yeah he is. and the way things are going he is probably going to be a one term president. we need someone who is a pragmatic and practical thinker in the officer who understands that all these problems are the governments fault and spending more, printing more money, etc is only going to worsen the situation.
I mean, what do you do when your financially unstable? Do you just keep spending even more money to fix your problem? NO. You live within your means, until eventually things get better. The government, however, does try to spend their way out of problems and it is just ridiuclous.
The fact that Obama is traveling around the world starting today i think is bit worrying. He is trying to work on this massive global undertaking for this problem...Hey OBAMA< how about we stop all our needless spending (like hundreds of thousands of our troops overseas), take away the income tax, and allow this problem to fix itself. Why does government always have to do something? If it just did nothing we wouldn't have a problem to begin with.
The government, however, does try to spend their way out of problems and it is just ridiuclous.
Yea, especially since it's OUR MONEY they're using. I could fix the economy overnight. First I'd legalize drugs and put a tax on them. The government would not only make billions from the taxes, but they would save several more billions that they wouldn't have to spend on drug probation. Then I'd bring out a real stimulus package: Three months with no taxes. Anything you want to buy, games, TV's, cars, planes, anything, tax free for three months.
Why not? It's a financial crisis, and we need people who are experts in economics to solve it. Many of these people come from Wall Street. There aren't many other major pools economic knowledge in America. You also need to realize that he does not want to appear to be the enemy of capitalism, something he's really trying hard to do. He's got to make his economic policy compatible with capitalism and the American publics' understanding of it.
"How can Robocop be pro-drugs? He should go catch the bad guys, not turn them into good guys! You're not my hero anymore."
Well think about it. Are people who sell alcohol 'bad guys'? Alcohol is a mind altering drug, there's no doubt about it, the only thing is that it's legal. But it wasn't always legal, and when it was illegal there were gangsters killing each other as well as some innocent bystanders. What about the Kennedys? They made all their money through bootlegging when alcohol was illegal. They made so much money that they could buy enough influence to get one of them elected president. Would you consider the Kenedys to be 'bad guys'?
Robocop wants me to do drugs! I'm calling the police. Oh snap!
Anyway, with the type of people dealing drugs these days, making it legal won't somehow make them go to the nearest IRS... I'm sure those gangsters you're talking about didn't do that first thing in the morning when alcohol was legalised either. Many of the more prominent bosses dabbled in various legal industries at the same time, no? At least, they always have restaurants or bars in the movies, hur.
And there are enough shit happening due to alcohol (car crashes, murders, etc, even if it is illegal to drine after use) whether it's legal or not, adding free use of drugs on top of that so people don't feel the need to do it hidden anymore? Not great.
"Robocop wants me to do drugs! I'm calling the police. Oh snap!"
lol, Actually, I don't care what you do with your free time, I just don't want the goverment to tell me what I can and can't put in my own body.
Al3xand3r said:
"with the type of people dealing drugs these days, making it legal won't somehow make them go to the nearest IRS...
If drugs were legal then they would be sold on store shelves, not on street corners. And I don't think a bunch of people would go out and start smoking crack and shooting up heroin just because it was legal. There should be a focus on educating people about the dangers of drugs, but at the end of the day you have to let people make their own decisions. Right now you can go out and drink a bottle of cough syrup, or sniff glue. If people want to get high they're going to find a way, but that doesn't mean it's a good idea to spend $30,000 a year to keep somebody in jail for non-violent drug use.
Al3xand3r said:
"there are enough shit happening due to alcohol (car crashes, murders, etc, even if it is illegal to drive after use) "
I don't think that's a very good argument.
There were nearly 6,420,000 auto accidents in the United States in 2005. The financial cost of these crashes is more than 230 Billion dollars. 2.9 million people were injured and 42,636 people killed. About 115 people die every day in vehicle crashes in the United States -- one death every 13 minutes.
If cars cause so many problems, why don't we make them illegal?? Because there are some people out there who can use a car without killing themselves or anyone else. And it wouldn't be fair to take something away from everybody, just because there were some people out there who couldn't handle it. That's why we have cars, and alcohol, and guns, and violent video games, and we should have drugs too.
But I cant, in good faith, support the legalization of highly addictive drugs such as Heroin and Cocain. I understand your point, and ill be honest if you did it as president(which would be impossible) you too would be a one term president, no matter the result. See The Wire Season 3 for a perfect bureaucratic response to this.
Weed though, should be 100% legal.
At this point its too early to tell much of anything about Obama. Despite people seeming to think so, he cant turn water into wine.
Hell yeah he is...I wouldn't be suprised is Obama was some bum off the street that wall street decided to put him in the white house and make him the perfect man, with glitz and glam and everything in between. I wouldn't be suprised if we catch him on camera smoking a joint and bangins some extra bitches in the oval office.
"That's capitalism for ya. The rich people have all the power."
Capitalism as a political system gives no one coercive power over capital flow. Otherwise it's not capitalism. What you have in America is Corporatism. (Also known as Fascism)
"That's capitalism for ya. The rich people have all the power."
Capitalism as a political system gives no one coercive power over capital flow. Otherwise it's not capitalism. What you have in America is Corporatism. (Also known as Fascism)"
Whoa, since when is fascism synonymous with corporatism?
Corporations aren't fascistic in nature. However, when the appearance of private enterprise and securities-based capitalization are in the hands of the government, then it's fascism. That is to say, when you think there is private enterprise but it's actually being dictated by the government, you have economic dictatorship.
Also, a capitalist president wouldn't try to do anything at all similar to a "Buy American" clause. That's economic nationalism, the economic basis for fascism.
So, in your eyes, that makes Germany a fascist nation?
You seem to have a very broad definition of fascism here. Do you mean to tell me that any government intervention in an economy is fascism? As for "buying American," it should be expected that in times of economic crisis nations will become more protectionist in order to sustain themselves.
Guess what happened last time a massive amount of protectionism pervaded the world economy? The depression grew deeper.
And yes, Germany's economy has fascistic patterns, so does Britain, Japan, China; all the world's largest economies are directed towards the advancement of the nations in which these economic activities are taking place, not the individuals and institutions undertaking these economic activities.
The very notion of wealth as the property of the nation is fascistic in nature.
That's right, I'm saying an income tax is fascistic too.
This thread title seems like it's going to attract a lot of Zeitgeist-watching conspiracy zombies.
I'm pretty sure I agree most with BoG here - you use financial experts to solve financial problems. Or at least, you use financial experts to make people think you're going to solve financial problems even if, realistically, you can't. I think any other explanation is reading too far into it. As it is, I feel like this thread is dangerously close to having someone using the word "sheeple" in a non-joking way.
"This thread title seems like it's going to attract a lot of Zeitgeist-watching conspiracy zombies.I'm pretty sure I agree most with BoG here - you use financial experts to solve financial problems. Or at least, you use financial experts to make people think you're going to solve financial problems even if, realistically, you can't. I think any other explanation is reading too far into it. As it is, I feel like this thread is dangerously close to having someone using the word "sheeple" in a non-joking way."
Thats right, a bunch of conspiracy zombies! Why dont you open your eyes, do some damn research, your the fucking Zombie.
"This thread title seems like it's going to attract a lot of Zeitgeist-watching conspiracy zombies.I'm pretty sure I agree most with BoG here - you use financial experts to solve financial problems. Or at least, you use financial experts to make people think you're going to solve financial problems even if, realistically, you can't. I think any other explanation is reading too far into it. As it is, I feel like this thread is dangerously close to having someone using the word "sheeple" in a non-joking way."
Thats right, a bunch of conspiracy zombies! Why dont you open your eyes, do some damn research, your the fucking Zombie."
If you actually did your own research instead of trusting a bunch of college students with no significant research of their own and some movie making software, you would know better!
ex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stVmEmJ666M
But this is a pointless argument. Theories about the existence of the Illuminati aren't falsifiable and therefore aren't valid, but that won't stop people from desperately clinging to the "can't disprove it" part.
"This thread title seems like it's going to attract a lot of Zeitgeist-watching conspiracy zombies.I'm pretty sure I agree most with BoG here - you use financial experts to solve financial problems. Or at least, you use financial experts to make people think you're going to solve financial problems even if, realistically, you can't. I think any other explanation is reading too far into it. As it is, I feel like this thread is dangerously close to having someone using the word "sheeple" in a non-joking way."
Thats right, a bunch of conspiracy zombies! Why dont you open your eyes, do some damn research, your the fucking Zombie."
If you actually did your own research instead of trusting a bunch of college students with no significant research of their own and some movie making software, you would know better!ex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stVmEmJ666MBut this is a pointless argument. Theories about the existence of the Illuminati aren't falsifiable and therefore aren't valid, but that won't stop people from desperately clinging to the "can't disprove it" part."
What I think has nothing to do with college students. At this point the take over is so near, that it is already to late. I dont care about the morons that are blinded, they wont be prepared and will be running around like chickens with there heads cut off when this goes down. Its your own grave you are digging not mine.
"This thread title seems like it's going to attract a lot of Zeitgeist-watching conspiracy zombies.I'm pretty sure I agree most with BoG here - you use financial experts to solve financial problems. Or at least, you use financial experts to make people think you're going to solve financial problems even if, realistically, you can't. I think any other explanation is reading too far into it. As it is, I feel like this thread is dangerously close to having someone using the word "sheeple" in a non-joking way."
Thats right, a bunch of conspiracy zombies! Why dont you open your eyes, do some damn research, your the fucking Zombie."
If you actually did your own research instead of trusting a bunch of college students with no significant research of their own and some movie making software, you would know better!ex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stVmEmJ666MBut this is a pointless argument. Theories about the existence of the Illuminati aren't falsifiable and therefore aren't valid, but that won't stop people from desperately clinging to the "can't disprove it" part."
What I think has nothing to do with college students. At this point the take over is so near, that it is already to late. I dont care about the morons that are blinded, they wont be prepared and will be running around like chickens with there heads cut off when this goes down. Its your own grave you are digging not mine."
"This thread title seems like it's going to attract a lot of Zeitgeist-watching conspiracy zombies.I'm pretty sure I agree most with BoG here - you use financial experts to solve financial problems. Or at least, you use financial experts to make people think you're going to solve financial problems even if, realistically, you can't. I think any other explanation is reading too far into it. As it is, I feel like this thread is dangerously close to having someone using the word "sheeple" in a non-joking way."
Thats right, a bunch of conspiracy zombies! Why dont you open your eyes, do some damn research, your the fucking Zombie."
If you actually did your own research instead of trusting a bunch of college students with no significant research of their own and some movie making software, you would know better!ex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stVmEmJ666MBut this is a pointless argument. Theories about the existence of the Illuminati aren't falsifiable and therefore aren't valid, but that won't stop people from desperately clinging to the "can't disprove it" part."
What I think has nothing to do with college students. At this point the take over is so near, that it is already to late. I dont care about the morons that are blinded, they wont be prepared and will be running around like chickens with there heads cut off when this goes down. Its your own grave you are digging not mine."
Cool story, bro."
Do some research or shut up. There are millions of people waking up to this, its world wide not just the US. Its to much to get into on a video game forum. The information is out there, if you dont care to find or see it, who are you to call it a "story". If you gave 2 shits you could find the info your self, but I guess its easier to say Im making up stories or a conspiracy zombie.
There have been theories like this in the past. They have all been wrong. The only thing different about this one is that people are throwing together pieces of old, defunct arguments to make this one seem more convincing.
And believing in them is not just some personal decision, like whether or not you choose to believe in a God. Believers have an attitude toward government that actively harms it. You are undermining the integrity of the republic and it's all for nothing. Your movement uses fear and unfounded claims of some scheme too large for normal people to influence to undermine the strength of real governments that actually exist now.
Who needs this war on terror? The real terrorists are kids on YouTube.
"There have been theories like this in the past. They have all been wrong. The only thing different about this one is that people are throwing together pieces of old, defunct arguments to make this one seem more convincing.
And believing in them is not just some personal decision, like whether or not you choose to believe in a God. Believers have an attitude toward government that actively harms it. You are undermining the integrity of the republic and it's all for nothing. Your movement uses fear and unfounded claims of some scheme too large for normal people to influence to undermine the strength of real governments that actually exist now.Who needs this war on terror? The real terrorists are kids on YouTube."
That is absolutely insane.
Conspiracy theorists are growing in number and fame not because they are cruel shit disturbers who are trying to undermine all the great thing the government is doing for the country, but because the changes that are happening to the country don't make sense to them in any other way. These people need the massive fuckups of their governments to be by-design, because if this economy collapses under the weight of the banking sector by accident it will be an even greater tragedy.
To say that people who are critical of the government are somehow harming society only gives them ammunition, Laszlo.
My point is this, it doesn't matter who is running the government or for what aims, what matters is they are fucking over every single dollar-earner in America. Intentionally or otherwise it doesn't matter.
"There have been theories like this in the past. They have all been wrong. The only thing different about this one is that people are throwing together pieces of old, defunct arguments to make this one seem more convincing.
And believing in them is not just some personal decision, like whether or not you choose to believe in a God. Believers have an attitude toward government that actively harms it. You are undermining the integrity of the republic and it's all for nothing. Your movement uses fear and unfounded claims of some scheme too large for normal people to influence to undermine the strength of real governments that actually exist now.Who needs this war on terror? The real terrorists are kids on YouTube."
That is absolutely insane.Conspiracy theorists are growing in number and fame not because they are cruel shit disturbers who are trying to undermine all the great thing the government is doing for the country, but because the changes that are happening to the country don't make sense to them in any other way. These people need the massive fuckups of their governments to be by-design, because if this economy collapses under the weight of the banking sector by accident it will be an even greater tragedy.To say that people who are critical of the government are somehow harming society only gives them ammunition, Laszlo.My point is this, it doesn't matter who is running the government or for what aims, what matters is they are fucking over every single dollar-earner in America. Intentionally or otherwise it doesn't matter."
I don't think I'm hurting their argument any, I'm just pissed off. I'm tired of people ignoring the truth because they want to believe in something bigger than themselves or because they're completely gullible, or because they just don't want to believe what's really happening.
I'll agree that the economic collapse is a terrible thing. I don't see how anyone couldn't. But it's not even the first time this has happened! Many of the causes for the Great Depression were just as stupid, really.
But it wouldn't take someone claiming to be an expert in grand conspiracies to see that was going to happen, or to see that corporations and governments frequently do bad things. All it takes is someone who's passed an American history class. I'm not saying that nothing should be done, or that people shouldn't be angry. My beef is not with you if that's all you're saying, but people need to stop acting like these are new developments or that it's "too late to do anything", as Kratos81 says.
"There have been theories like this in the past. They have all been wrong. The only thing different about this one is that people are throwing together pieces of old, defunct arguments to make this one seem more convincing.
And believing in them is not just some personal decision, like whether or not you choose to believe in a God. Believers have an attitude toward government that actively harms it. You are undermining the integrity of the republic and it's all for nothing. Your movement uses fear and unfounded claims of some scheme too large for normal people to influence to undermine the strength of real governments that actually exist now.Who needs this war on terror? The real terrorists are kids on YouTube."
That is absolutely insane.Conspiracy theorists are growing in number and fame not because they are cruel shit disturbers who are trying to undermine all the great thing the government is doing for the country, but because the changes that are happening to the country don't make sense to them in any other way. These people need the massive fuckups of their governments to be by-design, because if this economy collapses under the weight of the banking sector by accident it will be an even greater tragedy.To say that people who are critical of the government are somehow harming society only gives them ammunition, Laszlo.My point is this, it doesn't matter who is running the government or for what aims, what matters is they are fucking over every single dollar-earner in America. Intentionally or otherwise it doesn't matter."
I don't think I'm hurting their argument any, I'm just pissed off. I'm tired of people ignoring the truth because they want to believe in something bigger than themselves or because they're completely gullible, or because they just don't want to believe what's really happening.I'll agree that the economic collapse is a terrible thing. I don't see how anyone couldn't. But it's not even the first time this has happened! Many of the causes for the Great Depression were just as stupid, really.But it wouldn't take someone claiming to be an expert in grand conspiracies to see that was going to happen, or to see that corporations and governments frequently do bad things. All it takes is someone who's passed an American history class. I'm not saying that nothing should be done, or that people shouldn't be angry. My beef is not with you if that's all you're saying, but people need to stop acting like these are new developments or that it's "too late to do anything", as Kratos81 says."
The reason I said it was to late is because there are lots of people like YOU, that brush this off with out ever trying to do research for themselves. Now, if everyone thought like you the government could do what ever the hell it wants in the name "helping us" and no one would ever question anything. Did you know that there is a bill that passed the house that makes military service MANDATORY. They are reinstating the DRaFT, why do that if the troops are coming home. Have you researched FEMA camps. How about that they are talking about banning gardens because people "might grow pot" give me a fucking break is so we will be totally dependent on them for food shelter etc...... Do some fucking research and prove any of those wrong.
spending more, printing more money, etc is only going to worsen the situation.
spending money is the only thing that keeps the economy from near self destructing itself every time we have a financial crisis"
Um...no.
Spending is not intrinsically good.
People spend their money when they feel like it. That's called time preference. If people save money rather than spend, that's when businesses choose to invest in future projects and slow production in the present. Eventually, people do spend their money, it's just a matter of when. One of the biggest fallacies with Keynesianism is that savings=hoarding. The truth, is that spending=investment. When people save money, the economy is not hurt.
However, when the government thinks we are spending too little, it tends to take our money and spend it for us by either taxing us or printing money (which is a form of taxation). By doing this, the government destroys the entire concept of time preference. It spends money for the sake of spending money. It creates demand for things which consumer's don't demand. When things are not demanded by consumers, they have no value. The government uses this money and spends it on things which have no value. It is obvious that they have no value, because the consumer time preference was to save in the present and spend later, meaning that they value future consumption, not present.
So when the government forces spending in the present against consumer will, spending in the future decreases. That means that things which have real demand, or real value, will not be affordable because their wealth is being spent on things without value.
Worthless spending is not what keeps the economy from self destruction, it makes the problem worse. You need to focus on what is seen AND what is NOT seen. You make the fallacious assumptions that 1) Spending is intrinsically good. and 2) Savings=Hoarding.
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