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#2 Posted by TyCobb (1975 posts) -

As they mentioned in the article, they also slapped up a copy of it on pastebin if you do not want to feed them hits on this subject.

http://pastebin.com/kqtbeFzb

#3 Posted by MikeJFlick (444 posts) -

50% of gamers are women

and 80% of those women gamers are playing what exactly? facebook games? angry birds? sorry but they don't count, much like my playing of solitaire doesn't qualify me as a poker player.

#4 Edited by Darji (5293 posts) -

50% of gamers are women

and 80% of those women gamers are playing what exactly? facebook games? angry birds? sorry but they don't count, much like my playing of solitaire doesn't qualify me as a poker player.

I would not say that but when women play "core" games they really do not care much about this stuff in the first place.

#5 Posted by DarthOrange (3908 posts) -

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

#6 Posted by Animasta (14730 posts) -

@darji: because most of them have given up trying to change anything, more than likely.

#7 Edited by Darji (5293 posts) -

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

#8 Posted by FancySoapsMan (5818 posts) -

They made some interesting points, I guess.

But I still think that the recent discussions about sexism and games have been pretty dumb. And they just keep getting dumber!

yaaaaaaay

#9 Posted by JasonR86 (9729 posts) -

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

Don't be an asshole.

About the article, part of what makes this look so disingenuous is that this wasn't an issue until Anita Sarkeesian's kickstarter became such a big thing. Now everyone seems to talk about it and they all become big things (well, at least here and I'm sure elsewhere). From an outsider looking in it doesn't take much to think that the articles are being written with the intent to create traffic. That's always been my issue with all these articles anyway. I think the outward message is good though and I totally agree that we should all strive to reach equality for everyone of all races, genders, creeds, orientations, etc. etc. and if that means making a stink then so be it. Stink that shit up!

#10 Posted by Darji (5293 posts) -

@animasta said:

@darji: because most of them have given up trying to change anything, more than likely.

Or they just do not care. I know many women that are very independent and have a lot of self esteem and laugh about this bullshit. For example trash talking n online games is trash talking nothing more. Will you find Idiots who go to far? Sure but you can not remove idiocy from the world. The thing you can do is report them or block them.

Or look at the stupid controversy about the Dragons Crown Sorceress. It is just getting stupid and way overblown to a point were it is just annoying and no one wants to talk about the real issues that should be adressed anymore.

#11 Edited by BigJeffrey (5111 posts) -

I think this is a bullshit discussion among white males. I mean this FUCKING article is written by a male. John Walker sounds like a white blooded american male.

#12 Posted by mrfluke (5352 posts) -

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

#13 Posted by DarthOrange (3908 posts) -

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

It was a joke friend, Sony Santa Monica is run by a woman and is actually one of the, if not the most diverse video game studios in the industry. :)

#14 Edited by JasonR86 (9729 posts) -

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

#15 Posted by MariachiMacabre (7100 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

It really does.

#16 Posted by rebgav (1429 posts) -

I believe that there was already a thread on this article when it was fresh.

The lack of follow-up on 1reasonwhy is a little disconcerting given the self-congratulatory nature of the games bloggers' coverage of the original flurry of tweets. There are real people apparently experiencing real sexism first-hand in the games industry and yet the major sites seem content to let that slide while kicking up a fuss over shitty zombie-boob statues and machinima videos. I understand that it's easier to write about whatever marketing junk shows up in your inbox but it's surprising that there hasn't been more serious investigation and legitimate coverage, there's clearly a problem and a real desire to have it addressed.

#17 Edited by Slag (4899 posts) -

@jasonr86: revolutions ain't always pretty man. And the people who start them aren't always great people. These Johnny come late-lys may be not purely altruistic in their intent, but they are beneficial to keep the public's focus on the issue. Every movement needs followers.

I'm no fan of Sarkeesian, but if her kickstarter shenanigans by some miracle actually lead to real positive change because it got meaningful people to actually do something about it, I'm cool with it.

This fire has been waiting to burn for a long long time. Does it matter who the spark was?

#18 Edited by mrfluke (5352 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

Is it still defined as racist then if "racist" dude has a black friend? or rather said person is just kind of a dick?

With the context from the devs via twitter, imo that trophy name is more crass/crude, than misogynist/sexist

#19 Posted by JasonR86 (9729 posts) -

@slag said:

@jasonr86: revolutions ain't always pretty man. And the people who start them aren't always great people. These Johnny come late-lys may be not purely altruistic in their intent, but they are beneficial to keep the public's focus on the issue. Every movement needs followers.

I'm no fan of Sarkeesian, but if her kickstarter shenanigans by some miracle actually lead to real positive change because it got meaningful people to actually do something about it, I'm cool with it.

This fire has been waiting to burn for a long long time. Does it matter who the spark was?

I don't have any problem with Anita or anyone else. I'm just giving my impression of some of these articles and why they might rub people the wrong way. But whatever. Everyone's got to get their's.

#20 Posted by Animasta (14730 posts) -

I think this is a bullshit discussion among white males. I mean this FUCKING article is written by a male. John Walker sounds like a white blooded american male.

which, you know, he explains, in the article.

if you had read it you would realize that

(RPS also features Cara Ellison who is by far my favorite person there since Kieron left, and they also feature Leigh Alexander on occasion)

#21 Edited by Milkman (17342 posts) -

Oh fuck, here we go....

#22 Posted by JasonR86 (9729 posts) -

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

Is it still defined as racist then if "racist" dude has a black friend? or rather said person is just kind of a dick?

With the context from the devs via twitter, imo that trophy name is more crass/crude, than misogynist/sexist

One's friendships have no bearings on the nature of one's beliefs or precludes behaviors and attitudes. That's the joke. Every racist person has a black friend when they are around non-racist.

#23 Posted by Darji (5293 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

Don't be an asshole.

About the article, part of what makes this look so disingenuous is that this wasn't an issue until Anita Sarkeesian's kickstarter became such a big thing. Now everyone seems to talk about it and they all become big things (well, at least here and I'm sure elsewhere). From an outsider looking in it doesn't take much to think that the articles are being written with the intent to create traffic. That's always been my issue with all these articles anyway. I think the outward message is good though and I totally agree that we should all strive to reach equality for everyone of all races, genders, creeds, orientations, etc. etc. and if that means making a stink then so be it. Stink that shit up!

I am sorry but stuff likes this just makes me upset. The trophy name is really no issue it is an saying that you should care more about your friends than about some "one night stand" Or in this case Orccus decided for friendship to Kratos instead to bow to his mother's will. The whole thing got way to blown up with Sessler's misinformed video which he not even once apologized for.

And yes I agree we should strive for as much equality for everyone as much as possible but you can not archive that with using words like feminism or patriarchy. The moment you try to make one gender or race special you will never archive equality. And today's feminism is mostly not about equality anymore. It is about more and more privileges compared to men. For example women get special education possibilities and help that men do not get and because of that men are falling more and more behind in terms of education. I can even link you to a seminar hold by a "famous" feminists that actually says that they even fake statistics for their Textbooks they use at university to "train" and manipulate this new generation of feminists.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgpbDpXrEr4

#24 Edited by mrfluke (5352 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

Is it still defined as racist then if "racist" dude has a black friend? or rather said person is just kind of a dick?

With the context from the devs via twitter, imo that trophy name is more crass/crude, than misogynist/sexist

One's friendships have no bearings on the nature of one's beliefs or precludes behaviors and attitudes. That's the joke. Every racist person has a black friend when they are around non-racist.

You're definitely one of my favorites around here

#25 Edited by Animasta (14730 posts) -

@darji:

I like how even you included quotes (I assume they are air quotes) in your bullshit statement.

#26 Posted by mrfluke (5352 posts) -

@milkman said:

Oh fuck, here we go....

yep, this thread is gonna get hundreds of hits, for better or worse.

#27 Posted by JasonR86 (9729 posts) -

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

Is it still defined as racist then if "racist" dude has a black friend? or rather said person is just kind of a dick?

With the context from the devs via twitter, imo that trophy name is more crass/crude, than misogynist/sexist

One's friendships have no bearings on the nature of one's beliefs or precludes behaviors and attitudes. That's the joke. Every racist person has a black friend when they are around non-racist.

You're definitely one of my favorites around here

awww.

#28 Posted by Darji (5293 posts) -

@rebgav said:

I believe that there was already a thread on this article when it was fresh.

The lack of follow-up on 1reasonwhy is a little disconcerting given the self-congratulatory nature of the games bloggers' coverage of the original flurry of tweets. There are real people apparently experiencing real sexism first-hand in the games industry and yet the major sites seem content to let that slide while kicking up a fuss over shitty zombie-boob statues and machinima videos. I understand that it's easier to write about whatever marketing junk shows up in your inbox but it's surprising that there hasn't been more serious investigation and legitimate coverage, there's clearly a problem and a real desire to have it addressed.

Exactly. This whole conversation right now about is it too much boob or not is just getting stupid. We really should focus on the real problems here and not meaningless shit like this.

#29 Posted by Slag (4899 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

@slag said:

@jasonr86: revolutions ain't always pretty man. And the people who start them aren't always great people. These Johnny come late-lys may be not purely altruistic in their intent, but they are beneficial to keep the public's focus on the issue. Every movement needs followers.

I'm no fan of Sarkeesian, but if her kickstarter shenanigans by some miracle actually lead to real positive change because it got meaningful people to actually do something about it, I'm cool with it.

This fire has been waiting to burn for a long long time. Does it matter who the spark was?

I don't have any problem with Anita or anyone else. I'm just giving my impression of some of these articles and why they might rub people the wrong way. But whatever. Everyone's got to get their's.

fair enough man, I can see that.

I'm sure everyone is sick to death by now of this discussion, who isn't? I would think many people in the 60's got super sick of the Civil Rights movement too.

me-too articles like this just seem like a natural evolutionary step in a movement to me. They aren't usually great and maybe they are just cashing in on the debate, but I'm not sure it matters if they are great as much as it matters they are happening. Critical mass and all that.

It is what it is.

#30 Edited by Darji (5293 posts) -

@animasta said:

@darji:

I like how even you included quotes (I assume they are air quotes) in your bullshit statement.

I used these because I do not know especially if the is that famous or not. But she is really hated among these new radical feminists. And maybe you should watch her video before even trying to explain why this is bullshit.

#31 Posted by Sergio (2261 posts) -

The #1reasonwhy and #1reasontobe made sense at GDC, since that is about women in the gaming industry, but I don't understand why Anita was there. She's not a developer and not actually in the gaming industry. Are they now letting anyone have a panel at GDC as if it were PAX?

Other than that, I don't really have much to say about the RPS article. I agree with what he's saying, but I also think we should actually discuss things sanely instead of jumping the gun as much as gaming journalist have been doing recently and labeling some things with a knee-jerk reaction. It seems like there are too many people who don't know what the word "misogyny" means. Those who might disagree with one particular instance or another aren't trolls and aren't trying to subvert equality.

#32 Posted by FengShuiGod (1492 posts) -

It's like no one in the videogame industry (on either side of this debate) has ever read a book. Ever.

#33 Edited by Animasta (14730 posts) -

@darji: why? are you going to honestly discuss things with me or complain about radical feminism some more?

I don't even see what that has to do with anything anyway, because the state of women in video games is pretty shameful, real woman or otherwise, and that's what we're discussing; not radical feminism.

#34 Edited by mrfluke (5352 posts) -

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@jasonr86 said:

@mrfluke said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

agreed especially when santa monica devs came out on twitter and said it was a female lead that named that trophy

(im not here to debate over this bullshit btw, just dropped in to say this piece above)

Sounds like "I'm not racist! I'll have you know I have a black friend!"

Is it still defined as racist then if "racist" dude has a black friend? or rather said person is just kind of a dick?

With the context from the devs via twitter, imo that trophy name is more crass/crude, than misogynist/sexist

One's friendships have no bearings on the nature of one's beliefs or precludes behaviors and attitudes. That's the joke. Every racist person has a black friend when they are around non-racist.

You're definitely one of my favorites around here

awww.

lol no bullshit, you got a good wise opinion going on.

#35 Edited by Milkman (17342 posts) -

Love the term "radical feminist." I just imagine a woman doing a kickflip while screaming "DON'T OBJECTIFY ME" with a ripping guitar solo in the background.

#36 Edited by Animasta (14730 posts) -

@milkman said:

Love the term "radical feminist." I just imagine a woman doing a kickflip while screaming "DON'T OBJECTIFY ME" with a ripping guitar solo in the background.

do they do the hand wiggle with the pinky and thumb extended?

#37 Edited by Darji (5293 posts) -

@animasta said:

@darji: why? are you going to honestly discuss things with me or complain about radical feminism some more?

I don't even see what that has to do with anything anyway, because the state of women in video games is pretty shameful, real woman or otherwise, and that's what we're discussing; not radical feminism.

Oh I agree with that but the state of characters in general is pretty poor to begin with so we should strive to better Characters. Also what does qualify for a pretty poor female character? Only because she has big boobs and shows it too much or are you talking about the character itself? Because if you try to argue with the first than I will totally disagree with you.

#38 Posted by Sergio (2261 posts) -

Is "radical feminist" the politically-correct way to say "feminazi?" I know some women classify themselves as different types of feminist, such as "lipstick feminist," but I've never heard of one classify themselves as "radical feminist."

#39 Posted by DarthOrange (3908 posts) -

@darji said:

@jasonr86 said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

Don't be an asshole.

About the article, part of what makes this look so disingenuous is that this wasn't an issue until Anita Sarkeesian's kickstarter became such a big thing. Now everyone seems to talk about it and they all become big things (well, at least here and I'm sure elsewhere). From an outsider looking in it doesn't take much to think that the articles are being written with the intent to create traffic. That's always been my issue with all these articles anyway. I think the outward message is good though and I totally agree that we should all strive to reach equality for everyone of all races, genders, creeds, orientations, etc. etc. and if that means making a stink then so be it. Stink that shit up!

I am sorry but stuff likes this just makes me upset. The trophy name is really no issue it is an saying that you should care more about your friends than about some "one night stand" Or in this case Orccus decided for friendship to Kratos instead to bow to his mother's will. The whole thing got way to blown up with Sessler's misinformed video which he not even once apologized for.

And yes I agree we should strive for as much equality for everyone as much as possible but you can not archive that with using words like feminism or patriarchy. The moment you try to make one gender or race special you will never archive equality. And today's feminism is mostly not about equality anymore. It is about more and more privileges compared to men. For example women get special education possibilities and help that men do not get and because of that men are falling more and more behind in terms of education. I can even link you to a seminar hold by a "famous" feminists that actually says that they even fake statistics for their Textbooks they use at university to "train" and manipulate this new generation of feminists.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgpbDpXrEr4

I agree with some of those things that lady says, do you have another 2 or 3 professionals that can back up her claims? She places a lot of blame on liberals and seems just as guilty of pushing her own agenda as the radical feminists she detests so much.

#40 Edited by Animasta (14730 posts) -

@darji: the fact that a character has big boobs means nothing; it's about how much they're emphasized vs. actual characterization.

Like that sorceress thing lately? I didn't like it because the boobs were the focus and she had barely any notable features beyond big boobs. The archer doesn't and thus is better designed and more interesting as a result.

#41 Posted by Demoskinos (15179 posts) -

*sigh*

#42 Posted by JasonR86 (9729 posts) -

@animasta said:

@darji: the fact that a character has big boobs means nothing; it's about how much they're emphasized vs. actual characterization.

Like that sorceress thing lately? I didn't like it because the boobs were the focus and she had barely any notable features beyond big boobs. The archer doesn't and thus is better designed and more interesting as a result.

She had some odd ab muscles happening there too. And she kind of looked odd. And shitty. And her boobs were ridiculous.

#43 Edited by Mirado (1057 posts) -

Duders, please. Just...this isn't even a new article. I've got no issue with discussing sexism in the video game industry, but we danced this dance already. We discussed the hell out of this one. Everyone is just saying the same shit again, good or bad.

Head over here! I made a think talking about Divekick! Shameless self promotion, but really. Come up for fucking air for one damn moment, then plunge back into the water and try to drown each other afterward. Have a bit of fun discussing a stupid thing before you get no more joy out of either these forums or games themselves.

This is a serious issue. It is not the only issue. It deserves your full attention, but not all of it all the time. Step out of the echo chamber for a moment. Like it or hate it, give yourself a little change of pace with a bit of Divekick before heading back into the ring to pummel each other into the ground.

#44 Edited by Darji (5293 posts) -

@animasta said:

@darji: the fact that a character has big boobs means nothing; it's about how much they're emphasized vs. actual characterization.

Like that sorceress thing lately? I didn't like it because the boobs were the focus and she had barely any notable features beyond big boobs. The archer doesn't and thus is better designed and more interesting as a result.

I do not like it either but I do not think it is harmful in anyway. For me this stuff is just like porn. It is there for a special audience and that is it. For example I think Bioware does a great job of showing whats wrong with this Industry. They are creating really offensive and harmful characters but no one really seems to care.

Take a look at this although it is not a bad female representation but a transsexual one.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2p_4DIiPHA

This is what I consider offensive and harmful.

But instead people try to argue how ICO or Mario is a sexist game.Or how Persona 4 is anti gay... It is just sad to watch all this....

#45 Edited by Onced (109 posts) -

I enjoyed the article, the part pertaining to Machinima was especially vulgar. However I find it slightly disconcerting that the writer initially introduced the topic by stating "I want to communicate, not garner some hits on a graph" then closes the comment section. Upon reading the suffix, I can understand that he doesn't wish to have the comment section ladened with abusive vitirol. However I feel as if he's trying to create a Velvet Revolution wherein the sexist masses suddenly realise the error of their ways.

I feel that for any change to occur in the industry, there needs to be harsh criticism on both sides - even if that includes comment sections that resemble an emotional quagmire. Hopefully throughout the controversy, a maturing consensus will actually occur and potentially some form of change enacted. I'm not trying to be an anarchist, but by all means, create more discussion on this issue.

#46 Edited by Ravenlight (8011 posts) -

These threads are great for spreading awareness and making lists of people who are sexist douchebags.

@mirado said:

Duders, please. Just...this isn't even a new article. I've got no issue with discussing sexism in the video game industry, but we danced this dance already. We discussed the hell out of this one. Everyone is just saying the same shit again, good or bad.

The problem lies with people still saying the bad shit. When everybody is okay with acting like a decent fucking human being, the threads will stop.

#47 Edited by Darji (5293 posts) -

@darthorange said:

@darji said:

@jasonr86 said:

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

That Sony Santa Monica could learn a thing or two about sexism, with their offensive trophy names in games that are created by teams comprised entirely of men.

The trophy name was in no sense sexist or misogynistic. Try to think before putting out such bullshit^^

Don't be an asshole.

About the article, part of what makes this look so disingenuous is that this wasn't an issue until Anita Sarkeesian's kickstarter became such a big thing. Now everyone seems to talk about it and they all become big things (well, at least here and I'm sure elsewhere). From an outsider looking in it doesn't take much to think that the articles are being written with the intent to create traffic. That's always been my issue with all these articles anyway. I think the outward message is good though and I totally agree that we should all strive to reach equality for everyone of all races, genders, creeds, orientations, etc. etc. and if that means making a stink then so be it. Stink that shit up!

I am sorry but stuff likes this just makes me upset. The trophy name is really no issue it is an saying that you should care more about your friends than about some "one night stand" Or in this case Orccus decided for friendship to Kratos instead to bow to his mother's will. The whole thing got way to blown up with Sessler's misinformed video which he not even once apologized for.

And yes I agree we should strive for as much equality for everyone as much as possible but you can not archive that with using words like feminism or patriarchy. The moment you try to make one gender or race special you will never archive equality. And today's feminism is mostly not about equality anymore. It is about more and more privileges compared to men. For example women get special education possibilities and help that men do not get and because of that men are falling more and more behind in terms of education. I can even link you to a seminar hold by a "famous" feminists that actually says that they even fake statistics for their Textbooks they use at university to "train" and manipulate this new generation of feminists.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgpbDpXrEr4

I agree with some of those things that lady says, do you have another 2 or 3 professionals that can back up her claims? She places a lot of blame on liberals and seems just as guilty of pushing her own agenda as the radical feminists she detests so much.

That is the problem. Of course everyone will push his/her own opinion. One who I really like is the Amazing Atheist. He maybe a bit direct and harsh but it is a lot of truth he is saying. Also he is going a lot about these terms of feminists or patriarchy. Just watch these 10 minutes for example.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-Nw3zyYpvs

Oh and if you want to see these radical feminists.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2KPeMcYsuc&list=UUjNxszyFPasDdRoD9J6X-sw&index=8

#48 Edited by DarthOrange (3908 posts) -

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

I agree with some of those things that lady says, do you have another 2 or 3 professionals that can back up her claims? She places a lot of blame on liberals and seems just as guilty of pushing her own agenda as the radical feminists she detests so much.

That is the problem. Of course everyone will push his/her own opinion. One who I really like is the Amazing Atheist. He maybe a bit direct and harsh but it is a lot of truth he is saying. Also he is going a lot about these terms of feminists or patriarchy. Just watch these 10 minutes for example.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-Nw3zyYpvs

Oh and if you want to see these radical feminists.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2KPeMcYsuc&list=UUjNxszyFPasDdRoD9J6X-sw&index=8

...That man is not a professional, he is just a random man on youtube trying to sell T-Shirts and books with no credibility. At all. None. And he is an asshole. In this video he says that people who kill themselves after being bullied are pussies. He is the worst kind of human being.

Er ist ein schrecklicher Mensch. Bitte nie sehen diesen Mann wieder.

#49 Posted by Animasta (14730 posts) -

@darji: the amazing atheist also put a banana up his butt.

also he's human scum

so thanks for letting me know that debating you will be useless!

#50 Posted by Darji (5293 posts) -

@darji said:

@darthorange said:

I agree with some of those things that lady says, do you have another 2 or 3 professionals that can back up her claims? She places a lot of blame on liberals and seems just as guilty of pushing her own agenda as the radical feminists she detests so much.

That is the problem. Of course everyone will push his/her own opinion. One who I really like is the Amazing Atheist. He maybe a bit direct and harsh but it is a lot of truth he is saying. Also he is going a lot about these terms of feminists or patriarchy. Just watch these 10 minutes for example.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-Nw3zyYpvs

Oh and if you want to see these radical feminists.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2KPeMcYsuc&list=UUjNxszyFPasDdRoD9J6X-sw&index=8

...That man is not a professional, he is just a random man on youtube trying to sell T-Shirts and books with no credibility. At all. None. And he is an asshole. In this video he says that people who kill themselves after being bullied are pussies. He is the worst kind of human being.

Er ist ein schrecklicher Mensch. Bitte nie sehen diesen Mann wieder.

Ok first of all I never said he is a professional and honestly I did not even know him for is older videos. I stumbled across them through these feminist videos. And on this point I agree with him but that does not mean I will agree on everything he says. And yes the bullying stuff was stupid and I would never agree with that. However. Regarding the equality stuff I was watching I am agreeing with him.

@animasta Why? Because I think that you can not archive any form of equality if you only look at one side? If so then yeah I think the same about you.