#1 Posted by baconbits33 (1156 posts) -

So in school about a 4 weeks ago in my history class, my teacher hung the Confederate flag in our  class since we were studying the Civil War and also to incited a huge discussion in our class about it and what it meant to us and how we view it and we all got to voice our opinions and we spent the day learning about it's history and recent events surrounding the flag. And well last week our teacher had to take it down because 2 teachers were offended by it, however there were no such complaints coming from the students. Now when we were told the news about the flag our class was outraged by this and even all the African American students in our class argued that taking down that flag was completely wrong, and then several of the students (I am told) went to our sub-school and discussed with the sub-principals about putting the flag back up (once again I am told this but I doubt it....) 
 
So a week has passed by and the subject came back up today when a teacher hung a "Obama 08' Hope!" poster on her door and some kids came and said that if she could hang that up, then why can't our teacher actually hang up a flag that was only meant to actually teach students? 
 
So I'm asking GB users.... does the Confederate flag offend you? What does it mean to you?

#2 Posted by yeahno (269 posts) -

I live in the south so I see it alot. Most of the time it's fine unless it's 20 feet long and on the back of your truck. Also, it usually means southern pride (which I think is stupid), but I guess there can be some underlying symbols here or there. I never really know when though.

#3 Posted by turbomonkey138 (4950 posts) -

Alot of jerks from the UK wear it on their Leather jackets at college ....even though they are from Bradford . It offends my sense of fashion lol

#4 Posted by guiseppe (2841 posts) -

It makes me think of Pantera, and I like Pantera, so it's all good here. I should mention that I'm Swedish, so it doesn't really affect me in any way.

#5 Posted by MAN_FLANNEL (2462 posts) -

Anyone who is offended by it can personally kiss my ass. 

#6 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

The war's over, you can stop being offended over every little thing white guilt America.

#7 Posted by Snipzor (3317 posts) -

Comparing a campaign poster to a flag with very questionable values and history behind it is quite pointless. I hope you understand that.

#8 Posted by BiffMcBlumpkin (3720 posts) -

I know, right? Sometimes people are offended by my Swastika. I have no idea why those knuckleheads don't understand it has nothing to do with the Holocaust, it's just a general German pride thing.
#9 Posted by ahriman22 (2746 posts) -

No... Some people are way stuck up to actually be offended by such small things.

#10 Posted by ThatFrood (3375 posts) -

Some dumb things have just been said.

#11 Posted by Bombs_Away (1010 posts) -

I'm not bothered about it, it's only white middle class people who get offended cause they're complete knob jockeys. Mind you, the black guy in my basement didn't seem to keen when I asked him. Each man is his own I guess!

#12 Edited by ryanwho (12082 posts) -
@BiffMcBlumpkin said:

" I know, right? Sometimes people are offended by my Swastika. I have no idea why those knuckleheads don't understand it has nothing to do with the Holocaust, it's just a general German pride thing. "

Not even close to the same. And you want to say "but slavery", scept that's a vast oversimplification over the reasoning behind the war. The vast majority of southerners who faught didn't have slaves, most slave owners didn't fight, the emancipation proclamation only made slavery illegal in the south(who already rebelled, so its kind of like the US making a law for Maxico and expecting them to follow) and 3 states in the north continued to practice it. I could go on. Also its an important symbol in Hinduism and continues to be, if you go to that part of the world you'll see a huge number of people with a swastik necklace. But I guess they should pack it up, a fringe of radicals hijacked the symbol and changed the meaning and they don't want to offend you, right?
#13 Edited by baconbits33 (1156 posts) -
@Snipzor: Well I wasn't one of the kids who made a scene out of it. But yeah it actually has a point, the teacher wasn't a government teacher, and Obama wasn't in her curriculum, she was a Language Arts teacher and was only posting it up because of her political views (which is against school rules) however no one made a big deal out of it, but when a teacher puts up a flag in his room so he can create discussion and help make the environment more interesting to his students so they can learn and the flag doesn't represent any of his views whatsoever and is told to take it down.... then yeah there's something fucked up there.
#14 Posted by Disengage (429 posts) -

I once saw a guy with a Confederate flag patch on a Yankees hat. In Northern New York. Face, meet palm.

#15 Posted by iam3green (14390 posts) -

i'm not offended by a lot of things. so no i would not be offended by that.

#16 Posted by kratos (208 posts) -

I don't get offended so this is my point of view.
 
The fact that a teacher, someone molding young minds is actually spreading political views, which is fucking ridiculous, being aloud and another teacher using the flag of war for educational purposes is the most ludicrous thing I have ever heard.  I don't know where you come from but here teachers aren't aloud to spread there views on political and religious issues. (but they do)  This is all just dumb, and being handled wrong

#17 Posted by Video_Game_King (36272 posts) -

It's mainly offensive because of the strong association with the KKK. So yes, when taken outside proper historical context.

#18 Posted by r0k1ll (380 posts) -

Well, only in South Carolina i find it not offensive, since they pretty much are still confederate. 
 
And seriously, yes, I do find it offensive, but there is nothing you can do about since we have freedom of speech.

#19 Posted by MiamiRedHawks (914 posts) -

It personally doesn't offend me, but I can see why it upsets some people. This is why I would never wear or hang one.

#20 Posted by Rayfield (2097 posts) -

As an Australian, I have no frame of reference for the Confederate flag except for Dukes Of Hazzard. So my personal answer is no.
#21 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -
@Video_Game_King said:
" It's mainly offensive because of the strong association with the KKK. So yes, when taken outside proper historical context. "
KKK also has crosses all over their uniform. Do crosses offend you? They also have a triforce on there for some goofy reason. Do triforces offend you? You shouldn't allow the worst kinds of people to take control over a symbol. 
 
 
 
 
No really, triforces. Let me save you the google search. 

#22 Posted by BiffMcBlumpkin (3720 posts) -
@ryanwho said:
"@BiffMcBlumpkin said:

" I know, right? Sometimes people are offended by my Swastika. I have no idea why those knuckleheads don't understand it has nothing to do with the Holocaust, it's just a general German pride thing. "

Not even close to the same. And you want to say "but slavery", scept that's a vast oversimplification over the reasoning behind the war. The vast majority of southerners who faught didn't have slaves, most slave owners didn't fight, the emancipation proclamation only made slavery illegal in the south(who already rebelled, so its kind of like the US making a law for Maxico and expecting them to follow) and 3 states in the north continued to practice it. I could go on. Also its an important symbol in Hinduism and continues to be, if you go to that part of the world you'll see a huge number of people with a swastik necklace. But I guess they should pack it up, a fringe of radicals hijacked the symbol and changed the meaning and they don't want to offend you, right? "

Preaching to the choir bro! I know you want to say "But Jews" but anti-semitism is a vast oversimplification for WWII. The vast majority of Germans who fought had no participation whatsoever in killing Jews, at the same time we continued to practice legal segregation, and while we stormed into "liberate" we had vast camps of citizens interned behind barbed wire. It's a pride thing, a battle flag.
#23 Posted by baconbits33 (1156 posts) -
@kratos: You do realize in the sense you are talking then that every flag in the world is a flag of war?  
 
@Video_Game_King: But that's the thing, anyone who took it out of context was allowed to voice their opinion and then hear what the true reason for it being up was, and we hand only one kid in our class that was confused when she saw it but when we all discussed it she thought that it being there as a source for discussion and a reference to history was a really good thing.
#24 Posted by mordukai (7150 posts) -
@ryanwho said:
" The war's over, you can stop being offended over every little thing white guilt America. "
So if we go by your logic then it's ok to hang the nazi flag when you learn about WWII. 
#25 Posted by EvilTwin (3324 posts) -
@ryanwho said:
"But I guess they should pack it up, a fringe of radicals hijacked the symbol and changed the meaning and they don't want to offend you, right?"
We've all heard this countless times, but if you see a black swastika, in a white circle with a red background, you know what it means.  I should think the difference between a neo-Nazi and a Hindu is pretty obvious.
#26 Posted by Milkman (16802 posts) -

I'm not offended but I think people who hang it are dumbasses.

#27 Edited by ryanwho (12082 posts) -
@Mordukai said:

" @ryanwho said:

" The war's over, you can stop being offended over every little thing white guilt America. "
So if we go by your logic then it's ok to hang the nazi flag when you learn about WWII.  "
Its okay to wear a swastica if you're Buddhist or Hindi or Lainist or Native American and the symbol meant something to your people literally thousands of years before anything resembling the Nazi party existed, yes. The Nazi party is dead and those religions and groups are still alive, its their symbol now and they shouldn't get grief from people like you because you didn't have a clue about a symbol's history.
#28 Posted by BiffMcBlumpkin (3720 posts) -
@ryanwho said:
" @Video_Game_King said:
" It's mainly offensive because of the strong association with the KKK. So yes, when taken outside proper historical context. "
KKK also has crosses all over their uniform. Do crosses offend you? They also have a triforce on there for some goofy reason. Do triforces offend you? You shouldn't allow the worst kinds of people to take control over a symbol. 
 
 
 
 
No really, triforces. Let me save you the google search. 

 
"

I'm still not convinced this isn't a photoshopped image of Link.
#29 Posted by Video_Game_King (36272 posts) -
@baconbits33: 
 
Not in your teacher's case; that wasn't offensive, since it was a simple lesson on the flag itself.
 
@ryanwho:
 
But aren't the Confederacy and the Klan very strongly connected? Like "it's the whole reason they started that organization" kind of thing? The other symbols, while strong parts of their group, aren't exactly central parts. Show me a hate group based on the Triforce, and I will kick them in the balls for giving Jack Thompson and Michael Atkinson reasons to be such goddamn dangerous idiots!
#30 Posted by artofwar420 (6290 posts) -

I don't like slavery.

#31 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

Its really weirding me out now when I think about it. Why is it you only find this kind of stuff in Nintendo games? Mario's a communist and Link's a klansman. Miyamoto's a fucked up dude.

#32 Posted by BiffMcBlumpkin (3720 posts) -
@Video_Game_King said:
Show me a hate group based on the Triforce! "
Need I remind you of a certain 8.8?
#33 Posted by kidman (469 posts) -

I like Stuck Mojo so not offended at all. Besides, i'm for Poland so who cares?

#34 Posted by Everyones_A_Critic (6299 posts) -

I really just don't care for "southern folk" and their way of life. It doesn't offend me but it just gives me the impression that whoever is displaying it is probably not my kind of person.

#35 Posted by Phished0ne (2508 posts) -
I do not get offended when i see a Confederate Flag,  its just something i note when i am evaluating if i ever want to associate with said person again.
#36 Posted by MrKlorox (11209 posts) -

I'm more offended by crosses than the confederate flag. It doesn't represent racism, it represents not taking shit from your federal government. I try to ignore the hypocrisy.

#37 Posted by ErgoProxy77 (550 posts) -
@baconbits33: By Confederate Flag, you mean the Stars and Bars right?  If that is the case, then that is not the actual flag of the confederacy.  It was actually the battle flag of the confederates.  It represents violence and racism.  Everyone should be offended by it.
#38 Posted by BiffMcBlumpkin (3720 posts) -
@kidman said:
"I like Stuck Mojo so not offended at all. Besides, i'm for Poland so who cares? "
You need two more of your friends to straighten this post out. One to hold the R in your "for" and one to put the O and the M in the right place.
#39 Posted by ryanwho (12082 posts) -
@Video_Game_King said:
" @baconbits33: 
 
Not in your teacher's case; that wasn't offensive, since it was a simple lesson on the flag itself.
 
@ryanwho:  But aren't the Confederacy and the Klan very strongly connected? Like "it's the whole reason they started that organization" kind of thing? The other symbols, while strong parts of their group, aren't exactly central parts. Show me a hate group based on the Triforce, and I will kick them in the balls for giving Jack Thompson and Michael Atkinson reasons to be such goddamn dangerous idiots! "
I don't know the history of the triforce symbol. For all I know, it was literally invented by the Klan, which would make its uses later even more perplexing. 
I'll grant you this. Here's what the actual Confederate national flag looks like. 

The flag you commonly see is the Confederate war flag. Sort of like the Union Jack, I guess. So if its "just about history", why would they hang the war flag instead of the national flag? Well for one they have no idea there's a national flag, and/or they stand by the sentiment of the time even now. I live in Virginia, and my cousin's truck is covered in Confederate flags, and he's a pretty hardcore racist against blacks (but likes Mexicans, an odd thing that's actually really common for some reason). "Still at war" definitely describes him to an extent. Those people exist for sure. But I wouldn't assume everyone who does that feels that strongly.
#40 Edited by mordukai (7150 posts) -
@ryanwho: I do know about the symbol's history and I saw it all around India when I went there but I think my grandma would have had a problem if I came back with a garment bearing that symbol. WHat I was talking about is that going by your logic it will be ok for people to parade this around: 
 

So you want to tell me that if you see someone parading this flag around you would feel nothing? 
#41 Posted by roc_553 (209 posts) -

I was on a trip once to southern Illinois, and I once saw a house here with a confederate flag on display. 
In Illinois. 
The Land of Lincoln. 
 
 
The worst part was that in the center it had a picture of Hank Williams Jr.'s face. 
Honestly. 
You cannot make this shit up.

#42 Posted by baconbits33 (1156 posts) -
@ErgoProxy77: No not the Stars and Bars, the stars and bars looks a lot like the early American flag just with 7 stars in a blue field and 3 bars: 2 red, 1 white. It was the first Confederate flag made however they changed it to the flag that we know now today as the "Confederate Flag".
#43 Posted by Bombs_Away (1010 posts) -
@Mordukai said:
" @ryanwho: I do know about the symbol's history and I saw it all around India when I went there but I think my grandma would have had a problem if I came back with a garment bearing that symbol. WHat I was talking about is that going by your logic it will be ok for people to parade this around: 
 

So you want to tell me that if you see someone parading this flag around you feel nothing?  "
It makes me chuckle...Inglourious Bastards, great movie. I'm glad those Jews killed Hitler, he coulda been a bad man. Just a thought.
#44 Posted by BiffMcBlumpkin (3720 posts) -
@roc_553 said:
"The worst part was that in the center it had a picture of Hank Williams Jr.'s face. "
That's seriously pretty fucking awesome.
#45 Posted by Rallier (1739 posts) -
@ryanwho: the "triforce" in Zelda is a symbol in Christianity symbolising the trinity 
 
This image sums it up pretty well:  

#46 Edited by ryanwho (12082 posts) -

I feel like that's just taking it too far. I don't see what the Confederates did as on par with the Nazis. I mean, 5 years before the civil war slavery was legal all over the place, I don't think its fair to paint the war in black and white like that because the Union wasn't fighting in the name of slavery. Honestly, think about it, people going to war and dying over slaves? That wouldn't happen, just about everyone was overtly racist at the time. It wasn't a war over slavery, that was an issue but not the issue, and Lincoln was prepared to throw it away to bring the Union back together.

#47 Posted by jakob187 (21673 posts) -

You can look at the Con-flag in many different ways.  Some people, unfortunately, see it as a symbol of racism solely because you have idiots like the Aryan Brotherhood and KKK who want to use it as a symbol of fear.  Meanwhile, you have logical people like me and many others who see it as little more than a symbol of regional pride.  A lot of great things come from the South, and many people have tried to change the image of the flag over the years.  Yes, it has roots in shitty places...but so do a LOT of things.  Trying to hold on to an old meaning for something in a modern society can lead to more issues than anyone necessarily needs. 
 
With all that said - I'm not offended by it, but I'm also white...so I wouldn't understand the imagery it invokes nearly as much as black people might.  In turn, I simply look at it as a symbol of Southern pride and nothing more... 
 
...ya know, the same way that Pantera and Lynyrd Skynyrd did.

#48 Posted by iAmJohn (6120 posts) -
@Phished0ne said:
" I do not get offended when i see a Confederate Flag,  its just something i note when i am evaluating if i ever want to associate with said person again. "
We have a winner!
#49 Posted by MrKlorox (11209 posts) -
@Everyones_A_Critic said:
"

I really just don't care for "southern folk" and their way of life. It doesn't offend me but it just gives me the impression that whoever is displaying it is probably not my kind of person.

"
Mike Judge, the creator of Beavis and Butthead is a Texan. So are Beavis and Butthead themselves.
#50 Posted by roc_553 (209 posts) -
@BiffMcBlumpkin said:
" @roc_553 said:
"The worst part was that in the center it had a picture of Hank Williams Jr.'s face. "
That's seriously pretty fucking awesome. "
It went beyond horrible, past awesome, and stopped somewhere around "fucking bandannas".