#1 Edited by warthog (57 posts) -

one thing that i have see is that atheist disaporve god as they cant fathom that god can create a world where there is so evil and religious people embrace god cuz they believe that god created this awesome world.

what both fail to realize is that god exists but it is an evil god.If god is omnipresent,omnipotent then there would be no suffering or evil.the fact is that we are all trapped in this physical universe which is a creation of a demiurge and we are spiritual beings trapped.
http://www.xeeatwelve.com/articles/purification.htm
some quotes
Suffering causes a loss of energy on the physical, emotional, mental and spiritual levels.  If suffering were needed for purification, then it would be "God's" plan for such purification to be designed for "souls" to experience and go through for the purpose of "soul" advancement.  If that were so, then all those who contribute to the suffering of others would actually be Divine agents, assisting in the evolutionary plan through purification via suffering and self-sacrifice.  In that case, no one would have done anyone any wrong and thus no one should be punished or made accountable for his/her actions.  Yet, according to the evil Cosmic Law of this evil creation, the need for purification is precisely the cause which inflicts suffering upon others.


Why would "God" create matter in order for His creation to experience matter and then impose purification as a measure in overcoming the temptations of matter?  A "God" who purposely set up insurmountable and impossible tasks to test His/Her creation is a sick, evil creator.  The purpose of suffering according to the evil Controller is to extract energy from beings (like a generator generating power for the planet).  People must wake up to such lies and not be fooled or threatened by them.  That all "souls" are required to undergo incarnations in their quest for spiritual purification is false. 

People are being threatened by the belief that failure to learn any one lesson may require the "soul" to re-live similar existences many times until that particular lesson has been completely assimilated — this belief is absolutely absurd and very cruel. 



also  there are beings on this planet who have souls and not.if you dont beleive in life after death then you dont have a soul.you have 1 life whereas other beings have souls and have to be born again and again.


google organic portals






#2 Edited by Aurelito (792 posts) -

I barely understand the point of this so called article, but if you mean that God created both universe and human so he's devilish, you're wrong because your opinion is based on a book that only get used to torture fidgety kids. In the real book, this isn't Evil that is devil, it's human's nature that do it. unlike god, evil is created mentally by the weakness of human forcing with their worse part of nature.

And father of Jesus doesn't exist, Jesus isn't crucified, and you guys just burn your bibles and go to hell.

#3 Posted by SinGulaR (2469 posts) -

I don't belive in god because that concept isn't very rational. If one believes in god he see's the evil in the world as doings by some adversary of god or by said god himself to test the will of his followers. Either way it's not seen as cruel or sick, just as a fact of life.

#4 Posted by daniel_beck_90 (3244 posts) -
If you believe in God then be good for his sake
If you do not believe in God then be good for goodness

End of story
#5 Posted by Aurelito (792 posts) -
daniel_beck_90 said:
"If you believe in God then be good for his sake
If you do not believe in God then be good for goodness

End of story "
the problem is, if we do believe in god, we believe that there's an afterlife matter that is we'll see the consequences in there. but if we don't believe in god, so we believe that there's nothing further and we have enjoy this short period of time that we can breathe. so therefore, If we can't enjoy this short period, we can get enjoyment tools by doing bad things because who's watching over us if we do it so?
And, when shit happens, we can't grab a higher power except wine and other things.
And then, some do evil, some do good, it's not fair that they both should be treated same afterwards, witch is nothing.
#6 Posted by natetodamax (19421 posts) -

I am a proud atheist, so I agree with what SinGuLaR said. Also, I remember this quote from Hammer from Fable II. She basically says that everything has gone to hell because people "are living their lives based on books written thousands of years ago." The ironic part of the story? She's a monk.

#7 Posted by LuckyWanderDude (934 posts) -

Is this for real? I definitely think that the atheist perspective is more plausible than the gnostic perspective.

#8 Posted by Sway (63 posts) -

I believe there is no such thing as god because the world is too crappy like you said but I also believe there is no such thing as god because there is no proof that some guy blinked and created the universe. Therefore your theory fails.

#9 Posted by SathingtonWaltz (2167 posts) -

Yup I'm an atheist as well. But I never said that their is no God, only that I can't believe in one due to a lack of plausible evidence. There is nothing wrong with this. I live life by the gospel of "I don't know". 

#10 Posted by Drebin_893 (3011 posts) -

But which one teaches you to spell correctly?


Also, I'm a proud atheist.
#11 Posted by Sway (63 posts) -
Aurelito said:
"daniel_beck_90 said:
"If you believe in God then be good for his sake
If you do not believe in God then be good for goodness

End of story "
the problem is, if we do believe in god, we believe that there's an afterlife matter that is we'll see the consequences in there. but if we don't believe in god, so we believe that there's nothing further and we have enjoy this short period of time that we can breathe. so therefore, If we can't enjoy this short period, we can get enjoyment tools by doing bad things because who's watching over us if we do it so?And, when shit happens, we can't grab a higher power except wine and other things. And then, some do evil, some do good, it's not fair that they both should be treated same afterwards, witch is nothing."

Umm if you do believe in God all you have to do is say sorry to a preist and what you did is forgotten. So even Adolf Hitler can be in heaven as long as he says all his sins to a preist and boom his slate is whiped clean. So if you do believe in God doing something wrong is justefied because God will forgive you no matter what.
#12 Posted by Bioderm (198 posts) -
SathingtonWaltz said:
"Yup I'm an atheist as well. But I never said that their is no God, only that I can't believe in one due to a lack of plausible evidence. There is nothing wrong with this. I live life by the gospel of "I don't know". "
Then you are agnostic not atheist, I am atheist because I am 100% sure there is no god. Agnostics people are the one that are not sure that there is no god.
#13 Posted by Vinchenzo (6466 posts) -

I guess I should consider myself an atheist. Although I don't preach it either, religion is such a shitty topic to discuss. People have their freedom to choose what they want to do. I only hate it when they shove it in my face trying to force me.

P.S. Don't you hate when those Christians/Catholics come to your door with a bible and smelling of pure cologne?

#14 Posted by Sin4profit (3182 posts) -

God is just a defining word of the world's creation, something way beyond human comprehension...God ain't good, god ain't evil.

Suffering is a choice, not an infliction. Pain is the worlds first educator, you're suppose to learn from it, whether physical or emotional. Suffering is what one feels when they choose to dwell on pain ( or fear the existence of it) rather then learn from it.

Civilization's built around it's fear of pain and suffering, to the point where it's built a cage around itself. Some are comfortable in it's cage, others are not, and this can cause suffering it it's own society.

Our evolution, or spontaneous genesis from two nekkid folk'n'an apple, gave us a self consciousness, civilization wrote the standards that have evolved unconscously in our minds. As we look at the world, mindfull of our social standards, and compare it with our own life we may see "suffering" but that's only how you choose to feel. In the end, it's humanity that inspires social suffering, not god. The idea that god is toying with us to watch us suffer, or even that god's trying to inspire us to "see the light", are both bunk ta me. Humanity's choice to give god that kind of human consciousness is just human vanity if you ask me.

#15 Posted by Bioderm (198 posts) -

Any religion to come to my door I make sure they never come back by shouting ton of blasphemous word toward there religion, I never had any religious group come to my door for a good 5 years now. Don't show them respect they don't deserve it. Look at what happened in Brazil some girl got raped and the church didn't want  her to get abortion but she did anyway and she got excommunicated but the guy who raped her didn't. 

#16 Posted by TheHBK (5663 posts) -

Fuck you, the real religion is that of a Jedi Knight, who wants to go for a force power face off?  lets go.

#17 Posted by Phished0ne (2659 posts) -
I'm a Pastafarian!

No, but on the serious side, i will let a picture speak for me.


'Nuff Said

#18 Posted by Gmanall (1707 posts) -

 Did you ever stop to think that the problem with this world is not God it is us. You say that if God was everywhere that there would be no sin. Take a walk out in a city are you going to give all your money to every one that is poor?
  All that God does now he has a right to but as quick as he came down to earth and died he has a right to leave us in are sin to suffer forever. It is like you and your worst enemy are in the north pole you are in a nice hot tub but your worst enemy is out there freezing. You would leave him/her out to die instead of leaving your hot tube to pick them up and bring them to the hot tub (Unless you try to prove a point and say you would help but we know the truth). He being perfect came down to horrible earth and got spit on and killed for no reason, if any one would be justified for leaving us for dead he dose.  
          

#19 Posted by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -

We are an accident, but we are all part of the same accident. So to put it down too some kind of game that some kind of being has made for what ever reason is just stupid.

In all actuality we are god, as we have created him/her/it and have lived in actuality by our own rules/morels. But in the end right ore wrong is all relative. What was wrong 100 years ago is good right now as we evolve emotionally and morally as time and the concept of god fades and new concepts of god come in to play. As religion is always being reinvented to suite the new generation.

I hope we realize that we only have one earth and all the money in the world ore any god will not bring us together. And we find something to bring us together. I hope tyranny and/ore fear has nothing to do with it.

#20 Posted by Gmanall (1707 posts) -

  Nope we will never be all together. The Christen religion is not a pipe dream that every one in the world is going to come together and dance to barney.

  There are always answers and us just appearing is not the right one    

#21 Posted by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -
Sway said:
Umm if you do believe in God all you have to do is say sorry to a preist and what you did is forgotten. So even Adolf Hitler can be in heaven as long as he says all his sins to a preist and boom his slate is whiped clean. So if you do believe in God doing something wrong is justefied because God will forgive you no matter what."
The only problem with that is he killed himself committing a mortal sin according to the writings of the Bible giving him a one way ticket to hell.
#22 Posted by Gmanall (1707 posts) -

  Nope that God can forgive. God said the only none forgivable sin is the rejection of the Holy Spirit.

 When you believe in God it is not just a clean slate your live ends it is now being run by God and you will screw up but you do not live your life in sin anymore.         

#23 Edited by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -

Do you belief in god, cause I don't. 

#24 Posted by Gmanall (1707 posts) -

  Glad you asked. Yes, very much so.

#25 Edited by Phished0ne (2659 posts) -
Gmanall said:
"  . The Christen religion is not a pipe dream that every one in the world is going to come together and dance to barney.   There are always answers and us just appearing is not the right one   "
THAT is the problem, the Christian religion has became so different then what  Jesus talked about back in his day. When he was around, he talked about everyone loving each-other and being peaceful. But, now the christian religion is about interpreting old books poorly/ taking things that were meant literally back then, and saying they should still be meant literally now.


It boils down to this, along with the thing i said above, i dont believe in god, just like i dont believe in ghosts, if i saw the ghost of christmas past appear in front of me, then maybe i would concider believing in god.

#26 Posted by Bioderm (198 posts) -

Religions was probably needed in ancient times where people didn't know much about science, but today religions are not needed they make bad stuff happen more than anything else. Mostly Islam but other religions too.Example:  The pope said told people in Nigeria to not use condoms and that contry is very infected with HiV.

#27 Edited by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -

OK that explains a lot. I hope you don't take it personal but I think believing in god is not so ok thing cause it's a lie. A lie that is regurgitated from when we started recording history an even before that. With one message that they had the truth. The truth that enslaves people in a life style of constant fear of hell and a promises of redemption. Being thought what to think, belief and to vote on is just something I can't do. The good thing is that it thought me morals and a good sens of right and wrong. But that same sens made me aware of something wrong with my beliefs. I probably feel as strong as in my beliefs that god is a man made thing as you in your beliefs that the messiah will rise again killing me and taking you in his golden ship to sail to heaven where you will live with god endlessly....

#28 Edited by Carlos1408 (1582 posts) -

I'm not really religious but I believe in after life and that God exists, there are just many things that I don't agree with in the Christian, Islam and Jewish religions. When people say there is no proof of god existing, I say where is the proof that he doesn't exist, you can't proove either of them really. I simply respect all opinions and do not impose mine on others.

#29 Posted by Black_Rose (7772 posts) -

I would tend to agree, however that article is just poor.

I was a christian until a few years ago (I never went to church or anything like it, I just believed in God) and I've read the bible twice in my life, but as I started growing my views changed and I went to the atheist side. But after a while I learned that most atheists are close-minded fucks who don't respect other people's view and at the same time started learning more about other cultures and religions like Buddhism or Muslim and just decided that there's no way to prove god's existence or un-existence and went agnostic.

I can see both sides have good points, however the stupidity and intolerance of christian groups and hardcore creationists have made consider going full atheist again.

#30 Posted by Suicrat (3829 posts) -

Here's why God doesn't exist: Existence exists, if existed was created by a creator then there was existence before the creator. Unless the creator is nothingness or some shit like that, in which case it isn't god.

You can try and personify nature all you want, but in the end all you are doing is projecting your own image on to the universe, which is pretty blasphemous.

In other words, religious texts are blasphemy to themselves, in other words, their lack of logic is inescapable.

There's nothing wrong with poetic depictions of the universe, having said that, don't let these poetic depictions override your rational and empirical capacities.

#31 Posted by Gmanall (1707 posts) -

  Dang, I got auto log-off while typing a post.
  There is another place you are wrong you are not in fear of hell when you are saved. When you are saved you are saved for good and there is no way out. It would go against God if we could become unsaved.
  There is a old saying that goes like this "Serve God and do what you want" that is the life style of True Christens. It is more freedom then you will ever know.   
   

#32 Posted by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -
Gmanall said:
"  Dang, I got auto log-off while typing a post.   There is another place you are wrong you are not in fear of hell when you are saved. When you are saved you are saved for good and there is no way out. It would go against God if we could become unsaved.   There is a old saying that goes like this "Serve God and do what you want" that is the life style of True Christens. It is more freedom then you will ever know.        "
Wow Thank god you are saved. Cause I would want to life with god forever.
How do you explain dinosaurs?  A trick by god testing my beliefs? what about carbon dating? Ore being related to monkeys? How douse your god explain this?

I hope you don't feel like a spokesperson for god....

#33 Posted by Bioderm (198 posts) -

This is something that really scare me


  

#34 Posted by Geno (6768 posts) -

Sigh, go back to the drawing board please.

#35 Posted by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -

This is all done in fear and stupidity.

#36 Posted by Gmanall (1707 posts) -
THAfara0 said:
"Gmanall said:
"  Dang, I got auto log-off while typing a post.   There is another place you are wrong you are not in fear of hell when you are saved. When you are saved you are saved for good and there is no way out. It would go against God if we could become unsaved.   There is a old saying that goes like this "Serve God and do what you want" that is the life style of True Christens. It is more freedom then you will ever know.        "
Wow Thank god you are saved. Cause I would want to life with god forever.How do you explain dinosaurs?  A trick by god testing my beliefs? what about carbon dating? Ore being related to monkeys? How douse your god explain this?I hope you don't feel like a spokesperson for god...."
   Wow Sarcasm never heard someone talk like that before no never.
    He made the dinos and they all died WOOP end of story. Lets do another one shall we, carbon dating and ore monkeys are all based on subjective junk made to make it seem like they have scientific proof that God is not real (Sad that they have to sink that I mean you think that it would be easy to disprove Christens). Anyways God could have made the earth old like he did with Adam and Eve.
 
 
#37 Posted by ez123 (2010 posts) -
Carlos1408 said:
" When people say there is no proof of god existing, I say where is the proof that he doesn't exist, you can't proove either of them really.
The onus is on the person who believes to prove something. I don't have to prove that leprechauns don't exist, they just don't until someone discovers something new.
#38 Posted by JoelTGM (5783 posts) -

wonder how many pages this will get.

#39 Posted by crunchUK (6052 posts) -
daniel_beck_90 said:
"If you believe in God then be good for his sake
If you do not believe in God then be good for goodness

End of story "
everyone does as they please in the end
#40 Posted by Black_Rose (7772 posts) -
Gmanall said:
"   Wow Sarcasm never heard someone talk like that before no never.    He made the dinos and they all died WOOP end of story. Lets do another one shall we, carbon dating and ore monkeys are all based on subjective junk made to make it seem like they have scientific proof that God is not real (Sad that they have to sink that I mean you think that it would be easy to disprove Christens). Anyways God could have made the earth old like he did with Adam and Eve.   "
They don't have cientific proof that god is not real, they just have cientific facts that prove we are evolved monkeys.
#41 Edited by _Phara0h_ (925 posts) -

Ok sorry I just wanted to proof a point that you will go so far with your beliefs that you are making excuses for your god, and some of them really lame. 
Thats why it's a belief. And that's why I will never make you belief otherwise. I say peace lets agree to disagree.

You know if we started taxing god maybe we can out of this economic rescission.

#42 Posted by BiggerBomb (7012 posts) -

warthog said:

"
*****

what both fail to realize is that god exists but it is an evil god.If god is omnipresent,omnipotent then there would be no suffering or evil.the fact is that we are all trapped in this physical universe which is a creation of a demiurge and we are spiritual beings trapped.

*****

His/Her creation is a sick, evil creator.  The purpose of suffering according to the evil Controller is to extract energy from beings (like a generator generating power for the planet).  People must wake up to such lies and not be fooled or threatened by them. 

*****

also  there are beings on this planet who have souls and not.if you dont beleive in life after death then you dont have a soul.you have 1 life whereas other beings have souls and have to be born again and again

"


I hate to break it to you buddy, but that's not agnosticism. That's just fucking crazy.

#43 Posted by Suicrat (3829 posts) -

He's not talking about agnosticism, he's talking about its opposite: gnosticism. Which, yes, you're right in your description.

#44 Posted by Phished0ne (2659 posts) -
Black_Rose said:
"Gmanall said:
"   Wow Sarcasm never heard someone talk like that before no never.    He made the dinos and they all died WOOP end of story. Lets do another one shall we, carbon dating and ore monkeys are all based on subjective junk made to make it seem like they have scientific proof that God is not real (Sad that they have to sink that I mean you think that it would be easy to disprove Christens). Anyways God could have made the earth old like he did with Adam and Eve.   "
They don't have cientific proof that god is not real, they just have cientific facts that prove we are evolved monkeys. "

welllll..they dont even really have "proof" that we evolved from monkeys, the theory of evolution is still that.

Gmanall said:
   Wow Sarcasm never heard someone talk like that before no never.    He made the dinos and they all died WOOP end of story. Lets do another one shall we, carbon dating and ore monkeys are all based on subjective junk made to make it seem like they have scientific proof that God is not real (Sad that they have to sink that I mean you think that it would be easy to disprove Christens). Anyways God could have made the earth old like he did with Adam and Eve.   "
Here is my problem, anytime science brings up something, creationists instantly goes  "well god did that too".

It boils down to religion being something for people IF THEY NEED IT. But this thread is the sole reason why i strongly dislike most religious people, Why was this thread created? it seems that the person who came into it talking hardcore about religion is trying to convert people who dont believe, which is wrong.  If you were truely christlike you would allow other people to do as they wish, and not try to get them to think the same way as you.
#45 Posted by Aurelito (792 posts) -
Black_Rose said:
"I would tend to agree, however that article is just poor. I was a christian until a few years ago (I never went to church or anything like it, I just believed in God) and I've read the bible twice in my life, but as I started growing my views changed and I went to the atheist side. But after a while I learned that most atheists are close-minded fucks who don't respect other people's view and at the same time started learning more about other cultures and religions like Buddhism or Muslim and just decided that there's no way to prove god's existence or un-existence and went agnostic. I can see both sides have good points, however the stupidity and intolerance of christian groups and hardcore creationists have made consider going full atheist again. "
You can't keep your faith in god after reading bible, and you've read it twice. In other "text", there ain't claims about god created universe by blinking and poofing and never said that I'm the father of Jesus and never been claimed that "Alright fellas I'm a man leaving in the sky". instead, there are some explanations about existence of earth such as basic things like earth orbiting around the sun and other things that is very obvious to us now, but they weren't for a group of small time deserted nation who spent their time over war and drinking-like most of the guys doing now- so they kept me going and shown the path of logic to me. It's not the only thing, there other things as well, god is rather than the things you understand and because they were incompelete and irrational, so your believeness became same as them. Anyway, atheism is better than Christianity because it deals with logic in a more approximate rate.

Hail.
#46 Posted by TheGreatGuero (8882 posts) -

I almost started to comment on this topic since I'm atheist, but hey, check this out. I got a better idea!

-1.

#47 Posted by BiggerBomb (7012 posts) -
Suicrat said:
"He's not talking about agnosticism, he's talking about its opposite: gnosticism. Which, yes, you're right in your description."

Oh, is that so? I thought it was a typo! =P
#48 Posted by regularassmilk (1680 posts) -

...fucking what?

#49 Posted by regularassmilk (1680 posts) -

This thread shouldnt be on THIS website

#50 Posted by JJOR64 (19551 posts) -
regularassmilk said:
"This thread shouldnt be on THIS website"
Agreed.  This should be locked up and thrown into the pin.