america and freedom? all you have s this funny saying... if you wanna freedom go to europe! besides this event gets terrible hyped. but why care for non-american (very poor people are always non-american) "
wow are you kidding me? Are you some kind of retard troll? Are you being sarcastic? WTF is this?
A comment like this is the exact type of the ass-hole remark that the OP (And almost everyone else) doesn't want in this thread; thousands of people died, so show a little respect. If you can't, then GTFO.
" @Yelix: I excercised plenty of tact in what I said, I was respectful to the victims and I voiced an opinion based on historical fact, not fiction or hearsay. Go back to school before you reply to me again. "
You speak of various genocides without explaining what you're talking about. Rather than construct a meaningful argument with solid historical facts to back up your points, you have presented us with hyperbole and expect us to take you at your word.
As an American, I know that my country is not perfect and our history is not clear of wrongdoing. We've done some pretty shitty things in the past. That doesn't justify murdering 3,000 innocent civilians in an act of pure malice, though.
" My heart completely goes out to anyone who was killed or deeply affected by this tragic event. Not to America, but to them. "
I've always wondered why people think "Oh these people who died are cool, but the people who didn't and are barely related to american atrocities are dicks my heart can't go out to them."
" You know what's really sad? A few years ago, when I would ride the bus to school, I would ask much younger kids if they knew what 9-11 was; most of them had no idea. That just makes me sick. This was one of the country's greatest tragedies, and I believe the attackers will suffer for an eternity for causing so much harm (Yes, I believe in Heaven and Hell). What really makes me mad, though, is that these people who ruined our country are trying to build a mosque less than a quarter of a mile away. They may have their religious freedom, but if they really mean no harm, they should just move their mosque to another place in New York City. Even a lot of Muslim officials (who aren't radical) think they should just move the location. Also, look at the man in charge of this operation; he's a fucking psycho! "
Another confused and mislead person. The media has called it Ground Zero Mosque. In Reality the 'Mosque' is NOT A MOSQUE It is a Religious Centre. This means that it has prayer rooms where people from various cultures may pray like Muslims. It is also planned to feature basketball courts and other social activities.
All I have to say is that when I went to New York City last week, it still felt weird not seeing the Twin Towers dominating the skyline. We lost too many lives that day and it's a day that will be forever embedded in my mind.
A comment like this is the exact type of the ass-hole remark that the OP (And almost everyone else) doesn't want in this thread; thousands of people died, so show a little respect. If you can't, then GTFO. "
Yes, waah waah, 3000 people died. and then what? Like children in a sandbox you respond by killing 1.5 million of mostly civilans in Iraq and what not. You just care more because instead of seeing it vicariously on tv, it was close to you. I can show respect to those 3000 if everyone else here showed respect to the 1.5 million and growing amount of people who die over there.
It's always sad when people die. My heart goes out to the people who lost loved ones. Not to any specific country. And certainly not to a flag. I have always found patriotism incredibly dumb. They were people. That's all that matters to me.
I was ushered out of a House office building on the Hill (I was there for a press conference on Sudan) by Marines with machine guns just after the towers fell. For quite a few interns, it was their first day working for a Congressman in DC. I was actually in a cab in front of the Washington Memorial when the plane hit the Pentagon. I could see the smoke from across the Potomac. No one had any idea what the hell was going on. The radio was reporting that the White House was on fire. I looked over my shoulder in that direction and was like ... nope. Absolutely crazy morning.
For weeks afterward, I'd take the Metro into DC from Virginia. We'd go under the Pentagon on the Blue line, and you could smell the smoke and char from the building. For about a month, we had humvees on street corners. I'll never forget it.
I was in the 7th grade of middle school, nobody told us(except that there was a canceled day the next day). No adult told us until the Bus Driver pulled to the side of the road and gave us the news. I remember sitting in front of the TV for the rest of the day and watching the planes hit the Twin Towers over and over, along with the other planes.
If you ever get a chance to go to New York, make sure you head over to Ground Zero... it's really a magically sad place(not to mention how far away it seems to be from actually building that memorial that they wanted to build.)
" You know what's really sad? A few years ago, when I would ride the bus to school, I would ask much younger kids if they knew what 9-11 was; most of them had no idea. That just makes me sick. This was one of the country's greatest tragedies, and I believe the attackers will suffer for an eternity for causing so much harm (Yes, I believe in Heaven and Hell). What really makes me mad, though, is that these people who ruined our country are trying to build a mosque less than a quarter of a mile away. They may have their religious freedom, but if they really mean no harm, they should just move their mosque to another place in New York City. Even a lot of Muslim officials (who aren't radical) think they should just move the location. Also, look at the man in charge of this operation; he's a fucking psycho! "
1. There is an actual mosque even closer to the site,it predates the World Trade Center's construction. 2. The proposed building is not a mosque and is not visible from Ground Zero. 3.There are a number of strip clubs a similar distance from the site, clearly a community center is much worse. http://www.flickr.com/photos/shankbone/4916726165/
Those muslim officials want a quiet life, Muslims are being subjected to outrageous intimidation right now. Denying full property rights and religous freedom to people on the grounds that OTHER muslims did something you dislike is in fact "ruining" the country. It is easy to live up to ideals when they are not challenged, it is most important to live up to them when they are challenged.
A comment like this is the exact type of the ass-hole remark that the OP (And almost everyone else) doesn't want in this thread; thousands of people died, so show a little respect. If you can't, then GTFO. "
Yes, waah waah, 3000 people died. and then what? Like children in a sandbox you respond by killing 1.5 million of mostly civilans in Iraq and what not. You just care more because instead of seeing it vicariously on tv, it was close to you. I can show respect to those 3000 if everyone else here showed respect to the 1.5 million and growing amount of people who die over there. "
War sickens me, period. I understand the why of it, but the how and what... I've lost family and friends in war. I mourn them, but I also mourn the people they no doubt killed. I mourn the supposed need for them to travel across the world to fight. I mourn for everyone caught in the crossfire.
A comment like this is the exact type of the ass-hole remark that the OP (And almost everyone else) doesn't want in this thread; thousands of people died, so show a little respect. If you can't, then GTFO. "
Yes, waah waah, 3000 people died. and then what? Like children in a sandbox you respond by killing 1.5 million of mostly civilans in Iraq and what not. You just care more because instead of seeing it vicariously on tv, it was close to you. I can show respect to those 3000 if everyone else here showed respect to the 1.5 million and growing amount of people who die over there. "
Who precisely are you blaming? Americans in general? That's just taking the easy way out and ignoring specifics.
While I might not be an American, I still remember the day vividly. Was just messing around at the time in this pretty cheap MMORPG that essentially amounted to a glorified chatroom when a person announced that the U.S was under attack. Their persistence and urgency quickly made it known it wasn't a joke. So, I turned around and put on the little TV that was in that bedroom and was greeted by live footage of the North tower burning. The next two hours were spent was watching in horror as the events unfolded.
It's somewhat horrible that this attack affects me so much, while other attacks and natural disasters feel detached and a world away. It was the immediacy of it all, you know? Seeing it happen live on TV instead of hearing about it after the fact on the evening news. In a terrible way, I might be lucky, as I just couldn't give my empathy with every thing wrong in the world.
I know Europeans can sometimes seem insensitive and down right callous regarding the attacks, but honestly, I'm sorry. I mourn your losses. I honour your heroes.
As for where I was on the day: I was attending Marshall University in Huntington, WV at the time. I went to my first class at an ungodly hour, then I stumbled back to my dorm room and more or less passed out on my bed. I woke up hoping I didn't sleep past the start time of my next class. I had not, but that didn't matter when my roommate told me what was happening. He was glued to his TV, watching two familiar buildings burn. I told him I'd turn mine on (it was the bigger and nicer of the two) so we could both watch. I sat there transfixed for quite a while--long enough that I can't remember the exact time. I know I missed my second class. The rest were canceled. I came out of my stupor when my mom called. Her voice was shaken, but she wasn't crying--she was simply bewildered. A lot of us were, and still are.
" You know what's really sad? A few years ago, when I would ride the bus to school, I would ask much younger kids if they knew what 9-11 was; most of them had no idea. That just makes me sick. This was one of the country's greatest tragedies, and I believe the attackers will suffer for an eternity for causing so much harm (Yes, I believe in Heaven and Hell). What really makes me mad, though, is that these people who ruined our country are trying to build a mosque less than a quarter of a mile away. They may have their religious freedom, but if they really mean no harm, they should just move their mosque to another place in New York City. Even a lot of Muslim officials (who aren't radical) think they should just move the location. Also, look at the man in charge of this operation; he's a fucking psycho! "
1. There is an actual mosque even closer to the site,it predates the World Trade Center's construction. 2. The proposed building is not a mosque and is not visible from Ground Zero. 3.There are a number of strip clubs a similar distance from the site, clearly a community center is much worse. http://www.flickr.com/photos/shankbone/4916726165/ Those muslim officials want a quiet life, Muslims are being subjected to outrageous intimidation right now. Denying full property rights and religous freedom to people on the grounds that OTHER muslims did something you dislike is in fact "ruining" the country. It is easy to live up to ideals when they are not challenged, it is most important to live up to them when they are challenged. "
I forgot that it was a community center, and I also forgot about that actual mosque. Still, it's not wise to build this here. 70% of Americans are against it, and as I said before, several Muslim officials have said that they should put the building elsewhere. The difference between this and a strip club is that strippers haven't caused tragedies.
I understand what you're trying to say as far as Muslims taking a lot of heat, and honestly, I feel sorry for the majority of them. However, look at the guy in charge of this community center plan; he shows signs of psychosis and doesn't even give a fuck about what the Taliban did to us.
It was my third year of high school. I was having cereal for breakfast and my mom came DASHING into the living room to turn on the news (she'd heard about it on the radio), and I remember that so vividly because she's not the type to follow the news closely. I asked what was happening and all she said was "We've been attacked!" I didn't know if she'd meant our family, our town, our state, or what. When I found out it was in NY, it was a bit of a relief (selfish as that sounds), but then when it came out what was happening, relief was nowhere to be found. Still, stiff upper-lip and all that. I had/have a friend who's Persian and we were joking throughout the day just to relieve tension (and honestly I was a little concerned for his safety. Smalltown mentality and all that), and they essentially closed school that day. They still had sessions, but no one was really focussed and I'm pretty sure they just let people go home if they felt like it. The politics of how it's been handled since are another story for another thread, but it's nice to see that people can still treat each other like human beings on the internet (inevitable trolling aside).
I love all these people who say America only cares about themselves... Maybe our government made some wrong choices in the past and even the future but that does not mean that every American is selfish and cares only about #1. Most poeple by nature are selfish and care about #1, American or not, that is where the problem lies. A lot of them happen to get government jobs.
If you completely trust your government than you are just a damn fool anyway. Every government is made up of filthy greedy people, which is unfortunate.
There is a reason we even make fun of our country like "Team America World Police" but where would your country be without America? Under control of Natzi Germany? Who the hell knows...
If anything I think America should start taking focusing our own problems instead of trying to help everyone else out. When was the last time you saw Australia send aid to the homeless in America? HAH Or anyone in Europe? Please...
So if North Korea someday decides to attack Japan or Austrailia should America just say fuck em, let them fend for themselves? Lets see how that would turn out.
Also there is a reason so many people move here from other countries, we don't force them.
If something happened like 911 in any other country I would feel for the victims, their family, and their people. We should all take a moment and think about it no matter what country you are in and what beliefs you have.
@habster3: Frankly, I don't even understand what the big deal is. I don't live in New York and I've never been there. I have no issues with the construction of the community center. To me, this whole argument has been perpetuated by a media stirring up shit by riling up the lesser educated subset of Americans that for some reason still believe that all practitioners of Islam are homicidal maniacs bent on Jihad and ruling the world under sharia law.
I mean seriously. There's a disproportionate number of dumbasses out there that still think President Obama is a Muslim despite all evidence to the contrary. What the fuck is wrong with people?
Never forget. I still remember that day vividly. There are no good or bad countries. We are all guilty of war crimes, but 9/11 should have a special place in our minds and hearts.
I was getting ready for school when I heard of the first plane hitting the towers. I was in elementary school and thought it was more weird than anything.
" Never forget. I still remember that day vividly. There are no good or bad countries. We are all guilty of war crimes, but 9/11 should have a special place in our minds and hearts. "
there are only good and bad governments, this is not the place to discuss it. But a country can have a run of governments who behave badly and when you are the main player on the world stage the misbehaviour is amplified.
I can't say I remember it since I was around 4 to 5 but man its horrifying that people did that and so willingly. My heart and wishes will always go out to the dead and their families and anyone who disrespects that is someone I don't want to meet.
A select group of American's once again use the death of 3000 people to whine about people not sucking American cock. It's a shame that 9/11 has just turned into a patriotism rally rather than a time to mourn the loss of so many people.
I should have added, wasn't thinking, all of the countries in the world need eachother to survive... That wasn't the point I was trying to make though.
This is about morons that just like to say fuck your country on message boards. Not economics.
Most importantly it's about a tragic day that should be respected by all.
@Hailinel: Just look it up yourself. I'm not spending my time constructing a full explanation and a fully though out and well constructed argument for a nobody on the internet.
I pay my respects to the dead and mourn the social impact the event started and the troops that are posted abroad to this day. Although i just want to say I'm pretty sure the taliban didn't attack the US because you're "free". From what I see (even though most americans are going to call BS) america isn't free. It all depends on peoples definition of free, but there are ALOT of other countries I would consider more free than the US (and where I reside in the UK for that matter). But anyway, that's going slightly off topic. Most important is that peoples lives were lost and even more lives were destroyed. My heart goes out to all those people. EDIT: I forgot my 9/11 moment! I came home for lunch and my mother was in front of the TV and my mum just told me the US has just been attacked. Somehow I knew this was the start of an era as I knew with a military presence such as the US's, Shit was going to hit the fan for those responsible. The whole class day after that was a daze and no one could really concentrate.
" @Hailinel: Just look it up yourself. I'm not spending my time constructing a full explanation and a fully though out and well constructed argument for a nobody on the internet. "
@Hailinel: I don't believe all Islamics are homicidal, and I don't believe Obama is a Muslim. However, I do still have a problem with the center, mainly because the guy in charge acts like a radical whenever he's discussing the matter.
I think I'm going to drop the matter from this point, and I agree to disagree with whoever has a different opinion.
" @Hailinel: Just look it up yourself. I'm not spending my time constructing a full explanation and a fully though out and well constructed argument for a nobody on the internet. "
You're not exactly helping your argument by resorting to petty insults instead of constructing anything substantial.
@Hailinel: I don't believe all Islamics are homicidal, and I don't believe Obama is a Muslim. However, I do still have a problem with the center, mainly because the guy in charge acts like a radical whenever he's discussing the matter.
I think I'm going to drop the matter from this point, and I agree to disagree with whoever has a different opinion.
"
Can we at least agree that this whole "mosque debate" is incredibly stupid and focus on more important issues like the economy and the war in Afghanistan?
@Hailinel: Im not trying to help my argument, I don't give enough of a fuck about this forum. Just stop @replying to me and we can all be happy. If you must have the last word then go ahead.
@Hailinel: I don't believe all Islamics are homicidal, and I don't believe Obama is a Muslim. However, I do still have a problem with the center, mainly because the guy in charge acts like a radical whenever he's discussing the matter.
I think I'm going to drop the matter from this point, and I agree to disagree with whoever has a different opinion.
"
I never meant to insinuate that you did think that way. I apologize if you felt that I did.
" @Hailinel: Im not trying to help my argument, I don't give enough of a fuck about this forum. Just stop @replying to me and we can all be happy. If you must have the last word then go ahead. "
Those on the right wont watch it because its Keith Olbermann but this special comment on the controversy is.. well special on a par really with Jon Stewart's great speech delieverd when the Daily Show came back after the attacks. If someone can find Jon's speech they should put it up here as it is perfect.
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