Vice Guide: THE JAPANESE LOVE INDUSTRY

Since some people are really interested in Japan I think it deserves a thread. It is about Japanese people and their social love live and why Japan is dying. It is slightly NSFW.!!!! Which means you will see a woman in underwear or some boobs on a cover but nothing really serious but it is a very interesting video.

Japan is a country that is dying—literally. Japan has more people over the age of 65 and the smallest number of people under the age of 15 in the world. It has the fastest negative population growth in the world, and that's because hardly anyone is having babies. In these difficult times, the Japanese are putting marriage and families on the back burner and seeking recreational love and affection as a form of cheap escape with no strings attached. We sent Ryan Duffy to investigate this phenomenon, which led him to Tokyo's cuddle cafes and Yakuza-sponsored prostitution rings

http://www.vice.com/the-vice-guide-to-travel/the-japanese-love-industry

In my time being on the internet I see articles like this too often. Surprising they have the same outlook on relationships as me. I've always preferred being self sufficient and independent from another person. Not being tied down emotionally to anyone else feels very satisfying and I am free to pursue my own goals without having to act upon other people's wishes or wants.I think what's amazing is how I wanted to be host once upon a time. I had no idea you could earn that much from such an idea but he must be good at what he does.

I think the way they feel is very normal and many of my friends share the same opinion as me.

"and why Japan is dying"
Yeah, no. You're done..

Not "YOU" you, OP, but just, earth in general.
Humanity is done. It's over

Wow...this will likely be the stupidest thing I see today, and I plan to spend today on the internet.

Saying this is why Japan's population is ageing so badly is probably jumping the gun, but that's a pretty interesting travel video. This kinda makes me want to finally finish Catherine.

Its more about the crazy cultural which generates the work ethics started in the 60s and coming to fruition now. This is what happens when a culture fosters a high drive work ethic that is about sacrificing personal things for the good of the group. It was okay during the recovery years post WW2 but disastrous much later when the country is full of 40-50 year olds that are maladjusted, unhappy people who know nothing but how to work in a cut throat environment. That doesn't exactly foster a safe and healthy family situation. There is also a dimension of women's rights as well where it makes more sense if you are a educated Japanese woman the last place you'd want to work is in Japan.

It is a big part of it. Japanese women have a special view on romance through media and Japanese men will never satisfy these standards. On the other hand Japanese men have also a very special view on romance which can never be satisfied by Japanese women. These interests collide and it is a hassle to get emotional attached to each other. And of course it does not help that the market totally reacts to these needs to make a shit ton of money.

@extomar I am sorry but your last line is absolute bullshit. Japan is not like you can see in all these Japanese porno videos. Japanese women are very independent and not oppressed in Japan. They can do what they want and most women decide also not to get married and have a relationship at all. Instead they are doing it like men. Spending their money in hosts clubs and other establishments to get what they need. They do not get harassed or raped at every corner it is even quite the opposite. Japanese men are very afraid of Japanese women.

Yea. That's what he meant.

I wish they'd have a couple babies that are capable of making me a new Suikoden game.

The world is not exactly suffering from a human shortage right now, so I'm not ready to pull the alarm because a country is experiencing negative population growth. If anything it's the proper adjustment to the new standards of living and life expectancy that science has given us. We don't need to breed like animals to keep ahead of disease, environment and the brutal nature of our condition anymore. Explosive population growth and birth rates are emblematic of a civilization where a single life doesn't mean much and often passes without dignity.

@Darji: I don't think @EXTomar is saying that women are getting raped around every corner, I think he's saying that educated women are looking at their options and realizing that the Japanese system of work is a dead end. They've seen their fathers have the joy drained out of them and die on the job from exhaustion and stress, and they're wondering why exactly they'd want to 'trade up' to that kind of existence.

They made 13 of those.
Only one, maybe one and a half of them were good :P

Roujin Z was right all along! And with the 2020 Olympics in Tokyo, Akira is right on track too (except for the whole WW3 part). Katsuhiro Otomo is clearly some kind of prophet.

@darji said:

http://www.ipsnews.net/2013/01/japan-values-women-less-as-it-needs-them-more/

http://japandailypress.com/tokyo-court-rejects-lawsuit-to-allow-married-women-to-use-maiden-names-3029781/

I believe you were saying something funny. Women have made great gains in equality in japan but they're still waaaay behind the majority of other first-world nations.

The idea that japan is dying is as stupid as the "Japan is going to take over the world" idea from the 90's. I'm not saying japan doesn't have problems, but the only way you get to "Japan is dying" is if you assume current trends and issues will persist indefinitely. Its a very public issue in Japan. Seriously, even if they have to majorly incentivize having children, they'll make it work. It's not like there's not precedent for that.

I know that he does not mean it like that it was an overreaction to make a point. The problem is that women have to work the same amount men have to do. Both gender are being totally overworked and there is no free time anymore for relationships or people do not want to bother anymore with it because it could also mean stress. Instead they are paying for their needs. These men and women who visiting host clubs for example don't want to have sex they just want to have a good time without any stress or emotional investment and the the youth is the same. Look at the girl working in this cuddle cafe. She is emotional dead and can not express or feel her emotions anymore.

As for women rights. The biggest problem for women is that they normally can not go back into work when they have gotten married and a child. They are out of their job for too long. It is not like here where you start working after 2-3 years again. It is a much longer process there. Otherwise they are very liberal and free in Japan.

@ TowerSixteen I know these articles don't worry. As for the maiden thing it is just stupid.

The problem with these statistics is that there is no solution or any attempts to change that. Cutting a population by half in such a short time is a real problem. And it is a very dangerous social problem

@zeforgotten:

@oldenglishc: That's how I felt too when I booted up anything that wasn't the first Suikoden :P

It's a well-known sociological phenomenon that as women gain more independence and rights, access to higher positions and such, tend to delay child-rearing. (Please no one think that I'm arguing women shouldn't have rights or independence). This results in an upside down population where there aren't enough young to support the old. This is accelerated by japan's 20-year recession which means they can't financially afford a child. Some polls have shown women in Japan also have rather unrealistic expectations about male financials for wedding-age typical men but I would be apprehensive about trusting that sentiment. The same is also true about birthrates in most modern countries, even America. The only reason America has a fairly stable population rate is because of the large amount of immigration that is allowed. Japan historically allows very little immigration on the other hand. I think the vice's argument about sex industry largely affecting the population is a bit unlikely. It's like saying that strip clubs in America are causing declining birthrates. A possible contributing factor but a causal relationship? That idea seems spurious.

@zeforgotten: Fine, you win! I'll change my statement.

I wish some of these babies not being born in Japan would hurry up and make me a new Shadow Hearts game.

Damn son

@oldenglishc: Now we're talking

@ley_lines: This industry is the result of this problem not the cause. That is for sure. The question here is what caused this. And as answer you can just say their daily life, standards in their society and their impossible expectations for their partners which are established through Japanese media. That is why it is so serious there is no indication of slowing down but rather raising and by this speed these statistics are even very generous.

I have a wife and three kids. It's rad.

@darji: I still think your underestimating how women are treated culturally. Media is a good barometer of social attitudes, and while Japanese media portrayals of women have gotten better, and you can find the odd really good one, but they're still not great on the whole. Not that we don't have plenty of our own issues with that over here, but I don't think it's particularly world-breaking to say that the east is generally farther from the egalitarian ideal than the west.

Hm, I should have been a field reporter.

Japanese media portrayal of women is as sexualized as much as the portrayal of men. And I do not believe that Japanese media shows how women are treated in their society. Quite the opposite actually. In terms of sex in media Japan is most likely the most liberal Country in the world. Women and men are treated totally different in media than in real live there. And for the east thing. I would never consider Japan to be east and Japan would never consider themselves as east. Japan is totally different and always was. While Japan was heavily influenced through the western countries in the Meiji era Japan never really lost their own culture and social standards. And the treatment of gender is one thing. Because the west does it does not mean every other country has to do it too or that is the only right way. For example the US way of fighting equality is absolute terrible.

What Japan right now needs are social programs to abolish this emotional barrier people have. They need more family programs. If father and mother must work to survive as a family with kids then there is something terrible wrong. They should be able to chose if they want to work or not. And stuff like education is really really expensive from the beginning. But that is only the tip of the iceberg.

@darji: You assumed I was just talking about sexuality...and I never believed that media portrayals accurately portrayed life there, just that they revealed underlying attitudes and beliefs. The idea that they don't is absurd, otherwise your saying that the people of japan tend hold one thing to be true, but when they go to make thier media, they substitute in an entirely different set of values for some unidentifiable reason. Again, I'm not saying that the sociology behind it isn't fantastically complex and I'm not claiming it's straightforward representation but media DOES hint toward social mores and beliefs the world over and Japan is NOT an exception.

Also, whether or not japan wants to call itself the "East" or not is irrelevant. The implication of the term is simply that it is one of the group of countries to have among it's greatest historical influences Chinese culture and Confucianist values (and perhaps Buddhism and thereby Hinduism indirectly.) I freely admit that as an island nation it perhaps became a bit more distinct than usual but those influences are still strong, if maybe not as strong as, say, South Korea. But just as the "West" is shorthand for the cultural children of ancient Greece and Rome, so too is Japan part of the East.

Of course media influences people and in Japan it does it too. But it does not influence the treatment of women because that treatment is totally different than it is portrayed in the media. Be it animes, Japanese TV or even music. For example idol groups are treated with total respect. Especially women are treated very carefully in their society because most men are scared of women or social contact except their group anyway.

Of course that does not mean that women rights have still problems but that is like here. We should really strive for equal rights for everyone instead of special groups or minorities.

Thanks for Darji for jumping to the absolutely wrong conclusion and hence my reservation about mention that important point....

I meant that if a young graduate has a university masters or Ph.D you are much much much much better off going to US or Europe to find a job than anywhere in Japan. It is so much more so if they are a woman. This means that there is a "brain drain" where freshly graduated young men and women are just up and leaving because the work environment sucks (that whole cut throat environment thing mentioned before) and they can earn much more elsewhere. They start relationships and families elsewhere instead of Japan and the spiral continues...

Also a factor in this is that Japan has a strict immigration and visitor policy. If you can't get the local population to have more kids one thing to do help is promote immigration which no one seems to want. I suspect it would be pretty easy to get Philippines kids to move, work, and start having families in Japan which I would also suspect that very idea would freak many Japanese out....

So basically it can be summarized like this: If you are young and have skills there are plenty of reasons to leave Japan and not a lot of reasons to stay. Much more so if you are a woman. This is not a recipe for population growth. This isn't Children of Men kind of situation but it definitely isn't sustainable where I suspect by 2030~ the Japanese government will have to actually enact policy to promote growth instead of pontificate about it.

Never change, Japen...

Ok this is something we can totally agree on. Sorry but with the recent news and stories I was really coming to a false conclusion when you mentioned educated women are not staying in this country. So I am really sorry...

@darji said:

Man, this is the culture that had to implement women-only cars on their trains to combat all the groping. Idol groups have to sign contracts forbidding them to be in relationships so they can be a better fantasy for their male fans, who have been well-documented as having a vocal contingent who flip the fuck out if they so much as get caught kissing. Complaints such as "I don't want a second-hand wife" are common. And caution, particularly caution enforced by cultural mores promoting public emotional distance, is not the same thing as respect anyway.

@video_game_king: Wow, Fragile Dreams' translation seems pretty terrible

Can goat sex save Japan?

Women Cars were implemented way earlier than that and for a total different reasons. Yes today it stands for the chikan crimes and to prevent them but before it was impossible for women and children to get into these trains because of over population. None or less Japan is a country with a very low sexual crime rate. today it is also the country with the lowest homicide rate of the world. I am talking about todays general public not of the one a decade ago.

As for your other example. The same goes for boy groups. They do it because a single men or women is way better to sell to these people than one in a relationship. It really has nothing to do with gender.

The biggest problem however is the "second hand wife" which is a problem since women who are divorced and maybe even have a child have a very different stand in Japanese society. But this is also because marriage is something pretty rare today. Marriage in Japan is still very traditional and something special. in the west people marry way too young and getting divorced way to early for different often stupid reasons. In Japan it is the total opposite. People in their 20s normally do not marry at all and if they fill a divorce it is mostly when their children have grown up even if their love has faded a long time ago. Marriage in Japan it is much more invested and maybe that is why its such a hassle for younger people in Japan.

@bocam:

....How? Or is that sarcastic?

"We sent Ryan Duffy to investigate..."

That guy makes $800,000 a year to talk to women?

@zeforgotten: Fuck that, Suikoden II was light years ahead of the first game and the pinnacle of the series. V was better as well and while III was a worse Suikoden, it was a significantly better game.

IV was pure horseshit though.

Oh, man. I don't think I'm ever watching Japanese porn ever again. I don't want to support this kind of behavior. I'm aware the "show" he got was likely just the Yakuza dudes giving him the most extreme package possible as a joke, but things like the birth rates speak for themselves. The most hilarious thing is that their porn is still required to be censored. It's such an obvious and ridiculous farce. Er... I guess an equally ridiculous thing is that the Yakuza are seen as a legitimate organization by the Japanese government. That shit's scary.

I disagree with this. Outside of fear for future natural disasters, Japanese citizens are probably least likely to move out of the country compare to say, chinese or thai people. Mostly because despite social and financial problem japan is still one of the best country in the world for any one to live in.

The birthrate issue is more about what a developed country goes through. The people here have it too good, their lives are pretty damn easy for the most part, so why complicate that with children and wives or husband. Casual sex are pretty common amounts people these days, especially the youth. Basically the sexuality of Japanese people just went back to the Meiji-era, where free love are pretty common and combine that with modern life's delicacy. Why the hell would they want to have a family? I have been with my gf for four years, no marriage or kids in sight for neither of us.

Uh, negative population growth is a good thing. It is very easy to recover from underpopulation if such a thing were to become a problem. Not so for overpopulation.

I'm basing my opinion on that one screenshot.

Not to the extent that the population will be halved in less than a hundred years.

Overpopulation of the world in general is a problem but that problem isn't because Japan, a country of what, 200 million? 100 million? Has too many people. Look instead at the really high population growth in places like India, China, and Africa.

@bocam:

So you're serious? I feel I should mention that Glass Cage isn't a translation error or anything; it's actually a very specific concept in the game and is referred to quite a bit.

Less people in the world better..... yeah japan is not a gasbillion population country , but somewhere someone needs to breed less. Also has the same population as Mexico (Japan 120 million - Mexico 115 million) , and I think there just too many us mexicans already and we live in a rather huge country , I cant imagine how packed are those little islands.

I don't know if you would want to go to some of the places Vice does. Some seem cool, a lot seem real scary.

If the original term was グラスケイジ計画 I would have put "The Glass Cage Plan will commence shortly". Having Glass Cage by itself doesn't seem right. Either way I should get to playing my copy of Fragile Dreams.

No Japanese people don't have much sex at all. It is mostly all in their fantasies. Japan is probably the country with the oldest virgins in our world. And not because they can't have sex but because they chose not to. A 30 or 40 year old virigin male or female is nothing special in Japan. Many people do not even use these places to have sex but to stimulate their fantasy and fetish without having sex. Host clubs for example. While some are shady and have underground prostitution most of them don't. They go to these clubs and pay a ton of money without having or wanting sex.

And on the other side having way way more older people than young people is the death of any social system.