Was Lion King the last great "American" animated film?

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SethPhotopoulos

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#101  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Hermoor said:

@Dany said:

Up and Wall-E

I cried and teared up during both. Magnificent films

Really? Wow I didn't think that was possible...how much did you cry first time you watched titanic? If you cry over wall E I bet you had a mental breakdown after titanic. Seriously what you just said is kind of funny...xD

What is your problem? You do understand that critically these films are regarded as works of art or beautiful because of the themes and ways they approach them making them accessible to both children and adults? You do realize how hypocritical to call these people immature when your just angry that they share a different opinion than you? Any time someone brings up an argument for why these films are considered art to them you always shut them down by calling it cute or immature with no way to back up your argument. You need to be more mature and open minded to other people's ideas and opinions so that you can have an intelligent conversation instead of immaturely beating people down for no reason.

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SethPhotopoulos

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#102  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Jeust said:

How to Train Your Dragon is an awesome movie, and perhaps the best animation movie I've seen. This makes me disagree with your opinion. Ghost In The Shell is superbly animated, and deep in its phylosophical theme, but never grabs the warmness and funny nature of How to Train Your Dragon.

Well Ghost in the Shell is trying for a completely different tone than How to Train Your Dragon.

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NaDannMaGoGo

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#103  Edited By NaDannMaGoGo

My favorite animated movie is Mulan.

Dat art style, that story/plot, dat humor (the German voice actors, just perfect in that one) ah it's just awesome. Could go in detail but yeah, what a fantastic film. It was the first video tape I got when I was young and I watched it over and over. Then 2 years ago I thought "hey, I should watch it again" --- and I watched it over and over, stlll enjoying it a hell lot.

That said I'm not really much into other Disney movies, I'm just not. Didn't watch too many anyways. I watched the Lion King when I was very young but meh, somehow I just don't like it that much. I also really hate the Jungle Book or how it's English term is.

As for the "newer" animated movies, most of them are of course very well done and certainly enjoyable, even if just for the animation quality. However I'm kinda annoyed by this "take something inhuman and apply a billion human attributes to it so everyone can sympathize with it" aspect.

E.g. Wall-E which I watched last year.

Great animation, fantastic setting, nice background story (Plot though, meh) etc.

However the characters... I just look at this and am like, "right, this is supposed to be the most cute and sympathizable thing to ever exist." - A robot that is no robot really. And the great thing is, it being a robot means you can make really funny stuff with it. So it's bound to be fantastic. But when I see how the robot loves watching an old video tape with some old music and dance on it and hear him sigh... c'mon.

It's a fucking robot love story, that's actually stupid.

Edit:

A nice tip, this song is a real good motivator!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSS5dEeMX64 (great that more and more people keep watching this video!)

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#104  Edited By Jeust

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@Jeust said:

How to Train Your Dragon is an awesome movie, and perhaps the best animation movie I've seen. This makes me disagree with your opinion. Ghost In The Shell is superbly animated, and deep in its phylosophical theme, but never grabs the warmness and funny nature of How to Train Your Dragon.

Well Ghost in the Shell is trying for a completely different tone than How to Train Your Dragon.

And succeeded. But for me How To Train Your Dragon was a much better experience though. ^^

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imsh_pl

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#105  Edited By imsh_pl
@Hermoor said:

@imsh_pl: If beauty is in the beholder as you say...then a serial killer who finds children without heads and a dildo up their rectum beautiful. If beauty is in the eye of the beholder and there is no objective sense of beauty then everything is beautiful...and that means...yes there is no beauty. Fact is there is beauty, and it exists even if you are dead...even if every human being on earth was dead beauty would still exist. So no it's not in the eye of the beholder...

Also I think I'm more qualified to say what is beautiful or not simply because...YOU ARE ARGUING FOR TOY STORY OVER PRINCE OF EGYPT. Silly silly man...

YOU ARE AGRUING FOR THE PRINCE OF EGYPT OVER TOY STORY. Silly silly man...

Also yeah, beauty is subjective, just as morality, etc. They are these little things we people call

No Caption Provided

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SethPhotopoulos

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#106  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Jeust said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@Jeust said:

How to Train Your Dragon is an awesome movie, and perhaps the best animation movie I've seen. This makes me disagree with your opinion. Ghost In The Shell is superbly animated, and deep in its phylosophical theme, but never grabs the warmness and funny nature of How to Train Your Dragon.

Well Ghost in the Shell is trying for a completely different tone than How to Train Your Dragon.

And succeeded. But for me How To Train Your Dragon was a much better experience though. ^^

I just thought it weird that you said it didn't grab the warmness and the funny nature of How to Train your Dragon when Ghost in the Shell should not represent that description. I've no problem with you enjoying HTTYD over GITS.

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Hermoor

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#107  Edited By Hermoor

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@Hermoor said:

@Dany said:

Up and Wall-E

I cried and teared up during both. Magnificent films

Really? Wow I didn't think that was possible...how much did you cry first time you watched titanic? If you cry over wall E I bet you had a mental breakdown after titanic. Seriously what you just said is kind of funny...xD

What is your problem? You do understand that critically these films are regarded as works of art or beautiful because of the themes and ways they approach them making them accessible to both children and adults? You do realize how hypocritical to call these people immature when your just angry that they share a different opinion than you? Any time someone brings up an argument for why these films are considered art to them you always shut them down by calling it cute or immature with no way to back up your argument. You need to be more mature and open minded to other people's ideas and opinions so that you can have an intelligent conversation instead of immaturely beating people down for no reason.

These movies are critically acclaimed children movies....you want to know why Steven Spielberg created Dreamworks? It was not because of Toy Story, it was because of the Disney movies of the 90s. Toy Story and the new exciting technology killed traditional animation. I hope someday it will return in some form, there is something special about traditionally animated movies. UP and Toy Story are children movies only while Hunchback of notre dame, Tarzan Lion king among other disney movies can be watched and even CONVERTED into live action without much having to be removed.

Of course UP and WALL E could be convereted into live action too...but then it would be a shitty comedy. A house that flys because of baloons? A ship full of fat people....stupid just stupid. If you seriously say any of these movies are more beautiful or better than for example prince of egypt you are simply ignorant...it's as simple as that. And I'm not going to "open my mind" to houses that fly with the help of baloons or some little robot and a ship full of fat humans...it's cute and worth watching once maybe. But as I said earlier:

THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CUTE/FUNNY AND BEAUTIFUL. You can't compare beautiful too cute and funny. Two completely different genres. You can say Wall E is more funny and more cute than prince of egypt but saying it's more beautiful is stupid.

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#108  Edited By Mercy_

@VinceNotVance said:

THE SOUTH PARK MOVIE IS THE BEST ANIMATED MOVIE OF ALL TIME FACT

ಠ_ಠ

LION KING 4 LYFE.

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Evilsbane

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#109  Edited By Evilsbane

@Khessed said:

The Emperor's New Groove remains an unsung Disney classic in my book.

Best Disney Movie Ever.

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imsh_pl

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#110  Edited By imsh_pl
@Hermoor: I have a question for you.
 
I'll grant you the idiotic idea that beauty is objective. With that in mind I want you to answer the following questions:
1.What is the objective standard of beauty? What does it apply to? Is it accessible to everybody?
2.Is there a person who decides what is beautiful and what is not? If so, who is he/her?
3.Is there a group of people who decide what is beautiful and what is not? If so, who are they? 
4.Is there a source which defines what is beautiful or not? Perhaps a book, a sacred codex, a ruleset?
5.Supposing you answered the above questions: why should we obey the source/s of the judgement of beauty and be unable to step out of the boundries it sets us?
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Moreau_MD

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#111  Edited By Moreau_MD

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@Moreau_MD said:

I loved The Lion King. I loved Toy Story. My favorite as a kid had to be the Hunchback of Notre Dame though- truly great cinema. In my opinion, Disney/Pixar started to lose that magic touch with the likes of Finding Nemo and Monsters Inc- still great kids films but no-where near the level of the three previously mentioned. No wonder children seem to be less able to cope with life/school these days. Both companies need to realize that even very young children are capable of dealing with and processing far more challenging and thought provoking ideas and go back to the way they were before. Not going to happen though.

Up had to deal with letting things go and to move on after a tragic event like a loved one dying. Toy Story 3 was about growing up but still maintaining a piece of your inner child. Princess and the Frog was about following you dreams and having faith that they will come true after you put in a lot of work. It seems like after you watched those movies you mentioned you either didn't watch what came after or you weren't able to see some of the lessons in them.

I agree to an extent. Toy Story Three was both touching and a brilliant end to a beloved series. Up has to be one of the greatest animated films of all time (Who doesn't want a tennis ball walker!). I haven't seen Princess and the Frog unfortunately. However, none of these are quite as impactful, or as morally enlightening to a young child as the story of a deformed individual, who, despite suffering from intense loneliness and fear his entire life evolves into a magical human being (and does so in a realistic fashion). 'Realism' is the key word here in one sense- Disney would never have been able to do what they did with the Hunchback in this day and age- a modern day Disney film would undoubtedly have him end up with the girl and they'd end on a nice inoffensive musical crescendo. Surely even you have to agree that the mediocre far outweighs the awesome in recent years though. I was, after all, referring to the majority of new Disney/Pixar films- not all of them.

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zeforgotten

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#112  Edited By zeforgotten

And here I thought people got banned for being pathetic trolls. GG

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SethPhotopoulos

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#113  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Moreau_MD said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@Moreau_MD said:

I loved The Lion King. I loved Toy Story. My favorite as a kid had to be the Hunchback of Notre Dame though- truly great cinema. In my opinion, Disney/Pixar started to lose that magic touch with the likes of Finding Nemo and Monsters Inc- still great kids films but no-where near the level of the three previously mentioned. No wonder children seem to be less able to cope with life/school these days. Both companies need to realize that even very young children are capable of dealing with and processing far more challenging and thought provoking ideas and go back to the way they were before. Not going to happen though.

Up had to deal with letting things go and to move on after a tragic event like a loved one dying. Toy Story 3 was about growing up but still maintaining a piece of your inner child. Princess and the Frog was about following you dreams and having faith that they will come true after you put in a lot of work. It seems like after you watched those movies you mentioned you either didn't watch what came after or you weren't able to see some of the lessons in them.

I agree to an extent. Toy Story Three was both touching and a brilliant end to a beloved series. Up has to be one of the greatest animated films of all time (Who doesn't want a tennis ball walker!). I haven't seen Princess and the Frog unfortunately. However, none of these are quite as impactful, or as morally enlightening to a young child as the story of a deformed individual, who, despite suffering from intense loneliness and fear his entire life evolves into a magical human being (and does so in a realistic fashion). 'Realism' is the key word here in one sense- Disney would never have been able to do what they did with the Hunchback in this day and age- a modern day Disney film would undoubtedly have him end up with the girl and they'd end on a nice inoffensive musical crescendo. Surely even you have to agree that the mediocre far outweighs the awesome in recent years though. I was, after all, referring to the majority of new Disney/Pixar films- not all of them.

Outside of the Cars films I found them all to be excellent and in fact some better than what they had done in the early 90's. Outside of Princess and the Frog and the pretty good not great Tangled I'm not sure what Disney has done in recent years on an animated level.

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Claude

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#114  Edited By Claude

This thread is full of piss and vinegar.

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zeforgotten

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#115  Edited By zeforgotten

@Claude said:

This thread is full of piss and vinegar.

Now that you mention it, it does smell like old people in here :P

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imsh_pl

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#116  Edited By imsh_pl
@Moreau_MD: I found that what Disney has ceased being Pixar has become instead.
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Claude

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#117  Edited By Claude

@ZeForgotten said:

@Claude said:

This thread is full of piss and vinegar.

Now that you mention it, it does smell like old people in here :P

Hey, hey, hey. Easy. I just took a shower. I'm fresh.

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AlmostSwedish

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#118  Edited By AlmostSwedish

Hey guys, what about A Goofy Movie?

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zeforgotten

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#119  Edited By zeforgotten

@Claude said:

@ZeForgotten said:

@Claude said:

This thread is full of piss and vinegar.

Now that you mention it, it does smell like old people in here :P

Hey, hey, hey. Easy. I just took a shower. I'm fresh.

Fine, I'll trust you this time, Claude. But don't think for a second that it will be over so easy the next time.

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Hermoor

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#120  Edited By Hermoor

@imsh_pl said:

@Hermoor: I have a question for you. I'll grant you the idiotic idea that beauty is objective. With that in mind I want you to answer the following questions: 1.What is the objective standard of beauty? What does it apply to? Is it accessible to everybody?2.Is there a person who decides what is beautiful and what is not? If so, who is he/her? 3.Is there a group of people who decide what is beautiful and what is not? If so, who are they? 4.Is there a source which defines what is beautiful or not? Perhaps a book, a sacred codex, a ruleset? 5.Supposing you answered the above questions: why should we obey the source/s of the judgement of beauty and be unable to step out of the boundries it sets us?

Objective standard to beauty, well I would say beauty arises out of conflicts within our natural world. A tree fighting gravity, a waterfall giving in to gravity, a lion fighting off a bunch of hyenas. True beauty arises out of conflict.

This beauty can be seen by any organism that aware of it's own existence and can observe conflict and learn from it. I would limit this beauty to apes and humans. A person that decides what is beautiful...well I would say that the person with most life experience would be able to recognice it much easier than someone who hasn't a lot of life experiences. Someone that is 2 years old and walking around on his fours wouldn't be able to recognice it. A 70 year old man would though...

Of course the more aware of yourself and others the easier it would be for you to recognice it. There are some truly stupid humans out there that even when getting older are hardly aware of anything but their own ego and their personal pleasure. These kind of people would not be able to recognice it. I would probably say that a lot of you people in this thread that are arguing over toy story belong to this group of people. The more ego you have the harder it would be for you to spot true beauty.

There is no written law of what is beautiful or not beautiful. It's often said to be a subjective feeling one has, but I don't think so. True beauty can only be perceived by very wise or intelligent humans that have a lot of real life experiences of the world. If you are arguing that Toy Story is more beautiful than Prince of Egypt you live in the world of a four year old child and has therefore a harder time recognicing true beauty.

The mere fact that you are arguing for Toy Story, proves that I know better what true beauty is than you do.

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imsh_pl

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#121  Edited By imsh_pl
@Hermoor said:


The mere fact that you are arguing for Toy Story, proves that I know better what true beauty is than you do.

Again: what is true beauty and why should anyone agree with your definition.
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solidejake

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#122  Edited By solidejake

Umm... Not really. PIXAR know what they're doing.

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Can we just agree that Hermoor is a pretentious jackass and ignore him? I don't have a "dont feed the troll" picture but if I did it would probably be appropriate.

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Hermoor

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#124  Edited By Hermoor

@imsh_pl: I just told you what true beauty is and it's not subjective. Even if every human in this world would be gone even if there would be none to see beauty it would still exist. True beauty arises out of conflict...only organisms aware of their own existence and who can observe conflict are able to see true beauty.

The organisms with a long life experience and who are both wise and very self aware can easier see true beauty. The mere fact that you people see beauty in toys about to be burnt points towards you knowling little of the great beauties of the world.

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AssInAss

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#125  Edited By AssInAss

@Khessed said:

The Emperor's New Groove remains an unsung Disney classic in my book.

This is the correct answer.

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cookiemonster

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#126  Edited By cookiemonster

I think Die Hard is a pretty beautiful film.

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StalkingTurnip

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#127  Edited By StalkingTurnip

Umm.. What do you actually want to get from this thread? You asked if that was the last great American movie but then when other people held up almost universally held standards of greatness you shot them down. This also seems like question better suited for the screened forums. Unless you are just trolling.

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SethPhotopoulos

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#128  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Hermoor said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@Hermoor said:

@Dany said:

Up and Wall-E

I cried and teared up during both. Magnificent films

Really? Wow I didn't think that was possible...how much did you cry first time you watched titanic? If you cry over wall E I bet you had a mental breakdown after titanic. Seriously what you just said is kind of funny...xD

What is your problem? You do understand that critically these films are regarded as works of art or beautiful because of the themes and ways they approach them making them accessible to both children and adults? You do realize how hypocritical to call these people immature when your just angry that they share a different opinion than you? Any time someone brings up an argument for why these films are considered art to them you always shut them down by calling it cute or immature with no way to back up your argument. You need to be more mature and open minded to other people's ideas and opinions so that you can have an intelligent conversation instead of immaturely beating people down for no reason.

These movies are critically acclaimed children movies....you want to know why Steven Spielberg created Dreamworks? It was not because of Toy Story, it was because of the Disney movies of the 90s. Toy Story and the new exciting technology killed traditional animation. I hope someday it will return in some form, there is something special about traditionally animated movies. UP and Toy Story are children movies only while Hunchback of notre dame, Tarzan Lion king among other disney movies can be watched and even CONVERTED into live action without much having to be removed.

Of course UP and WALL E could be convereted into live action too...but then it would be a shitty comedy. A house that flys because of baloons? A ship full of fat people....stupid just stupid. If you seriously say any of these movies are more beautiful or better than for example prince of egypt you are simply ignorant...it's as simple as that. And I'm not going to "open my mind" to houses that fly with the help of baloons or some little robot and a ship full of fat humans...it's cute and worth watching once maybe. But as I said earlier:

THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN CUTE/FUNNY AND BEAUTIFUL. You can't compare beautiful too cute and funny. Two completely different genres. You can say Wall E is more funny and more cute than prince of egypt but saying it's more beautiful is stupid.

No no no no no no no my dear.

For starters animated films are created in animation because thats they way they feel the story must be told. You will always lose something if you decide to make a straight adaptation from animation to film without concessions and changes being made to the story. Imagine Lion King having a literal live action adaptation of Lion King would be silly. You keep saying that those Pixar movies are strictly children's movies when in fact they are family films just like the Disney movies of "old".

There is also something that you have to learn like suspending your disbelief wich you seem to be able to do with movies like Tarzan which has humans communicating with animals on a vocal level or in Lion King where all of the animals form a monarchy under Mufasa to the point where they all celebrate the birth of the new prince lion and sometimes they even work for the lions. In Mulan you are able to deal with a talking dragon with the voice of Eddie Murphy who makes a Batman joke even though Batman wasn't even an idea in the time he lived in. However you are not able to deal witha film that uses balloons to fly a house?

You also seem to not even try to read into the films you are watching. Up is about being able to move on and let go after a tragic event like the death of a loved one. If Up was strictly a children's film there would be no subtext and it would just be a movie about getting from point A to point B without anything other than his dead wife wanting him to do it. The inner conflict of Carl trying to hold onto to the memories of his dead wife refusing to let go is beautiful. It also leads to the fact that he is also struggling with how the world has changed and evolved around him. His old styled house is evidence of that and the fact that he refuses to leave without it to go to a world untouched by technology and the ever changing chaotic nature of humans. Wait.. you do know that there is more than external conflict in storytelling right? Man vs. man, man vs. technology, man vs. nature, man vs. self, ect.

You want to know something else... I agree with you on Wall-E. How can I agree with you on Wall-E but not most everything else you said. Oh wait, its called subjectivity. A matter of opinions. Beauty is subjective and you cannot change the definition of beauty to fit your own needs. Ever heard the term beauty is in the eyes of the beholder?

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MetalBaofu

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#129  Edited By MetalBaofu

@Hermoor said:

There are some truly stupid humans out there that even when getting older are hardly aware of anything but their own ego and their personal pleasure. These kind of people would not be able to recognice it.

So, what you are saying is, you can't recognize it. Your idea of "beauty" is so small and shallow that it's kind of pathetic and sad. You're so close-minded you can't see any sort of beauty in something like Toy Story, just because they aren't "human."

But, hey....continue believing what you will and have fun trolling. Back to Assassin's Creed I go.

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AlexW00d

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#130  Edited By AlexW00d

@Tru3_Blu3 said:

@AlexW00d said:

I preferred Toy Story to any other Disney film, but since it's not animated, yeah?

wat

What? I thought it was common knowledge that film is CGI? I am pretty sure it was the first big budget one.

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SethPhotopoulos

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#131  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@AlexW00d said:

@Tru3_Blu3 said:

@AlexW00d said:

I preferred Toy Story to any other Disney film, but since it's not animated, yeah?

wat

What? I thought it was common knowledge that film is CGI? I am pretty sure it was the first big budget one.

CGI is still animation. It's computer animated.

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mikemcn

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#132  Edited By mikemcn

@Toms115 said:

lilo and stich dawg

Awww yeahhhh.

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#133  Edited By Hermoor
@metalhead87: you can't see any sort of beauty in something like Toy Story, just because they aren't "human."

For the love of god, compare KID!?

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AlexW00d

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#134  Edited By AlexW00d

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@AlexW00d said:

@Tru3_Blu3 said:

@AlexW00d said:

I preferred Toy Story to any other Disney film, but since it's not animated, yeah?

wat

What? I thought it was common knowledge that film is CGI? I am pretty sure it was the first big budget one.

CGI is still animation. It's computer animated.

No it's not. CGI is rendered, whereas animation has every frame hand drawn. Very different things.

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Gruff182

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#135  Edited By Gruff182

Disney is just the publisher of Pixar. Their creativity is all in house.

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matthias2437

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#136  Edited By matthias2437

@Khessed said:

The Emperor's New Groove remains an unsung Disney classic in my book.

This. Also Toy Story was amazing. So was UP, UP was one of the best movies of 2009.

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SethPhotopoulos

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#137  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@AlexW00d said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@AlexW00d said:

@Tru3_Blu3 said:

@AlexW00d said:

I preferred Toy Story to any other Disney film, but since it's not animated, yeah?

wat

What? I thought it was common knowledge that film is CGI? I am pretty sure it was the first big budget one.

CGI is still animation. It's computer animated.

No it's not. CGI is rendered, whereas animation has every frame hand drawn. Very different things.

No.

Computer animation is the process used for generating animated images by using computer graphics. The more general termcomputer generated imagery encompasses both static scenes and dynamic images, while computer animation only refers to moving images.

@Hermoor said:

@metalhead87: you can't see any sort of beauty in something like Toy Story, just because they aren't "human."

For the love of god, compare KID!?

Hint: When you look up funny scene your gonna get a funny scene.

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#138  Edited By Hermoor
@SethPhotopoulos: Hint: When you look up funny scene your gonna get a funny scene.

Show me the beautiful scene then, I just searched for Toy Story and picked the first clip that wasn't a trailer...show me the epicness and beauty of this Toy Story movie you argue is more beautiful and a better movie and story than prince of egypt.

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MetalBaofu

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#139  Edited By MetalBaofu

@Hermoor said:

@metalhead87: you can't see any sort of beauty in something like Toy Story, just because they aren't "human."

For the love of god, compare KID!?

Um....no. I'm not trying to compare anything. That's you.

I don't think one is any more "beautiful" than the other. That's you.

You are the one that thinks beauty is objective, remember? Not me.

BTW, you said you are twenty, so stop calling me a kid, kid.

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#140  Edited By AlexW00d

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@AlexW00d said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@AlexW00d said:

@Tru3_Blu3 said:

@AlexW00d said:

I preferred Toy Story to any other Disney film, but since it's not animated, yeah?

wat

What? I thought it was common knowledge that film is CGI? I am pretty sure it was the first big budget one.

CGI is still animation. It's computer animated.

No it's not. CGI is rendered, whereas animation has every frame hand drawn. Very different things.

No.

Computer animation is the process used for generating animated images by using computer graphics. The more general termcomputer generated imagery encompasses both static scenes and dynamic images, while computer animation only refers to moving images.

All that post proves is that CGI and Computer Animation are different things. All animated stuff these days will be done with computers as it is much much easier. Doesn't make them CGI though, as that post shows. In future, read what you copy from wikipedia.

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SethPhotopoulos

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#141  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Hermoor said:

@SethPhotopoulos: Hint: When you look up funny scene your gonna get a funny scene.

Show me the beautiful scene then, I just searched for Toy Story and picked the first clip that wasn't a trailer...show me the epicness and beauty of this Toy Story movie you argue is more beautiful and a better movie and story than prince of egypt.

Now settle down and try to wrap your head around that essay I wrote as an argument instead of acting stubborn.

And try to read into things past the surface. Give me an essay about why the scene in Prince of Egypt is beautiful past the surface and look at the subtext. I can do it for Prince of Egypt because there is subtext to that movie like there are Pixar films. If you have the ability to determine what's beautiful and change the dictionary to fit your own needs you can definitely tell us why it's beautiful.

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SethPhotopoulos

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#142  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@AlexW00d said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@AlexW00d said:

@SethPhotopoulos said:

@AlexW00d said:

@Tru3_Blu3 said:

@AlexW00d said:

I preferred Toy Story to any other Disney film, but since it's not animated, yeah?

wat

What? I thought it was common knowledge that film is CGI? I am pretty sure it was the first big budget one.

CGI is still animation. It's computer animated.

No it's not. CGI is rendered, whereas animation has every frame hand drawn. Very different things.

No.

Computer animation is the process used for generating animated images by using computer graphics. The more general termcomputer generated imagery encompasses both static scenes and dynamic images, while computer animation only refers to moving images.

All that post proves is that CGI and Computer Animation are different things. All animated stuff these days will be done with computers as it is much much easier. Doesn't make them CGI though, as that post shows. In future, read what you copy from wikipedia.

Animation is the rapid display of a sequence of images of 2-D or 3-D artwork or model positions in order to create an illusion of movement. The effect is an optical illusion of motion due to the phenomenon of persistence of vision, and can be created and demonstrated in several ways. The most common method of presenting animation is as a motion picture or video program, although there are other methods.

It just sounds like Traditional animation and computer animation are different things but a subset of animation as a whole. Stop motion counts as animation. Cut outs count as animation. They are all a subset of animation.

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#143  Edited By Bribo

I don't have time to read all the posts on this thread, but I'll estimate that somewhere in the region of 15 other duders have pointed out that The Iron Giant is better than The Lion King.

And at least 6 pointed out that Aladdin and Beauty and the Beast used CGI, thereby eliminating the argument that CG is somehow "cheating".

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#144  Edited By Hermoor
No no no no no no no my dear.

Either you think I'm a girl or you think I'm 7 year old. I'm neither "dear."

For starters animated films are created in animation because thats they way they feel the story must be told. You will always lose something if you decide to make a straight adaptation from animation to film without concessions and changes being made to the story.

How do you know? Of course a movie like Mulan wouldn't have as much extreme facial expressions and poses etc. But without much work one could trace the animation and make it into a live action movie without much problem.

Imagine Lion King having a literal live action adaptation of Lion King would be silly. You keep saying that those Pixar movies are strictly children's movies when in fact they are family films just like the Disney movies of "old".

Of course they are family movies all of them are. The difference between Pixar movies and Disney movies is that I'm not going to sit down alone and watch one of those. I would however be able to sit down and watch Prince of Egypt for example or Hunchback of notre dame without problem. Pixar is a family movie...many of the disney films from the 90s and older could be considered movies for adults, since they aren't as cute as they are serious and realistic.

There is also something that you have to learn like suspending your disbelief wich you seem to be able to do with movies like Tarzan which has humans communicating with animals on a vocal level or in Lion King where all of the animals form a monarchy under Mufasa to the point where they all celebrate the birth of the new prince lion and sometimes they even work for the lions. In Mulan you are able to deal with a talking dragon with the voice of Eddie Murphy who makes a Batman joke even though Batman wasn't even an idea in the time he lived in. However you are not able to deal witha film that uses balloons to fly a house?

Talking animals as in the lion king aren't a problem since the characters and story are well developed. Tarzan talking with animals is also not a big problem since he has grown up in the jungle. Talking dragon in mulan and some silly joke doesn't distract me from the main storyline that actually is quite seriously potrayed and is quite a beautiful story as well. One could turn all the movies above into good live action movies without problem, one would have to remove the silly batman joke though and Timon and Pumba. But otherwise there is little problem. I could imagine they would use something like Aslan from narnia for the lion king. I imaigne it could be quite beautiful a live adaption of the lion king...anyway. Turning UP into a live action movie would be SILLY, I don't have a problem with how unrealistic it is for baloons to fly a house. I have a problem of how sillly it is, turning UP into a live action movie would be a silly comedy. Not very different from Jumanji or whatever that movie was called with Robin Williams. It would never be a serious movie...

You also seem to not even try to read into the films you are watching. Up is about being able to move on and let go after a tragic event like the death of a loved one. If Up was strictly a children's film there would be no subtext and it would just be a movie about getting from point A to point B without anything other than his dead wife wanting him to do it. The inner conflict of Carl trying to hold onto to the memories of his dead wife refusing to let go is beautiful. It also leads to the fact that he is also struggling with how the world has changed and evolved around him. His old styled house is evidence of that and the fact that he refuses to leave without it to go to a world untouched by technology and the ever changing chaotic nature of humans. Wait.. you do know that there is more than external conflict in storytelling right? Man vs. man, man vs. technology, man vs. nature, man vs. self, ect.

Remove all the cutness from UP and you have nothing left to cheer for. The story is simple, not that it's bad just it's simple. Actually this movie would be something like Amelie from mon marte or whatever that movie was called. It's following one person in his life...boring life...no conflict just a old lonely man and his feelings. It's just depressing and I would say waste of time. The difference between let's say Igmar Bergman's the seventh seal and amelie from mon matre is big. That is the same difference that exists between pixar and some disney movies. What makes UP last for a few years after it's realease is it's cutness...not the old guys wife's death.

You want to know something else... I agree with you on Wall-E. How can I agree with you on Wall-E but not most everything else you said. Oh wait, its called subjectivity. A matter of opinions. Beauty is subjective and you cannot change the definition of beauty to fit your own needs. Ever heard the term beauty is in the eyes of the beholder?

If beauty is in the eye of the beholder, then beauty is "a beheaded little girl"...I don't agree. People can be confused...what they see is not beauty. They are just confused and dumb. Now that Toy story clip you showed is once again cute, a boy leaving his toys to the next generation...cute nothing more. There is no conflict it's simple and deals with tiny feelings. Like for example...without the sinking of Titanic the love between Leonardo dicaprio and that other girl would not be as beautiful as it was. There needs to be a conflict for anything to be truly beautiful...cutness alone isn't at all as beautiful as conflict+cutness. True beauty arises out of chaos and conflict. Therefore you arguing for toy story and UP shows you know nothing.

Give me an essay about why the scene in Prince of Egypt is beautiful past the surface and look at the subtext. I can do it for Prince of Egypt because there is subtext to that movie like there are Pixar films. If you have the ability to determine what's beautiful and change the dictionary to fit your own needs you can definitely tell us why it's beautiful.

A better way for you to know why it's beautiful is to watch it. But I'm going to summarize it quickly:

It's about how a lot of people have been enslaved under the pharao of egypt. How the god of Abraham guides moses through life and uses him to free his people from the pharao. God is willing to sacrefice the brotherly love that is between moses and his brother for the freedom of his people. It's a story of love, friendship and pride. There is a great conflict going on within Moses and his brother. Not only is it a great story taken straight from the old testamente of the bible, it's also very well done. The music and animation style is beautiful. It was even designed to follow old egyptian wall paintings. A beautiful movie that far surpasses the silly Pixar movies about flying baloon houses and toys...

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#145  Edited By kmdrkul

Hey guys, we're talking about animated films here. Why are you getting so worked up -_-

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#146  Edited By SethPhotopoulos

@Hermoor: You don't seem to know that conflict is not just external but internal. You can't change the dictionary to fit you needs and your immature in how you deal with disagreements. You know nothing of film and I'm going to leave your insanity behind me. You seem to only be interested in a certain tone and that tone is the only thing you classify as beauty.

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#147  Edited By Hermoor
@SethPhotopoulos: You don't seem to know that conflict is not just external but internal.

The internal beauty between Claire and umm leonardo dicaprio would be nothing as beautiful as it was if it wouldn't be for the sinking ship. I'm not saying there isnt a tiny bit of beauty in UP and toy story. I'm saying comparing them to Prince of Egypt is stupid.

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#148  Edited By GunslingerPanda

Lilo and Stitch, mother fuckers.

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#149  Edited By StalkingTurnip

@Hermoor: Beauty since it is not a physical thing is a subjective thing. It isn't real. What is beautiful for you can be disgusting for someone else. Quit acting like it is a thing that can be measured.

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#150  Edited By Hermoor

@StalkingTurnip: If that is true then everything is beautiful....so:

Beautiful=Everything??

Since when was beautiful a synonym to everything? I see no use for the word beauty if it's subjective...