Let's talk Prometheus! (also, spoilers)

So I saw it today, and I really have no complaints. I felt the film was made as Ridley Scott had intended it to be. Whatever you can find to complain about, there's a reason behind it. What did you think about it? The worst thing is that I saw it with my family and none of them know the Alien franchise like I do, so it's hard to talk to them about it. Also, when we were going to our next destination, I had to argue with my dad and tell him that Predators don't exist in the world of Prometheus (since he took the AVP story for granted). It annoyed me to say the least.

There are a few things that they don't explain, but since I think there has to be a sequel, and hope there will be, I can hardly call them plot holes since I think those things (like the black goo) weren't explained in this film, but may be explored more in the future films. I was a bit shocked I didn't even think of how obvious it was until I saw the film, the whole ship, planet, and space jockey aspect. Before the film, I was wondering about the planet, 'cause I assumed that there was only one ship. It wasn't until the end I fully understood the reason why Ridley Scott said it wasn't just another alien film (which isn't something I was thinking about as I was watching it).

This for me, is a film I'll be thinking about, and keep coming to different and new conclusions as I think threw it all, or that's what I feel is going to happen. Eh, I just want to hear what others have to say then I'll reply back, 'cause I can't really think of much to say on my own. I do think that whatever there is to complain about, there is a reason behind it; intentionally unexplained, or for the viewer to figure out. Anyways, I'm done saying what I want for now. There's a lot on my mind of the film, but I don't want to write it all down 'cause then it'll just be jumbled.

I'll just leave this by saying, I'm a little sad the experience is over, 'cause they set it up so perfectly for a sequel that I just want more of it, but I have to wait not only for a sequel, but for the release of this on 3D, or blu-ray. Also, maybe you'd like to read this. IMDB sometimes has some interesting answers to questions asked about films. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1446714/faq#.2.1.15

I agree with you and make the stunning prediction that this thread will be locked.

@TentPole: Why, 'cause there's been a few already? I don't know. Those are buried.

I didn't understand why that facehugger (if it was even a facehugger) was so freaking gigantic or why the xenomorph came out full grown and didn't have a second mouth. There were many tie ins to Alien that confused me. I also didn't like the look of the Space Jockey. I was kind of disappointed that the Space Jockey "face" was really just a helmet.

@NTM: I would not call them buried but I also don't actually care if this gets locked or not. I just think it will be. My second prediction is that time will be kind to Prometheus and it will be remembered as fondly as Blade Runner one day.

I agree that it was a fantastic film. I'm just not seeing a lot of the complaints people seem to be having about it. There's a lot of over-analyzing and overblown expectations as to what exactly this movie set out to do in the first place.  Sure, it wasn't perfect and there are a couple of things that bothered me, but overall it was quite an experience, and a very visually stunning one at that. 
 
Honestly though, I would have rather had it take place on LV-426 rather than another planet, and change the events at the end so they directly set up Alien, instead of leaving it open for a sequel and implying that a near identical scenario would have to happen on LV-426, which seems kind of ridiculous. There's not that much that would've even had to have changed.

I was actually surprised by some of the negative reactions it's gotten. The main complaint I've run into time, and time again, is that it raised deep questions about the nature of our creation, but it failed to answer them in a satisfying way. That's a valid criticism, but like I posted on the screened review by not matt or alex; any answer would have been unsatisfactory, and by leaving it open-ended it creates this kind of Lovecraftian dread. The illusion that there are answers to be found, when in fact, it's only doom. On a practical note, not answering the questions leaves the obvious sequel hook that will undoubtedly happen. The abortion scene was...tense, to say the least.

@PlasmaBeam44: You liked when his face was actually the elephant and not a suit? Also, you can interpret the whole xenomorph whatever way you want for now, 'cause that's not something that was fully explained. When I walked out of the theater, I thought and said "that must have been the origin of the xenomorph", but then I thought about how what came out doesn't even appear elsewhere in the Alien franchise, so it may just be another breed of xenomorph. Either way, you shouldn't look at it and be confused in a negative way. As with many things in the film, you should be wondering what exactly is going on.

@OneKillWonder_ said:

I agree that it was a fantastic film. I'm just not seeing a lot of the complaints people seem to be having about it. There's a lot of over-analyzing and overblown expectations as to what exactly this movie set out to do in the first place. Sure, it wasn't perfect and there are a couple of things that bothered me, but overall it was quite an experience, and a very visually stunning one at that. Honestly though, I would have rather had it take place on LV-426 rather than another planet, and change the events at the end so they directly set up Alien, instead of leaving it open for a sequel and implying that a near identical scenario would have to happen on LV-426, which seems kind of ridiculous. There's not that much that would've even had to have changed.

Not that you don't get it, but to anyone else that doesn't, basically, what this film was doing was saying "Alright (original Alien series) you go do that, and we (Prometheus) will go do this." I guess I didn't expect what they are trying to do, but in the end, it all made sense. It really is different, and to reply to your comment about wishing it was set on LV-426, again, it's mainly just about being different, they could have gone the other route, but they didn't really want to get that close to the other films. It would have been harder set it apart, which is what they're trying to do.

@High_Nunez: I think those people who have those complaints don't understand what movie they went to see, or they didn't understand the intentions of the director. This film wasn't going to be all about answers to our unanswered questions from the original Alien series. I think people still can't get past the fact that it's different. I personally was expecting some answers, but what I got was something entirely different, none of which I was thinking about as I watched the film exactly, but after. I was kind of thinking "how will this lead into what Ripley and those guys do?" when that's not the approach that should be taken, and it's evidently clear as you watch the film.

I didn't like it. I've expressed my (apparently very disagreeable) sentiments on a different thread, but suffice it to say that I didn't bloody like it. I know it's different, and I kind of expected that going in. But what I got simply did not float my boat.

@believer258: Well, either tell me or show me a link. I want to disagree as well, and tell you what's what. :D

@NTM: I agree entirely. This was not a film that was meant to provide neat answers, it was meant to create dread about the unknown, and in some cases, unknowable; horror/sci-fi incarnate. I really enjoyed it. In that way its connections to Alien are more spiritual than narrative.

@OneKillWonder_ said:

I agree that it was a fantastic film. I'm just not seeing a lot of the complaints people seem to be having about it. There's a lot of over-analyzing and overblown expectations as to what exactly this movie set out to do in the first place. Sure, it wasn't perfect and there are a couple of things that bothered me, but overall it was quite an experience, and a very visually stunning one at that. Honestly though, I would have rather had it take place on LV-426 rather than another planet, and change the events at the end so they directly set up Alien, instead of leaving it open for a sequel and implying that a near identical scenario would have to happen on LV-426, which seems kind of ridiculous. There's not that much that would've even had to have changed.

Not that you don't get it, but to anyone else that doesn't, basically, what this film was doing was saying "Alright (original Alien series) you go do that, and we (Prometheus) will go do this." I guess I didn't expect what they are trying to do, but in the end, it all made sense. It really is different, and to reply to your comment about wishing it was set on LV-426, again, it's mainly just about being different, they could have gone the other route, but they didn't really want to get that close to the other films. It would have been harder set it apart, which is what they're trying to do.

I disliked the couple of character threads came and went, including Charlize and Guy Pearce's characters, and thought that the film was a little scattershot in its themes. It addressed several things and left them hanging.

Also, OP, you sound like kind of a dick by basically referring to anyone that disagrees with you as one who "doesn't get it". You sound like Leigh Alexander talking about Kojima.

@NTM said:

@believer258: Well, either tell me or show me a link. I want to disagree as well, and tell you what's what. :D

The characters were for the most part stupid (yes, there's David, I said for the most part), the dialogue wasn't always so great (FATHER! Wait, wasn't this already said earlier in the film?), some events seemed a little bit random (Space zombie dude returning for NO REASON other than to have something happen on screen). All in all, the whole thing felt like a series of related events instead of a cohesive plot with a main point to the ending. Shit just happens, and a lot of it isn't very compelling beyond the played-out "were we created by aliens/what comes after?" thing. EDIT: And the creator/created thing, that was interesting but not really dwelt on much.

I guess my main problem is the ending. I know that it wasn't supposed to be completely related to Alien, but I can't help but think that a very similar set of events happened on LV426 in order for Alien and Aliens to be possible. Like, an unbelievably similar thing. That Weyland's company could have sent more ships out there isn't so far-fetched. I just don't understand how it didn't make sense to have Prometheus feed directly into Alien. There's no story reason why it had to end the way it did; the film could have just as easily delivered the same message with very little changes. It just feels like Scott was superficially trying to separate the two films further than they had to be. I don't quite understand why this was necessary - Alien and Aliens fans have long since separated the first and second movies as two entirely different experiences. A third experience that delivers on a different side of science fiction that also directly feeds into Alien would not have been a difficult thing to accomplish. It would have successfully answered the very questions that fans were wanting answered while satisfying the film's other prominent questions about life's origins, its endings, and whatever may happen afterwards (a question which was smartly left open-ended)

There are some plot holes here and there; most concerning to me is the xenomorph in the end. For one, the giant face hugger from her C-Section was a little odd, but OK. I can easily accept that the first face hugger was a special case. And I can even accept that the first xenomorph was a special case in terms of looks. But how did xenomorphs end up on LV426 in the first place? They've never been shown to be able to fly anything, and their precursor is just hanging around on LV223 instead of LV426.

EDIT: And yes, I feel that it deserves a re-watch. On DVD. Not at the movies.

After I had finished watching in it 3D which is really well done, I wasn't sure how I felt about the film. Sure it was good no doubt it, but it felt like something was missing just to put it over the edge into the territory of amazing. Now that It has had some time to sink in, and that I've read about Ridley Scott's plans for the series, I can appropriate the film a lot considering that it'll be a trilogy and the Blu Ray release will include and extended cut of the film with 20 minutes of additional footage.

Two things really stick out to me as memorable scenes, the first being the first encounter with the engineer's hologram footage and any scene which involved David. I think Prometheus will be one of those films I'll enjoy more each time I re watch it.

I loved the movie, going to see it again tomorrow. I don't understand the people hating on the movie so much at all. It has faults but still a spectacular experience. If anything my complaint is that it felt rushed towards the middle/ end. I know its a long movie as it is, but a Lord of the Rings extended directors cut will really do this move well once it is out dvd/ blu-ray.

I do have my theories about what was really going on, drove myself crazy with it right after I saw it, but it is Damon Lindeloff, and I did the same with Lost so there that. Also I was under the impression this was the first of several prequel movies set in this universe, and the ending sure seems to support that as well. I'm assuming it's going to make an ass-ton of money, so I'd bet on seeing Shaw and David again in a few years.

@NTM This thread might get locked and told to go to the other Prometheus thread of which is MAJOR and had a huge amount of discussion I strongly advice you look and read the stuff there. However I am not going to repeat myself on anything. Go the other discussion on the film since there was so much discussion. http://www.giantbomb.com/forums/off-topic/31/spoilers-for-prometheus/550097/

As I said in the other thread, I think this is the best Sci-Fi film since Blade Runner.

It was awesome

@believer258 said:

There are some plot holes here and there; most concerning to me is the xenomorph in the end. For one, the giant face hugger from her C-Section was a little odd, but OK. I can easily accept that the first face hugger was a special case. And I can even accept that the first xenomorph was a special case in terms of looks. But how did xenomorphs end up on LV426 in the first place? They've never been shown to be able to fly anything, and their precursor is just hanging around on LV223 instead of LV426.

The carriers that the space jockey's have all, or at least, the two, the one from Prometheus, and the one in Alien/Aliens, both had the Xenomorphs in it. It's not the xenomorphs flying ships, it's that the space jockey's must have crash landed on LV-426 and had the eggs in it. Also, as I have said before, when I came out of the theater, and as I was sitting in there, I thought "alright, so these are the origins of xenomorph", but that may not be the case, it could have been an entirely new breed of xenomorph.

That's not that hard to imagine, whatever else you were complaining about is very opinionated so I don't really have to say you're wrong, 'cause I can't. If you think it's dumb that they made it the way they did, then that's that, but I think it's totally fine, and I'm kind of glad they're not just trying to lead one thing into another. I'm awaiting what's next. I think you almost can't judge the film since there hasn't yet been a trilogy, or a sequel. It's very much the first part of the story. I also think the biggest mistake would be if this was the only one.

@Brendan: I never said "if you don't agree, you're an idiot", so I can't sound like a dick, what I said is, there's enough evidence in the film for people to go on if you look hard enough, and what's in there that wasn't shown was intentional so you shouldn't really be complaining about it. They should be making a sequel, and while there are not guarantee's that'll give you all the answers you want, you can at least hope for more. If you don't think so, then I don't really care. I never called anyone an idiot, and I didn't have the intention in doing so. You idiot, just kidding.

As I said in the other thread, I think this is the best Sci-Fi film since Blade Runner.

my complaints are:

- the story loses sight of its goal and falls apart at the start of act 2

- the "abortion" scene was fanfuckingtastic, except the plot just treats it like a random moment and it's never really addressed or given room to breathe. It happens, and then we're on to the next thing.

- the Space Jockeys looking like white hulks kinda sucked. Considering the creative power behind the film, I'm surprised so little thought went into the design of the Space Jockeys.

- Noomi Rapace is fucking awful in this movie. I kept hoping she'd die and then, nope, she lives.

- The movie should've been about Michael Fassbender, Charlize Theron, or Idris Elba. They were the only actors with the presence that screamed "protagonist." Noomi Rapace is a fucking chump.

- Shit just kinda happens, and no thought is given to weight of the implications the film makes. I blame Lindelof. Dude's a fucking hack.

- Everything I found interesting about the world Prometheus creates, the film has no fucking intention of looking into, however briefly. It's like pressing your nose against a window, salivating at all the goods -on the other side except the shopkeeper has no intention of ever selling that shit to you.

- Damon Lindelof needs to be lit on fire with cooking oil. He is such a fucking hack.

- the cuttlefish/giant rapist starfish was a pretty awesome monster. Genuinely freaky. Sadly it gets maybe three minutes of screen time and only manages to face-rape a white supremacist hulk.

Aside from all of those, the movie was alright.

EDIT: If there needs to be a sequel to this, I'd like one request:

For the love of Christ don't get Lindelof to write it. That guy. is. a fucking. hack. As someone who sat through six seasons of Lost expecting some big "what it all means" payoff, I can tell you for certain that this man just pulls whatever he can out of his ass and has no regard for plot, pacing, or story structure.

I hate this film a large amount. I have the same reaction to this that Vinny had to Flower. I'll preface by saying I'm about to go into rant mode and none of this is personal, I'm glad everyone can like different stuff, gives the world colour and whatnot.

So here we go: Prometheus felt, to me, like thematic analaysis for 12 year olds. It didn't have characters, it had actors stand around and state out loud the questions they wanted the audience to consider without providing any answers. It's like they watched any good science fiction film, say, Serenity, and realised that after watching it they had come out thinking not only about the characters of the the film, but also considering the rights of humanity to be human. It's presented subtly, it has a message, and it's not punching you in the face with it. It is enjoyable on the complete surface level, and also a subtextual level. See also: Inception, Attack The Block, and Starship Troopers. Starship Troopers should be a bad B-Movie, but specifically by having a subtext and a moral which the characters completely ignore, suddenly becomes something more, illogically so.

Prometheus is all subtext, to the point where it is just text. Everything we know about Shaw's character is about religion, and the fact that she loves Holloway, so she can have the sex with him. But then later in the film, when he dies, she stops caring about him because there's no plot-reason for her to care. Literally, no one mentions Holloway again. What the fuck is that about? People don't do that - the film prioritised plot over character, and when you lose character consistency you cannot care about anyone. Take David, he's a robot, which means he's kooky! This allows the filmmakers to have him forward the plot in ways that make no sense, thus undermining his abiliy to be analysed. He takes a canister back and infects Holloway, because he's a robot! It's a bad kind of ambiguity - a character such as this should not have clear motivations from the start, and should be a complex web for the audience to unravel, but when we unravel here, all we can tell is he does what he does because that's what needs to happen for the plot to advance. He becomes merely a plot device, with no character to his name, like everyone else.

And that's what confuses me when people debate this on an actual intellectual level, because we're giving this film far more credit than it deserves. There's nothing to debate, because the characters every word and discussion is woodenly stating the theme of the movie in the most obvious of terms. This causes it to not work on an analytical level, and also not work on a base level because there were no characters, we don't care when anyone dies.

If you would like to see a similar film, which I hold very close to my heart, which has a central thematic issue which is discussed by the characters, but I love to pieces, then watch Children of Men. What it does differently is have these conversations come from believable, rounded characters who have opinions on the world around them. There is more to them than what we see, and that's just not the case of Prometheus.

I didn't hear anyone say this but I figure the xenomorph at the end of the movie is a baby queen. We know how normal ones are born, but now how queens are born. It looks more like a queen than a worker/drone anyway.

My second prediction is that time will be kind to Prometheus and it will be remembered as fondly as Blade Runner one day.

the xenomorph's looks are also dependent on what they were born out of. so the variation of the one we saw in the movie didn't bother me.

@OneKillWonder_ said:

@NTM said:

@OneKillWonder_ said:

I agree that it was a fantastic film. I'm just not seeing a lot of the complaints people seem to be having about it. There's a lot of over-analyzing and overblown expectations as to what exactly this movie set out to do in the first place. Sure, it wasn't perfect and there are a couple of things that bothered me, but overall it was quite an experience, and a very visually stunning one at that. Honestly though, I would have rather had it take place on LV-426 rather than another planet, and change the events at the end so they directly set up Alien, instead of leaving it open for a sequel and implying that a near identical scenario would have to happen on LV-426, which seems kind of ridiculous. There's not that much that would've even had to have changed.

Not that you don't get it, but to anyone else that doesn't, basically, what this film was doing was saying "Alright (original Alien series) you go do that, and we (Prometheus) will go do this." I guess I didn't expect what they are trying to do, but in the end, it all made sense. It really is different, and to reply to your comment about wishing it was set on LV-426, again, it's mainly just about being different, they could have gone the other route, but they didn't really want to get that close to the other films. It would have been harder set it apart, which is what they're trying to do.

The only reason I feel that way is because I felt like it had already gone far enough in trying setting Alien up that it should've just went all the way. Like I said, not having it set on LV-426 leaves one with the assumption that basically the same events would have to occur there at a later time, which would be far too much of a coincidence to be plausible. Hopefully whatever the sequel ends up being will explain this. I dunno, I just don't think the movie set itself as far apart from Alien as maybe it wanted to. That didn't stop me from loving it, though.

Why would you assume that the same events would occur on LV-426?

As for the differences in the facehugger and xenemorph, clearly the bio-weapon they evolve from is some sort of ultimate evolution soup, which is affected by surrounding environment, hosts and other factors and therefore the organisms develop differently - with one thing in common: survival and extreme self-defense mechanisms. Furthermore the goo/soup in Prometheus could be an earlier or later version than in Alien.

@Oldirtybearon said:

- the "abortion" scene was fanfuckingtastic, except the plot just treats it like a random moment and it's never really addressed or given room to breathe. It happens, and then we're on to the next thing.

Well, it was actually an impromptu c-section, not an "abortion". I agree though, I think a lot of the ways some of the crew acted didn't seem realistic to me, and that's one of the small problems I had with it, but it didn't have a huge effect on me, and wasn't that detrimental.

@WickedFather said:

@TentPole said:

My second prediction is that time will be kind to Prometheus and it will be remembered as fondly as Blade Runner one day.

Maybe the awful director's cut, but not the good version with the voice over.

I am just going to assume you are making a silly joke and don't have that shitty of taste.