...it is a sad week for Nintendo.

And we are to blame.

Lighting returns sold way more then 3d World. And, well....yeah...:/

It was also the lowest selling 3D Mario in its first week. It did not move many extra systems. (think in japan it moved a extra 6,000).

One of the best (if not the best) platformers out right now, and it did worse then a 3rd (i think) FF 13. :/

In the first year of the Wii U, more games came out that i will remember. And play. Then the past gen first year.

And for the life of me...i cant remember the first year of the ps3 or 360.

And other game devs look at it this way, if Nintendo cant move systems with there own games, why bother.

Every single review i read with the good games of the Wii Us had the same comments in them.

"I'd love to play it! But i dont have a Wii U, and im not going to pick one up cause next year it wont matter!" Even if it has around 6 games that only it has that are truly awesome. And more to come. :/

...well maybe if enough of the people who left comments like that did pick it up, it would matter.

Nintendo is stuck in this cool to hate zone. They make great games, and do improve stuff (slowly...they know the internet is there at least..) in there own time. But no matter what they do, they wont get out of that zone. They wont fail to the point they will vanish we could hope...but who knows. They are not looking good right now. But the games still are.

GAME OVER

RETURN OF LIGHTNING

Lightning returns is out?

That's what happens when no third party is willing to support your console. Also, we are not to blame for this.

@kidavenger: In Japan, yes.

Doesn't WII U have the same specs as a XBOX 360 or PS3 though, if only a bit higher... I'm glad that system isn't selling, if it were to get popular than you would get "WII U" only devs in 1 or 2 years because it can't match up to current consoles or PCs, my 5 year old PC runs better than a WII U for god sake.

Any idea how A Link between Worlds is doing because I actually bought that. That might be my fav. game this year.

Yep.

Additionally, the old "Nintendo can sell systems on their own merits" mantra doesn't work when you confuse the shit out of the mainstream and don't make it clear that you're actually putting out a new console. Seriously, everything about the Wii U is convoluted as fuck, even for someone like me.

#

Isn't the statistics on how Japan still prefers 2d to 3d Mario games? I think I remember reading about how Japan almost always bought more 2d than 3d Mario games.

Anyways, not a surprise. Lightning Returns had a much larger install base than Mario, and without reading the numbers I'm sure (and I hope) Lightning Returns didn't sell very well either.

3DS is a success for them now, so there's that at least. Nintendo just got off to an absolutely awful start with the Wii U: The launch window was an absolute wasteland when it came to games, they created endless market confusion by calling it the Wii U and not marketing it the right way etc. It's hard to really do anything after such an awful start, especially when people know that the console won't have any real 3rd party support. I'm not sure if they can really do much to improve sales on the thing at this point, it just seems to be N64 ver. 2 right now.

And because of the lack of 3rd party support, the quality games are still few and far between for the Wii U next year. Sure, Nintendo still makes fantastic games, but that's not enough for most people. I'll buy a Wii U this month to play Wonderful 101, Mario and WW, but I don't think games like those are anough for most people.

This is what happens when you are so far behind actual tech and services. The Wii worked because the gimmick motion controller worked. This time it is nothing new just like a DS or 3DS or tablet. Also the name is confusing for the normal Wii customer. People still think that Wii and Wii U is the same.

At some point it does not matter anymore how good these games are.

@aterons At some points it is even behind the 360 and PS3 spec wise.

@amyggen Yeah Lightning Returns sold not even half what FFXIII-2 did. IT bombed as well. as for the 3DS it is still selling under Nintendo's expectations and forcast except in Japan.

@gonmog: I seem to remember the first year of PS3 pretty well. Resistance and Motorstorm were the big hits around launch, Folklore and Warhawk were cult hits and Uncharted came out a couple days before the first anniversary. Multiplatform wise CoD 4 and Assassin's Creed also hit in the first year. It was a good year.

On the topic of Lightning Returns I can only recommend looking up the ending. I don't care about FF (only played 24 hours of XIII and thought it was bad) but god damn that shit is hilarious and super nuts. It's so badumb.

With the exception of Bayonetta 2, SMTxFE (and probably a handful of future titles), I have no interest in the Wii U. Mario & friends and his first-party friends are cool and stuff, but they don't do anything for me anymore.

As things are right now, I'm patiently waiting for the wave of games in 2014 with my PS4, Vita, 3DS, PS3, and the ghost of my 360 in tow.

@darji: you really have it in for nintendo don't you

Nintendo want to build a fire and sing a couple of songs.

Nintendo games rank among the best in the industry but 5-6 per console generation isn't enough to warrant an early system purchase. Nintendo jumped the shark with the wii and burned a lot of their fanbase, they should have leaned into the mainstream instead of confusing everyone.

what does this even mean? These are the fact right now. There is nothing you can argue about the tech or financial reports from Nintendo. I totally acknowledge that Nintendo can make great games for people who are interested in these but that is basically it. Nintendo needs a new lead and a vision for the future.

We are not to blame for Nintendo releasing a system that can't come anywhere near competing with the power of the PS4 or XB1.

We are not to blame for Nintendo deciding to release two of their most anticipated games during a period when most people are going to be talking about/buying new hardware.

We are not to blame for Nintendo only having a handful of games coming to it's new console.

So you're telling me that a poorly advertised, half-step of a system didn't work out well for Nintendo. I guess it's time I retire this GIF from my hard drive.

Seriously, with an install base globally of ~3.5 million (as of November 2013) there is almost no way the Wii U is going to gain enough steam to get that much past the GameCube's final numbers. (~14-15 million units).

Oh shit, Lighting Returns is out?

Yeah, this is nobody's fault but Nintendo's ...is Bayonetta 2 out yet?

I cannot believe they blew the 1 year advantage of the WII U.

After the QL, I legitimately want to play this game, but at this point I've gotten so used to the idea that I won't own a Nintendo console that it is kind of outside my realm of considerations that I would buy a Wii U for any game that isn't.... I don't know. Mechwarrior 5? Summoner 3? Freedom Fighters 2?

@darji: every post i've seen from you re: nintendo has been nothing but doom and gloom; it's not hard to sense a bias. throwing in a little snipe at the damn popular 3ds was also a bit chuckle-worthy.

just like that people like you think it's all about the tech and not the games. all the blistering fast ddr5 in the world's not going to make up for interesting mechanics/art direction/story. sure nintendo may have to reevaluate themselves, but not in those areas mentioned, proof good games can be delivered pretty much regardless of the platform. where i think they stimbled was marketing and visibility. given the right spin it wouldn't be hard to make the tablet seem vital and intuitive to use.

all told i definitely wouldn't count the wii u out yet. it could have a similar turnaround ala the 3ds, and games are still coming. hell the monolith x thing looks fantastic alone, they just need to pimp the fuck out of it.

This shows once again the incredible power of marketing. From the start, the Wii U has been terribly marketed, with people in the mainstream not sure what it even is. I’ve always thought that it had a real smack of the Dreamcast about it, thank goodness Nintendo has its mountains of 3DS money coming in.

Why is it a problem for Nintendo if FF13-3 sells well? I never understand the impetus behind these threads where for whatever reason they feel like the whole thing is a "zero sum game" when it turns out very far from it.

Edit: To be clear, I'm objecting to the assumption in the OP. The problem with poor sales of Super Mario 3D World isn't FF13-3 Lightning Returns. It also isn't our fault. If there is a problem, it would be due to multiple factors too large to cover in a response to post.

Should have called it Wii 2.

I don't think it's fair to compare Mario 3d Wrold sales to those of Lightning Returns, seeing how Playstation 3 is waaay bigger in Japan than Wii U is.

Because "OMG gloom and doom" is how the internet works.

I wouldn't worry. First party Nintendo don't make most of their money in week one anyway. They have the longest of long tails. When/If the Wii-U picks up steam this game will sell loads more copies. Probably more than FF13-3 or whatever it's called.

Maybe Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy 13 is fucking awesome. Hey, it could happen, right?

Also while we're talking Nintendo's position in the market, let's not forget that they're dealing with a pretty big handicap; a weak domestic market that is turning to smartphones in droves. It's not such a big deal for Sony, who make profit on a bunch of other divisions such as music, TV, and movies, and Japanese companies are supported big time by international sales, especially at a time like now where the yen is weak (which was the main reason why Nintendo turned a profit in Q2 2013 in spite of a continuing drop in sales), but Nintendo has really been floundering in Japan in recent years, and smartphone sales rose 47 percent in Japan in Q2, which is a big threat to their 3DS sales, which dropped by 400,000 units compared to Q2 2012.

Things are certainly not all doom and gloom for Nintendo, but there are a lot of dangers. They shouldn't let arrogance and complacency lead them to neglect the all-important art of marketing and public visibility, and they shouldn't let profits derived from the weak yen hide the fact that sales are dropping.

I hope Wii U can match the GameCube install base at least. Smash Bros. and Mario Kart will help. Metroid, F-Zero, Bayonetta for the core, Zelda U. Another price drop next year -- $199 is where I believe the system should be, from a market perspective. Marketing needs to happen in a significant way, and it isn't, which boggles my mind. Shame that they dropped the ball on the a second launch with the price drop and Zelda/Mario. Nintendo is the only one who can save itself from this perception problem -- but I do think the Wii U is salvageable. Whether or not Nintendo will do it is another story.

The company seems stuck. Blinded by the success of the Wii into misjudging why the Wii was successful in the first place. Yes, motion controls, which have proven to be a fad, but also timing -- Wii launched in a different world at the right time. Wii U seems like it was designed for that reality, ignorant of everything that's changed in the years since -- the quickened upgrade treadmill, the expectation of media capability, the sense that third party developers should participate in hardware design, not be dictated to; a device that costs nearly as much as a tablet but is 1/25th as useful for most people.

Sony has given the industry a master class in changing corporate behaviour and core perception. Nintendo needs that level of turnaround. Maybe not for the Wii U -- maybe the success of the 3DS can float them past it -- but definitely for whatever comes next. Floundering in the console space now, they are in the best position to have a short gen and get on the next big thing -- VR -- before the others can afford to. Or forgo home consoles and stick with handhelds for a while. 3DS is hands down the system of the year for me.

Mario games have legs for years in Japan, and Super Mario 3D World is going to outsell Lightning Returns at least 6-8x in the coming weeks simply because Mario games just keep selling. This is hardly anything worth nothing.

they got my business this year, for what it matters to them. After enjoying the hell out of my 3DS I decided to buy a Wii U aswelll, its currently installing system update, even if I don't end up with any more games for either system, I feel they would have been worth my money...

Give it time? Super Mario 3D World will stay "in print" and on store shelves for years to come, and hopefully store clerks will recommend it over New Super Mario Bros. U (though no guarantee; when I bought a 3DS in Feb 2013, the Best Buy guy kept asking if I was sure I wanted Super Mario 3D Land instead of New Super Mario Bros 2.). On the other hand, 13-2 and 13-3 are probably gonna burn out pretty quickly in terms of sells, and 13-2 really didn't sell that well, in the grand scheme of things.

Also this:

Dude, really? I'm shocked.

.........aaaaAAAND SO WAS MARIOOOOOOOOOOOO hHUEHEAHAWAHAHAA

ᕦ(°ヮ °)ᕤ

I can believe it pretty easily. I feel like they really accelerated their plans to release it, once Wii sales really fell off sometime around 2009/2010.

I mean, hell, they showed it off at E3 2011 when they barely had anything to show, showed it off at E3 2012 with really not much else solid to show, then launched it in fall 2012 before any of their first party software was particularly close to ready. Nintendo Land is built off a bunch of tech demos they'd been tooling around with for a year or two, and New Super Mario Bros. games may as well be randomly generated by robots at this point. Those were clearly the two games Nintendo could throw together fast, and somehow Ubisoft produced ZombiU on presumably kinda short notice, and then that's about it for software.

This year, all we got was Game & Wario for like the entire first half of the year. Eventually, Pikmin 3, Rayman Legends (might as well be a Wii U exclusive since it's the best version), Wonderful 101, Wind Waker HD, Sonic Lost World, and Super Mario 3D World came out, but basically ALL of those were only ready by late summer/fall 2013. The first like 9 months of the Wii U has been WAY more dire than the first 9 months of the 3DS, for comparison.

Wait, did people actually believe that the Mario game was going to be the turnaround point for them?

Mario 3D World got me to buy a Wii-U. In the week I have had it, I have quite enjoyed my experiences with it.

The message about the 3DS comes from Nintendo themselves not from me. The 3DS ios selling well in Japan yes but again it is selling under Nintendo's expectations. That is also a reason why they introduced the 2DS.

As for the rest. No it is not all about tech but if a system can not even stand up to 10 year old machines and the services and their thinking like console bound accounts can not even slightest stand up to the standard services today than you really have a problem. Also the maybe worst problem Nintendo has is the Name. People who bought a Wii still do not know that it is a new system and that will never change anymore.

The Wii U is dead and there is absolute nothing Nintendo can do to save this. Look in 2014 the third party support will be almost zero as predicted from me since the announcement.3rd parties move to the PS4/XBox One and these consoles will outsell the Wii ltd in Summer 2014 or if not by Winter 2014 and that is not a fanboy comment but a very realistic prediction. For example the Install base of the Wii U right now is like 3.9 million if we are generous Sony sold 1 million in 24 hours ion the US and probably 1.5 million in Europe. depends on what they could ship. The Ps4 in Europe is sold out until February/March right now. The demand is crazy.

And as good X looks it will not sell systems. As sad as it is. Same for Bayonetta 2. It will not sell Systems. Maybe just maybe Mario Kart can do this but that is really Nintnedo's last hope here. Right now it really looks like under 20 million LTD and even that is very generous right now. At the moment I can not even see 10 million.

If you think that technical specifications and financial reports are directly proportional when it comes to Nintendo, then you are not only outdated (by about a decade now), but also impressively delusional.

Who cares what's inside the box? Look at the games. Like specs dictate the quality? Just bask at the legendary library the Wii has, with great exclusives coming from both 1st and 2nd party studios, and even 3rd party ones.

I don't know how anyone can seriously make the argument you're trying to make. Unless you're trolling.

Is this seriously a surprise? Everyone knew the WiiU would die a quick death after they release the specs and MS and Sony said their far more powerful consoles would be out a year later. Nintendo people seriously need to start living outside the bubble. You all should just start demanding they go multi platform instead. You can't support a console if the only games that sell for it are first party games.

3rd party support? Which? And Again I am not degrading the quality of Nintendo games. But this will not help their situation anymore. They have NEGATIVE Shipments in Europe. Negative!!! And it is great that you enjoy your Wii U and I will never say anything like that. But the Wii U has the possibility to wipe them of from the market right now. And what then? Going the Sega way? No!! Nintendo will not doing this with their current board of directors. They will rather sink it completely.

The only thing that could save Nintendo somehow is a drastic change in Leadership. That means Iwata gone, Miyamoto gone from the persepective of a Boardmember and all the other 70-80 year old Board members also need to go. Nintendo needs a new Leadership with a future vision. Right now Nintendo is living 10 years in the past and that is very very dangerous.

Again this is a completely unbiased view from me that has nothing to do with their games but rather with their market situation and financial standpoint. And to solve this they should or even need to go 3rd party or there won't be any Nintendo anymore in 5-10 years.

Darji, you are pretty much nothing but biased when it comes to Nintendo. You've been practically shining your shoes to start tap-dancing on the company's metaphorical grave.

Pointing to Japanese sales figures and doomsaying is pretty stupid. Dynasty Warriors games regularly outsell american made blockbusters over there. Japan is only indicative of Japan, its a much bigger market now. But then this is the same crowd who go "see the xbone sold a million worldwide day one and the PS4 sold a million in just one country they are neck and neck!"

Idiots do their thang see what they wanna

@darji: You don't need to be a mainstream hit to make a profit -- and that just may be how Nintendo's going to be from now on. Well, at least in the console field. They're going to continue rocking it in the handheld space, I'm sure.

Personally, I don't give a crap about this console war stuff. The WiiU's not technically impressive, sure, but it has games I want. So I'm gonna get one and have fun. Everyone else is free to be bitter over nothing, I guess?

I personally think Nintendo's main issue at the moment isn't that they've done a poor job distinguishing the Wii U from the Wii (though, they have) but rather that they've done a poor job distinguishing the Wii U from the 3DS. Outside of only a few titles, what do you need from the Wii U that you can't get on the 3DS? The graphical fidelity is such on the 3DS at this point that you're not really getting gimped, graphically unimpressive experiences anymore, and the games on the Wii U aren't sufficiently different that it would draw a mass market audience to the system who felt like they were missing something.

People say "Nintendo can't just rely on Nintendo fans to power their consoles, this shows it!" but I actually think that's wrong, there are plenty of Nintendo fans that could make a Nintendo home console a successful, profitable product; it's just that most of the franchises people want from Nintendo are leading on or have achieved parity on the 3DS. If you want Smash Bros. then you don't have to get the home console, you can get the same game on the 3DS. If you want Mario Kart, the 3DS has it, Monster Hunter, the 3DS has it, 3D Mario or side-scrolling mario, the 3DS has them both. If you want a new Zelda, the 3DS just got one; the Wii U probably won't get one for another couple years. This goes on and on.

Nintendo scrambled to defend the 3DS and practically forgot that if you want people to buy both of your consoles you have to make compelling and different offerings for each individual console. Sure, the Wii U name and hardware itself hasn't done it any favors, but if you're the person into Nintendo games, or the kind of person that just gets a Nintendo itch once or twice a year, the 3DS, outside of the most hardcore of hardcore, has you completely covered at a significantly lower cost of entry.

If I were a betting man, I would put money on Nintendo's next console being a merging of their portable and home console lines.

That's funny because I'm in the UK and they're still being advertised as guaranteed for Christmas...

I am not going to buy a console for "6 games and more to come". If I buy a console I expect it to have a regular stream of good games for years, and for me to be able to get the 3rd party games I also enjoy on it. Until the WiiU can provide that, I have no interest in buying one.

The quality of Nintendo games isn't killing the WiiU, it is the total lack of 3rd party support that is killing it.

No that is my current View on things. And to be fair I am not the only one. Right now Nintendo is treated almost as a joke in this industry. At least on the console side. The handheld is still going but the question is for how long. Will we even see another generation of handhelds? I highly doubt it. Sony will most likely go out of this business and Nintendo can just not compete with Apple and the rest of the mobile phone market.

If anything will change I will definitely change my view as well but right now it looks more as grim for Nintendo. If you like your Mario games sure by one but do not be surprised that the support will not be there anymore in lets say 2 years at most. Even for Nintendo if something drastically does not happen and change their current Situation. Right now they are getting outsold by the Vita...... A system that should be dead by now but strange found a bit of life back with the PS4 comparability for a short amount of time. You will not see many more Vita only announcements but if a PS4 version will be announced many of the will also support the the Vita.

Yeah right.. keep telling yourself that.

That system has something like two or three games now that are worth it.