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#1 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

I really think they are (excluding the 3rd). I've always found the Saw movies way over-the-top (and not in a good way). I'd even say the best Saw movies aren't as good as the first 2 Hostels.

The thing that makes Hostel better is it seems much more grounded in reality and the idea that the average family man could also be a sadistic killer who pays to torture and kill people for a thrill is way creepier than some old man who kills based on a twisted sense of justice.

I also feel that the idea of an organization that kidnaps and sells people for torture is beyond fucked up, but also believable, which makes it even creepier.

I really think the first 2 Hostels are highly under-rated horror films that get wrongly branded as nothing more than "torture porn" or a Saw rip-off.

So what do you guys think? Am I the only one of this opinion?

#2 Posted by Hailinel (24818 posts) -

Wait, there's a Hostel 3?

#3 Posted by Seedofpower (3930 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

Wait, there's a Hostel 3?

Haha, I asked the same thing. Apparently came out last year.

#4 Posted by Tim_the_Corsair (3065 posts) -

Both franchises have no redeeming qualities whatsoever.

#5 Posted by PeasantAbuse (5138 posts) -

I've only seen the first in each series and didn't really like either one. I guess Hostel is a bit better than Saw because it didn't have Cary Elwes.

#6 Posted by SethPhotopoulos (5263 posts) -

@Tim_the_Corsair said:

Both franchises have no redeeming qualities whatsoever.

I'd agree with that.

#7 Posted by frankfartmouth (1018 posts) -

That's an unpopular opinion? The first Saw movie was OK, but the rest are just derivative, sequel-spawned dreck. The first Hostel was pretty damn good, I thought. Flawed, for sure, but most horror movies are. Objectively, I'd say it's at least a wash, but the whole yearly Saw entry thing has sent that whole franchise to shit for me.

#8 Posted by SeriouslyNow (8534 posts) -

@Tim_the_Corsair said:

Both franchises have no redeeming qualities whatsoever.

Well Saw is an Aussie franchise of sorts. There's that.

#9 Posted by Hailinel (24818 posts) -

@Seedofpower said:

@Hailinel said:

Wait, there's a Hostel 3?

Haha, I asked the same thing. Apparently came out last year.

Holy shit. I just read the plot synopsis on Wikipedia, and whoever wrote it makes it sound utterly batshit insane:

Justin gets strapped into a chair and a mist settles in the room. A woman dressed in a penguin costume comes out with a crossbow and shoots Justin multiple times, killing him while Carter, Flemming, and Travis watch.

A woman in a penguin costume with a crossbow? Man, what?

#10 Posted by JEC03 (900 posts) -

I like the Cube movies more then both but If I had to pick one I guess Hostel.

#11 Posted by Khadyn (228 posts) -

Just watched Hostel Part III earlier today and it was ok. Agree the first 2 were much better and highly recommend them if you haven't seen them. As for Saw...I liked the first one but, it pretty much died and haven't seen any past the second one.

#12 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

Wait, there's a Hostel 3?

Yup, it's a shitty direct to DVD sequel made without Eli Roth's involvement or consent.

#13 Posted by MikeGosot (3227 posts) -

Saw is cool. The first one at least. And i like elaborate killing and mindless violence.

#14 Posted by awesomeusername (4185 posts) -

@Tim_the_Corsair said:

Both franchises have no redeeming qualities whatsoever.
#15 Posted by Hailinel (24818 posts) -

@JEC03 said:

I like the Cube movies more then both but If I had to pick one I guess Hostel.

I never saw the second Cube, but I saw the first, which was all right (though the ending could have been better). Cube Zero, on the other hand, completely removed good feelings I had for the original by painting the people behind the project as completely absurd. It's like the Cube series went from oppressive, faceless, psychological villainy to Saturday morning cartoon.

#16 Posted by MrKlorox (11209 posts) -

Sure. And Earthworm Jim is better than Super Mario World...

#17 Posted by Seedofpower (3930 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

A woman in a penguin costume with a crossbow? Man, what?

Holy shit, that sounds totally fucking hilarious. I need to gather some friends and some liquor and watch that movie.

#18 Posted by Landon (4143 posts) -

Saw 1 is the only good Saw. It was mysterious and cool, and it implied a lot of the violence instead of only focusing on it.

As for Hostle, I've only seen the first one, and only the last hour or so of it on TV. I enjoyed it more than I thought I would, but I still think Saw 1 is better.

#19 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

@Seedofpower said:

@Hailinel said:

A woman in a penguin costume with a crossbow? Man, what?

Holy shit, that sounds totally fucking hilarious. I need to gather some friends and some liquor and watch that movie.

Well prepare to be disappointed. I recently watched the 3rd one on Netflix and it doesn't really look like a penguin outfit. She looks more like a female version of Kabal from Mortal Kombat. A completely lame scene just like every other scene in Hostel 3.

#20 Posted by bassman2112 (837 posts) -

I really like the first few Saw movies. I am willing to bet most of the people who are talking shit about it haven't seen any, because (at least) Saw 1 is astounding.

Hostel is weird, I only saw the first one and wasn't really that into it. By the end all I could think was "I don't feel like that did anything on any level for me."

#21 Edited by CornBREDX (5300 posts) -

I disagree. 
Hostel is a boring piece of crap. An hour of boring touring through Europe with unlikable characters and awful dialogue, then 20 minutes of torture and 10 minutes of escape (these are estimates).
I found Hostile to be incredibly slow, boring, and almost unwatchable. Saw is a pop corn horror flick with a well paced story, understandable characters, and the fascinating look at the "what would you do if you were in this situation" that made it enjoyable. 
Only speaking for the first one of each, i don't care much for debating sequels.
That is of course my opinion. To each his own. =) 
 
@JEC03 said:

I like the Cube movies more then both...

I agree with this part of your sentence (Except the second cube movie. That movie is nonsense).
#22 Posted by Napalm (9020 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

Wait, there's a Hostel 3?

There's a Hostel 2?!

#23 Posted by Hailinel (24818 posts) -

@Lobster_Ear said:

@Seedofpower said:

@Hailinel said:

A woman in a penguin costume with a crossbow? Man, what?

Holy shit, that sounds totally fucking hilarious. I need to gather some friends and some liquor and watch that movie.

Well prepare to be disappointed. I recently watched the 3rd one on Netflix and it doesn't really look like a penguin outfit. She looks more like a female version of Kabal from Mortal Kombat. A completely lame scene just like every other scene in Hostel 3.

Bummer. I liked the image I had concocted in my head better.

#24 Edited by LackLuster (719 posts) -

I watched all of the Saw films for an article in my campus paper and the only ones that are even somewhat entertaining are Saw I and II. I have not seen the Hostel moves, but it would not be hard to beat the Saw films.

The main issue with the Saw's is that they completely beat you over the fucking head with the twist that happens in every movie even though they aren't difficult to grasp at all.

#25 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

@CornBREDX said:

I disagree. Hostel is a boring piece of crap. An hour of boring touring through Europe with unlikable characters and awful dialogue, then 20 minutes of torture and 10 minutes of escape (these are estimates).I found Hostile to be incredibly slow, boring, and almost unwatchable. Saw is a pop corn horror flick with a well paced story, understandable characters, and the fascinating look at the "what would you do if you were in this situation" that made it enjoyable. Only speaking for the first one of each, i don't care much for debating sequels.That is of course my opinion. To each his own. =)

Understandable. Though I feel that the first half of Hostel actually adds to the movie because until roughly the halfway point they are just a few douchey Americans having a good time in Europe and then everything abruptly turns to shit and I think without that contrast the movie wouldn't be as effective.

#26 Posted by PrivateIronTFU (3874 posts) -

Popular opinion: They're all ass.

#27 Posted by CornBREDX (5300 posts) -
@Hailinel: I feel there's a conversation there. I thought the third Cube movie was brilliant. At first it seems nonsensical with these guys who seemingly "work for the cube" but by the end we aren't so sure anymore. They seem to be in a hell of their own. 
 
It wasn't as well written as the first, but it had merit continuing the questioning of "What is the cube?" "Who created it?" " Why is it here?" and expounded on it by giving us reason to question who runs it even and why and if they even know who they work for and if they even know what they are really doing. 
 
That's what I thought anyway. It was an interesting take on it.
#28 Edited by StrainedEyes (1324 posts) -

Disagree, the Saw franchise is one of the best horror franchises ever. Hostel is boring.

#29 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

@PrivateIronTFU said:

Popular opinion: They're all ass.

I would never say they are amazing movies. I mean, I would never have either series in my collection, but I still think Hostel deserves more credit than it gets and is overall better than Saw.

#30 Edited by PeasantAbuse (5138 posts) -

Remember when the guy in Hostel was puking with the ball gag on? Yeah that was gross.

#31 Posted by Redbullet685 (6044 posts) -

The first Saw is actually a great movie and I don't like Hostel at all. So just because of the first Saw (the rest are mediocre at best), I will say that the Saw franchise is better.

#32 Posted by CornBREDX (5300 posts) -
@Lobster_Ear: While I agree it is necessary, Eli Roth couldn't write himself out of a paper bag and creating the dichotomy required here did not work. He's one of the worst director/writers and only thing I really enjoyed that involved him was Inglorious Bastards. 
 
Don't get me wrong, either. I know what he was going for, I'm a fan of 70s horror camp as well. The problem with some of these films, and maybe he captured to well, was their slow pacing and awful dialogue. Quentin Tarantino does similar but the difference with Tarantino was he more often then not finds a way to make it watchable when he write those kind of omages (such as Dusk til Dawn- which yes you can also thank Robert Rodriguez for as well).  
 
So, it's not like I don't like that kind of film. I just don't think Eli Roth put it together in an entertaining way. 
#33 Edited by Kidavenger (3556 posts) -

The first Saw movie is not just a good horror movie; its a good movie period.

I've only seen the second Hostel and I didn't think it was very good; the plot was weak and just seemed like a dumb excuse for some gory stuff to happen, pretty much like the rest of the Saw franchise, I do think it was more extreme/disturbing than any of the Saw movies though.

#34 Posted by PrivateIronTFU (3874 posts) -

@Lobster_Ear said:

@PrivateIronTFU said:

Popular opinion: They're all ass.

I would never say they are amazing movies. I mean, I would never have either series in my collection, but I still think Hostel deserves more credit than it gets and is overall better than Saw.

Yeah, I guess if I had to pick, I would say Hostel beats Saw.

I actually really wanted to like Saw, because of the actually pretty good cast they got for the original. I mean, Danny Glover, come on. And hell, the posters for the film really had me interested. It was definitely something I knew I'd never seen before. But then I saw it.

It was after that film that I realized, if horror movies want to keep me entertained, put in some damn characters that I actually give a shit about.

#35 Posted by TooWalrus (13202 posts) -

I haven't seen any of the Hostel movies, and I've only seen Saw 1, 2 and 6. Really, the only one worth watching is the first Saw.

#36 Edited by Mystyr_E (1190 posts) -

They're all terrible and trying to say Hostel's better than Saw is just arguing what side of a shit-covered coin is cleaner

Edit: and oddly enough, that's my 666th post

#37 Posted by Akeldama (4247 posts) -

@Hailinel said:

Wait, there's a Hostel 3?

I just watched it on Netflix like a week ago. Fucking awful.

However, I tend to agree with this thread. Hostel 1 and 2 are much better than anything the Saw films did.

#38 Edited by I_Stay_Puft (3393 posts) -

If comparing the first movies in each franchise I would have to go with Saw I over Hostel 1. While both movies were equally gruesome, Hostel was one of movie where the main characters fates were decided and there was really nothing they could do. What makes Saw terrifying, was that Jigsaw was A. a puppet (or so we thought) and B. gave the victim the choice, do I mutilate myself and suffer this pain and try to continue it or do I die. Am I able to exert this pain on somebody else in order to save myself? Hostel showcases the worst in human beings, while Saw examined the worst in the characters themselves. Besides in the beginning, I thought it was an f-ing puppet on a bicycle who did all this and that's pretty damn creepy.

#39 Posted by HistoryInRust (6316 posts) -

I agree with the OP's sentiment one-hundred percent.

#40 Posted by ImmortalSaiyan (4677 posts) -

I have never seen any Saw or Hostel move. From my understand they are just gruesome violence for it's own sake, is this correct?

#41 Posted by PixelPrinny (1030 posts) -

I think you're wrong and here's why:

The original Saw wasn't in your face torture porn like the subsequent ones in the series or any of the Hostel movies were. Saw was about a few people in a helpless situation having to make great sacrifices to get out of it. Much of the horror was more implied than actually visualized.

Hostel never had this psychological element to it. It was just watching some 'Merican Asshole types acting dumb, getting kidnapped, then watching all but one of them die horrifically. Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that's an inherently bad thing and you're certainly more than welcome to enjoy that sort of movie. It's just not on the same level as something that goes for a more psychological type of horror. In fact, I would argue that the only movie in either franchise that could be truly considered "horror" would be the original Saw.

Now if you were to remove the original Saw and go from 2 onward where they really do become more torture porny then sure, you've got an argument, although I still enjoy the Saw movies more just because Jigsaw is a far more interesting character than any of the Hostel characters (hell, I can't remember any Hostel character names, even, as they're usually in and out within the same movie).

But different strokes for different folks. If you prefer Hostel over Saw, then all the power to ya.

#42 Edited by Yummylee (21652 posts) -

I'll admit that the Saw series (movies, never tried the games) is a guilty pleasure of mine. I haven't actually seen the last one, though, but the first, third and sixth I think are alright... I think; in all honesty, they've all kinda become a little jumbled and I sometimes get them mixed up. And it admittedly all become fucking ludicrous even by Saw standards after the third, but I'm a bit of gore junkie and I enjoy the elaborate traps and wacky twist-endings.

I've only seen the first Hostel, but I also remember enjoying that too a fair amount, especially for the lead character's performance. Hostel most definitely made me feel much more uncomfortable than the Saw movies generally did, though.

EDIT: Also I agree with the folks in here about the Cube movies. the first two Cube movies at least are pretty stellar, whereas for the third all I can remember is the opening scene where the guy drowns in acid after mistaking it for water...

#43 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

@ImmortalSaiyan said:

I have never seen any Saw or Hostel move. From my understand they are just gruesome violence for it's own sake, is this correct?

I wouldn't say that's fair. I think both movies offer an eerie sense of dread and hopelessness that perhaps requires the viewer to wonder "What if I was in their shoes?" in order to get the most out of it. The gore is definitely there but it's not the main focus.

A movie that better fits your description is The Human Centipede 2. DO NOT watch that fucking movie.

#44 Posted by MildMolasses (3221 posts) -

While I am a fan of the saw series, I will admit that they are terrible movies. The first was the only one with an original idea, but it was crippled by horrific acting. Hostel was an awful film that did nothing but rip off scenes from Takashi Miike films. So much so that it became predictable. Hostel 2 was a terrible film notable for showing that chick from Welcome to the Dollhouse naked and covered in blood, and a pretty amazing monologue from Rick Hoffman. Perhaps Hostel 3 is amazing, but I really can't take any more of it. Saw at least has a mythology running through it, even if it is overly convoluted and contrived

#45 Posted by Lobster_Ear (285 posts) -

@MildMolasses said:

While I am a fan of the saw series, I will admit that they are terrible movies. The first was the only one with an original idea, but it was crippled by horrific acting. Hostel was an awful film that did nothing but rip off scenes from Takashi Miike films. So much so that it became predictable. Hostel 2 was a terrible film notable for showing that chick from Welcome to the Dollhouse naked and covered in blood, and a pretty amazing monologue from Rick Hoffman. Perhaps Hostel 3 is amazing, but I really can't take any more of it. Saw at least has a mythology running through it, even if it is overly convoluted and contrived

Funny because Takashi Miike was actually in the first Hostel, so maybe he didn't feel that way or maybe those scenes were homages.

#46 Posted by Symptomz (130 posts) -

Agreed. But I think the general populous prefers Saw for it's story that's gone on like, 5 movies too long.

#47 Posted by crusader8463 (14422 posts) -

The first Saw was pretty neat, but they ran that series into the ground fast for me. I only recall watching the first 2 Hostel movies and liking them more then saw. Just not really into the torture porn movies any more.

#48 Posted by Apparatus_Unearth (3153 posts) -

I really like all of the Saw movies except the seventh one. I've seen the first two Hostel movies, and they're quite good.

#49 Posted by Still_I_Cry (2494 posts) -

Hostel made me feel like my brain was oozing out of my ears because it was both unbearably moronic and boring.

At least Saw was somewhat entertaining (barring the last 3-4)

#50 Posted by Yummylee (21652 posts) -

Also speaking of Torture Porn movies, another solid is The Loved Ones. As you'd expect, it's got some fucking nasty material in here, but the acting is surprisingly competent and it's got a lot of effectively intense scenes.