit of looking at the past with rose-colored glasses. They ignore the fact that truly ground-breaking titles were just as rare back in the 80s and 90s as they are today, simply because nostalgia has blinded them into thinking that the "good old days" were a constant stream of new ideas as opposed to the constant stream of platformers, fighting games, and whatever trend-of-the-moment was around.

Second, we have an increasing trend toward overt sensationalism in the press. This isn't even close to being a gaming-only concern. Politics, sports, crime, you name it: sensationalism and extremism are increasingly the only thing news outlets have time for. Combine that with the popularity of talking heads who have nothing to offer but cynicism and prejudice, and you have a global media atmosphere that is hostile to informed, complex, moderate thought.

The internet is a large part of the issue as well. While initially, the internet was viewed as a place of infinite knowledge, that enthusiasm has been tempered by the increasingly frequent use of the internet as an echo chamber, a way to shelter oneself from opposing viewpoints by only viewing those outlets whose views match your own. What little we get from opposing views is metered by the snark and cynicism of the presenter, who is less trying to tell the reader, and more trying to enforce reader bias.

Then we have a strange, interesting quirk of human nature: As a whole, we seem to be bothered by the very existence of things we don't approve of, regardless of whether there is any harm or indeed any effect on us at all. Be it Call of Duty, gays, racial minorities, or the mere fact that there are adult males watching My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic, people on the outside tend to be bent out of shape about things that they don't like, even if said things affect them not at fucking all.

Lastly, and in relation, we as a species tend to latch onto things we like with an unnatural fervor. As many have said, people seem to have issues just saying something is OK. It's either amazing or complete and utter shit. The inability to see shades of grey is compounded in gaming by the inability to enjoy something that is merely fun and entertaining as opposed to world-shattering.

Lots of boring conferences. Microsoft's was so long winded about things like fucking the history of Nike. Nintendo's was even more boring, despite focusing... on games? Or the two that were announced. But some good games were shown, like Halo and Gears and Ubisoft had some good stuff.

That's why I don't pay attention to E3. I usually end up finding out about games that interest me on my own time, only hearing an echo of what the best and worst of E3 was. Most of what I'm going to see is negativity and I don't need that. Also this guy.

@YukoAsho said:

@RadioFlyer said:

If you're paying any attention to E3 this year, it's hard not to notice the intense negativity surrounding almost everything at the show. While I'll readily admit, not everything I've seen has been an A+, I don't really get all the hatred people are showing. Last night, I was watching the Sony Press conference, and all anybody said in the chat was "boring" or "this looks fucking dumb". I have no problem with people not liking things, but I think if you take a step back you realize just how amazing these games are. I mean when I told my brother who doesn't really follow games that new Halo, Dance Central, and Forza games were coming out, he was super excited even though he played all the previous games in those series

So I guess my question is, why can't we approach games with the same enthusiasm? Why must a game always be on the cutting edge and incredibly unique to make us happy? We don't go into movies with those expectations. I saw The Avengers and thought it was awesome, even though it was just another super hero movie. E3 is full of awesome games this year, why can't we appreciate them?

There's not really a single answer. I have, however, noticed a few trends, both in gaming and in humanity at large.

Firstly, there seems to be a belief that the lack of creativity is somehow new in this generation. It's no secret that many people on gaming forums, in chat rooms, writing blogs, and especially in the media, are veteran gamers who've been at it for quite the while. As such, many seem to have developed a habit of looking at the past with rose-colored glasses. They ignore the fact that truly ground-breaking titles were just as rare back in the 80s and 90s as they are today, simply because nostalgia has blinded them into thinking that the "good old days" were a constant stream of new ideas as opposed to the constant stream of platformers, fighting games, and whatever trend-of-the-moment was around.

Second, we have an increasing trend toward overt sensationalism in the press. This isn't even close to being a gaming-only concern. Politics, sports, crime, you name it: sensationalism and extremism are increasingly the only thing news outlets have time for. Combine that with the popularity of talking heads who have nothing to offer but cynicism and prejudice, and you have a global media atmosphere that is hostile to informed, complex, moderate thought.

The internet is a large part of the issue as well. While initially, the internet was viewed as a place of infinite knowledge, that enthusiasm has been tempered by the increasingly frequent use of the internet as an echo chamber, a way to shelter oneself from opposing viewpoints by only viewing those outlets whose views match your own. What little we get from opposing views is metered by the snark and cynicism of the presenter, who is less trying to tell the reader, and more trying to enforce reader bias.

Then we have a strange, interesting quirk of human nature: As a whole, we seem to be bothered by the very existence of things we don't approve of, regardless of whether there is any harm or indeed any effect on us at all. Be it Call of Duty, gays, racial minorities, or the mere fact that there are adult males watching My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic, people on the outside tend to be bent out of shape about things that they don't like, even if said things affect them not at fucking all.

Lastly, and in relation, we as a species tend to latch onto things we like with an unnatural fervor. As many have said, people seem to have issues just saying something is OK. It's either amazing or complete and utter shit. The inability to see shades of grey is compounded in gaming by the inability to enjoy something that is merely fun and entertaining as opposed to world-shattering.

@RadioFlyer said:

@pornstorestiffi said:

@Jimbo said:

Don't slap a fucking happy meal down on the table and expect me to send compliments to the chef. Games that looked good got praised, games that looked shitty or bland (which was most of them) got judged accordingly. I feel sorry for you if you need to be unquestionably enthusiastic about everything put in front of you in order to enjoy your hobby. Have higher standards and you might find that you end up enjoying it more. It's better to be in the critical, vocal minority than in the majority that just doesn't care and will accept whatever they're given. We're consumers and customers, not cheerleaders for the industry. I ain't gonna pretend that 8 Uncharted games is an appealing proposition just so that you can feel good about buying 8 Uncharted games next year.

That sums up how i feel. It may sound harsh but its the truth. When people put a bowl of shit in front you and expect to gobble it up at least have the decency to tell those people to fuck off, and do better next time.

Why must everything be so extreme? Why is everything shit to you guys? If Uncharted 3 (not 8......again with the extremes) is shit, then what is good? What does a game have to do in order to impress you?

Uncharted 3 wasn't shit, i never said that anywhere. But it's a game i played once, cause it didn't amaze me the way the first to did, why? because nothing changed in the formula. But a game has to renew it self, or at least throw some new ideas in there, to make it worth my while. I have played video games since the late 80's and i have played so many damn games, my taste in games has changed, and my standards have gone up.

I do not need to waste my money or play games that have been done to death and bring nothing new to the table. And certainly i do not need to play sequels that doesn't set them selves apart from their previous installments.

While I understand people's cynicism, I think the majority had unrealistic expectations for this year's E3, despite nearly every message prior cautioning us not to get our hopes up for anything ground breaking.

The thing we should keep in mind is that we are starting to come up on the end of this console cycle, and, from a business standpoint, that is not a good time to introduce a new, unproven, IP.

As the creator of video games, I can attest to my disappointment with this year's E3.

I think the games being shown are looking pretty good, and I'm excited for them, but the press conferences were boring.

Because pretty much everything about E3 this year has been shit.

@AhmadMetallic said:

Personally I'm cynical when a developer throws flashy shit in my face to cover the rehashed, recycled gameplay that consists of scripted events and restricted player freedom. Psuedo-freedom.
Like Far Cry 3. And Crysis 3. And Mass Effect 3. And Future Soldier.

When a game actually breaks ground and gives me a satisfying experience where I, THE PLAYER, take control and create the magic, not WATCH the magic happen, then we're getting somewhere.
Like (seemingly) Watch Dogs. And Assassin's Creed 3. And (seemingly) Hitman: Blood Money. And Max Payne 3. And Human Revolution. and Planetside 2.


You're allowing games to get away with 2002 gameplay by focusing on how they look (graphically and coolness-wise) and focusing on the lore and story. Scripted games, graphics-based games, rehashed multiplayer games, monologue-based games, I'll always make fun of those.

Wait, how do you have freedom in Max Payne 3? It's one of the most linear games I've played in recent memory...also the amount of long and unskippable cut scenes in that game makes your use of "WATCH the magic happen" humorous. =P

It's not as if freedom of choice is the only way to go. What is wrong with a linear game? I loved Max Payne, and part of that was because it had a solid structure. If you allow the player too much free will you can't control the flow and the experience will usually be much more shallow because of it.

@TheDudeOfGaming said:

Well, 2 things.

1. This is the internet
2. And we're humans...kind of.

@Anwar said:

Two threads about this, what? Isn't one enough? How about locking this instead of negative discussion about an unreleased video game? @Sparklykiss

http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/general-discussion/30/so-much-negativity-going-on-in-the-e3-chats/549341/#204

Who the fuck are you, this is like the third thread I've seen you in saying it should be locked...are you afraid your internets will run out of space?

@pornstorestiffi said:

@Jimbo said:

Don't slap a fucking happy meal down on the table and expect me to send compliments to the chef. Games that looked good got praised, games that looked shitty or bland (which was most of them) got judged accordingly. I feel sorry for you if you need to be unquestionably enthusiastic about everything put in front of you in order to enjoy your hobby. Have higher standards and you might find that you end up enjoying it more. It's better to be in the critical, vocal minority than in the majority that just doesn't care and will accept whatever they're given. We're consumers and customers, not cheerleaders for the industry. I ain't gonna pretend that 8 Uncharted games is an appealing proposition just so that you can feel good about buying 8 Uncharted games next year.

That sums up how i feel. It may sound harsh but its the truth. When people put a bowl of shit in front you and expect to gobble it up at least have the decency to tell those people to fuck off, and do better next time.

Why must everything be so extreme? Why is everything shit to you guys? If Uncharted 3 (not 8......again with the extremes) is shit, then what is good? What does a game have to do in order to impress you?

@Anwar: If you're auditioning for a spot on the mod squad you're going to have to up the pedantry levels.

Not pedantic enough. That's what I'm saying.

I had to turn off the chat while watching live streams since most of GB's users just had to act like dicks the whole time. Sarcasm is dead and the Internet killed it!

• Rational person: "Oh my, this is certainly not for me. Ah well."
• Translated to Internet language: "This fucking SUCKS, the developers should burn in hell, and all console noobs buying this should be ridiculed for an eternity!!!"

@salad10203 said:

The internet is filled with introverts who see the internet as their outlet where they can rage. Normal people don't get online and cry about video games.

That's not true in the age of Twitter, Facebook and Justin.tv. Normal people do all the things which supposed introverts used to.